Sunbelt Asia

It's refreshing to have a businessman own up to their operation's failings, and be likewise open about trying to make things better. I agree that you do need to try to make things better, particularly at the Soi 12 location. (It also reminds me why I'm not anxious to have my own business, for fear of having to deal with such stupidity as you recount above).

I must admit challenges are what motivate me. I have a test on my hand with regards to service. I however feel bad when someone spends their hard earned money and don't get 100% enjoyment. Service is important. A number of restaurants get the food right or the service right but not many get both right. I wish sometimes that we were like Leelawadee restaurant http://www.leelawadeerestaurant.com/home_en.html where we have 200 staff. 99% of them don't speak English and the service is fine. To be frank, its quite easy to get staff there. But that service model of no English won't work at Sunrise. The other restaurants that I'm involved with are all QSR and service is not important like a sit down restaurant. As long as they are pleasant that is all that matters.

When I talk to other business owners, they always say the biggest challenge in Thailand is staff. They are what can make or break you. One of the reasons I've been successful is my wife is excellent at human resources. She is the glue that keeps it all together. The last few months, she has been busy working outside Thailand on other projects and boy do I miss her skills in all my companies. I really appreciate her even more on dealing with Thais now.

I certainly understand unusual circumstances can arise. But it's more than a bit amusing to hear, after the fact, that my Cinco de Mayo dinner was sabotaged in large part by a love spat among love-lorn university girls who then hit the road. So much for trying to match Coyote on that score... Really, of course, I'd wish you didn't... and instead just find competent, service-oriented dependable staff... (Maybe easier said that done).

Wasn't searching for the pretty girls, they came to us. But all I really care about is passion to give the best to the customer.

I do have a question about the newer set-up at Soi 12, regarding your comments. The last time I went into the old original location, they didn't want to serve me and told me to go across the street to the "restaurant" location. That day, they told me the old counter is now only for delivery. Is that correct, or, is it possible to still walk in there and get food to go or to sit at the old counter???? You seemed to say there is some quick in/out option still, but not clear how to do that...

Sorry for the misunderstanding. If it’s a group of two or three they should only suggest that they can eat on the other side but we've had groups of 6 or so still eat at the original location for old time sake. It's perfect for singles. Maybe 40-50 singles are served a day at the counter. They just walk up to the counter and fill out the form for "Build your own" give it to the food maker. You pay then or after you eat. It’s also possible to get take out there which a number of people do.

www.sunrisetacos.com

Thanks for the update on Cinco de Mayo promotions.. Those are nice...I'll be sure to swing by....for a big mango margarita to celebrate....

It's also nice to hear about the wait staff.... Some of the past ones seemed... a bit... disinterested at times...

But.. just for the record.... while some feminine eye candy is always nice.... the main thing... as I know you know... is the FOOD and DRINK!!!! Just keep on that...and everything will be good....

When I mentioned about the Coyote ladies in a prior post...I think... it was just responding to what another poster had previously said... Some Mexican food place could have poor/bad food...and the HOTTEST ladies in BKK...and it wouldn't get me in the door... (well... almost!!!!) hhehehehehehe......

Those four pretties have left last weekend along with some of the old staff, because of fighting over the attention of a guy and all involved felt they lost face and had to leave. I felt then like I was back in High School. Just immature children.

So I was left going into Cinco de Mayo with six less waiters, two cashiers and a number of newbie’s. UGH

know Greg has written before about having new staff in the Soi 12 location. I hadn't seen the couple of waitresses working tonight before. But based on their performance, it's hard for me to imagine that either of them have any clue about how to do restaurant service, no matter how personable they may be... And in terms of waiter/waitress service, that seems to be pretty much the norm at the Soi 12 location since it opened its "restaurant" location.

Don't know what's going on at the other Sunrise locations at present. But for me, it's a particularly bad sign when a "Mexican" restaurant that's advertising a margaritas special for Cinco de Mayo can't turn out a decent serving on two different tries, and the staff in general seem to be clueless as to their broader lackings....

Well I did have new staff even newer than those that I wrote about. Plus bad luck on your part as 10 p.m. till 11 p.m. could not have been worse timing on my end. 10 p.m. is when the staff has a shift change. So the limited “experience” staff left then to catch the bus. They already had worked 12 hours and were exhausted after serving a packed restaurant all day so it was not right to ask them to work even longer. I was left with some real newbie’s at that time. Also bad luck I was told that their was a fire at Soi 4 so had to leave myself to make sure the staff at another restaurant were ok there so I was not around. As they say, it rains it pours.

