WhamBam

Vote LEAVE

For the sake of the NHS. It is being overwhelmed by immigrants claiming free health care and getting away with it. Hospitals are struggling. People with H.I.V., cancer and other serious problems are getting free care none have paid in to get.

For the sake of the likes of British Steel where thousands of jobs have also been lost because of E.U. rules saying our government cannot help the steel industry, yet the likes of France ignore similar rules.

To regain the ability to rule ourselves with our own laws. Since we joined the Common Market in 1973, over 50% of our laws are dictated to us by Brussels.

Just a few reasons to LEAVE

Soon.... soon, (I hope - not wanting to scud the result) we will be OUT

Then we can cheer. Well, some of us can

IF we vote remain, we can all be under the thumb of the non elected idiots who run the E.U. and live to regret it.

Watch them steamroller new policies through and then people say... "Oh, what have we done!!"

All I can say about the English game last night is .... pathetic.

Vape in the condo / house but you have to smoke ciggies when outside (in the pub for example) to get a nicotene hit, if you need one.

Yes, madness.

For the life of me, I cannot understand why people would actually vote to live under autocratic rule that is akin to dictatorship. To live in a country where your own government has little or no say in laws, rules and regulations that are made. To be told by foreign people what taxes to pay, where you can fish, what armed forces you have to join and so much more.
To have foreign police on your own soil.
And to pay for the privilege.

Where else in the world would the people stand for this??

Would Americans vote to be ruled by the Mexicans? Or vice-versa? Or Thailand to be ruled by a group from Asia combining the likes of Vietnam, Cambodia and Burma (Myanmar)?

Where else in the world would allow themselves to be overun by foreigners and be told to do so?

Yet all these things and much more is what is happening in Europe now. And there is much worse to come.

Where do these sheeple come from? Why are they so easily led and herded by dogs from other countries who have nothing in common with themselves?

Madness, sheer madness.
The lunatics appear to have taken over the asylum that is Europe and those who vote remain are more crazy sheeple IMHO of course.

For those predicting doom and gloom for the UK economy after BREXIT ....

Germany’s Largest Bank Says Massive UK Growth After Brexit – BBC and Remainers Silent

Link here

http://www.breitbart.com/london/2016/06/15/germans-largest-bank-says-massive-uk-grown-brexit-bbc-remainers-silent/

I prefer wall fans to the smaller table top type.

A good free standing floor fan is better too IMHO than a desktop one.

No screws to undo to take a wall fan down. Simply lift it off the bracket and clean the same as any other fan.

Ceiling fans are good IF they are properly balanced. I have been in several places where these wobble so much I was wary of sleeping beneath one.

Mr Truell, one of the leading donors to the Tory party has now said he has stopped his donations, a move on from his earlier threat to do so according to this article.....

http://www.breitbart.com/london/2016/06/13/top-conservative-donor-withdraws-support-irresponsible-remain-campaign/

Edi Truell, a pensions advisor, said Mr Cameron’s warning this weekend over the alleged damage Brexit would do to pensions was the final straw in a long list of “unfair” claims by the Remain campaign.

If the various topics I have read in the newspapers are to be believed the £ will be expected to take a hit in the initial few months after BREXITbut in the longer term it is expected to rally again.

I am no expert in these matters - far from it - so I go by what I read.

I DO notice though that the bigger the company / financial institution, the more they are crying over the thought of BREXIT becoming a reality and that is why the markets are suffering slightly regards the £. Seems to me it is being rigged to scare us into vorting to stay in the autocratic E.U.

These huge corporations are the ones with the most to lose.

Yesterday? I was reading about the RHA (Road Haulage Association) and they too were saying the small to medium companies are the ones hardest hit by E.U. regulations. The largest companies are all for remaining.

Yet, it is - I believe - the small to medium companies that employ most people overall.

It seems then that the big companies will benefit and the others will not if we remain in the E.U.

I am not rich by any means but I am willing to take a hit on my £ FX rates in the shorter term to see a Free Britain with its own soveriengty, no E.U. army, no E.U police force and to be able to have our law making abilities.

Dictatorship by autocrats be damned. Freedom and BREXIT is my dream.

Cameron under more pressure over his scaremongering campaign for Remain.

