lannarebirth

What is at stake here? The dictatorship of Thaksin??

All the marbles. Think "Thaksin Dynasty".

In fact one of the red leaders is ex-PAD.

Interesting. Who?

Wennnnngggg!

Looks like I picked the wrong day to give up sniffing glue. It would have helped all this seem for rational.

THE NATION: Red shirts' msg is getting more subtle now. It says "real pinksℜ whites" r fine, but yellow disguised as pinks/whites are bad

THE NATION: Now we have reds, fake reds, blue, white, pink, yellow, and yellow disguised as pinks/whites.

Refresh my memory, who are the whites again? Mae Chee?

whistle blower? markets manipulated? YAWWNNNNN... manipulation happens in all markets, has happened and will happen all the time. welcome to reality and expensive bakeries

True, and the lesson I learned long ago was, when the market is being manipulated, get on the side of the manipulators.

So, now its 9 months until the House is dissolved ...and then what ...another 12 months until elections are held? Or are they actually holding elections in 9-10 months?

My understanding is, that Abhisit's offer to dissolve the government and call new election (whiich was turned down BTW) was conditional on his getting some constitutional reform measures agreed upon, then a referendum on said reform, then Parliamentary implementation of that reform. Also there had to be some agreement as to access by all candidates to all areas and voters who form the electorate. also he expected that emotions might cool in that time frame. as I said, it was turned down so it is unknown if that is still the current roadmap toward new elections.

You got anything on the Red Gaurs or the Village Scouts? Always fun looking back through the scrapbook.

Ah diversion. I don't DENY violence on either side. There are a lot of posters who DENY violence on the PAD side.

Can they admit to the lies?

My point is, its just not very relevant anymore. If people want to be trapped looking backwards there will be plenty of reasons found for not moving the country forward. The neogotiations started are the way forward. A couple more parties need to be brought on board. The Privy Council and constitutional scholars. All parties need to understand that everything is on the table except the rights of the people which are sacrosanct.

"The Institution" needs radical change, sooner rather than later. It would behoove all parties to recognize that fact and do something about it now, in the spirit of negotiations, rather than later with emotionally charged people in the streets.

Sounds like Jungle Flight vs Flight of the Gibbon wars to me. I hope the tourists can support both of you. Don't make a mess.

Lamphu House Backpack Storage, 75 Soi Rambuttri, ☎ +66 2 629 5861-2. Lamphu House is a resort-style guesthouse, a big plus is that you can store your backpack here for about 10 baht a day. You don't need to be a hotel guest to use this service.

http://wikitravel.org/en/Bangkok/Khao_San_Road

I see in the Nation that the UDD is getting a little edgy about other groups wishing to protest as well. If democracy dictates this freedom then it's for everyone, not just the reds. I'm beginning to believe that the UDD/Red-Shirts only want democracy as they define it and have a controlled monopoly with that. UDD is full of b/s. They continue to prove this by their words that they are not and have never been about democracy. Selfish, self-serving interests only. Time to give it up, the mask has been removed.

Red-shirt leader Natthawut Saikua said the protesters going to Chulalongkorn today would be a group of "medium size, neither big nor small", but the red shirts' plan to stage their first-ever demonstration at an academic institution immediately caused jitters.

Moreover, the red shirts made it clear yesterday that they regarded the other side as being "a government tool" created to weaken or discredit them.

The red shirts' scepticism about the "pink" movement was somewhat ironical, considering their major complaint was that they were regarded as Thaksin's "tools" rather than a pure political force yearning for democracy.

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/home/2010/...t-30126186.html

First Weng, now Wuttanut, it's a PR man's dream.

Netfan,

The website I told you was not to do with this blood saga article. I just answered to your call for some other liberal websites, but I sensed you're not one of the ''liberal ones''

Me supporting the Reds doesn't mean I support Thaksin, so pls distinguish the fact that there're really people out there, like me, who would do anything within their power to chase the dream of true democracy. I just feel for those who're trying in vain against the elites -that doesn't mean I'm a pro-Thaksin.

Neither did I say I agreed with their blood campaign. I just found the cheap tactic of a false claim like this more pathetic.

I'm just a Thai woman who wants to see change. I'm not brave enough to go in the open like these red-shirts, because of my profession. That's why I feel these people trying to make change (which may never come) have made more sacrifice for their belief than you and me would ever do. Hats off to them.

