OZONE

Sorry you all, I completely disagree with pre-nup. If you truly cares for the others, Money or items shouldn't be an issue. Even if you are trying to protect yourself. If money and things matters that much to you than you shouldn't get married. As far a i'm concern, its all about caring and wanting to take care of the other person, even for a short period of time. Thats what life is to me.

If I had one piece of advice for guys taking a Thai woman back home it would be 'keep her away from other Thais as much as you can'. I'm a fluent Thai speaker and I've been in the company of Thais overseas, the whole topic of almost every conversation is spitful gossip laced with green eyed envy. That has a huge amount to do with background and education.

Your fluency with the Thai language is a great advantage in this regard, but is it only Thai women who gossip about possessions, wealth and other such things?

In Australia, the Thai population is increasing rapidly. Today, we have Loy Krathong being celebrated officially in at least two different locations in Sydney. Thousands of Thais will be in attendance, so keeping Thais apart is virtually impossible....unless you lock them up.

For Thais to integrate properly into Farangland society, they need to have a feeling of belonging to that society.

We men bring our g/f's out to Farangland on at least two separate tourist visas. These visas should give us all a fairly good idea of how our partners will cope with living in Farangland.

The Thai women living in Australia that I know, want to be self sufficient. They want to meet their obligation to their families back in Thailand, by supporting them financially, so obtaining work is very important to them.

The most difficult thing is to find our g/f's full time work. Lack of education and experience are hinderers.

My g/f is employed as a full-time casual in the hospitality industry. Her salary is at the lower end of the average pay scale but she loves her work. Her wages far surpass what she could be expected to earn if she still lived in Thailand.

She is able to support her family back home and she feels important as she no longer has a need for my financial assistance.

When women have a feeling of belonging and are self-sufficient, they can live happily anywhere in the world.

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Can't agree with you more. She'll be happy as long as she do not feel like she's depending on you for everything. Also, I suggest having her attend local school, community college etc... for sense of accomplishent.

If I'm not mistaken, I believe Amway was started in Michigan, US. They are operating under the watchful eyes of the gov't because of fraud, and I think the paramid scheme had something to do with it; hence, they started selling outside of usa and became successful. not sure though

I do know thar They have an unfavorable reputation here, so I wouldn't trust them

excuse my ignorance ,but i thought network marketing was a pyramid system ,as opposed to a pyramid scheme ,or is that the same thing ??now youve got me thinking !!!

The basic difference between the Pyramid scheme or system and Networlk marketing scheme or system is that, in a network marketing environment, products are purchased either directly from the company concerned, or from licenced agents and at fixed prices set by the company. The company pays a commission of part of the purchase price to the agents who make the sale or those who introduce the customer.

In a Pyramid, A will purchase from the company and sell to B, making a profit. B then sells to C and so on down the line until J is left with a very expensive piece of trash he can not sell on.

In general, network systems tend to have high quality goods, which sell at between 20% and 50% (or greater) discount than equivalent quality goods in the shops. They are able to make the savings because they spend next to nothing on marketing and advertising. They also have no "paid" sales force and no high costs as regards shelf space in retail outlets or wholesalers' margin.

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This type of logic must absolutely be from a representative of an "Amway" product

I am seriously thinking of getting a visa organised for her to visit Australia or the UK or maybe Singapore when we go on holiday next time, as I feel that I would like to give her that as a special gift from us. She can't travel to these places alone as she doesn't speak any English at all.

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GREER,

That is one of best thing I've read in this forum. It shows you have compassion for other human being and shows how much you appreciate her. She'll love that.

Congratulation! Its always nice to hear good news

Hmm. curious myself about the dual citizenship. I'm not sure if Thailand allow dual citizensgip. I will ask mrs ozone and see. If anyone else knows please let us all know.

Ozone, quick question. Do you think that all Thai people should be paid at a western salary level?

Just interested to know.

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Ofcourse I do not think the salary are of equal nor have I said otherwise.