Mr Truell - one of the Tory parties main contributors has said he will pull back from funding the party while Cameron is still in charge.

He is also quoted as saying, “The much greater risk is remaining within the EU, they've got explicit plans to destroy British pensions."

And

Former foreign secretary John Nott suspended his own membership from the Tory party because of "poisonous" David Cameron's "tirade of fear" against a Brexit.

It seems Cameron is doing BREXIT a whole world of good

And now the remain campaign are so scared of a BREXIT that they have asked Cameron to stand down and let Labour Party Corbyn take over the reigns. Yet the Labour party is already split over BREXIT with - it seems - the party haemorraging support to BREXIT.

For some reason, Corbyn tends to forget that many immigrants are being shovelled into Labour and 'working class' constituencies. But the people know what is happening and the people do not like it.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-36485985

I had read about this but could not find the link

In my view it speaks volumes.

Thanks for posting this MJP.

I read there is now a 19 point lead for BREXIT.

I seriously doubt the truth of any poll, but hope deep down in my heart that it is such a huge lead. If it is and we really do vote OUT there will be dancing and partying in the streets.

I have been MIA for a little while - living life - but I think it is great to see the general populous coming to their senses and giving BREXIT a 10 point lead. It seems there is light at the end of the tunnel and common sense seems to be prevailing.

The remain brigade really seem to have outdone themselves since the live debates began on television. I wonder how many toes they have left, if any, after shooting themselves in the foot so much.

I am hoping for massive celebrations after the OUT vote

Another thing I've noticed about Brexiteers is that they seem to think that they can have their cake and eat it.

Take Nontabury for instance - does he seriously think that UK will retain the same levels of trade with the EU if we are not a member? but when I point out that international road transport will suffer, he starts talking "scaremonger" as in plagues and earth quakes.

Will Japan continue to increase involvement in the car industry when UK is outside? No of course not....but Nontabury talks about plagues etc "What about the plague. The earthquake,resulting in the UK sinking into the Atlantic,surely you can make up some more scare stories. Pathetic!!"

Not exactly a counter argument by any definition, but pretty obviously a case of believing one can have one's cake and eat?

As I recall, Nissan (Sunderland) said they would keep their factory there if we exit Europe.

Canada, New Zealand and Australia amongst other countries have said they see no problems trading with a U.K. that is outside of the E.U. And also, I seem to recall, those same countries saying trade with the UK is stifled by us being in the E.U. due to E.U. rules and red tape aimed at keeping much of the trade within the E.U. itself where possible.

Many countries in the E.U. will still actively trade with the U.K.

Do you think they will stop selling BMW's in the U.K.? Maybe they will stop selling Volvos or other makes of cars.

Do you think the Spanish (for one) will want to stop selling their fruit and veg to us? Or their package holidays?

Many other countries in the E.U. itself will need to trade with us too even if we are not a club member.

To me it is scaremongering to say counties in the E.U. will not trade with us. It may be that we get better deals in some respects too.

As I recall, Nissan (Sunderland) said they would keep their factory there if we exit Europe.

Canada, New Zealand and Australia amongst other countries have said they see no problems trading with a U.K. that is outside of the E.U. And also, I seem to recall, those same countries saying trade with the UK is stifled by us being in the E.U. due to E.U. rules and red tape aimed at keeping much of the trade within the E.U. itself where possible.

Many countries in the E.U. will still actively trade with the U.K.

Do you think they will stop selling BMW's in the U.K.? Maybe they will stop selling Volvos or other makes of cars.

Do you think the Spanish (for one) will want to stop selling their fruit and veg to us? Or their package holidays?

Many other countries in the E.U. itself will need to trade with us too even if we are not a club member.

To me it is scaremongering to say counties in the E.U. will not trade with us. It may be that we get better deals in some respects too.

*****

- I would take issue with every point you make - your premises are shaky in the extreme and without any reasonable foundation. They fly in the face of common sense.......you seem to have some vague idea that “things were better before” - which is of course totally incorrect and one can never go back to the past - especially one that never existed.

Nissan - yes- they did and I covered that - essentially this is the usual diplomatic approach of the Japanese...... just check what the Japanese said/say about Thailand and this has resulted in an 81% reduction in investment this year.