Then you are what the Red movement needs publicly. If they would find a Caesar Chavez, MLK, Su Kyi figure to lead them and truly condemn the acts of violence, refute Thaksin and be willing to hold meaningful talks with the government, they would achieve much more and perhaps gain international support. But realistically, what do you think would happen to you if you got up on stage and said what you said here? With the leadership the reds have now, there is, unfortunately, no room for a reasonable person such as yourself in their leadership ranks.

Chavez from Venezuela along Su Kyi and MLK ?

Next time choose better please

Uh-hum!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/C%C3%A9sar_Ch%C3%A1vez

Beatings, draggings, shootings, violence in general.

You got anything on the Red Gaurs or the Village Scouts? Always fun looking back through the scrapbook.

From tulsathit's tweets. Maybe it's only me but it reads hilarious. From Wuttanut:

Red leader Nuttawut said the "pink" movement campaigning for peace is in fact yellow shirts in disguise.

I wonder if Nuttawut is related to Koo? They both say the exact same thing!

It sounds like a Seinfeld episode to me.

Wuttanut: "Abhisit provoked us today by entering Govt House. He will meet us for sure this weekend." about 2 hours ago via TweetDeck

Wuttanut: "The parade to Chula will be neither big nor small. The size will be just about right." about 2 hours ago via

From tulsathit's tweets. Maybe it's only me but it reads hilarious. From Wuttanut:

Red leader Nuttawut said the "pink" movement campaigning for peace is in fact yellow shirts in disguise.

Some pretty reasonable talk from that side for a change. Big stuff if they could pull it off.

Apiwan wants amataya toppled

Can be found on the Bangkok Post website.

CMF --- for "spin" you will have to consult with your handlers. The ones that turned down a compromise. The ones that let Abhisit speak directly to their followers etc.

It is a pity that you haven't been in Thailand long enough to see how well that the discussions played for the government. If you knew how Thais respect politeness and an attitude of being willing to compromise and hear someone else's opinion, then you would understand how well this played to the rest of the country. Abhisit did what Thais expect out of leaders and Jatuporn came off looking like a thug. Many of the reds that have not been totally braindeadened by the PeopleTV slanted "news" and information will have seen this but more importantly people all over Thailand saw it. It was a big PR "coup" for Abhisit to get that much unobstructed free airtime into the heart of the Red camp.

Abhisit has everr appeared the conciliatory prime minister in this red made mess and the 2 publicly televised discussions just added to his image, while making Jatuporn and Dr Weng look like total reactionaries with no plan at all.*

That no violence has befallen the reds at their rallies has not gone unnoticed by people either. People remember the nightly grenade attacks at Government house (after Sae Daeng, a red leader, announced that there would be grenade attacks). People remember those grenade attacks continueing at Suwannapoom after the AOT closed the airport and walked away. People SEE the grenade attacks happening across bangkok and remember who talked about grenades (Sae Daeng -- the red leader that frequently has visited Thaksin). Then they have now heard jatuporns threat of more to come. Great timing that! "Hey world --- help us!, hey world --- BTW we are planning on making Bangkok look like Thailand's "restive South".

The above PLUS Abhisit's reminder of when the term "double standards" started being used in Thailand (after Thaksin's was not found guilty on his 2001 assets concealment case) certainly made its way through the public's mind.

I don't disagree they didn't come across well - and you know I do not support nor condone violence in any of my posts and have spoken out against it many times - but my point is... they have forced Abhsisit to consider an early election - you should conceed this point.

I'd agree with that. Given that the red shirts are prone to violence and they have shown in the past they don't care who gets hurt or what gets damaged in pursuit of their aims, and given that Abhisit has NEVER resorted to violence against civilians or even criminal demonstrators it was a pretty good ploy to stoke the flames of violent insurrection every night on stage. To symbolically turn a political debate into a bloodletting with the implied threat that class warfare would ensue and blood would flow in the city they came to turn into a "sea of fire" in order to achieve their "democratic" aims. Yeah, those were some pretty crafty and shrewd "political" moves. Thing is, being dumb as a box of rocks, when they were given everything they "said" they wanted they pig headedly turned it down. Now who looks like a fuc_king idiot?

The stuff that ends up in one's Inbox:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/khmerintelligence/message/722

I have no idea if these are credible assertions, but it's out there.