My point of this matter is working overtime needs to be compensated. Just because you can make these people work overtime for free, It doesn't mean you do it. Obviously everything is based on prior arrangements. If she / he gets food, living quarter etc... for free than it changes

Paying 5000 baht / month while working them 6:00am-9pm, 7 days / week with no living quarter, food allowance is slave labor to me. Taking consideration of the cost to travel, food, living expenses. The 5000 baht is not enough since Rent takes half of that (pending on location).

I commend people like you (EVO) & Greer for treating them better than slaves. I do not have a problem with your arrangement, However, If anyone pays these people 5000 baht without any benefits and thinking they are doing these people a favor, than think again. Its slavery as far as i'm concern.

I can sit here and argue my point day after day, but If one do not read all my commments and try to understand it , than theres no point to argue. So heres a quick summary.

1)As far as i'm concern, If you employed anyone for low wages and force them to work long hours with same pay, you are exploiting them. You are contributing to slavery of the third world.

2) I have a condo in Surat with a Thai wife, work Mon-Thurs in bkkand travled home on week-ends. Currently Wife and I are back working in USA (temporary). Although we can afford to hire a help staff in Thailand, we refused to do so.

Weather you like my posts or not its irrelevant to me. This is my opion. I valued yours and everyone elses but don't think for a minute that I won't rebut when I disagree with your comments.

Thats my opion and that's what matter.

"If you sell it, they will come". In Thailand, everyone knows its a harsh punishment for selling drugs, yet they still do it. Play with fire and you get burn; in this case, you'll get death for a bunch of green papers.

DONT - use the special hand (i mean ) to point  or  keep things

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Good point . If you do than you might get same foot up your arse

Be as respectful to all the elders as much as possible, smile and whAt ever you do, DO NOT TOUCH OR RUB ELDERS ON THEIR HEAD. Thats a big no no.

As far as I'm concerned, proven terrorists and those that control them should be tortured for information that will save innocent lives.

They are making a tough world even worse.

Fight fire with fire! 

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Cheers to you.

Its like the BULLY in school, He'll keep picking on you until you decide to get up and kick his arse, than and only than, He'll show a bit more respect for you

Minimum wage = minimum service

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The kind of wages discussed here are clearly slavery. Doesn't anyone have a conscience?

Guess not

Wait Wait, I just figured it out. The maid is actually paid 2500 baht + all she can steal. Now it makes good sense

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apparently its standard for many foreign settlers (not all) in Thailand to play follow the leader. The model is "If my neighbor can cheat the poor people than its ok for me to do also" I find it to be absolutely disgusting. Regardless it's from Farang or Thai.

BTW, I'm not saying pay them the US standard wage, but just be fair. NO FORCE OT for freeeeee

Don't complain that others don't read your post when you lack readingcomprehension yourself.

I wrote: "When you truly live here, not in your $-bubble, you can complain that people under-pay their staff."

It means that when you are payed in dollars you have no concept of the value of the local currency. You might know how much the milk costs, but you lack any real feeling for it.

So no, I haven't written that you don't live in Thailand. Not native english-speaker, are we?

And your concept of overtime versus salary is still bull. Just ask any thai people that live here...

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Congratulation atleast you paid attention and figured out i'm not a, English-speaker. English is my Third Lanuage and I believe I'm quite good. What is your excuse?. I posted the same statement many times stating "monthly payment is based upon agreed hours; If required to work more, than the employer should pay more". if you can't understand this statement than you really need to go back to school.

who said "overtime - versus- salary?. I said "salary+ overtime". Again, go back and read it.

I do not need to ask Thai people about this issue as you request. Majority of my Employees are Thai and more than willing to accept "paid overtime" instead of working for free. What person in their right mind do not mind working for free. especially, when its forced upon them?

Why is this such a hard issue for you to accept. You are taking advantage of these people because you can. Shame on you

OZONE>> When you truly live here, not in your $-bubble, you can complain that people under-pay their staff.