I do understand why the margaritas were not frozen then at 10 p.m. We had sold many yards that night and the two machines with three dispensers holding 7 gallons eachm takes an hour to refreeze the juice for every time the cycle is sold out. The place was absolutely packed with yard glasses being bought before 10 p.m. No wonder why, I actually lost 23 baht on every margarita yard we sold for Cinco de Mayo but it was a nice thing to do for the party atmosphere. We sell lots of margaritas but on average its one person ordering 12 ounces for 99 baht not the whole restaurant ordering a yard. Now if I was there, I would have put it in the blender to freeze it. Common sense stuff but with new staff just forget about it.

It all makes me long for the good old days where there just was the counter..and good food.

I know you have a bad taste about the service other night. But I hope to see you again.

We still do have the counter for the good old days. Just more like self service. You are in and out fast.

You also have the option at Emporium where they use Emporium waiters to expedite the food or you could go to Siam Paragon where I was just told yesterday by Siam Paragon management that “no one comes close to our standard of service at Sunrise.” That "they tell other restaurants managers to watch our waiters, they are that good." Now I really don't know if smoke was being blown up my butt or if it’s true. I have heard positive feedback from other customers but will be checking it out more myself. So if it’s true why do we have it so right at Siam Paragon and so wrong at Soi 12 location?

1. Experience. The waiters have been working together for a couple months. Not one of our waiters at Soi 12 has worked more than a month in the morning or afternoon shift.

2. The menu is much simpler and has many more set menus. Siam Paragon does not have build your own options except for two items. You know how hard it is just to get one order right at many restaurants in Thailand when you order #1 and you get #11? At Soi 12 we have 10 different options for each item, it’s a time bomb.

3. Passion. The manager there has a big passion to win. She demands the best service.

4. Common sense. I agree some of the staff does not have a clue even after being trained at Soi 12. Some do and some don't. It simply takes time to get them switched on.

So how do I change Soi 12?

A. Get a better trainer for the waiters. Don't think it's the pay as I’m now at 8- 10K. per month. (Plus they get tips of around 3K+ per month)

B. Have a line at the counter and nixed the waiters. The food is made in front of you like Chipotle. On fajitas or nachos it’s expedited to your table.

C. Change the menu to less "Build your own” options.

I'm leaning more to option B. Even then with this concept, it can have problems with service; I went to this taco place last month in Atlanta. Great food but check out the comments on the service. They have waiting lines out the door.

http://atlanta.citysearch.com/review/11340776 I was expecting rude service from the cashier so my expectations on service were very low. It turned out ok the cashier was rude but as I said, I was expecting it to happen but my expectations on the food was certainly met. Still because of the cashier I would not be going there as my first choice.

can honestly say i love the food at sunrise. That is the only good thing i can say about them. When they first opened up problems with the staff is to be expected. Sadly it seems the staff seems to get worse, i dont know if they just have a high turn over, or just hire IDIOTS. I personally will not being going back there. The last straw was a few days ago in the evening at soi 12 location. I dont know if its just me, but every time i go its a new person at counter, and they honestly get worse each time. Ordered at 7:52 food got food at 8:40. Wasnt big order 3 tostatada and 1 burrito................ The running back and forth, the forgetting stuff, it was so bad had one of the staff apologize for the cashier incompetence.

Would strongly suggest to rethink your hiring process, and throw in some training.

I’m very sorry this happen to you.

I know what day this was... The cashier quit as well so I was left in a lurch. That was why the running back and forth. I'm sending you a p.m. for letting me know.

Went to Sunrise Tacos yesterday for Cinco de Mayo.

My table had:

2 x margaritas @ 199 ea

a "Tijuana" @ 199

apple pie @ 69

ice cream @ 59

corn bread @ either 59 or 69, let's say 69 as the worst case scenario

Total by my calculations: 794

+ tax: 55.58

Total: B 849.58

Only this morning did I realize that our bill was B 1006.25. Check your bills at Sunrise, folks.

I surmise as you know the exact amt you have the receipt. Was their any extras like guacamole? Sending you a private message. Fortunately this is a first I have head about something like this but want to look into this.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

This is why I have not done any franchising yet. I’m still tweaking the system. You guys have ideas; I’m open minded because even after owning 19 restaurants, I don’t have all the answers.

