Mike Lister

I what way is the economy tanking, where and how?

Government spending stimulates the economy and increases GDP by building infrastructure that pays local firms who pay wages and buy supplies, the end product makes business operate more efficiently and facilitates the movement of products and people quickly and more easily.

Do you have anything to support that statement or is it just a thought? The banks are private institutions that compete against each other, lending is what they are designed to do so if they stop lending, what happens next!

I doubt I understand it better than you, as I recall you have an extremely good grasp on things!

Perhaps it's just me but I still don't see this so called looming economic crisis....from the link above: What - "Gross domestic product fell a seasonally adjusted 0.6% in the fourth quarter" Why - "A major drag in the fourth quarter was a decline in fixed investment, partly due to a delay in the budget". That's not partly, it's more like wholly, a self serving strategy of delay, to reinforce the need for the giveaway program! What - "while private consumption stagnated and exports nearly flatlined". Why - Flat lining can be a good thing, especially when it happens at near record levels, which both did! What - "The economy expanded 1.9% in 2023, slower than expected, and less than revised 2.5% growth in 2022". Why - Economic growth was on track to meet the forecast but government delayed the budget in 4Q23 which resulted in a fall of 0.6% hence targets were missed. The BOT press release said: The Thai economy slowed down from the previous quarter. Tourist expenditures and the value of merchandise exports, excluding gold, softened due to the subdued global demand together with structural factors, which negatively affected manufacturing production and private investment. Public spending also contracted from capital expenditures of the central government as well as investment from state-owned enterprises. Nevertheless, private consumption and activities in the service sector continued to improve and remained to be the key driver of the Thai economy https://www.bot.or.th/content/dam/bot/documents/en/thai-economy/the-state-of-thai-economy/monthly-2023/press-en-2023-12.pdf If there is an economic crisis it appears to be an intentional man made crisis.

Sherrings, PWC and Mazars all acknowledge the current Gift Tax rules and these have been posted previously, the PWC verbiage and link were incorporated into the document some time ago and are copied below. Despite those things, I continue to be apprehensive about the blanket adoption of this rule by everyone. The RD did not devise a complex anthology of tax rule detail, only to see it over ridden by one very simple but large tax loop hole. Even Mazars wrote when the rule was first established in 2016, "the introduction of such tax may prove difficult to implement and will be open to abuse". I wrote earlier that application of the rule is likely to depend on custom and tradition and may be applied unevenly across the population and geographically. My suspicion, and it is purely that, is that wealthy Bangkok families who make periodic gifts to relatives may be viewed differently from foreign retirees seeking an easy way to escape paying tax on funds transfers. In other words, the supermarket owning scion in Bangkok is likely to receive different tax treatment from Percy the pensioner who lives in Nakon Nowhere! For those who take comfort in the written word, the Gift Tax is well documented. But for those looking for a fool proof escape from potential tax on remittances, some caution is perhaps best advised, especially in light of the way this subject has been addressed previously in other countries. The PWC quote, from the Simple Tax Guide 43) "PIT is levied on gifts given by persons who are still alive. The tax is collected on the assets or the amount given to parents, ascendants, descendants, spouse, or others based on the value of the gift that exceeds a prescribed threshold, which depends on the type of gift and donor. Assets or amounts given that do not exceed the threshold are exempt from tax. 44) The following gifts are exempt from PIT: a) Income derived by a parent from the transfer of ownership or possessory right in an immovable property without any consideration to a legitimate child, excluding an adopted child, in the amount not exceeding THB 20 million throughout a tax year in respect of each child. b) Maintenance income or gifts from ascendants, descendants, or spouse, in the amount not exceeding THB 20 million throughout a tax year. c) Maintenance income derived under a moral obligation or gifts made in a ceremony or on occasions in accordance with established custom from persons who are not ascendants, descendants, or spouse, in the amount not exceeding THB 10 million throughout a tax year. d) Income from gifts in the case where the person who receives the gifts will use them for religious, educational, or public benefit purposes according to the intention of the donors under the criteria and conditions referred to in the Ministerial Regulations. 45) Gifts in excess of the above thresholds will be subject to PIT at the rate of 5% and will not need to be included together with other income when computing the annual PIT liability. 46) For ascendants/dependants the threshold is THB 20 mill, nor non-ascendants/dependants it's THB 10 mill". 47) https://taxsummaries.pwc.com/thailand/individual/income-determination Sherrings and Mazars Links below: https://sherrings.com/gift-tax-law-in-thailand.html#:~:text=Tax Payable on Assessable Gift Income&text=an adopted child)-,On the amount of the gift received in excess of,transfer of the immovable property.&text=or a spouse-,On the amount of the gift received in excess of,a personal income tax return. https://www.mazars.co.th/Home/Insights/Doing-Business-in-Thailand/Tax/Introduction-of-Inheritance-and-Gift-Tax

