kwilco

38 minutes ago, scubascuba3 said:

I'm surprised you guys are still banging on about it, talk about flog a dead horse

the Thai media spends a lot of time reporting crashes - one of the reasons is they can't actually publish a lot of political stuff as they could end up being sued or worse.

THe result is that a lot of rubbish is posted about road safety eeven on this site - if you like many other posters don't know anything about it then it would be boring but there is a lot that needs to be said to change peoples perception about road safety in general and this is a good example of how people misunderstand and misread Road safety incidents in Thailand. Even you "are still banging on about it, talk about flogging a dead horse" and have decided to chip in - maybe you'll learn something - who knows?

We also can't tell if the video is running at the right speed - certainly ther e is a tendency for them to look faster and BE faster.

2 minutes ago, scubascuba3 said:

Sadly witnesses often chicken out, cowards 

THat's irrelent - I'm talking about the fact you can't rely on them anyway. s I said there are papers on this.... A lot of witnesses are "shocked" by the event  or impact and grossly over estimate speed etc ..

Foreigners driving in Thailand are usually ignorant of the priority laws and fail to understand their significance.

Anyone who has driven in Europe in thee 1960s/70s will know the effects of "priority" laws. (the other way round) the effect was devastating - and there have been significant changes to overcome this. THsiland has not. In Thailand they still remain as a significant part of the driving psyche and culture - foreigners ignoring them do so at their peril.

A lot of driving behaviour is subliminal - It may also be a contributory factor that the (elderly?) Swiss guy comes from a "DoR" country - he may have not instinctively looked or anticipated oncoming traffic correctly.

THe classic example. of this is the pedestrian who steps off a kerb having looked left instead of right.\in this case in doesn't look as if he checked the traffic to his left and even if he did, he may have looked into the wrong lane and nothing wouls have registered - least of all a "fast" moving vehicle in what he considered to be the wrong lane.

THe most common thing said after an accident is "I just didn't see him".

23 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

 

Yup... I quite agree...

 

Very rudimentary calculations based on what maybe flawed observation and assumption gives the following.

 

CCTV Frame rates are 25 fps

 

The SUV travelled ~2m in 2 frames...  thats a speed of 90 kmh.

The SUV Travelled ~2m in 4 frames... thats a speed of 45 kmh.

 

If the measurement is slightly off and its not 2m but 1.5m.

The SUV travelled ~1.5m in 2 frames...  thats a speed of 33.7kmh.

The SUV Travelled ~1.5m in 4 frames... thats a speed of 67.5 kmh.

 

 

Yes, its rudementary, however, in the most favourable light - the SUV was travelling at 33 kms...  in the most damning light, the SUV was travelling at 90kmh....   my guess is the SUV was travelling somewhere closer to 60 kmh - which is a reckless speed to enter a junction at which the visibility of crossing traffic is blocked. 

Digital not frames - we don't know if it was constant, accelerating  because we haven't seen the hudred or so metres before the junction.

THe difference in speed between 30 and 40 kph is huge.

It can be calculated by the distance off line travelled by the m/c that was hit.

In countries where crsheds are scientifically analysed the speeds of vehicles is detwermined quite accurately not from video but the resulting distances travelled on/across the asphalt. In Thailand crashes simply aren't calibrated.

Certainly no=one on this thread could make an accurate assessment.

30 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

Right of way at unmarked junctions of equal status is to the right

In Thailand priority is to the left.

If two vehicles enter a junction from different directions at the same time, the vehicle on the left side has a right of way, except when there's a designation of "principle roadway" in which case the vehicle on the principle roadway has a right of way.]

Section 72

11

[A principle roadway is announced by the traffic officer and installed with indicative traffic signs.]

the "law" part of this is mentioned in the Highway code translation which actually dates from 1979

Land Traffic Act, B.E. 2522 (1979)

39 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

I think its quite clear that the approach of the SUV was at speed

You aren't taking into account the natural fallibility of observation - it is totally subjective. I'm not saying you are wrong but there is simply not enough in view to make an accurate judgment.

Another factor is that gauging speed on videos is very difficult - you actually have to measure distance against time and check that the reply speed of the video is properly calibrated. Without doing this videos tend to make speeds look faster.

