RedPill

9 hours ago, Mama Noodle said:

And if they dont, and it proves how god awful Dem run states are, you guys will still blame Trump and absolve people who really need to be held to account

That's the problem in the US, either all dems or reps or dems vs fed (trump) ... it's unbelievable painful to watch this from the sidelines how divided this country is. It's all blaming and fighting, fighting the dems, fighting the reps, fighting the media ... meanwhile all the ppl die.

4 hours ago, Oldie said:

They cannot make a special law for your building. And people can gather in and around the pool and because being wet cannot use masks. Also some people lying in the sun will avoid to use masks so that not halve of their face will remain white. 

Yes, they could specially remove that law ...

I don't know, that is the second Reuters with a dramatic title in 2 days ... looks like they don't want to wait a few days, but everyone to stay home forever. That title, talk about fear spreading, faster than the virus itself.

My sister living in Germany tells me just a few days ago, other than she has to wear a mask while shopping now, and her teenage daughter not seeing her boyfriend for 7 weeks, live is pretty much not that dramatically different. Her husband also still runs his telco business, although limited, on building sites. 

This is so much fear mongering ... it smells like a rat.

13 minutes ago, stevenl said:

I only do FB because I have to, and live in Thailand. But afaik criticism of the Dutch approach is not suppressed, and from what I read it is being suppressed in Germany.

That's interesting. Because I know several Dutch ppl who are completely talking the Dutch press down.

And when I watch the German news, including all the discussion programs, I find it rather balanced, with critics from all sides. I don't have the feeling 

I watch something where I get brainwashed.

I have this discussion with a Dutch cousin of mine since many weeks ???? He's a bit of a antivaxx/5g guy. But in a light, non-aggressive way. In any case, he shares a lot of things with me, where I say ... man, the German press is not like that. 

1 hour ago, stevenl said:

Yes, it does seem Germany is going (way) overboard.

From what I read in the Netherlands, and the comments I read from my Dutch fellows on FB, it's all a little bit similar ...  I mean the overall situation.

Or what is your take on it?

1 hour ago, Logosone said:

with right wingers and conspiracy nuts sprinkled on top.

This quote made me laugh ????

You are right though ... we have to keep it very sharp. Too many things are getting mixed up. 

I mean about the demos, not about that paper you guys discuss.

15 minutes ago, daveAustin said:

Best to open early and smooth the curve than big Vs up and down methinks. If no vaccine is forthcoming, this is the only way forward - i.e. move on and have at it rather than completely destroy economies and lives anyway.

Btw, Germany was on the fringes and hasn't had a 'proper' dose. 

You mean a proper dose of dead people? They did had a proper dose of infections though. I mean, they have been in the top of the charts since how long now.

I agree with you overall. After almost 8 weeks now ... it's enough. 

The people who can stay at home and have the means and/or also can work from home, are the ones who are very critical about everyone who is not 'just' staying at home.

This can't continue forever of course. That's why people are going on the streets, and for me personally, rightly so. If done in a correct manner.

53 minutes ago, bendejo said:

First off, for the OP, approaching a guy in any form of drag for casual conversation

Something like this. It's one thing to greet or talk to someone when you meet them.

It's another thing to randomly just walk up to someone in Tesco's who is just sitting there ... and force him into a conversation.

Who knows, the guy sits there and just has a bad day? Not really waiting for a guy to walk up to him and want to chit chat ... just because

he has the same color of skin or is from the same race.

Did the OP ever think about that?

But I agree, you could at least listen for a second and see whether he needs help or directions. That would be the right thing to do.

2 minutes ago, lkv said:

I just don't understand how yesterday 100 people infected 110 people and today they infect 113 people.

 

How can this model be so precise? And what model is this?

I don't know, I never looked into detail of these models or calculations. Good you brought it up. Something to look into.

I hear them talking about it, but no one really gave any details on this. 

10 minutes ago, lkv said:

Ok. So I don't know what to make of it.

 

In various articles i researched, they claimed the rate was 1.0 3 days ago, then 1.1, then 1.13.

 

The reality is, nobody can calculate R0 realtime. - read article below.

 

So I don't quite understand where their estimates derive from - I understand they must be using models, but still - or if they just use it as a scaremonging tactic for people to practice social distancing.

 

https://www.wsj.com/articles/germanys-r0-coronavirus-experiment-11588115565

Good point, how do you want to measure this R metric?

I guess that's what 'the app' is going to be used for they are talking about ... hypothetically, if everyone would have one, you would get this kind of data.

But personally, I don't like this idea of a tracing app at all. 

These are the ppl who f%$ it up for all others, IMO

Antivaxx demo goes wrong ... a small group of activists derail a initially 'registered and peaceful' demonstration.

I find the behavior of antivaxxers incredibly stupid.

On the very first day, when the gov opens restrictions and the first ppl enjoy sitting on a terrace again with a cup of coffee in the sunshine, after weeks staying at home.

The antivaxxers have to go onto the street in a very chaotic and unorganized way, on top of each other, shouting at the police.

I have no idea about that vaccine thing ... it's too complex for me, in medical terms, so many different opinions.

But one thing is clear to me ... something scientific you can argue or proof or discuss in a different manner.

You don't have to go onto the streets and f$# it up for all the other people, who are finally outside sitting in a cafee again.

In that aspect, I don't have much respect for these conspiracy, 5g, antivaxx chaos activists.

I do respect 10k people coming together and demonstrate in a safe way, where police is watching from the sidelines, and don't have to do

anything. It would be a crazy world if no one would be allowed to demonstrate for their rights.