Of course they won't simply "jump ship" they have money invested, but as the purpose of the factories was to export to EU it is unlikely they will either invest further or continue for long.

Yes- they did and I covered that earlier - just check what the Japanese say about Thailand and this has resulted in an 81% reduction in investment last year alone.

Of course they won't simply "jump ship" they have money invested, but as the purpose of the factories was to export to EU it is unlikely they will either invest further or continue for long.

Now as for your call to trade with “Canada, New Zealand and Australia”

Firstly look at the size of the market,

Canada - 36 million

New Zealand - 4.5 million

Australia - 23 million

EU over half a BILLION!

then look at the distances - UK is PART of Europe, the countries you talk about are scattered all over the planet; we are thousands of miles from those markets - what are we going to sell them anyway that they can’t get closer to home??

BTW - You will note too that ALL Japanese motor manufacturing has or will cease in Australia within the next year. Despite what they said about 4 years ago - it doesn’t take long to announce a change in policy in diplomatic terms.

“Do you think they will stop selling BMW's in the U.K.?”

No but going back to your better times....do you remember how much a BMW/Mercedes/Citroen/Volvos used to cost compared to a similar model built in UK back in the 60s?- all cars built in Europe had a duty slapped on them to protect the British motor industry. They were phenomenally expensive. .... and of course in many countries (e.g. Thailand) still have a huge tax loading on their prices- so yes they will still sell BMWs but don’t expect the price to remain the same. The car market and cars available will take on the appearance of the Thai market, with tax incentives for the Japanese factories to continue making vehicles but in reduced capacity for a “home market”.

Britain is no longer a manufacturing country - it isn’t going to change back by leaving the EU, it is just going to reduce it’s potential service economy and have to introduce import duties to protect what ever manufacturing remains after major companies sift to the EU mainland.

As for agriculture - some of the biggest sufferers will be the farmers who have benefitted from EU support for decades and a market that supports farmers - they will either have to be subsidized by the UK government or compete on price alone.

One thing you can be sure of border controls, duties and resulting increased transport costs will QUICKLY reduce the variety of gods (including Spanish tomatoes and Oranges - on the supermarket shelves. AGAIN do you remember in “times gone by “? The range of foods we had on our shop shelves - (we didn’t even have supermarkets in most towns. So if you think food will remain the same, you are in for a MAJOR disappointment.

Package Holidays?

Now where have you been? I used to run a low cost resort in Spain and the package holidays you talk about are in real trouble -they can’t pare down costs enough........ the only way they were able to run was cheap flights and bus services down to Spain. Both of these will disappear within 2 years of joining, there will no longer be a borderless route between UK and Spain the processing at borders will increase both time and costs and of course we will have to see how the pound progresses - they may just become to expensive for us.

The original package holidays started when the UK had a considerably more expensive COL than Spain and fuel for flights was nothing. That kind of holiday is a tiny portion of the market - when was the last time you visited Benidorm?

All these so called “markets” you talk about are in fact much smaller than you seem to realise - Spain doesn’t need UK tourists - they have a huge market from all over the EU - just look at the Thai tourist market - a decade ago Westerners were number one now it is Russia and China -

Exit the EU Spain will keep their holidays but they will finish with the UK.

As for scare mongering - that is just a cliché, a sound-bite used by those without a real argument.

The truth is we will HAVE to trade with Europe - but if we leave it will not be a PART of Europe, it will be as an unpopular outsider.

We have 2 years to negotiate out and then as long as we want to re-negotiate the thousands of deals with have become accustomed to, and from a position of disadvantage - who in there right mind would do that?

things change, there is no “golden era” we can return to...

We can happily trade apparently.........

Some of the most eminent legal experts in the field (of trading in and outside the E.U.), the Lawyers for Britain research discredits claims by Chancellor George Osborne that the UK would find it “very difficult” to renegotiate trade deals with 27 EU members and 50 global trading partners.

Director-general Martin Littlewood said: “This nails the lie from the Remain camp that if we were to leave the EU Britain would find itself at ground zero, or year zero.

“In fact, we would have in place nearly all the arrangements that we could possibly want and we would have plenty of time to exercise flexibility from there.”

