northernjohn

And the yellow farangs start to dream again.

How many times have you declared victory now?

Well, they feel important to live in a country of desperate and oppressed people, that's why they support military dictatorship, massacres of civilians, and widespread robbery and corruption (Thaksin government was by far the LEAST corrupt in history of Thailand, according to Transparency International)

With a population of desperate and starving people, they will run around with their miserable pensions feeling like the "farangs kings" who can buy anybody, from the little daughter of a desperate farmer to the countryside maiden who will clean their rooms for a miserable salary.

Fist act of the new army government will be to lower drammaticaly the minimum salary. That's what yellowish farangs are looking for: feeling rich in a desperatly poor country

Nice try at misdirection.

Transparency International only has records from the year 2,000. It show's a low corruption until the Army turned it over to the Thaksin led governments at which point it took off like a sky rocket. It stopped rising when the Democrats came in it showed a leveling out even a slight dip. Then when the Thaksin led government came back in it shows it going up like a rocket again. In the year 2013 it increased from 65% to 67%.

You do have a vivid imagination I will give you that.

Again your feeble attempts to defend these defenseless actions by the protest guard.

!. the guards caused the confrontation, by attempting to order citizens to leave a public park!

2. The guards are not peaceful unarmed protesters.

3. the article stated when the gunshots started the occupations of the taxi ran, did a gun fire by itself from inside the Taxi.

Could you kindly, advise us to the other source you stated had a different version of the incident!

Cheers

Hang on. When it is a bomb or gun fire aimed at "enemies" of the PTP it is the PDRC especially when no one was hurt according to you. These attacks forced the PDRC into Lumpini park in the first place yet you still say it is the PDRC forcing themselves into a park.

Now we have a taxi driver (with no passenger as witness because he mysteriously disappeared) who after having bullets fired at him is slightly grazed and is telling the media and police his version of events while no one else can collaborate it. I am sure that there will be no CCTV footage of this either. Mark my words, if they were the PDRC guards that attacked you can bet your farm tractor (that has to be repossessed) that the police would find the CCTV footage to back their claims.

So you read an OP that tells a taxi drivers version of events with no other witnesses and you have no idea what this taxi drivers back ground is. No CCTV footage yet you are adamant that this is gospel while sitting on your front patio drinking coffee. YET during a red shirt rally in Phichit, former Pheu Thai Waipote Arpornrat threatened the NACC, saying the graft-busting agency would find “hell on earth” if it dared to rule against the prime minister and the next day a hand grenade was thrown into the NACC compound and going by your wisdom and sound deductive reasoning it was a PDRC protestor.

That's PTP logic right there.

Okay, okay, the taxi driver shot himself, just as the guy a couple of days ago bound his own hands and feet and threw himself in the river.

Where does it say he was shot? "A bullet fragment" Now I am no ballistics expert, but either the bullet hits you or it doesn't. One would suggest that a piece of broken glass from the bullet hitting the window hit him. This could be from a drunk passenger firing from inside the taxi at a peaceful guard trying to defend innocent protestors.

Now if it is a PDRC guard firing at the taxi driver I look forward to the CCTV footage the police will present. And rest assured they will only present it if it suits their agenda.

Good point how does a fragment graze you if you are running. Also the guy was drunk.

Be interesting to see if their is any footage on film

What did the police say who were told to protect the PDRC? I am pretty sure that was one of Yingluck's directives before she went into seclusion.

Well what you say should hold true but if you have been following this government from the time it took power you would know that there was no opposition allowed in Parliament.

The Opposition was powerless because the sitting government had the majority with out the support of any one else. Remember it was the grass roots people who started this it was not a company or another political party. The unity came after there was several groups out there protesting without a leader. Suthep came along and took the reins and brought them all together. The PTP now listen but it is to late. They have painted themselves into a corner from which they can not escape.

