Mike Teavee

4 minutes ago, JohnnyBD said:

I guess the only way for your capital gains to be non-assessable income is to not be a tax resident in the year you remit the proceeds to Thailand.

Technically it's to be non-tax resident in the year the gain was made, but for something big like the CGT on the sale of a house I would do both (realise & remit) in a year I was non-tax resident. 

4 minutes ago, Pattaya57 said:

 

Yep, this really is a game changer. 

 

With my current non-imm O I can stay in Thailand for 1900 baht per year + 3800 baht per year for multi re-entry permit. So 28,500 baht for 5 years.

 

For DTV it seems I can book my same annual check-up at Bangkok Hospital I always do and get a 5 year multi-entry visa. Total cost in 5 years would be:

 

Initial visa - 14,400 baht (A$600 or US$400)

Yearly extension: 1900 baht x5

Yearly border hop: 3500 baht x4 (no need in last year)

 

So total cost is 37,900 baht

 

Oops, non-inm O is 9400 cheaper without having to leave the country 😀

That assumes you're only leaving the country because of the Visa and not leaving on holiday or visiting family.

I visit my family in the UK once per year so that takes care of the annual "Border hop" & take the GF to visit a different country at least once per year which takes care of the extensions.

So total cost of the Visa over 5 years is 10,000B (Or whatever the equivalent is in the country where you apply). 

Have to ask, what's the point of getting a Multi Re-Entry permit if you're not going to be leaving Thailand at least 2 times pa. 

1 hour ago, JohnnyBD said:

I think you're exactly correct. For example, I have a Roth which was worth X amount on Dec 31, 2023 (all in stocks). If I withdraw and remit all the dividends & interest in 2024, then it's assessable income in Thailand even though it's not taxable in the US. What's left in the Roth is still pre-2024 assets (stocks). If I sell any of the stocks and remit the monies, then I should calculate the amount of principal versus gains using the stock prices on Dec 31, 2023. The gains would then be assessable income, and the principal would not be. This seems right to me.

Unfortunately Capital Gains on the sale of stock will be based on original costs & Thailand would tax the whole gain if you remitted the money, the only way you could have locked in the value as at 31/12/2023 would have been to have sold them.

E.g. Lets say I bought 1000 shares in 2020 at £1 per share & sold them tomorrow for £2 per share, I would be taxed on the whole £1,000 gain not what they were worth on 31/12/2023.

I do wonder what the position would be if I used the money to buy new shares (In the UK it would have to be different stock) & then sold these, my Capital gains on the 2nd sale is likely to be a loss but would the original gain be counted even though I didn't remit it to Thailand. 

On 7/26/2024 at 11:49 AM, Robin said:

I have read through all the 19 pages above, and it seems to me that much depends on the definition of 'savings' that are being brought in to Thailand.

If I sell my house in UK, is this money 'savings'  House was bought over the years with payments from my income.  Was that "savings,"

Value of house has increased during the time I have owned it, but as my 'principal dwelling ' in UK it is exempt from UK Capital gains tax.

How will RD view this money if I transfer it to my Thai bank account?  I would call it savings.

Second question;  If I give this money to a trusteed friend in UK, and they then send me 20M B as a gift, is this exempt from tax?  If they do that every year until the money is used up, is it still a tax emept gift?

Any gains made on the sale of your house would be classed as "Capital Gains" and so taxable if you remit it to Thailand.

The fact that you bought it out of already taxed income doesn't come into it as that went to cover the Cost of the house not the gain (Same with any stocks & shares you own).   

Just now, racket said:

 

The key factor to consider is the income tax requirements. I believe an individual becomes liable for income tax in Thailand after staying in the country for 180 days or more, unless a tax treaty applies. However, it’s relatively easy to circumvent this by leaving Thailand and returning before reaching that threshold. It will be interesting to see how this situation evolves.

 

Here are more details on the tax requirements: https://www.expattaxthailand.com/wp-content/uploads/2024/07/FOREIGNERS_PAY_TAX2024.pdf

It's 180 days in any one calendar year so if you spend Jan-March 2025 in Thailand (90 days), leave & come back Oct-Dec 2025 (92 Days) you're tax resident.

On the flipside if you spend August 2024-June 2025 in Thailand, leave & don't return until 1st Jan 2026 you won't have spent 180 days in either year so won't be tax resident in either year. 

10 hours ago, farang51 said:

 

That is just b*llsh*t made up by crazy people. I really hate that kind of lists that are clearly the work of some jealous b*st*rds. Everybody knows that the Danes are the friendliest people in the world.

Absolute BS, nobody has ever met a nice South African... 