On a positive note, a magazine ranked seven different Mexican restaurants this week in Bangkok and said about Sunrise " Excellent food combined with fair prices, make for the best deal in town... top it off with the best guacamole this side of the Pacific"

Regards

Greg

www.sunrisetacos.com

Everything seems to be wrapping up now with the firetrucks leaving. Firemen were seen in an area upstairs ( closest to the street) next to the old Big Mango bar and behind the Mandarin Bar.

Nana closed down. No idea if they will reopen tonight or not.

www.sunbeltasiagroup.com

Fortunately I still have my last entry so I have 90 days to prepare for another visit. The lady was kind enough to offer a 60 day extension for 1900 Baht, but I would rather do a border run and get 90.

I phoned Sunbelt and they were very helpful (for free! even). They informed me that I can still apply for an extension beyond the visa expiration date, based on my last 90 day stamp. I wasn't aware of that.

They also said I may need a legal document providing proof of parenthood and custody (this may not fly well with the mother!). This process is apparently expensive and takes about 6 months in the courts. This seems a little devisive for a family so I'm not really keen on taking this approach because it might appear like I'm ripping my daughter away from her mother.

The other option is to get married! Yikes! Is there a cheap low-key way of doing this, if I choose this avenue?

If your child is under 7 years old and you don't have a marriage certificate then you need a court order for the court to sign on the child’s behalf that you are the father.

In your case easier to wait till Sept. when your child turns 7 years old and then get the paperwork at the regional office stating that you are the father.

And here is a customer that usually never uses a visa service, but was willing to lay out some cash to get it doen and zip, nuttin, nahda.

I saw Josh followed up and you said it was him. That is "funny" as you said, as Josh is 100% client service oriented. Perhaps it was a typo on the tel #, e-mail caught in the filter but I will get to the bottom of it because as I said its not our standard of service.

www.sunbeltasiagroup.com

To Sunbelt:

Sorry I have to disagree: There is no chance that the cheap USB Cameras one can see in immigration offices and borders have a chance to record fine detail like the Retina. It needs much different, more sophisticated equipment than that.

Sunny

Not sure as I'm just repeating what I heard from one of the staff members. As I was on the other side of the Embassy maybe its just a face feature scan instead of a retinal/ iris scan.

However it made sense to me as they want you to look at the red spot in the camera and how else did they catch these people wanted? They use this same camera in the USA for visitors.

www.sunbeltasiagroup.com

I use to work in a Five star resort in krabi as a IT supervisor they only offer me 15000baht they should give me double than that bec. Im the only IT in the whole 5 star hotel and its peak season alot of problems so i work 830am till 10pm or even until 5am but they dont give me over time pay!!! my boss promise me work permit at higher salary but they dont give me anything... they dont give me overtime pay, no service, charge no work permit, underpayed and then when my tourist VISA nearly expire i told my boss where is my permit then he said just wait after 1 week... 1 day before expired date of my VISA i went to the office of my boss and he said this is your salary dont go back bec. you dont have any work your terminated!!! and another thing when i can back to my bedroom no more bed!!!

In all i done work more than 13 hour a day no day off no permit no overtime no service charge underpayed and Fired!!!

WHAT CAN I DO?

I surmise you were working less than three months so you are not entitled to any severance pay as you were in the 90 day probationary period.

The most you would be entitled to would be 15,000 Baht because you were not given a one pay period notice. If the pay period was every month then you are entitled to 15K.

However in my opinion, it’s not worth the hassle to go after them in Labor Court for this amt as you did not have a work permit. The best avenue is tell them to check with the Labor Court, that you are owed this amount and see if they will give you anything.

We have won in labor court up to 800,000 Baht for clients even though they did not have a work permit. But of course this was years they were working and had a contract.

We STRONGLY advocate have a work permit in the future.

Good luck.

...we even smile our sweetest...

I believe you are not allowed to smile nowadays for an immigration photograph. Something to do with the face recognition software.

--

Maestro

I know you're joking. Even when the cameras work I'll bet the facial recognition software (if it's really here) doesn't work. I came it yesterday and the officer took a picture of my grinning face. He started laughing and I was out.