You know tabloids, they don't let anything slip to drama and spice it up .. never. The Sun, Bild etc. 

If the Bild reports that this was a peaceful demonstration, with 10k people, without any incidents ... then you know

it was a good demonstration.

https://www.bild.de/regional/stuttgart/stuttgart-aktuell/gegen-corona-regeln-mega-demo-mit-mehr-als-10000-demonstranten-70546726.bild.html

13 hours ago, Saint Nick said:

Pretty much thanks to a few ten thousand demonstrators on the weekend, who were "fighting" against their "freedoms" being taken away!

You just can't cure stupid!

I wouldn't say this is the complete picture.

Everybody has the right to say something in a democracy. No one has to take 'all and everything' what a government dictates for granted.

These 10k people in Stuttgart, did it in the correct way. They kept distance, raising their points, worries and opinions.

There were 300 police around them ... and they did not had to do anything ... no aggressions, a safe demonstration. 

A demonstration which was registered and approved by the government. And went without any significant problems.

Meanwhile, on other places, chaotic activists gather in unorganized get togethers, on top of each other, screaming around, freedom, 5G, Antivaxx ... extreme left and extreme right, shouting at the police, making trouble ... no one knows what the real point of the demonstration was. 

Everyone goes there with their extreme opinions, ignores all the rules, demo not even registered and are aggressive. 

These are the people where I say ... you just can't cure stupid. 

3 minutes ago, Sujo said:

But its not his job to spread his own personal theory without it being approved or else everyone would do it and cause untold confusion of facts.

For a split second, I thought you guys talk about white house press conferences ????

5 hours ago, BritManToo said:

Wordy troll back looking for love with Thai hookers working from ThaiFriendly.

 

If by some chance your post is real, she probably couldn't talk 'cos she was banging a paying customer.

Send her some money by Western Union, and she'll talk for an hour or two.

About banging customers ... I'm wondering how this is going at the moment, or the past 7 weeks. 

Is anyone going to meet up with someone they met online? ... and then bang her?

And then go back to social distancing tomorrow? ????

6 hours ago, phantomfiddler said:

Maybe I am missing the point here, but I see no value in attempting to belittle someone,s contribution to a discussion without cause or proof

And as last thing to your comment. I see Alex posting all sorts of typical slogans in the US/Trump threads. I think he's a big boy.

Germany was doing very well so far handling this outbreak. I have read enough stuff and opinions, political banter, even conspiracy theories.

With this one, I can follow by myself and see what is exactly happening, what's news reporting or what are facts. At least a little bit, for once.

"just stay at home if you feel you are at risk" ... is just another typical statement which I will filter out, following the progress of re-opening of restrictions. Enough of this stuff.

6 hours ago, phantomfiddler said:

and where did these specific 200 workers come from ?

From Poland ... cheap exploited labor. Factories making lots of money and put them into s#$t place to live with daily

picks up to and from the factory.

This factory number with infections, had nothing to do with the re-opening of restrictions 3 days ago.

They happened to be reported in exact parallel, but the Reuters news article makes it read as it's an outcome of the re-opening.

That factory was infected before re-opening of restrictions already. Reported at the exact same day when the first people started to enjoy their new freedom again. But nothing to do with re-opening of restrictions.

I say good they single this out, close the factory and 'only' keep the restrictions for this area ... and not for the complete country.

i.e. no virus spread in Thailand. A few cases in Yala ... but all other people are still restricted to travel across a province in Chiang Mai

5 hours ago, phantomfiddler said:

How is Alex missing the point ? and where did these specific 200 workers come from ? In fact there are hundreds of thousands of workers living in cramped conditions around the world, probably millions, always have been and always will be, and this has no bearing on Alex,s correct conclusion that the cure is worse than the disease. Maybe I am missing the point here, but I see no value in attempting to belittle someone,s contribution to a discussion without cause or proof.

Attempting to belittle someone? Never been the intention. Maybe Alex can speak for himself if he really felt like this. 

If you go back and read my reply ... I was 'not' talking about the 'correct conclusion' that the cure is worse than the disease. Not at all.

I was replying to his statement: "Stay inside if you think you're at risk." Which not everybody just can. There are millions who don't get any social benefits and have their jobs/businesses closed (i.e. Thailand ... getting what? 5k? Just stay at home if you're at risk?)

I'm very aware that there are millions of cramped conditions around the world.

Just pointing out that the article is talking about 50 cases per 100k population as the metric to monitor the 

progress, to either open up more or close again.

I'm following all the news around this ... including discussions whether this number should be 35 or 50 or any other number.

They opened up just 3 days ago ... and only 1 state first, others follow step by step, gradually.

That meat factory story is also since 3+ days in the news ... I just pointed out to not mix this up with the broader population getting ready going out again and picking up their 'normal life's'.

Life has to go on ... also that I agreed with Alex ... just not the statement ... stay at home if you feel at risk. Because that's just not possible for everyone.

Another topic which is more or less useless to discuss. With free speech and free media, everyone knows what the ppl think, need or want.

34 minutes ago, ukrules said:

Too early to tell until the end of the week, they relaxed the restrictions only about 4 days ago.

 

Maybe they get a big surge, maybe not - will be good data to work with going forward and many other countries can learn from the outcome.

Not only good data ... also good lessons how to apply the metrics ... and don't throw everything into one big pot.

The good thing about this, as far as I follow it. They isolate the area of cases ... and not the complete country for all.