PS Just joking, worked in JBurg & met many very nice South Africans, some of the nicest guys I've ever worked with. 

50 minutes ago, racket said:

 

I understand your first point. However, let's consider a scenario where you begin your elite visa journey and are currently three months in, with 9 months remaining in the first year of your 5-year elite visa. You decide to leave Thailand for a short trip to Singapore and plan to return after a week. If you return to Thailand without a re-entry permit, does this void the remaining 9 months, or do you receive a new 1-year entry? From my understanding, if you don't apply for a re-entry permit, you will lose the remaining 9 months and instead receive a new 1-year stamp on your passport based on your 5-year elite visa, effectively starting your second year. That’s why I have repeatedly said that one might need to apply for a re-entry permit if you’re going to continue your stay based on your initial 1-year stamp.

You will be given a new 12 month permission to stay which starts from day of entry & would cover the previous 9 months you had + an extra 3 months so you won’t lose anytime in Thailand.

46 minutes ago, racket said:

 

You ALWAYS need a re-entry permit if you are planning to leave the country regardless of visa type in your passport. 

 

There are two types of reentry permits available:

    1.     Single Reentry Permit: Allows you to leave and re-enter Thailand once.
    2.    Multiple Reentry Permit: Allows you to leave and re-enter Thailand multiple times within the validity period of your visa.

The Elite visa is a multi-entry Visa so you don't need a re-entry permit to re-enter whilst it's still valid (Same is true of the LTR & 1 year Non-IMM OA visa and apparently the new DTV visa). 

I started on a 1 year Non-IMM O "Retirement" & visited Thailand at least 10 times (working in SG I used to pop over for a long weekend at least once per month) over the course of the year without needing a re-entry permit until I came in just before it was expiring & I needed to get a re-entry permit to protect my permission to stay so I could return to get an extension (With Multi Re-Entry permit as the Visa was no longer valid). 

4 hours ago, sometimewoodworker said:

This is one of the exact reasons to be non resident for 1 tax year, however having a capital gain in your home country is another reason to be non resident when the gain is realised. Regrettably HMRC will have their pound of flesh.
 

personally I will be likely to have a significant capital gain since one property has a 2,700% increase since it was purchased in 1974 so I will be non resident in the year I sell it. This will mean that if or when I remit these funds, however much I send I can have zero assessable income in Thailand for many years to come 

I'm having an internal debate with myself about whether I should also sell my UK house in 2026 when I'm going to be non-tax resident anyway.

Am sure you're already aware but the Capital Gains on your property will be calculated using the property's value in April 2015 so you may find your CGT bill is not as bad as you were maybe thinking. 

57 minutes ago, 5ilver said:

 

You're a legend not just in your own mind mate, thanks for sharing this. Looks like this was posted on Chinese Instagram with that Xiaohongshu watermark at the bottom right. Do share more deets when you get them.

 

I just enquired about the DTV with the consulate in Singapore, and seems like they're only processing foreigners holding long-term passes there at the moment.

When I was working in SG on an EP (Employment Pass, initially 2 years & then on 3 years extensions) they would only grant things like the MTV to Citizens & foreigners who had PR status so I guess it will be the same with the DTV.   

3 hours ago, Liquorice said:

I disagree.

The validity of a visa and the validity of a passport are separate.

It's the period of stay that is limited to the expiry date of a passport.

As I keep saying, in the case of Elite Visas you are only given a Visa in your passport up to the expiry date of your passport however your approval letter gives you the rights to (at least) a 5 year Visa so the remaining time will be granted to you when you get your new passport - Seems you consider the approval letter as the "Visa" whereas I consider what ends up in your passport as the "Visa".

End of the day none of this matters as one way or another you'll get a visa that's valid for 5 years, unlike when you're doing annual extensions where you would lose time if you did your extension when there was <12 months on your passport. 

1 hour ago, rocketboy2 said:

 

Don't think I can be bothered with subtitles or bubbed tv shows now days ( I assume that's the case ) ?

but thanks anyway.

I don't know, Crouching Tiger Hidden Dragon https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0190332/ is one of my all time favourite movies and I think the Chinese dialog / English subtitles somehow made it more authentic. 

2 hours ago, Liquorice said:

What sticker/stamps are you referring to?

Even with an e-visa, Immigration will not issue a 'permission of stay' stamp beyond the expiry date of the passport.

Nothing to do with permission to stay, I'm referring to the Visa Sticker (or Stamp) that they put in your passport.

As already discussed if you were on an Elite Visa & your passport expired in < 5 years you would only get the sticker/stamp up to the date of expiry of your passport & would get a 1 year permission to stay (assuming your passport had more than 12 months left on it).

