johnnybangkok

7 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

LOL. I gave up the opportunity to earn the really big bucks in the Aussie mines to become a nurse. I did that for decades. Did those that I sacrificed to save care- no. Did a grateful nation give me thanks and a big pension- no. What I got was bully managers and a low wage. If I could go back to when I decided to do it , would I do it again- never in a million years. Would I tell anyone else to do it- no way.

I had empathy by the bucket load when I started- not so much at the end.

You can keep your empathy- I'd rather have earned the big bucks and be living on a nice Thai beach right now.

 

PS. I didn't give it up sooner as I had to give it up to realise just how bad it was. I was pretty indoctrinated when I was doing it.

 

I can't think of a single situation where a lack of empathy has benefitted a situation but I can think of several were no empathy has created problems - Nazis/Jews, Cambodian genocide, Rwanda etc.   

I'm sorry your own personal experiences have left you so bitter but you should maybe try not to project your own failings on to others who don't feel the same way. The world is a diverse place filled with happy and unhappy people but if we all felt the way you feel and gave up on our empathy, can you imagine just how unhappy it would soon become for us all? 

3 hours ago, Mick501 said:

Living proof that the ability to cope with reality is not essential for life, let alone forum posts.   

The only proof here is that a play on words is well above your head.

Just for clarification since you seem to need it spelled out; we understand the reality he is POTUS. We just can't believe it (get it?)

9 hours ago, lkv said:

Yeah, millions of deaths from flu last year, and you cried for each and every one of them.

 

So I take it we're not having tea together, no?

“Millions of deaths from flu last year”? she also said you were prone to exaggeration. 
Happy to have tea together though. At a safe social distance of course. 

2 hours ago, lkv said:

Thank you so much for the warm wishes.

 

I did pass on the message to her, whilst she is happy that you care and she appreciates your concerns, she told me to tell you not to worry, as this is a flu virus part of the coronaviruses family, and we all have to go through it at some point, sooner or later.

She called me too and thanked me for my concern. She also asked me to ask you not to visit.

Something about you being inconsiderate.

1 hour ago, SMEinBangkok said:

And to your limited understanding of human society, we can add passive-aggressive....haha!

 

Oh...is that more of your empathy for the masses?

Like most, normal, functioning members of society, I do have 'empathy for the masses' 

I'll make an exception for you though as you're just rude.

1 hour ago, SMEinBangkok said:

Sounds like something straight out of the Communist Manifesto....

 

If you had any real concern or empathy for the "masses", then you would go with the 99.96% of the world's population that's completely unaffected by this virus (that's a pretty big mass, right?).  But, you don't have any concern for anyone other than that fearful face that stares back at you everyday.

Does the face that stares back at you look anything like this? ???? or is it more ????. No. no I got it.............. it's this isn't it ????

Just now, thaibeachlovers said:

I don't take that seriously because for the 4 weeks during lockdown thousands of people every week were mingling freely in supermarkets ( no social distancing or masks ). The evidence of my eyes does not support your contention that we are all doomed if we mingle.

How many caught it in my area- none.

Yes because your 5 square miles is exactly the same as the whole of the rest of the world. 'I didn't see it with my own eyes, therefore it can't be happening' line of rebuttal.

8 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

I'm elderly and I wish they had done that. The recession/ depression to come will ruin so many lives and the lack of tax puts my pension at risk.

Me, me , me

2 hours ago, SMEinBangkok said:

This graph, like so many others, should be studied as an example of the lack of basic math and analysis skills in the vast majority of the world's population.  It's essentially nothing more than a cartoon with unlabeled x and y axis, and visually, the same area contained in each 'equation'.

 

Nearly all of the reactions to this virus have been exaggerated by a few well-meaning, but frightened people.  NONE of their predications regarding it have come true, but one from the 'opposition' has.  Global economic disaster with no plan or understanding of how to recover from it.

 

Let's take a quick look down memory lane:

3 to 5% mortality - Now looking at around .5%

Hospitals overwhelmed - Not one listed by name so far

Much more deadly than any other respiratory illness - Not according to US cases and data from the CDC

Social distancing, lock downs, business closures are the only solution - And yet the countries that have fared the worse are the ones who applied this in the most draconian terms and the others that didn't have fared better.  It's counter intuitive and it'll take time to determine what measures worked or didn't, but the results are NOT uniform.

Don't wear a mask because it won't help and you're hurting health care workers.

Wear a mask unless you're a heartless monster.

 

And on and on....the same thing is playing out in comments here and on other forums.  The catastrophe ghouls know everything about the virus because they're listening to all of the experts....of which none exist because this is the first one in modern history.  

 

Here's a 'novel' solution.  If you're old, and especially if you're a man, with underlying health conditions, then YOU shouldn't go to work, YOU should self-isolate, YOU should practice social distancing, YOU should wear a mask.