Lets face it when we have a PRIME MINISTER who does not condemn groups that support her for suggesting openly separation of the country and when she finally does it is done on Facebook only after the Army has taken steps to deal with this obviously illegal action. We have a government that is completely ineffective. They can not even pay their bills.

As for the shooting well as you can see there is another side to the story. Is it true will we ever know who knows.

The one thing that is consistent is the anti opposition leaders have had to hire their own guards as has been shown time and again the police will not protect them.

Who tells the police what to do? I am not talking about public ordering them I am talking about the real orders that they follow.

I was here in Bangkok in 2008 and 2010 during those protests too. I was fiercely critical of the redshirts for staying over three months, the incendiary "death to the elites, burn the city" etc. speeches and also I remember the offstage interview just before the serious violence in 2010, in which the redshirt leader said "deaths among our numbers can only further our cause." I was highly critical of all this - just as I am highly critical of Suthep's actions these past few months.

I have also taken issue with Yingluck since before she was elected, when she did her almost commando-roll to avoid the news cameras asking her for a pre-election quick interview on what she believes in. I have criticised Yingluck for failing to attend Parliament and for failing to be more gladitorial in the debate arena. I consider the PTP passport-for-crims, rice-scam, kids-tabs and amnesty-bill to be utterly corrupt on many levels.

But that doesn't change the fact that state changes have to come from consensus at state level. There is no monolith on a hilltop somewhere that says "this is how it must be", and the parliamentary system is highly augmentable to suit the problems of a given nation. They need locks and regulations to prevent abuse of power in parliament, but these changes have to come at state level. Simply taking to the streets and toppling the system, while promising that your new system will be far less corrupt - this is not a solution. These are also the promises given by all dictators in history.

The problem at state is lack of regulation of members post-election, corruption in both main parties. Neither of those problems will be solved by having street-battles. Those problems have to be solved at state level by consensus and by willingness to take emergency measures to augment and fortify existing systems, instead of just toppling them by street-based overthrow movements. The problem is that the willingness is not there, and this applies to the groups behind Suthep too. They don't want the corrupt and unregulated political machine retuned if it will affect their own interests.

Another obvious point is that if the Dems rebranded and started acting in ways that had mass-appeal, they could eventually win an election, especially now the PTP star is fading. But the Dems don't do that because they represent certain views and groups who do not want to compromise any more than PTP do.

I was not here for the 2008 show so I will take your word for it.

I like the theory that you propose but in order for it to work you would need an educated voter. That is not the case here in Thailand. I do not believe it will be for quite a while. I may not have been here as long as you but I have been here long enough to know education is a very low priority for not only this government but previous one's.

As far as the protesting goes it is a free country. They are free to protest. I do not agree with the blocking of streets or occupation of buildings but I will take that any day over the red shirt ideas.

I believe in what Suthep is pushing for. He is not setting himself up as the head of the committee or for any other position. All though I am sure he would like it. As far as that go's so would I. In fact I would be perfect. I do not know enough about the details to comment. But I do know the difference between right and wrong is not the same as the difference between legal and illegal.

This government is not going to change in the next three generations if left to the current practice's. I do believe that there are many qualified Thailand loving open minded people to form a new interim Government and put teeth into the constitution and clarify it . I don't think it is that bad it just needs some tinkering with. Especially the clarification. To many opposite's in it.

What has happened in the streets is not a nice thing but hopefully it has pointed out the need to the people to change the way they are being ruled. It is for that fact that I back Suthep.

In my world I either back him or I say let the current corruption continue. As with yourself it is just my opinion and I really can not do any thing about it. Except at the personal level in helping my family get an education.

I hope the taxi driver recovers from his injury with no lasting damage, and is able to return to driving his taxi soon.

These are the inevitable consequences of taking to the streets and demanding what is basically revolution, overthrow of a political system and kidnap of high level state persons etc. There are people out there who are quick to lose their cool when they feel they are part of some great historic moment and that they are the only true representatives of righteousness and justice. This is always the danger of taking politics away from the debating-floor and discussion-table, and onto the streets. It is a magnet for some very unstable violent extremist types who feel that "might is right" and words are superfluous. This of course applies to both sides of this directionless and grim factional squabble.