Thailand has found quite a few criminals that have been wanted in other countries. Some them come to mine was the

Russian arm dealer

The woman who robbed many banks in the USA

All were using a phony passport but were arrested later; I know they have had other cases of people wanted. One of the American Embassy staff told me” People that are wanted in the World are not aware that the software Immigration uses is very good. It was developed in the Stares and goes to all the intelligence agencies. Your retinal/ iris scan is like a fingerprint.” So it’s not just a pretty picture for your vacation is why Thai Immigration wants your photo.

www.sunbeltasiagroup.com

Been to both Coyote on Soi Convent and Sunrise near Suk Soi 12 numerous times....

Gotta agree with Greg. Coyote has him beat hands down when it comes to 1) the vast breadth of their margarita menu, 2) the "suay" factor of the serving ladies, and 3) the advantages/comforts of a newly done, upmarket sit-down restaurant.

But, for almost everything else, including the biggies of value, price and the flavor/authenticity of the food, I'd argue Sunrise comes out on top of Coyote. And, as an aside, Sunrise also mixes a darned good regular and mango margarita at a good price.

When I want an evening out or want to run the gauntlet of flavored margaritas, I'd choose Coyote. But when I want to eat good, hearty Mexican-style food at a good price, I'd pick Sunrise every time...on their "good" days.

PS - Don't forget Charlie Brown's just off of Suk Soi 11 - they make a tasty regular margarita, have the advantages of a sit-down restaurant, some nice "hometown" Thai ladies on staff, and a mountain order of good nachos that I wish Sunrise would take a lesson from.

Thanks for the feedback.

By the way, we may have started to catch up on the "suay" factor. Have four new waitresses that were previously presenters at Bitec that are very cute and have a bubbly personality. They are seniors at a University looking to improve their conversational English and make some spare cash as a waitress. This pipeline continues we may eventually catch up with Coyote on having pretty servers.

Other good news…

Cinco de Mayo or the Fifth of May is a day that is celebrated all over the world.

In Mexico or wherever the culture of Mexico is celebrated — people gather to have a fiesta in honor of the event.

This festival observes the 1862 victory of 4,000 ill-equipped Mexicans over 8,000 well-equipped French invaders. The battle known as the battle of Puebla took place on...(you guessed it) May 5.

Today, all is forgiven, with fiestas planned in Mexico and in many communities around the world. Gringos who have little idea why they are coming to a Cinco de Mayo celebration are happy to commemorate the day and join in the fun and parties on May 5th.

Cinco de Mayo is on Monday and Sunrise Tacos is ready to give guests a fiesta of their own! Festivities will include a giant frozen margarita with flavors of Lime, Mango and Fresh Strawberry. You also will get to keep the giant souvenir glass! This Margarita by- the- yard ™ (800 ml or 27 ounce glass) glass comes with 3 shots of tequila and 1 shot of triple sec along with the freshly squeezed lime, mango or strawberry juice for only 199 Baht + Vat (50% off the still low price at Sukhumvit Soi 12.) This offer is valid Monday May 5th at the Sukhumvit soi 12 and Siam Paragon Branch.

Mexican food is a huge part of celebrating Cinco de Mayo. To celebrate this fun holiday and all the tasty meals that go with it, for every 500 Baht your party spends on our delicious food at Sunrise Tacos that day; you will get one free “I Love Tacos” or “I Love Burritos” shirt. (Value of 250 Baht.) This offer is valid for the Emporium, Siam Paragon and Sukhumvit Soi 12 locations or also valid Monday when you call for delivery at 02-229-4851 or order online at http://www.chefsxp.com/home.php?manufacturers_id=98. Delivery is 24 hours a day.

Be sure to come out and celebrate with us at one of our biggest fiestas of the year!

www.sunrisetacos.com

So is there still a way to "backdoor" that 4 or 2 thai employees thing?

Sorry what do you mean "backdoor" thing? What is your goal then I can advise you the best way to go with.

www.sunbeltasiagroup.com

Ok, my goal is to start a company and have a work permit but I don't need thai employees. I know that before it was possible to avoid that by doing a border run every 90 days. What about now?

As of right NOW, in most cases the company is allowed to not have Thai employees if a letter is written explaining why you have not hired any Thai employees or filed the Social Fund Report.

www.sunbeltasiagroup.com

A.) If I did get an Education Visa, is there any allowance working part time, I know with some countries, a student/education visa allows you to work part time (Japan for example)

No. Been that way for a year.

B.) Since I can't own the land, could my boyfriend open up a new shell company in his name, receive the rental property in the company's name, and use that as his capital/assets to then hire me on a work permit? Basically it would be his capital, not mine.

yes

C.) I guess in essence, what is the best way to go over there and not have to do a visa run every 90 days or try to marry anyone?