Besides, some people here pay their staff more then the thais that live around us do...

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First, I've stated 3 times on previous posts, I have a Condo in Surrathani, By the way I work in Krungthep (Bangkok, just incase you didn't know) and have an apartment there as well, so go back and read the posts.

Second, I didn't complaint about under-paying the workers. I merely pointed the fact that if you worked an employee over the time agreed upon, you need to pay overtime.. So get it right

Go back, reread the posts, understand it than give feed back.

Does anyone know the names of these places?

Why would you pay any money for any women, beautiful or not. Sounds kind of stupid to me. What ever happened to the oldfashion "Love". hel_l if you need beautiful and smart women, go to any colleges. PLenty of them

What kind of respectful family gives up their daughter for 1 million baht or any money anyway.

Hi all

Thank you for your inputs. From your posts I think the level is approx. 5000 per month.

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Please ignore our little misunderstanding. Majority of the time this forum is a very good place to start. We have our liitle terrible discussion now and than, but more times than not, its very helpful.

women's chat shows that my mrs watches, and they say oh this is a 'must have' and this is a 'must have' and she believes them.

boring drivel and expensive.

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with any luck, they'll start to discuss the "must have" cordless drill. wahooo

Again, you did not read the entire post. 6000 is the starting wage. Our cook earns far more than that. Plus paid time off during the year plus insurance plus meals plus tips plus help with medical bills.  We are not in the US so US wages are not applicable here. Our staff makes a very good wage for Thailand. I'll tell her you think she should get paid less when she works less and more when she works more. I am sure that will thrill her no end when she has bills to pay and can't make it because it is a slow season. Get off your high horse ozone, you don't know what you are talking about.

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"So for 5 months out of the year you work her 13 hours / day and pay her the same as the rest of the year"

To most people this staement would mean that you should pay her for working more than usual. How did you assume I said you need to pay her less?

Get off my high horse? You are the one who is taking advantage of these people, not me! .

Beginning to think i'm leaving a note for Cathy Lee Gifford

By the way, the post is about the Maid on staff "at home" not at your work place so she get no tips, now does she?

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You obviously know nothing about the working life of the average Thai person in Thailand since you don't even live in Thailand. I won't discuss this with you any longer since you don't have any idea what you are talking about.

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Sorry truth hurts.

For my credentials. I lived in Chiangmai, Lampang, Bangkok & have a condominium Suratthani for better than 15 years while employing for a us firm. I can speak, read, write Thai, what about you?. I know the Thai people likethe back of my hands. I be willing to bet that these folks do not call you their friends when they leave work. Wonder why?

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I see, so that's why you are posting in US dollars when it never applies locally and know nothing about current wages. In fact, two of our staff have been with us for 3 years, so again, you clearly don't know what the heck you are talking about. I never said my staff did outside work, did I? In fact, they do not do any personal work for me whatsoever. I am perfectly capable of doing my own laundry and cleaning my own house. Unlike most other places run by Thais where the staff is expected to the work around the resort and the owners laundry, housecleaning and childcare.

Once again, you have proved you can't read.

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If you go back to the original post by " CPH" it clearly states "Hi, How much do you pay your maid. Live in and live outside. What work does it include, for instance cooking, cleaning, laundry etc."

This to me sounds like he's asking for a "live in -or outside" maid and not an employee at your place of work; So, is it me or you who can't read?. You are in the wrong forum.

And once again, you failed recognized that i've lived in Thailand and have a condo in suratthani for the last 15 years. Go back and read my posts correctly instead sitting there being irritated. Get it straight

Just in case you didn't know, Calling names, being a tyrant only proved you're classless; so if you need to get your view point across, its more advantageuos to be calm. . Its also differentiate between good and horid management. Which one are you?

How about you get off your high horse?

What's next, expect anyone to pay their maid 50K+ THB because that is the social welfare-level in my homecountry?!

