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You claimed that Israel supported Hamas when it was doing good. Right from the start, Hamas called for the eradication of Israel. In fact, its earlier constitution was blatantly genocidal. Yet Israel supported it? Really?

Unpopular enough that Netanyahu felt he had intervene to help shore up Hamas' popularity. That's how unpopular. Really? Hamas was getting all the aid it wanted from Iran? It didn't want any more? You got some evidence to support that?

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What utter nonsense. Israel imposed on embargo on Gaza when Hamas won the election in 2007. Because it explicitly said that Hamas was a terrorist organizaion. It helped support Qatar when it was giving aid to Hamas to the tune of 30 million dollars a month. Netanyahu said he was doing that to prop up Hamas against the PA. Hamas needed that propping because it had become so unpopular in Gaza. Stop making things up.

I get it. Hamas is using civilians as shields. So the way to deal with that is to starve those civilians to do and deny them medical supplies. That way, they'll be worthless as shields.

That's your argument? It would be worse? You take no account of why Hamas got to be popular in the first place. And you take no account of how unpopular Hamas was before October 7th. And how Hamas might not be in power now if Israel hadn't help to keep it there.

Hmmm...Hamas...Isn't that the group that Israel helped to support as a counterweight to the PA? Or is it some other Hamas you are referring to?

What has that got to do with Hanuguma's know-nothing claim about Palestinians should be begging to be part of Israel's economy?

You think Israel would let them be part of their first world economy? The explicit policy in the West Bank and Gaza, when Israel occupied it, right from the start was to keep the Palestinians economically suppressed. In the West Bank there are 2 sets of laws. One that governs Palestinians and one that governs Israelis. Anyone with any knowledge of this situations knows how the laws have been used to suppress Palestinian development. Clearly, you are not one of those in the know.

Sure. The way Israel has prosecuted this war and it deepening of oppression on the West bank has nothing to do with it? For a long time the Europeans more or less looked the other way at how Israel treated Palestinians, but Israel's conduct during this war has made that impossible. If Hamas has succeeded, that's because Israel has played right into their hands.

Israel has made it easy for those countries. after taking actions like this: Israel announces largest West Bank land seizure since 1993 during Blinken visit Israel’s far-right finance minister, Bezalel Smotrich, announced the seizure of 10 square kilometers (3.8 square miles) of Palestinian territory in the West Bank on Friday. The move marks the single largest land seizure by the Israeli government since the 1993 Oslo accords, according to Peace Now, a settlement watchdog group. “While there are those in Israel and the world who seek to undermine our right over the Judea and Samaria area and the country in general,” Smotrich said Friday, referring to the territory by its biblical name, “we are promoting settlement through hard work and in a strategic manner all over the country.” https://archive.ph/VKF2s#selection-667.0-675.306

And what is Israel's plan for ending the war? Does it even have one?

You are just as free to ignore my posts as I am to address yours. And vice versa. Who said otherwise?

I got exciting news for you. This is an open forum. If you care to carry on a private colloquy with another member, that's what the PM function is for.

So what? I was responding to part of what you quoted. Just not the part you prefer gets paid attention to. And what do you think the significance of that "update" is?

What has this got to do with the specific update the French gave? "Israel’s Foreign Minister, Israel Katz, speaking in Paris at an event attended by Séjourné, urged him “to announce loud and clear that the decision of the Chief Prosecutor is unacceptable to you and the French government – regardless of the authority of the court.” “This is what our friends around the world did, and this is what I expect from our friend, the French government,” Katz said, referring to denunciations of the prosecutor’s move by US President Joe Biden among others." You're the one who introduced it into the thread. Not me.

That a member nation can find a decision of the ICC unacceptable. It's one thing to disagree with a decision, it's quite another to find it unacceptable.

Therefore not to have its assumptions questioned?

Actually, you didn't claim anything. Maybe you didn't read what you quoted? "Israel’s Foreign Minister, Israel Katz, speaking in Paris at an event attended by Séjourné, urged him “to announce loud and clear that the decision of the Chief Prosecutor is unacceptable to you and the French government – regardless of the authority of the court.” “This is what our friends around the world did, and this is what I expect from our friend, the French government,” Katz said, referring to denunciations of the prosecutor’s move by US President Joe Biden among others."

Even if one crime is greater than the other, that still doesn't mean they aren't both crimes. And the alleged criminal conduct of netanyahu and gallant are both grave, regardless of what the leaders of Hamas have inflicted.

Without even seeing the evidence that the ICC investigators have gathered.

What Spencer isn't saying now but what he and other experts in this kind of warfare maintain is that it isn't enough to just to defeat your opponent in battle, , but you also have to occupy the territory they held. Otherwise they come back. . Israel hasn't followed that policy. Which is why they're fighting again in the North. Israel may simply not have the resources to occupy all of Gaza.. Which is why they're trying to outsource it to some Arab force. Why would any of the regimes in the Mideast want to wade into this mess and bail out Israel?

This should come as no surprise: Israeli soldiers and police tipping off groups that attack Gaza aid trucks Individual members of Israel’s security forces are tipping off far-right activists and settlers to the location of aid trucks delivering vital supplies to Gaza, enabling the groups to block and vandalise the convoys, according to multiple sources. Settlers intercepting the vital humanitarian supplies to the strip are receiving information about the location of the aid trucks from members of the Israeli police and military, a spokesperson from the main Israeli activist group behind the blockades told the Guardian. The claim of collusion by members of the security forces is supported by messages from internal internet chat groups reviewed by the Guardian as well as accounts from a number of witnesses and human rights activists. https://www.theguardian.com/world/article/2024/may/21/israeli-soldiers-and-police-tipping-off-groups-that-attack-gaza-aid-trucks

Making things up much? " Ultimately, the Constitution did not create an enumerated power to control free people’s immigration into the United States..25 The Constitution enumerates other powers that are considered inherent to a sovereign, but the Founders did not include immigration as one of them." https://www.cato.org/policy-analysis/brief-history-us-immigration-policy-colonial-period-present-day#post-ratification-period

Why do you think he's a "thorn in their side"? Are there lots of mullahs in Iran who are secretly secular humanists?