 

Oops...almost forgot.  Mankind has only eliminated two globally-present, disease-causing viruses in the past.  Smallpox and Rinderpest.  It took effective vaccines and a decades long public health campaign.  So....eliminating the virus isn't a realistic option.

'3 to 5% mortality - Now looking at around .5%' - Thanks to self-isolation and social distancing

'Hospitals overwhelmed - Not one listed by name so far' - Thanks to self-isolation and social distancing

'Much more deadly than any other respiratory illness' - Not according to US cases and data from the CDC - Thanks to self-isolation and social distancing.

'Here's a 'novel' solution.  If you're old, and especially if you're a man, with underlying health conditions, then YOU shouldn't go to work, YOU should self-isolate, YOU should practice social distancing, YOU should wear a mask'.

Ah yes, the VERY old suggestion that people will be so responsible and caring of others that they'll self-regulate to a point that this all goes away. Self-regulations has proven to work so well in the past that I hear there is now no longer drunk drivers, we don't need speed limits and theres no video security anywhere as no one steals any more. They're actually thinking of disbanding all courts now as you know, what's the point when everyone is so just so damn responsible.  

12 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

I'm old, and a man, and up to me I wouldn't do any of that except social distancing ( because I don't want others to blame me if they catch it ). I'm retired so I don't work anyway.

If I die I die, and I have a do not resuscitate living will. I'm not going to hide in my room like a frightened child if I have the choice.

 

Exactly the problem with giving people a 'choice'. All you can think of is how it all effects you where the real problem is whilst you are waltzing around trying desperately to social distance but failing miserably, you can be infecting so many other people.

Why can't you boomer generation understand it's not JUST about yourself? Others are at risk and you will never get blamed for someone else catching it because someone else will not know who they caught it from if everyone is just allowed to mingle freely.

And I'm glad you're happy with 'If I die I die'. Many of us with many, many more years to go are most definately not.  

4 hours ago, RJRS1301 said:

I thought I would share some information regarding my niece who was a fit 35 year old female, with no underlying health issues.

The woman was diagnosed 59 days ago, now considered "recovered".

Still living with ongoing gastrointestinal cramps, ( had to be hospitalised for those following discharge after her initial 14 days treatment), continuing cardiac problems ( which did not exist prior to infection) remains short of breath on exertion, continuing fatigue, problems with balance.

This is a woman who runs a farm, is a volunteer firefighter, and fitness freak, prior to infection with Sar2Covid virus.

 

Thank you for sharing this and showing a human face to the consequences of everyones actions. These are real people we are talking about and although it sounds like your niece is still suffering (and I'm genuinely sorry to hear that), thankfully she has not joined the growing list of those that can't suffer any more.

2 hours ago, Mama Noodle said:

 

Flu shots only cover some viruses and are only 40-50% effective. Pneumonia vaccines do not exist unless talking about pneumococcal bacteria.

I tell you what then, why don't you not take any of them and since you are so eager to get everything up and running, why don't you become the first to head to your local bar/restaurant/mall, shaking hands and mingling with the masses. I mean surely that'll be fine or are we only talking big when it's others who are getting infected and dying?

Self-isolation and the likes is there to protect the elderly and 'at risk' but when I hear many of the comments of you baby boomer generation perhaps I should adopt your own stance and just say to hell with it, let the dice fall as they may.

15 hours ago, Mama Noodle said:

 

In other words, you are staying afloat but your 10 employees are not. Be interesting to get the perspective of your 10 recently laid off employees into this discussion. 

What a truly horrendous thing to say. You think any of this is easy? I've put in 15 years of blood, sweat and tears to build a business and give people a living and although some of my employees may lose their job, I stand to lose a job, a business, a house and most of my money and will have to start all over again. SME businesses like mine are directly in the firing line with C19 so I would appreciate a bit more understanding from people like yourself who are 'retired and on pensions' and therefore have very little skin in the game other than not catching it. My suffering is to help those 'most at risk', which I believe you probably fall into if you are old enough to be 'retired and on pensions'. 

Overall I really think none of this should have got to this stage and governments have handled it abysmally but I'll point fingers after this is all over. And yes, despite all this I still think the lockdown is appropriate given the options available.     

29 minutes ago, CygnusX1 said:

Forecast suicides, not enough time elapsed yet to look at actual suicides -

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8293233/Far-people-Australia-predicted-die-suicide-coronavirus-lockdown.html

(article discusses prediction from Sydney University “Mind and Brain” centre.)

I’m guessing that most of us posters are retired and on pensions, so we don’t appreciate what people go through who’ve just lost their jobs or businesses.

I employ 45 people, have had to let 10 of them go already and I'm expecting more. I am VERY aware of the consequences of the lockdown but still believe it's the best thing for society. 

59 minutes ago, Mama Noodle said:

 

Nobody cared in 2017-2018 when upwards of 80,000 people died of the flu. 

 

Nobody cares when 250,000 - 800,000 people die globally every year from the flu. 