Well what you say should hold true but if you have been following this government from the time it took power you would know that there was no opposition allowed in Parliament.

The Opposition was powerless because the sitting government had the majority with out the support of any one else. Remember it was the grass roots people who started this it was not a company or another political party. The unity came after there was several groups out there protesting without a leader. Suthep came along and took the reins and brought them all together. The PTP now listen but it is to late. They have painted themselves into a corner from which they can not escape.

Lets face it when we have a PRIME MINISTER who does not condemn groups that support her for suggesting openly separation of the country and when she finally does it is done on Facebook only after the Army has taken steps to deal with this obviously illegal action. We have a government that is completely ineffective. They can not even pay their bills.

As for the shooting well as you can see there is another side to the story. Is it true will we ever know who knows.

The one thing that is consistent is the anti opposition leaders have had to hire their own guards as has been shown time and again the police will not protect them.

Who tells the police what to do? I am not talking about public ordering them I am talking about the real orders that they follow.

Just because they are not in power that makes it right to kill and hurt innocent people???????

Name one remember you are the one who said innocent not me.

Why do the Thai judiciary bother with all this stuff. Their decisions are totally ignored by everybody and rarely enforced. Surely their time would be better spent at the golf course.

You have a valid point there.

All ready the Government is saying they are going to ignore the ruling if they don't like it.

Reshuffling top senior officials required a Cabinet resolution and royal endorsement. Therefore, the court ruling could be deemed interference, Kanin said.

What a bunch of <deleted>. The only thing they will listen to has to come from Dubai. Or have it shoved down their throats by the people. It should be their automatic duty to look after the welfare of the people and obey the law. Because the law has no teeth in it they just do as they please.

But you have to admit they are listening to the people now. The Prime Minister is in hiding.

I use Kasikorn. I have been dealing with them for 35+ years. My home bank is of no consequence as they all use transfer banks. The bank my bank uses is Wells Fargo. Transfers are slowed by a day since they switched from JP Morgan Chase. The US gov't has their nose in everything and I am sure this is the reason for the change. Different questions are asked.

Kasikorn is quick with putting money in your account. I do believe they charge 500 baht. Other banks have a similar charge and I am sure others have good luck with other banks.

Interesting. I have money on direct deposit into the Wells Fargo bank. It is not a great deal the minimum SS I don't even have to file a tax on it.

I was under the impression that the only way to get it transferred at a reasonable rate was with the bank of Bangkok.

Yes I would think they would have one in all the malls. Check Siam Electronics quite a few different machines there out side and up stairs

Was just at the Prom tonight….though the place appears empty, the restaurants were mainly full, and that is the reason we went there…..I think it will do just fine. Was at Central Fes today as well, and it was a bit too busy for my likes.

Did you find it a bit loud? I know I do.

I hope the Promenada makes it as I do think it is the nicest mall in Chiang Mai. Just needs more businesses that are in demand.

there are a lot of people out that way and the area is still growing.

Perhaps if the PDRC truly had the welfare of 'the people' at heart they would have started this 'oh so amazing' brainwave a hell of a lot sooner. Instead their actions, motivated by power hungry ambitions, have so far only been of massive detriment to Thailand.

Excuse me but power hungry ambitions require people looking for power.

All I have heard from the PDRC is plans to reform the government no names mentioned. Hard to amass power if you don't have people.

Now on the other hand we see certain people with power desperately trying to hang on to power.

A great big list of them and more trying to get on their list. They have even mentioned my way or we will divide the country. Then one of them had a moment of clarity and realized what they had said and now has them all trying to marginalize it.

Finally yes finally we see some action to plan for reform and do you think the PTP will send a representative. Not likely the way they have been fighting to hang on to their power. Why would they want to be a part of the answer to an honest government?