If you care to check there are a lot of papers on the fallibility of witnesses to calibrates speed and the fallibility of video evidence.

4 hours ago, In Full Agreement said:

 

 

What does the USA have to do with this thread?

It’s down to perception.

I said….

“People's perceptions of driving in any country are universally uninformed and their ability to understand what is really going on is minimal

It is also worth bearing in mind that in a 4-wheeled vehicle in Thailand you are LESS likely to die than in a 4-wheeled car in the USA”.

There is a lack of understanding of what is happening – the general attitude is that “driving in Thailand is mad and all Thai drivers are bad” – but the statistics don’t back this up – as 4-wheeled transport is less deadly than in the USA where a lot of people wrongly consider the driving to be "better".

14 hours ago, Rimmer said:

 

Had not grey the car stopped in the fast lane to let the scooter go through? The White car must have seen that but still overtook it on the inside at high speed, It does not look like the grey car was slowing to turn as the front wheels are straight.

Unfortunately the video doesn't show the approach of the SUV to the junction, so there is very little you can reliably conclude from it.

People are very bad at viewing videos dispassionately.

On 4/22/2024 at 5:04 PM, richard_smith237 said:

And then there is also this.... 

 

 

 

we can't see - if the traffic lights are working.

we can be pretty sure the motorcyclist didn't look left.

the driver of the SUV did not seem to have adjusted speed for the junction.

Anyone having driven this junction and all the other junctions along these roads will be aware that they whole layout is totally unsatisfactory especially at rush hours.

It seems that Thai has not one single traffic engineer anywhere in the country

3 minutes ago, Klonko said:

Insisting on the official traffic rules is a recipe for a disaster especially in Thailand. Both drivers were driving recklessly. I have driven both roads by car and motorcycle and never would drive across this intersection from either side without looking for other vehicles  and being prepared and able to give way even if it's my right of way. Anticipating the Thai style behaviour of other drivers, I feel as comfortable as driving in Europe.

Yes - many foreign drivers are not good enough to adapt to a driving environment that is quite different from their home country. Some even think that Thai people should drive like they do in their home country.

Basically if you find yourself shouting at other drivers, it is probably you who are not fitting in.

Pelpe's perceptions of driving in any country are universally uninformed and their ability to understand what is really going on is minimal

It is also worth bearing in mind that in a 4-wheeled vehicle in Thailand you are LESS likely to die than in a 4-wheeled car in the USA.

2 hours ago, Ralf001 said:

 

 

The fact I have experienced this exact same incident several times at this same intersection and on each occasion the police declared me not at fault..

 

Yeah I will side with their decision rather than your keyboard thumping.

I'm not questioning tany decision (mind you  - RTP??) - I'm pointing out the paucity of understanding people have when it comes to analysing acidents in general - especially watching videos.

"experienced this exact same incident several times at this same intersection" - ? - Brings to mind a quote of Einstein's "Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results"

6 hours ago, SAFETY FIRST said:

Who says they aren't the 'main road'? 

 

A maun road is designated by police or local authority.

It may be altered or whatever but that doesn't mean it is given a change of designation.

However if there are road marking at the junction that would say.

Most foreign drivers are unaware of the defumault....that is priority on the left.

7 hours ago, hotchilli said:

So you know what's going to happen in 24 years from now... smart Alec?

I certainly wouldn't assume it would change for the better.

6 hours ago, SAFETY FIRST said:

You are missing my point, see the madman on his little vehicle travelling an unsafe speed through an intersection with some cars 100km/h, he is barely visible, that lunatic is trying to outrun a 2 tonne SUV, there's the problem. 

 

 

6 hours ago, Ralf001 said:

The fact it is dual carriageway perhaps !

That doesn't matter, it has to be officially designated. You can't just make assumptions... believe it or not there will be an official designation if there isn't then its priority on the left.

12 hours ago, Ralf001 said:

 

For further info.

 

The solid red lines are the main road.

The dash yellow is the street.

The Swiss gent was on the street.

 

who says they are the "main road"?

Thos policy was first introduced in 1946.

After Brexit the situation remains up in the air even for pensioners in EU.

Oddly enough, it is not in place for pensioners in the USA, but is in Canada and Australia.