 

That is not a false equivalent, those are hard facts presented for perspective and context. 

 

Nobody is going around murdering grandmothers so you can lay off the hysterics.

As has already been pointed out by Chessman, you are taking yearly death totals and trying to compare them to 2 months of C19 data, however lets run with your false equivalence (because that's what it is) and extrapolate things out. The highest number of worldwide deaths for flu is estimated at 650,000 (not 800,000)   https://www.who.int/mediacentre/news/statements/2017/flu/en/ and that's the very highest as and even though its actually between 250,000 and 650,000, for the sake of argument lets take the highest number of 650k. So far C19 is responsible for 280,000 deaths (https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/coronavirus-death-toll/) WITH LOCKDOWN. If we extrapolate that out for a year then that's 1,680,000, more than 2.5 times the death rate of flu AND THAT'S WITH LOCKDOWN and taking the highest flu total. If we take the lowest of 250k then it's 7 times this number. A new report just out from the Imperial College of London estimates that without intense government intervention, the novel coronavirus could infect 7 billion people and kill 40 million this year, (https://www.businessinsider.com/covid19-model-predicts-40-million-people-could-die-without-interventions-2020-3). I'm not going to try and say this would have happened as of course this is just modelling but to any sane person looking at what the experts are saying, this very real and very dangerous pandemic has the potential to be in the Spanish Flu kind of numbers unless drastic measures are taken.

The time for containing this has well and truly past and once it's all over, heads should roll but this continued attemp to try and compare this to flu or other similar worldwide killers is spurious at best, downright neglegent at worse.

20 minutes ago, lkv said:

Most did not keep themselves fit and healthy, it's not my problem.

 

It will only become my problem if ICU's are overloaded.

 

I read every label of a product in a supermarket that I buy, for nutritional values.

 

And anyway, whoever is afraid to go out, please lock yourselves in the house and ask social services to bring food over and leave it at the door.

Ahhh the old 'I'm alright so <deleted> everyone else' philosophy. Nice.

9 minutes ago, Monomial said:

You are entitled to your value choices, and I am entitled to mine. You are NOT entitled to force your values onto me. Do you hear yourself?  "2% of deaths are under the age of 60." Exactly. *ONLY* 2%. I'll even give you as high as 5% of deaths.

 

I am quite willing to accept that risk in order not to have my life destroyed by the economic evisceration being forced upon me. I accept a chance I will die every day when I drive on the roads. And as long as I don't overwhelm the health services with my judgements, I am not in any way affecting your life.

 

You are the one who is unwilling to accept that people do not share your value system.

 

Fortunately the vast amount of people and governments do so there's that.

9 minutes ago, NoBrainer said:

In case anyone asks to see the study i referred to

 

 

 

Jesus, talk about false equivalents. 

Amazingly enough, when you lockdown 99% of the population, less people are exposed to other major killers such as road deaths (38,000) other accidents (169,936) and normal flu (55,672) https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/fastats/deaths.htm. There is even a trend saying 'allmost half of the respondents reported that they are seeing a 40 percent to 60 percent reduction in admissions for heart attacks'. https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/06/well/live/coronavirus-doctors-hospitals-emergency-care-heart-attack-stroke.html stating 'Maybe we have removed some of the triggers for heart attacks and strokes, like excessive eating and drinking or abrupt periods of physical exertion'.

Buy hey, produce a fancy graph that feeds into your echo chamber and I'll sure no one will notice.  

7 minutes ago, NoBrainer said:

 

Like many things, the goal post keeps moving.

 

When they are hell bent to take your rights away, it is better to ease it in slowly, rather than all at once.

It seems to be now decided along political lines in many countries. In the US the Right wing wants to re-open everything now, and do not want to wear masks or do anything different than they did before, because they have come to realize this is just an epic scam that has been perpetrated on the world, by the American Democratic party, NWO people & the Chinese.

A recent study was released comparing US death rates (from Jan tp April) over the last 5 years. This year is only 102% of the 5 year average, 2017 being the highest.

So in other words, Covid Flu has caused hardly any more deaths that we see every year.

 

On the other side, are the Left wing people who are mostly hiding in their basements, scream at people that don't wear a mask, and want to keep the worlds economies closed until after the next election. They also refuse to accept that there is a treatment that is about 98% successful if administered early, and costs very little, leading to massive unnecessary deaths.

 

So it is really a fight of ideologies, or good VS Evil, in other words. Fortunately the Good side of the equation is getting the message out, and exposing the fraudsters for what they are. So for now it's just sit back and see who will eventually win. As for Thailand, it will take longer than usual for the powers that be to realize the truth, but they are always quite slow and conservative in nature, so this is not surprising.

 

Killing vulnerable people willingly to get deaths out of the way faster, achieve herd immunity and to open up the economy is not a battle of 'good versus evil'. It's common sense against eugenics.