"Can I claim that any money brought into Thailand, is from my savings, and any top up to my savings is from previous years pension payments, not in this year? Similar with my Norwegian account". If it was then yes you can, just be prepared to prove it if asked. If it wasn't no you can't. Be aware that income from any year after 1 January 2024 is assessable to tax, delaying it's importation to Thailand by a year doesn't change anything. Suggest you read this: https://aseannow.com/topic/1319807-personal-income-tax-guide-for-foreigners-thailand/

Please read the forum rules, specifically number 17. https://aseannow.com/forum_rules/

I'm told the discussion is about Australia and not Thailand hence we might be off topic here, I'm somewhat unsure. SO let me just answer your point and then leave you to it, I only entered because to answer what I thought was a Thai related tax question. When you write, how OA pensions are classified, I don't know what you mean. The Thai RD regards income as assessible or exempt. If the DTA regards it as exempt, that's what it is, otherwise it's assessable. There is no other middle ground scenario that is nationality specific that is separate and apart from the DTA and the Thai tax code.

As of now, there is no Immigration requirement that applicants have a Thai TIN in order to extend a permission of stay.

It doesn't matter whether any funds are transferred or not, the individual is still regarded as tax resident. Whether or not they should pay tax in Thailand is a different matter, clearly, if they had no income, remitted to Thailand, no tax return is required, ergo, no tax is payable.

ANYONE who remains in Thailand for more than 180 days in a calendar year, is tax resident here, regardless of nationality or any other factor. Individuals may disagree with that but it is solely the call of the Thai government and nobody else.

I don't mind what posters want to call their threads, it's their choice. But what is going to happen is a parting of the ways, without further discussion, with immediate effect..

This thread looks like it's going to go the same way as others before it and for the same reasons. Posters have specifically opened a new thread to move away from what went before but it seems to have not had the desired effect. I'm going to take the unusual step here of asking KH to open his own thread to discuss whatever he wants to discuss and hopefully that will attract like minded debaters who wish to enjoin his debate. That will leave this thread to discuss what the OP intended at the outset. BUT, all parties need to remain in their respective threads, all crossovers get deleted without warning. If that means one thread attracts lots of people and healthy vigorous debate and the other attracts nobody, so be it.

1 million Baht.

If you are tax resident in that year and if you will owe tax that year, yes. Here, read this:

An extremely long post that attempted to hi-jack the thread, again, was removed. If you post again, consider the contents and length very carefully.

I removed 13 posts from posters who broke forum rules by posting negative comments on a news article, AND, one comment by a poster who chose to comment on moderation and look, nobody got a warning and nobody got suspended. Please note that if you keep pushing the envelope, this trend and my good nature wont last forever.

What do you mean,.....Or.....?

If there was no will, the laws of inheritance will apply which are very clear, you may wish to review them. Succession under Thai Inheritance Laws The chapter 'statutory right of inheritance' contains the laws of descent and distribution of the estate when there is no last will and testament made by the decedent. Pursuant to section 1629 of the civil code there are 6 classes of statutory heirs in Thailand and they are entitled to inherit in the following chronological order: descendants parents brothers and sisters of full blood brothers and sisters of half blood grandparents uncles and aunts The surviving spouse of the deceased is a statutory heir in accordance with a special provision in the civil code, section 1635. https://www.thailandlawonline.com/thai-family-and-marriage-law/legal-aspects-of-a-last-will-and-testament-in-thailand#:~:text=Succession under Thai Inheritance Laws&text=Pursuant to section 1629 of,and sisters of full blood As far as a lawyer is concerned, you should look at the different embassy web sites since they usually contain list of lawyers around the country that are recommended by the embassies, it should help taking some of the guess work out of it.

A presumed trolling post has been removed, the banks will not take your money after one year, if you don't operate it!

There is a hierarchy of RD tax offices, starting with small teassabahn offices, moving up to District offices and then to Regional offices. I deal at District Office level but I have been told in the past that I may get a call from the Regional office, if they had any concerns or issues. Top of the tree is RD offices in Bangkok, to which all the regions report. I would advise against dealing with the RD at the tessabahn level, if possible. Your comments below further confirm that this is an informal traditional and customary practise rather than anything else, some care is needed in this area. "When inquiring about gift tax, the official in charge advised my wife in Thai language that 'monetary gifts originating from overseas to a wife are tax-free.' However, there is nothing in writing".

The question to be asked is, what is it the government could default on that might cause that scenario, they have very low borrowings and over 95% is THB debt in country.

Those things are useful to understand but this is not an area I would want to get involved in nor recommend an approach. I suspect much of this will depend on custom and tradition rather than strict interpretation of the code and this of course can change without notice. I think if I were to use Gift Tax I would want there to be a clear delineation of funds, accounts and usage.

Dormant accounts are deposited at the Finance Ministry or BOT, for a period of 10 years as I recall, thereafter, if not claimed, they become the property of the state. In the meantime, banks can make monthly charges. There's a Bangkok Post article on this entitled, "Dormant account law details emerge", dated 18 Jan 2018.