I see that you are employed for a US-firm, meaning you most likely aren't even getting local salary-level. Can I have your salary too?

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50k? you need to go back and read my posts. I did not mentioned 50k, 5k or otherwise. I merely pointed the fact that if you worked an employee over the time agreed upon, you need to pay overtime. Just because you can forced them to work overtime without pay, It doesn't mean you do it!!!! So get your facts straight.

Ofcourse I get US paid. Who in their right mind would take less money to move over-sea, may be only you? Sure you can have my salary, all you have to do is go to school, be dedicated and good at your job.

Again, you did not read the entire post. 6000 is the starting wage. Our cook earns far more than that. Plus paid time off during the year plus insurance plus meals plus tips plus help with medical bills.  We are not in the US so US wages are not applicable here. Our staff makes a very good wage for Thailand. I'll tell her you think she should get paid less when she works less and more when she works more. I am sure that will thrill her no end when she has bills to pay and can't make it because it is a slow season. Get off your high horse ozone, you don't know what you are talking about.

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"So for 5 months out of the year you work her 13 hours / day and pay her the same as the rest of the year"

To most people this staement would mean that you should pay her for working more than usual. How did you assume I said you need to pay her less?

Get off my high horse? You are the one who is taking advantage of these people, not me! .

Beginning to think i'm leaving a note for Cathy Lee Gifford

By the way, the post is about the Maid on staff "at home" not at your work place so she get no tips, now does she?

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You obviously know nothing about the working life of the average Thai person in Thailand since you don't even live in Thailand. I won't discuss this with you any longer since you don't have any idea what you are talking about.

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Sorry truth hurts.

For my credentials. I lived in Chiangmai, Lampang, Bangkok & have a condominium Suratthani for better than 15 years while employing for a us firm. I can speak, read, write Thai, what about you?. I know the Thai people likethe back of my hands. I be willing to bet that these folks do not call you their friends when they leave work. Wonder why?

People should not think about wages in USD or any other currency than Baht and compare it to the average wages for Thailand, not any other country...as other posters have noted, if the maid or whoever is upset by the wage they will either

A) Not take the job.

Quit quickly when they find something better.

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If you read it correctly, you'll noticed I have a problems with sbk forcing them to work 13hr days for 5 months without any compensation. Most of the employee he keeps talking about are his employee at work not at home. I'm talking about the "maid" at his house who gets no compensation for the extras hours she puts it. The maid at his house is the subjext matter not his work

Again, you did not read the entire post. 6000 is the starting wage. Our cook earns far more than that. Plus paid time off during the year plus insurance plus meals plus tips plus help with medical bills.  We are not in the US so US wages are not applicable here. Our staff makes a very good wage for Thailand. I'll tell her you think she should get paid less when she works less and more when she works more. I am sure that will thrill her no end when she has bills to pay and can't make it because it is a slow season. Get off your high horse ozone, you don't know what you are talking about.

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"So for 5 months out of the year you work her 13 hours / day and pay her the same as the rest of the year"

To most people this staement would mean that you should pay her for working more than usual. How did you assume I said you need to pay her less?

Get off my high horse? You are the one who is taking advantage of these people, not me! .

Beginning to think i'm leaving a note for Cathy Lee Gifford

By the way, the post is about the Maid on staff "at home" not at your work place so she get no tips, now does she?

Did you read the whole post? That is for 5 months out of the year. The rest of the time is quite easy for basically 25 days with 5 days of hard work. And to be honest, I put in longer hours than that. Obviously you have never worked in the tourist industry which has high periods and low periods. High periods you work your butt off, low ones you slide.  Most other places let their staff go in the low season. We keep ours on, with full pay, even when we don't need them.

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So for 5 months out of the year you work her 13 hours / day and pay her the same as the rest of the year. that's a good thing? The wage after a 13/day, 7 days/week is only 1500 baht/week? thats 37 US dollars. . Why don't you increase her wage as you demands more out of her