Britain is already a signatory to more than 50 trade deals of varying degrees of importance between the EU and nations outside Europe.

They include tariff-free South Korea and Switzerland, both top 10 trading partners for the UK.

Along the same lines, here is some other news on the trade front from Martin Howe QC, one of Britain’s leading EU experts.

He says “Britain would have existing trade deals in place” from the first day after Brexit."

Britain is already a signatory to more than 50 trade deals of varying degrees of importance between the EU and nations outside Europe.

They include tariff-free South Korea and Switzerland, both top 10 trading partners for the UK. And exports to South Korea account for a £5billion boon to Britain’s economy every year while those to Switzerland represent £7.3billion.

You see, far from believing the U.K. will crash and burn in the trade world, there are plenty of opportunities.

Maybe some 'Doom and Gloom' people should realise the U.K. has a life - a Trade Life - outside the E.U.

And you say about this "Golden Era". Well, it seems we can have a Golden Era outside of the E.U.

Tight so n so's

Etihad had a delay on my luggage (ok, not the same as destroying the contents) but they compensated me 1,400 Baht a day for each day and gave me 4,200 Baht. They also kept in contact with me and had the baggage delivered to my condo in Pattaya. A world of difference to how this customer was treated by the Thai airline.

All you truckers out their..wave good-bye to continental work as Britain's trade with Europe slides away. bye-bye Eddie Stobbart

All you car workers - the only reason that Japanese manufacturers have plants in UK is so they have a foothold in the EU to avoid the restrictions on imports of vehicles from outside the EU. just like Thailand where thanks to the current admin investment is down by 81%, so the Uk will suffer the same as manu multi-nationals lose interest in investing in a country that doesn't have the benefits of being inside the EU.

...and while you're at it say good-bye to London as one of the top financial centres in the world - that accolade will finally go to Germany

What about the plague. The earthquake,resulting in the UK sinking into the Atlantic,surely you can make up some more scare stories. Pathetic!!

Another thing I've noticed about Brexiteers is that they seem to think that they can have their cake and eat it.

Take Nontabury for instance - does he seriously think that UK will retain the same levels of trade with the EU if we are not a member? but when I point out that international road transport will suffer, he starts talking "scaremonger" as in plagues and earth quakes.

Will Japan continue to increase involvement in the car industry when UK is outside? No of course not....but Nontabury talks about plagues etc "What about the plague. The earthquake,resulting in the UK sinking into the Atlantic,surely you can make up some more scare stories. Pathetic!!"

Not exactly a counter argument by any definition, but pretty obviously a case of believing one can have one's cake and eat?

As I recall, Nissan (Sunderland) said they would keep their factory there if we exit Europe.

Canada, New Zealand and Australia amongst other countries have said they see no problems trading with a U.K. that is outside of the E.U. And also, I seem to recall, those same countries saying trade with the UK is stifled by us being in the E.U. due to E.U. rules and red tape aimed at keeping much of the trade within the E.U. itself where possible.

Many countries in the E.U. will still actively trade with the U.K.

Do you think they will stop selling BMW's in the U.K.? Maybe they will stop selling Volvos or other makes of cars.

Do you think the Spanish (for one) will want to stop selling their fruit and veg to us? Or their package holidays?

Many other countries in the E.U. itself will need to trade with us too even if we are not a club member.

To me it is scaremongering to say counties in the E.U. will not trade with us. It may be that we get better deals in some respects too.

I think most of us have fallen victim to Pattaya snatches at some stage.

Some even keep going back for more.

In all my visits to Pattaya I've never been mugged, robbed or snatched from and neither have any of my friends.

Not sure where you get this 'most' from. Maybe others will shed some light on this - if they have or have not been.

I think you've led a very sheltered life. One of the few here in the land of (cynical) smiles

On the other hand, maybe I haven't

I guess the above 2 posters are not really up on British slang

On the other hand, masybe some of us are but we took the word in context, not out of context

I think most of us have fallen victim to Pattaya snatches at some stage.

Some even keep going back for more.

In all my visits to Pattaya I've never been mugged, robbed or snatched from and neither have any of my friends.

Not sure where you get this 'most' from. Maybe others will shed some light on this - if they have or have not been.