Pensioners in Thailand should have seen this coming as it is nothing new.

Tge pension in 2000 was about £67 whereas now it is around £220. This is still tiny compared to countries like France and Germany.

Even on £220 per week, pensioners still have to pay for healthcare.

1 hour ago, GammaGlobulin said:

Even Vindaloo is not a stew

Are you using it as an English term - why not a stew?

Stewing is a moist heat, slow cooking method, where small uniform pieces of meat and/or vegetables are cooked in liquid, and then served in the resulting gravy.stew is a cooking method - Stewing is a moist heat, slow cooking method, where small uniform pieces of meat and/or vegetables are cooked in liquid, and then served in the resulting gravy.

On 4/22/2024 at 5:32 AM, webfact said:

 

Pattaya —A Swiss expat in Pattaya is critically injured after being hit by a car while riding his three-wheeled electric scooter to buy medicine. His wife is seeking justice for her husband, claiming the other party refused to take responsibility.

According to the Thai wife, Mrs. Samrit Geisbuehler, the accident occurred on April 19th at around 9:50 AM as her husband, 73-year-old Mr. Andeks Geisbuehler, was on his way to purchase his regular medication. The incident was captured on CCTV footage, showing the car, an Isuzu Mu-X, colliding with Mr. Andeks’s scooter as he crossed an intersection on a road along a railway in the Khao Talo area, South Pattaya.

 

Mr. Andeks was rushed to the hospital with severe injuries and has been placed in the ICU. Mrs. Samrit revealed that she was disappointed with the alleged lack of support from the driver, who she claimed has not offered any words of consolation or financial assistance to her Swiss husband. 

 

By Aim Tanakorn

 

Full story: THE PATTAYA NEWS 2024-04-22

 

Get our Daily Newsletter - Click HERE to subscribe
 

Unmarked junction priority is on the left.

2 hours ago, MangoKorat said:

555 So now they're moving their entire operations to Thailand.

 

Breaking News!

 

Putin annexes Phuket.

there's a problem with most countries wanting to repossess or impound oligarchs' property

43 minutes ago, sambum said:

 

Firstly, “How do you work that one out Kwilco that the Brits get longer visas?”  was not from me, so address your reply to the correct person, please.

 

Secondly, you highlight a point about visas and then prattle on about the ex military and firearms, as if that somehow makes a "gun culture", while completely ignoring my comments about the strict firearms laws in the UK.

 

Thirdly, in Thailand, from what I have heard over the years (19 coming on 20, by the way), MANY Thai families have unlicensed firearms, and  many people are getting shot because of "loss of face (e.g.somebody honks a car horn at them!) Now, THAT is a gun culture!

 

Similarly, I feel that any further discourse with you on this subject is pointless, so don't waste your time by concocting a reply which would no doubt be of the "baiting" type, but if you really NEED to have the last word - go ahead - be my guest!  

Reply not worth the effort - you are just rambling now to v=cover up your intial nonsense

13 hours ago, MangoKorat said:

Yes,  I wonder if 'ordinary' Russian people ever questioned just how many millionaires were created, almost overnight when the supposedly almost bankrupt communist system collapsed. They were most likely gangsters before that event and it seems a relatively small number of them carved up previously national assets.

 

I doubt many Oligarchs have decided to move their 'Superyachts' to Thailand but as with all gangsters, they have their lieutenants who carry out their dirty work. I think its a fair bet that its those lieutenants that are flocking to Thailand - the outcome is predictable.

 

Great move from the inept, cash is king Thai government - give Russians longer visas, lay on special flights for them, etc. etc. They complain about the number of Western criminals that make Thailand their home - they ain't seen nothing yet!

russian super yachts - https://www.autoevolution.com/news/russian-billionaires-amazing-floating-chalet-docks-in-thailand-the-new-superyacht-haven-193785.html

Panang and Massaman are popular all over Thailand but they probably originate in the South. Massaman means muslim  - it is basically a copy of curries from the South Asian sub-continent.

Panang name has no connection with the Malaysian island Penang, it is derived from the expression describing how monks sit cross-legged.

As curries they are particularly popular with tourists who don't have to make such a big taste adjustment as they do for "genuine" Thai food.

I wonder if the poll just included THai people where it would rank.