"have so far only been of massive detriment to Thailand the Shinawatra clan"

I took the liberty to correct a mistake for you no thanks needed.

Just what we need...MORE rice.....they can't even shift the mouldy stuff in storage. Flood the market and prices per tonne will drop even further. Perhaps every student up north should take economics 101 and understand about supply and demand.

They couldn't afford it. They would have to go out of country to get that kind of an education.

While I am glad to see Thailand finally do some thing remarkable. I like many am wondering what the short term effect will have on the industry. I can see the long term if this is the real McCoy having many rice growers seeking other plants to grow.

Great as it is if it is for real it will be a very painful transition.

While we may disagree on what protective regulation means, I think we agree that if democracy is to make it in Thailand, it needs one or more political parties representing upcountry. In addition, the Dem's have to, once again, become a political party, not boycott this and boycott that...

I had a similar discussion pre-protest, but as the only 'farang' in the room, I knew I didn't stand a chance. Sadly, if we had the discussion today, nobody will have budged from their position.

Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

Yes I'm sorry, I lapsed into the nomenclature of my peergroup (again!), I should have typed out the full explanation. Protective regulation as used in my group, is a convenient general grouping of any legal and ground-level system that protects citizens directly ; for example laws regulating the safety of rail / road / workplace / food / water / medicines. Laws that monitor and capture corrupt players can also fall both inside and outside this grouping, depending on the situation. It is a convenient umbrella term.

Re; Thailand, we need a seachange, and a new party which sweeps aside the rot and is genuinely passionate about reforms, and can not rest until their vision of a prosperous and stable nation is realised. I think if such a party emerged they would be welcomed by the electorate in a truly jaw-dropping way. I still believe that Thailand has the suppressed kinetic energy to surprise many doubters, once a new progressive party emerges, the long held-back progress could leap forward in a shocking way.

Thanks for the clarification. Often the laws are there, but the enforcement is not due to corruption. Such a party you mention would be a great start. For now, it would be part of a coalition, but not the major party of a coalition, since people have become used to getting money now, not promises of a better future. You can see it in the problems people are having with the PTP's unpaid IOU's.

It would take time, but it is needed for democracy to flourish. Hopefully we can see it in this life.

Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

Well it all looks good on paper and sounds good but where are the people going to come from to form this new party?

I have a little bit of a different view on the Democrats than most. I feel if they had not refused to join in the past election nothing would have changed. The PTP would have been back in power. Albeit with a few less seats. Still enough to run their my way or the Highway system. The Democrats were the opposition but the PTP with there red shirt coworkers had enough power to over look them. They were even not allowed to talk at times.

It would seem that the other parties agreed with the PTP way of governing so I would not look for much support from them in forming a new party bent on reform and improving the lot of the every day working Thai.

When there is a vote of 305 to 3 to white wash Thaksin it pretty well tells us where there priorities are. Defiantly 305 people who would be unsuitable for a new party to reform Thailand.

Where are the people to come from to form this new party and will the red shirts let them or try to stop them through intimidation and violence both methods they have used in order to gain the power they now have.

So as I see it you not only need the people but you have to find away to safely discard the trouble makers.

Yes Glacier is very reliable,have been with them since they started,I prefer the glass bottles

24x500ml 56 Bht, ,and in all this time never had a bad bottle,delivery twice a week,Sat and

Wed to me.

Recommend them and really the water is very good, don't know how they can deliver for

56 bht, theres a lot of work involved, cleaning bottles, filtering , ozonating the water, filling them,

loading on to trucks,then delivery to your home.

regards worgeordie

We use to use Glacier and they delivered to the door. Then one day they said no more. There was around 30 cases in the building. The funny part is that there is a restaurant in the building that they still deliver to. Go Figure.

We now use another company Pole Star and the management has taken care of the payments. Leave it at the desk and the management see's to it that it gets to your door 30 baht a case. I do miss the glass bottles though.