No easy answer. Best thing is to make sure you want to move here first.

www.sunbeltasiagroup.com

Does anybody know whether it is possible to get a work permit whilst possesing an "ED visa ?

No. Been that way for about a year now.

www.sunbeltasiagroup.com

1. Since your BF is Thai, Wouldn't it just be a lot simpler for him to open a Company here and if needs be, employ you ? (If thats possible)

Two options...

The BF would need 4 Thai employees to hire her because he is a natural employer. Still she also has limited protection with her investment of 25K (the best way then is a registered loan... but you'll still need some good luck with this route).

If he forms a Thai company and employs her. Not a big difference in cost savings. Limited protection also as she is just a minor shareholder.

www.sunbeltasiagroup.com

Sorry to say but you should really think of being in the rat race some more and save up some more savings. 25K just won't give you any breathing room and then you will be miserable. Your relationship very well could end because of it. Then what will you have? ...a broken dream. Sorry but the odds are very high that this would happen.

Please save up some money is my advice but do keep your hope alive.

However in case you insist on coming and doing this. Here are the answers.

[A.) I'd like to open a business there to provide myself a Work Permit and also to make money. I'm not sure as an American if it's better to use the Thai/US Treaty or the normal way of opening a business.

Yes it is better

B.) I know part of the condition of getting the work permit is capital, since they don't live in any of the houses they own and collect rent on them. Could I put one of the houses into the company's name and use that as part of the 2million baht capital to get the work permit.

The reason you want to register Amity is to have control over your company. By putting a house that you don't own to pay for share capital, won't work with you being the largest shareholder. Also the house most likely has land with it on the chanote which the Amity Company can't own.

Be aware in August 2009 as an Amity Treaty shareholder, the company may have to prove that 3 million Baht capital came from overseas. Until that time no one looks at how the shares were paid in cash or via equipment, etc.

C.) Since my boyfriend is still a thai citizen, would it better for him to open the company then me?

No. You want to protect that USD25K.... Relationships do sometimes end.

D.) is 15K baht a month decent to cover living costs in Chiang Mai (won't be paying for house/rent). We're not party people or drinkers, so it's really just food, misc purchases, gas, etc.

This is more a question on how long is a string. It just depends. However if you eat and live like many Thais, yes 15k living costs is ok for some Westerners. It has been done.

E

.) For coming over to Thailand, is it better to just get a Tourist Visa and then start up the company and go after the WP. Or since I want to learn the language when I get here, should I just sign up for language courses now and get an Education Visa and then roll it over to a WP later?

Education visa will not allow you to get a wp. Get a multi entry non immigrant visa there in the States.

www.sunbeltasiagroup.com

So is there still a way to "backdoor" that 4 or 2 thai employees thing?

Sorry what do you mean "backdoor" thing? What is your goal then I can advise you the best way to go with.

www.sunbeltasiagroup.com

Are you saying here that you only need two Thai employees if you are married to a Thai, AND you also have a sole proprietorship (Thai or Amity)?

Yes

Or are you saying that for a sole proprietorship you do not need any Thai employees, and completely unrelated to that, if you are married to a Thai, you only need 2?

A sole proprietorship has been different from a Thai Limited company in that it ALWAYS has required Thai employees for the last 18 months for any new application of a work permit. The regulation says it could be met also by paying tax in the previous year of 25,000 Baht or 50,000 Baht depending if you were married to a Thai. However, Bangkok no longer on new applications will accept that criteria of tax. That’s the way it has been for the last 18 months.

www.sunbeltasiagroup.com

Okaaaay I found the answer to my question:

" This has already changed since Feb. You now need 4 Thai employees to get a work permit. ( Before it used to just the criteria for Immigration) The only exception is if you are working for a sole proprietorship or are a sole proprietorship under the Amity treaty for the USA/Thailand and are married to a Thai, then its 2 Thai employees required.

www.sunbeltasiagroup.com"

The only thing I dont understand is that in their message sunbelt says "This has already changed since Feb"

I went to see a lawyer of Sunbelt asia last month (March 2008) and he told me that everything was OK, dont need any Thai employee.

And in their message now they say that you actually need 4 thai employees since February...

Does'nt look very serious to me...