The Times, The Telegraph and the Mail all reporting on the new E.U. army. (Though this was reported on Breitbart a couple of months ago, the mainstream press seem to be just getting onto it).

The details to be kept under wraps until after the referendum - I wonder why they would do that?

So, all our armed service men and women who swear allegiance to the Queen and countrey would all have to break those vows? What about the S.A.S. - the best in the world at what they do? When they come under E.U. rule how good will they be then?

I notice too that Germany seems to be one of the countries striving to get this E.U. army set up.

I wonder what language will be spoken?

Yet another nail in the coffin of Britain - what once was a great country. I will vote OUT.

A previous poster used the term “inclusiveness” as an ideal for the citizens of the EU, believing

that the umbrella of the EU would “magically” (my word) have them all pulling together towards a common goal, united in a single purpose. How to achieve this “Utopian” state? There are no mechanisms, as yet, in place to promote a “European” patriotism. It remains a disparate and polyglot and economically unequal grouping which the EU is trying to cobble together as an “entity”. It is my belief that the EU will have largely disintegrated long before deep feelings of patriotism can be instilled or inculcated in the population, but that’s another story altogether.

I was brought up to be fiercely patriotic, although not "jingoistic" as previous generations had been.

I was proud of my country and my citizenship of it. I see nothing particularly wrong with that, although DD finds it something of an embarrassment. Perhaps it is an anachronism in this day and age? I don’t know. I would need to be persuaded.

However, I am quite certain that without some overarching program in place within the EU to create feelings of pride, belonging and, yes, patriotism in its structure, its denizens are unlikely to ever be able to coalesce into some meaningful body able to compete with the other major political and economic structures in the world at large. And they will possibly, further down the line, also become

unleadable and ungovernable because of it. Watch out for a strongman to emerge as a force for leadership in this scenario!

How to do away with individual emotional National Anthems, National sporting teams, and National Pride? It will absolutely become necessary if “Europe” is ever to work. This is not some Orwellian fantasy, by the way. The EU Commissioners will have recognized this, I am sure, and will be putting plans in place, no doubt getting ready to create a separate department and appoint a czar, mandarin or other functionary to oversee the process to its conclusion.

.

Is this what the British really want to ally themselves with? Surely not?

I recall reading - a while ago - that there will be no 'England' football team in the future, no Scots or Welsh teams either. We will have a 'Euro' team. A bit like the U.S.A. or Russia having their own teams. This has, apparently, been decided by the E.U. already but they are waiting to see what happens with the vote.

There were exercises recently in the U.K. of the E.U. 'army' that the E.U. want in place of a British army. It was on a small scale but obviously seems to be the way forward for the E.U.

The E.U. want a European police force too from what I have read.

Then there was the articles about England, Wales and Scotland becoming 'zones' in the E.U. with their own Czar(s). This would be further into the future as I recall.

Extremely interesting reading. I am not all surprised if these things are on the European Union's drawing board. I think we all have a pretty good idea, now, of how the EU Commissioners think, and what their "Grand Design" is, going forward. And where will it end? Will the United Kingdom eventually and ultimately just become a "province" of the European Union?

Do you recall what the source of the article you read, was?

As far as I recall, it was at Breitbart.

They seem to be one of the few places that give more information. I believe they were the first to break the news of the Cologne assaults over the new year.

With a lot of the British sites 'supressed' it is one of my sources of information.

A previous poster used the term “inclusiveness” as an ideal for the citizens of the EU, believing that the umbrella of the EU would “magically” (my word) have them all pulling together towards a common goal,

united in a single purpose. How to achieve this “Utopian” state? There are no mechanisms, as yet, in place to promote a “European” patriotism. It remains a disparate and polyglot and economically unequal grouping which the EU is trying to cobble together as an “entity”. It is my belief that the EU will have largely disintegrated long before deep feelings of patriotism can be instilled or inculcated in the population, but that’s another story altogether.

I was brought up to be fiercely patriotic, although not "jingoistic" as previous generations had been. I was proud of my country and my citizenship of it. I see nothing particularly wrong with that, although DD finds it something of an embarrassment. Perhaps it is an anachronism in this day and age? I don’t know. I would need to be persuaded.