When you get your new passport they will issue you with new sticker/stamp for the remainder of the 5 years. 

Visas are tied to Passports so I'm guessing that the same will be true of the new DTV visa OR you'll need to carry the letter confirming your Visa & your old passport (which has the number listed on the letter) with you when you travel.

I can't imagine you turning up showing an eVisa letter & not having the passport that it's been issued against will get you anything but a 30/60 day Visa Exempt stamp.

12 hours ago, bkk6060 said:

Many talking about leaving before 180 and listing off several countries they will go to when they leave.  I hope those are figuring the cost of airfare, hotels/rooms, transportation, etc.  I did this and came to the conclusion it would be less expensive to stay here and just pay the tax. And, places like Cambodia and Phillipines are a big downgrade in lifestyle in my opinion. Hopefully not, but I am happy here paying some menial tax in my situation is no big deal.

Exactly, I did the maths on somebody remitting 1Million THB of UK (already taxed) pension income & the max they would need to pay in Tax is <1,000B.

However, spending less than 180 days in Thailand makes sense when you want to remit a large chunk of money, E.g. In 2026 my private pensions start to pay out so I plan on bringing my PCLS (Pensions Commencement Lump Sum) of approx. 12Million Baht over so I can invest the $250,000 I need to invest to get an LTR visa & the tax on this would be >3Million THB so its a no-brainer for me to spend < 180 days in Thailand that year.

Hopefully it's just for the 1 year as if I can get an LTR I can bring money over freely without worrying about Tax.

I do hope that Thailand realises it will lose Expat money under this new tax regime, me spending 6 months outside of Thailand will mean they're losing approx. 720,000B that I would be spending in Thailand if I wasn't being forced to stay away.

10 minutes ago, Liquorice said:

This is one of these occasions where it's extremely important to understand the difference between a valid visa, and the 'permits' of stays issued by Thai Immigration.

Only the periods of stay are limited to a passport expiry date.

The validity of a visa is not affected by passport expiry date ........... simply carry both old and new passports if entering the Country.

 

After obtaining a new passport, simply have the stamps transferred to the new passport at Immigration to obtain the 180-day extensions.

This is where it's important to differentiate between a Visa that's a Sticker/Stamp in your passport & an "eVisa" that may be your Visa or may get you the Sticker/Stamp in your passport.

The former are only ever valid until your passport expires however the letter of approval for your Visa will get you a new Sticker/Stamp that's valid until  the end of the "Visa". 

50 minutes ago, roobaa01 said:

Good morning 

Pertaining the DTV validity 5 years, what happens if my passport has a remaining validity of only 4 years would receive a 5 year validity sticker?

 

Wbr

Roobaa01

Suggest you go back 1 page & read the discussion on this point.

In a nutshell you will be given a 5 year eVisa, it's unknown at this time whether they will put a sticker/stamp in your passport up to the date of expiry (They certainly won't put a stamp later than this) & then you'll get the remainder added to your new passport OR whether you'll need to carry the 5 year eVisa with you on every entry (& presumably your old passport as that's the passport the eVisa is tied to). 

19 minutes ago, stat said:

Thanks! Good for the UK guys then, in GER you lose all your allowances + you are supposed to detail your ww income and pay 40% plus on your german income when your ww income is over 60k EUR even if you only earn 5K eur in GER.

Ouch, but didn’t you (or somebody else) post that a German can choose to be taxed in Thailand instead of Germany on their pension which sounds like a good deal. 
 

UK Pensions are taxed in the UK, no choice. 
 

25 minutes ago, stat said:

Correct but then you only pay on your UK income and cap gains on UK property and you can not use the allowances to my understanding. So UK tax rules should only bother those that are still tax resident in the UK. When I moved to TH the german IRS did not bother me at all as I made sure I had no German income.

In the UK you can still use your £12,570 Personal Allowance although in some cases it might be better for you to forgo this as it can reduce your overall tax bill (I don't understand it enough to get into it & most people, including myself, still use their UK personal allowance). 

But you cannot use things like your annual £20,000 ISA allowance.   You can keep anything that you have in an ISA & still benefit from no tax on interest but you cannot add anything more to it whilst being non-UK Tax resident. 

UK CGT for Expats is limited to Property & even then, if you're selling your primary property then there is no CGT to pay (E.g. for my 1st 3 years of being non-UK resident for Tax because I was working overseas & kept my house empty the UK still considered it my Primary property, it was only when I started to rent it out that it stopped being my "Primary Property" & so I have to pay CGT when it comes to selling it).