It doesn't matter where you eat in Thailand - The biggest restaurant or the smallest street stall, the hygiene conditions the food is prepared in and the supply chain of the food from farm to restaurant is abysmal (sorry for the understatement).

But, you have to eat, so take the usual precautions and at least try and buy/eat at the cleanest "looking" places. It doesn't really help, but you will feel as though you're at least trying.

Um....was at a big mall recently considering a big brand burger. Was inspecting the menu and salivating over a whopper burger (that's a giveaway) when I noticed Somchai in the food assembly area with his thumb up his nose. He then promptly gathered a bun, slapped on a pattie etc. and then the top bun. All with no gloves.

Even training provided by the big brands didn't stop his thumb getting up his nose, so I would second guess that the priority at his last toilet visit was popping a pimple and greasing his hair - as opposed to washing his hands.

Agreed it doesn't make a lot of difference. The thing is with a food cart you can see what is happening where as in a restaurant how many people inspect the kitchen. Even in a clean kitchen their is no guarantee of personal hygiene being enforced.

One other thing to look at is we are foreigners from supposedly locations with better hygiene in the restaurants. The Thai people have been eating this stuff for centuries and probably have a better tolerance to some of the things that we get sick on.

I say supposedly cleaner. I was involved in the states with the remodeling of several kitchens in well known restaurants. The hygiene level was poor and that is being generous. How ever the dining rooms were very nice.

he Anti Government had over 100,000 at their own expense come into Bangkok at one time.

yes, at their own expense...... the backers of the 'anti-gov' movement have very deep pockets,they can 'buy' a whole lot of people

And of course Thaksin can't.

Just consider the source. This is Chiang Mai and bound to be a lot of misinformation about the anti government protestors out there.

It is a shame we couldn't hear what they had to say. My money says if you understood Thai it would have been the same rhetoric as the red shirts spout. As I posted else where they are just trying to make more room for another leader. The present red shirt system does not leave enough room for a lot of nepotism.

Wonder if they had any good entertainment? Some of the anti protestors was darn good but seems to be lacking a lot lately.

Not a vegetarian myself but have from time to time enjoyed a vegetarian buffet on Soi 17. Have to admit it is an unknown as they do change their offerings from day to day. But I have always enjoyed them.

Is that "Khun Churn" (sp). If so, I've been told that they've moved to a less expensive area.

Correct, they moved to the back of beyond in the old cultural centre at the end of Wualai.

But across from their old place khun Mor is a safe bet. I always recommend our customers to go there as it has an extensive thai menu, you get absolute plate full.

The food is great but I don't like the ambience of the place. It looks good yet there is something homely missing and I can't put my finger on it.

They have a branch in central also now.

Is Wualai. the one where they have the Saturday night walking Street also known as the silver street.

Yes you are correct the fellow who introduced me to the one on Soi 17 said the place across the street from it was also very good.

around the corner from it is a good ice cream place. I found it to be costly.

I have a serious question for those with more knowledge about where the RTA recruits from?

If the RTA has a significant proportion of recruits from the North and East, as in Red areas, what do they think will happen if a civil war were to ever break out? Do you think these soldiers will stand and fight against their kin, or will the Army collapse and have many units classed as combat innefective/Non Mission Capable?

It's all very well saying things like "Send the Army In" but it's not really that simple, loyalties within the Army will be tested and stretched to the limit, how would you react if you were ordered to go and "Crush" a village that you belonged to?

Last thing Thailand needs is a civil war..

If civil war should breakout God forbid IMO it will be fought mainly for control of Bangkok and possibly Chiang Mai. I don't think there will ever be an instance of the military or others wanting to 'crush' a village as was done in Vietnam back in the day. The problem in a civil war is you won't know who the enemy is.

I agree with the Bangkok part, but why would anyone fight for control of Chiang Mai? There is absolutely nothing of value there? Just alot of crazy red shirts and a few tourists.