However, I am quite certain that without some overarching program in place within the EU to create feelings of pride, belonging and, yes, patriotism in its structure, its denizens are unlikely to ever be able to coalesce into some meaningful body able to compete with the other major political and economic structures in the world at large. And they will possibly, further down the line, also become unleadable and ungovernable because of it. Watch out for a strongman to emerge as a force for leadership in this scenario!

How to do away with individual emotional National Anthems, National sporting teams, and National Pride? It will absolutely become necessary if “Europe” is ever to work. This is not some Orwellian fantasy, by the way. The EU Commissioners will have recognized this, I am sure, and will be putting plans in place, no doubt getting ready to create a separate department and appoint a czar, mandarin or other functionary to oversee the process to its conclusion.

.

Is this what the British really want to ally themselves with? Surely not?

I recall reading - a while ago - that there will be no 'England' football team in the future, no Scots or Welsh teams either. We will have a 'Euro' team. A bit like the U.S.A. or Russia having their own teams. This has, apparently, been decided by the E.U. already but they are waiting to see what happens with the vote.

There were exercises recently in the U.K. of the E.U. 'army' that the E.U. want in place of a British army. It was on a small scale but obviously seems to be the way forward for the E.U.

The E.U. want a European police force too from what I have read.

Then there was the articles about England, Wales and Scotland becoming 'zones' in the E.U. with their own Czar(s). This would be further into the future as I recall.

Something i find quite strange is that such a high proportion of TV posters support Brexit and from the comments on here many have significant nationalistic or patriotic reasons for wanting UK to leave. So why are you living in Thailand and not the UK ??

I spend my time in both Thailand and the U.K.

Is it so strange that I do not want my children and grandchildren to be brought up in a country ruled by non elected officials?

for me personally, I can be nationalistic and still travel the world and stay where I want and when I want.

Also, the U.K. is where my money is, my house and many friends and family. That gives me good reason to want to be involved and be able to vote on the referendum.

"The country, along with the rest in the Schengen, was ordered by Brussels to accept thousands of migrants or face a £195,000 fine (250,000) per person rejected."

This from Hungary who are voting on whether to let more migrants into their country. Hungary feel they are being bullied by the E.U. Now, who would have thought that the E.U would try to force such a thing through? And this coming from elected representatives? NO.

We do need to vote OUT to stop our own beautiful country being under an E.U. dictatorship.

IMHO of course

So Whambam, what would you suggest doing about the refugee crisis? Separately, in this age of global media, what would you do about economic migration?

I'm all ears!

Which 'refugees'?

Have you seen how many of these 'refugees' are fit, healthy young men? These should be back in their own countries fighting to help liberate them. Instead, they move into Europe where they try ti intimidate the local populations. There are reports of them patrolling streets insisting life should be lived their way.

Women are harassed for wearing western style clothing. Women and children are accosted in streets, on trains, in swimming pools.

These 'immigrants should be deported back to their own countires.

I see no reason why these 'immigrants' should be forced onto any country that does not want them.

The women and children - and there seem to be very few of these - should be given safe haven in the FIRST safe country they land in. This should be a temporary measure until their own countries are deemed safe once again (which - admittedly - may take some time). But these genuine refugees should not then be allowed to have all their dozens of relatives join them. They, also, should not be allocated to a country that does not want them, but remain in the safe countries they land in.

If Turkey - as the E.U. says - is a safe place, then they should stay there, not be shipped to Europe.

I suppose you would have them flood into the U.K. and live here on benefits, get free housing, white goods and free schooling? They do not integrate wherever they go.

There are reports today that another refugee place has been torched in Italy. That would make it the 3rd time they have torched this particular place. A safe place where they are looked after and given shelter. Not that it means much to them.

"The country, along with the rest in the Schengen, was ordered by Brussels to accept thousands of migrants or face a £195,000 fine (€250,000) per person rejected."

This from Hungary who are voting on whether to let more migrants into their country. Hungary feel they are being bullied by the E.U. Now, who would have thought that the E.U would try to force such a thing through? And this coming from elected representatives? NO.

We do need to vote OUT to stop our own beautiful country being under an E.U. dictatorship.

IMHO of course