On 2007-03-02 11:18:08 I wrote…

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?sh...t&p=1173720

I often have joked that my tombstone will read " Here lies the man who stated everyday : "Four Thai employees in a Limited Co. are not required for a work permit "

Not sure if the tombstone will be big enough. However I have said it so much everyday... 20-30 times a day, I'm sure the reflex will be there to still be saying it, even after I have faded away.

www.sunbeltasiagroup.com

So why a year later, the change after over a thousand posts saying the same thing as above since Oct 2004? Because even if the regulation hasn’t changed, its how the interpretation of the province Labor Dept head understands it. For instance the last 4 years, in Chiang Mai, they have required one Thai employee for a work permit. Where does it say you need one Thai employee in the regulation?

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?sh...mp;#entry188450

It doesn’t anywhere except article 8 that says “Article 8. Considering permitting otherwise than the cases or criteria herein prescribed shall be the power of the Director-General.” That means that Labor Dept Director-General in that province requires it, so be it. They make the rules and this regulation is only a guideline. The same goes in Nitcha Thani which required Thai employees the last three years while Bangkok did not.

Since Feb they have been stricter in Bangkok. The reason some of our clients have not had a problem with needing 4 Thai employees at this time. We had written a letter explaining why they don’t have a social fund filing for four Thai employees. Some days we submit the work permit application and they don’t ask for any letter or Social Fund filing showing proof of Thai employees. Other days they do ask for it or come back asking for proof.

A new regulation will be coming out but who knows what it will say. Bottom line I’m sure it will have “Considering permitting otherwise than the cases or criteria herein prescribed shall be the power of the Director-General.”

Some days, just like the ocean has tides that change, so does the Labor Dept stance. In Thailand, it can be black and white for years.... then Bammm! It's a great country so you deal with it.

www.sunbeltasiagroup.com

Would be a nice poll for the farang managing directors with a PROPER work permit:

1. Who has 4 thai employees?

2. Who has no Thai employees?

We have easily over 500 clients whose MDs are foreigners and have a work permit and don't have 4 Thai employees. When they applied it was not required. Times change... and if you have been in Thailand a long time, you know they also change back. But today is only today.

On the other hand we have also hundreds of foreign MD's that have many Thai employees. For some it means nothing on the new change except providing the extra paperwork. For other applicants it does mean a lot to hire more people than they even need to have working.

www.sunbeltasiagroup.com

So.....

What are the practical ramifications of obtaining a work permit(and the job that goes with it) while on 1 year retirement extensions?

The only real benefit of the retirement extension is not having to do visa runs. I'm in my 6th year of extension based on retirement.

I've been reading for years on TV questions from people regarding their work permits and have vaguely ab sorbed the info while knowing it did not apply to me. But I seem to recall questions about having to leave the Kingdom within 7 days of the WP no longer being valid. And the answer was that that was the case. This is one example of a possible conflict.

Would this situation be particularly desireable? The ability to work without having to worrry that when the WP expires that you have to leave. Or will you have to leave? Would you just carry on with the retirement extension and get another WP when you got another job?

Having to Leave in 7 days does not apply in this case if his extension of stay is based on retirement. Even if he had a work permit.

Only if he had a extension of stay based on business would the work permit be linked to that permit of stay and he would have to leave.

www.sunbeltasiagroup.com

Sorry Sunbelt but this is NOT correct. Thai there is still NO need for 4 Thai employees for the non-Thai(s) to get a work permit. The 4 Thais remain a requirement only for the extension the visa to a "long-term/1 year" visa. The only significant change made by the 22 February 08 amendments to the Alien Work Act is the allowance for work permits to be good for 2 years instead of just 1.

Never thought I would be the one that would be on the side of the fence saying you need 4 Thai employees to get a work permit. Go back in the archives, if I didn't say it over 1,000 times I would be very surprised the last six years..."no Thai employees are required to get a work permit." A number of posts I even remember writing" please put it on my tombstone, no Thai employees are required to get a work permit"

But department heads do change and how the labor dept interprets the regulations. Since Feb 2008, in Bangkok they now want to see 4 Thai employees for every work permit application. So I guess my tombstone can no longer say" No Thai employees are required for a work permit" This could change in the future but as of today this is the way it is in Bangkok with the Labor Dept, you need to show the social fund filings for your Thai employees or a very good letter explaining when in the next month you will be hiring them.

www.sunbeltasiagroup.com

.