An apparent rebuttal from Cambodia about Mr. Raimsy's statements. Selling the country. I thought Thai politician's had a monopoly on that one.

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/home/2010/...a-30126011.html

Cambodia's opposition leader accused of "betraying Cambodia"

"The betraying opposition party leader Sam Rainsy has colluded with Thailand and sold himself to Thailand to let Thais invade Cambodia," Chea Dara was quoted as saying.

I'm going to take this latest salvo from the Cambodian government towards its opposition leader as confirmation that there may be more tha a little substance to the original link I posted.

Its a fairly solid assumption and also an indication that the Reds have been responsible for the other attacks...

Sedition is coming to mind.

Sedition is the incitement of public disorder and rebellion against the government.

If this is what is required to bring about real economic - social - and political change in Thailand then bring it on.

It's looking more and more like a political certainty if the Red Shirt movement doesn't change its tact any time soon.

(Incidentally - I'm not an advocate of any form of violence - political or other - if anyone happened to wonder.)

The thing about sedition is, you'd better be dam_n certain you're gonna win. I'm not sure someone paying day clappers to show up for a parade should have that kind of certitude.

I refer to the Big Mac index when I want to know about undervalued/overvalued currencies. Why are you laughing? It's as accurate as any other system.

Last time (8 years) I was in Lugano it was about 15 equivalent dollars for a "McGruyere" burger. I'm gonna go out on a limb and say the CHF may be just a bit overvalued.

Okay, I'm beginning to admire this Abhisit guy. He keeps talking about the 70% of Thais who do NOT consider themselves Red or Yellow. Maybe he has studied the successful Western politicians who did the bestjob of wooing the Silent Majorities!'

or maybe? he is a good guy....

If he feels this insight is true... test it - have an election... he is speaking about dissolution already

Pardon me

He already said he will have an early election

what part of early election you don't understand

I agree - great news!!! that's what we have bene saying all along - great that Abhisit has caught the mood of the country

Actually, the mood of the country, according to the latest poll says a lage plurality of the people think he should finish his term. Its in one of these threads here someplace.

And Thaksin himself of course can hold his own in any discussion or negotiation, business, politics or otherwise.

There's a near limitless library of youtube videos of a babbling, fumbling, stumbling Thaksin that overwhelmingly disputes that.

Discussion? Did he ever hold a discussion where he didn't preach and make himslf the topic under discussion?

Negotiation? You mean like those FTA's he negotiated that opened up Thai business sectors to foreign competition in exchange for those governments opening up their telecommunications sectors to Shin Corp?

Business? Did he ever run a business where his sales weren't "greased" or he didn't bribe his way or legislate his way into a competive advantage or monopoly position? Has he ever competed with any company on a level playing field?

Politics? "After me comes the flood" springs to mind.

QUOTE(Jatuporn):"He also called for the withdrawal of soldiers from the temples which were being used as temporary bases around the Red Shirts protest site, saying it was not appropriate. If the government refuses to do that, he said, protesters will gather at temples to pressure them to leave."

I think this could be the emphasis of next Saturday's protest. The removal of troops from each of the temples surrounding the protest site. If that's at all possible. I guess the Red-Shirts could claim the 'moral high ground' in this respect in that - by anyone's reckoning - the holy sanctity of the temples is being abused by the military who have turned them into fortified bastions.

I don't know if the Red-Shirts have access to any of these temples at the moment. I would imagine the temples and the temple grounds are open to everyone. Any one side laying a territorial claim - for their own benefit - could be an interesting and debatable point.

I agree. I think the soldiers should be replaced by the police whose job is to protect people and property. I hope they can find enough dependable ones.

I think the assertion that "the military are pulling Abhisit's strings" is not accurate. If you have a medical problem and you go to a surgeon for advice he will recommend surgery, if there is a standoff between civilians and the military the military will respond with a military type reaction UNLESS they are taking their orders from a civilian government. They're trying it Abhisit's way. Yeah, maybe that could change in the future, but that's the only conclusion I think one can draw right now.

Anyone see the picture of Abhisit on the nationweekend.com cover? Goes well with thw Thaksin as Superman image someone posted the other day.

My wife is just sure the "weng" thing will go "inter". She and her friends are already cracking themselves up over it. I made the comment that I have a certain sympathy for Weng. Her response: "you can see he took the money now, som nom naa".