There is no vital infrastructure, no important natural resources, no harbour. It may be an important tradepoint to some neighbouring countries, but not the only one, so can easily be replaced. Further, those tradepoints matter mainly to the people in Chiang Mai, not to the rest of the country. Most international trade is done by ship. Yes, there may be alot of culture and beautiful scenery, but none of that is important in terms of war.

You might as well try to take Koh Samui :-)

There's Doi Inthanon just up the road, the highest point in SE Asia. The American's thought it important enough to build a listening.... sorry.... research station on the top of it.

IMO Chiang Mai may very well be a strategic location if the sh*t storm comes. The reds will have to control Chiang Mai and Bangkok. The VKong felt it was necessary to capture and control Saigon in 1975. IMO the control of Bangkok and possibly Chiang Mai would be necessary in order to stand off any kind of strong resistance. Bangkok is the Prize.

Saigon was the financial and business center of the country, the port to the world, and a main entry point for the US army, so of course the VC wanted it. Are you comparing Saigon and Chiang Mai? Or did I misunderstand your post? Chiang Mai is the center of ... nothing, and I fail to see that it has more strategic value than say Koh Samui?

Yes the Army may well be divided.

But let us not overlook the fact that many of these soldiers have been given a taste of life out side a village that is strictly controlled by a head man and may not be that happy to keep it that way.

The Court shouldn't have any problems with red shirt armed democracy guards any more than it didn't have a problem with Suthep's democracy armed guards. If the law is the law, the number of guards shouldn't be relevant for either side.

So long as democracy guards behave "peacefully" to express their freedom of speech doing things like padlock public buildings, follow people into shopping malls and attempt to kidnap them, beat up police, block public thoroughfares, occupy public lands and buildings, shutdown tv broadcasting, threaten to kidnap PDRC leaders, initmidate PDRC-friendly businesses, police are not empowered to use force against such guards. If the court does rule against red shirt armed democracy guards, then clearly it is biased in favor of PDRC and must be deemed "corrupt." I say all this as "tongue-in-cheek" but the cumulatve actions by "independent" agencies and courts seemed as a minimum inconsistently applied to politically opposing parties.

You're trying to confuse the issue at hand by suggesting that Suthep's and the PDRC guards are 'democracy guards'. They are not, they're supposed to offer the anti-government protesters some security from violence which the police was unable or unwilling to provide them. Not that those guards have been much successful in that either.

The red-shirt 'democracy guards' are to 'protect democracy' something the UDD is supposed to be doing for a while already. No idea why we would need one more, separate red-shirt guard, aren't the MiB enough?

I think they need another red shirt organization to make room for some idiot to have a group to lead. Nepotism in the red shirts as it stands now is to limiting so they are branching out to make more room.

I just checked with Netflix and all I got was it is unavailable in your country.

Not been even reasonably close to being a techy maybe some of the other posters have the answer. I just know that on my true home page it has Netflix and that is what I got when I hit on it.

How do you find the quality of the picture on your Apple?

Not a vegetarian myself but have from time to time enjoyed a vegetarian buffet on Soi 17. Have to admit it is an unknown as they do change their offerings from day to day. But I have always enjoyed them.

<snip>

Perhaps I am doing it wrong I ask for X number of Baht's. Would I be better off asking for Canadian currency. Then exchanging it over here?

Without doubt (at least in my experience) it is always best to ask your home country bank to sent in home currency and let your Thai bank handle the exchange rate to baht. Thai banks always offer a much better rate than you home country.

If I understand you correctly I am better off with my CIBC Visa in the bank asking for $2,000 Canadian as opposed to 60,000 baht. I use those numbers arbitrary as they are never the same value and I often need more for upcoming school or insurance payments.

I suppose if the bank would do that I could then order the opposite and compare. My credit card will bear that much cash advance.

The $5 handling charge on each transaction is negligible at that amount.

Am going to have to look into the transfer of funds. The bank of Siam tells me I can if I have a form filled in by the CIBC. Will set that up next time I am back there. Don't know how it will work out money wise. My U S dollars are not worth the time.