Now the whole element of key money adds a unique dimension to this struggle. Working tirelessly to make a business thrive only to be "forced" out by rediculous sums of KM is hardly encouraging.

Key money is not necessary a bad thing as long as you have your eyes open for the future. Realise the risks and rewards. Have your lawyer draw up a contract spelling out what the maximum rent increase with key money can be charged in 3 years and for an additional 3 years. Under the Civil commercial Code that’s the maximum number of option extensions an entity can have is two extensions. However you can put in the contract that another entity will be entitled to the lease in year 9-12 and permission has been granted by the landlord.

Make sure your contract does not simply have option to renew. Under the Civil Commercial Code both parties ( Landlord and tenant) have the option to renew unless its spelled out that that legal right of the landlord has already been granted to the tenant for the renewal. In this case, only the tenant has the right to decide every three years.

The best option is to register the lease with the Land Dept. It can be up to 30 years. If it’s a tax issue… tell the Landlord you will pay the tax for the registration.

www.sunbeltasiagroup.com

So, I guess the answers to my questions are that

a - Maybe I will still have an O retirement visa, with a work permit. The officer did not really say.

b - The work permit may cost me 20K per year, even though my salary may only be 29K per month.

But an employer rejected my application this week, saying that at age 65, I cannot get (or, the school or agency cannot get) a work permit!

The Amity treaty also did not seem to work. Maybe I will never be allowed to work legally. What a country.

If your application was accepted last week, it still would of been 3,100 Baht in government fees.

It is not correct that you cannot get a work permit by being 65 years old. I have a foreign employee that works with us. He will finally hang up his shoes at the end of the year and he is 81 years old with a work permit.

www.sunbeltasiagroup.com

Can one of the Thai employees be the wife of the foreigner?

yes

www.sunbeltasiagroup.com

Is the length of the WP granted also not dependent upon the number of employees in your Company?

Good point aesthete. The 3 month work permit was a bit of a loophole for those whose employees couldn't manage the four Thai employees needed to get a the 3 month WP and non-imm B visa extended up to a year. It may well be Immigration's way of cracking on down on expats running their own very small companies. This comes from Immigration only as the Labor Ministry (whose role it should rightly be) doesn't care about numbers of Thai employees. As Immigration is part of Thailand's finest they probably feel must legislate on behalf of other ministries. Let's see how this turns out but there doesn't seen to be any movement to lighten up anything to do with foreigners' rights in Thailand.

This has already changed since Feb. You now need 4 Thai employees to get a work permit. ( Before it used to just the criteria for Immigration) The only exception is if you are working for a sole proprietorship or are a sole proprietorship under the Amity treaty for the USA/Thailand and are married to a Thai, then its 2 Thai employees required.

www.sunbeltasiagroup.com

On that subject, if I get a new work permit in May, and my non-O retirement visa is changed to a non-B visa to work, will I pay 1,900 baht and still have an annual extension date of November? Or will the extension date be subject to the terms of my school contract? How much does a work permit cost?

In Bangkok at least, you do not need to change the permit of stay on retirement to get a work permit. This flip flops every year or so and now the tide has changed to allowing it again.

If you show a contract, the work permit will correspond to that period rather than one year.

www.sunbeltasiagroup.com

I am on Non B visa multiple entry from abroad ( 1 year, but every 3 month required to leave the country) for a few years now.

Untill my last renewal work permit was issued only for 3 month, but now it is 1 year even for Non B visa holders ( not extension of stay ).

Sunbelt sendt me the information on their newsletter already a few weeks ago, but i did not understand when this regulation was due to enforcement.

Tomorrow I will be the proud holder of a one year WP, and I will save myself the costly and time consuming trips to the gov. office every three month.

The regulation for Bangkok has not come out yet but it will essentially work like this. ( Nothaburi has already released their regulation.)

Everyone now will get a one year work permit and it will be max. 20,000 Baht. Before if you had a visa expiring in 80 days, even if on page 5 of your work permit you were granted a one year work permit, it was valid for 80 days. You then needed to revalidate the work permit in 80 days by showing you had gotten a new visa or extension of stay permit. Now you will no longer need to do this revalidation.

Your costs will unfortunately go up because of the increase of government fees to max. 20,000 Baht for the year.

Also, you can get a work permit on a "o" visa even if its for retirement or you have a extension of stay permit based on retirement. It's only on a education non immigrant permit or "ed" visa, that they won't allow a work permit.

www.sunbeltasiagroup.com