beginner

I recently hired various bikes for one or two weeks at a time to see how they suited my lifestyle.

Honda Airblade: FOR: I loved the combi brake which lets you use the left lever only to stop securely. I can't understand why other manufacturers haven't copied this idea.

The fuel filler on the transmission tunnel is also a good idea but means the tunnel is higher than the competition. You have to lift your leg high to get over it. Most bikes have scratched paintwork on the tunnel because of this.

I liked the cutout connected to side stand. Some people hate this feature.

AGAINST: The small wheel diameter means it bottoms noisily on many speed bumps.

There is very little storage space under the seat. Unlike Nouvo Elegance, you can only store one helmet not two.

There are no pockets to store water or sunglasses etc on front. There is no hook to hang shopping bags.

CONCLUSION: it rides very well on smooth roads but is not very practical for shopping trips. In slow manouvering it feels very heavy and cumersome. It looks good.

YAMAHA NOUVO ELEGANCE. FOR. Bigger engine 135cc gives even more acceleration and a feeling of stability at speed.

It feels much lighter and more agile. The bigger wheels don't bottom out on speed bumps.

The storage space is bigger than airblade. Pockets and a hook are provided making carrying shopping much easier.

AGAINST. Not a lot but would be improved with a combi brake system.

CONCLUSION. Yamaha Elegance suits my needs very well. Shopping trips are easy and handling feels very predictable and safe. Even a large unexpected pothole didn't throw it off course.

SUZUKI HYATE 125. FOR: Cheaper than the other two?

AGAINST: my first bike wouldn't start and run without a long warm up period before I drove off. This made early morning runs dangerous as it kept stalling.

The replacement (both bikes were new with less than 1000 km) wouldn't start at all one morning and had to be pushed back to base.

CONCLUSION. Quality control is lacking. A close examination of build reveals many cheap and nasty engineering solutions compared to Honda and Yamaha. Where are they assembled?

FINAL THOUGHTS. I also tried other models but they are basically too small and uncomfortable for a large farang like me but suited Thai riders very well. The Yamaha Nouvo Elegance pleased me most but the idea of an even more powerful auto appeals.

The new Suzuki Skydive looks good on paper and may be better if it is as well built as the others. Has anyone ridden one yet?

Does EFI make much difference to the ownership experience?

@'VegasVic'

Here is the truth my friend, the overall market had an irrational exeuberance leading up to its highs in August 1987 and the tumble started, from those lofty highs in August 1987 the DOW did not set a new high for about another 1 1/2 years (not 17 years as you proposed or perhaps you meant 1.7 years?) The market recovered from what people called the October crash of black monday within a few weeks (it actually recovered most in the next day or two) and the DOW actually ended 1987 higher than it began it. When I said the DOW recovered within weeks I was talking about the black monday crash itself, however as I have said even though the DOW was overinflated when it hit its highs in August 1987 it made new highs a little more than 1 1/2 years later, not 17 years later!!! Now since you obviously have a computer, I would suggest that you use it and do a litttle research before you post outrageous falsehoods again Anybody buying a consevative basket of stocks today may not double their money 18 months from now but they will likely make 50% + returns

This needs a little more analysis. Presumably, you are referring to the raw index and is not the inflation adjusted. Some previous house price and market collapses in the UK were followed by rampant inflation which meant that nominal prices recovered but real prices did not.

The stock market indices are designed to go up not down. Poorly performing companies are removed and fast growing good performing companies are added.

The net effect is that the index goes up but unless your holding exactly matches the index, the value of your particular stocks may decline or even evaporate.

So your advice to buy a 'conservative basket of stocks today' may require very good luck in picking the right conservative stocks.

6.65% tax free offshore does me OK for the moment.

OK, but by what metric did it take anywhere near to 17 years for the markets to reach their 1987 peaks again after the crash? If you don't like the DJIA, take a more broad index such as the S&P500 or the Wilshire 5000 if you want. If neither of those make your point, try adjusting them for inflation to see if that makes the claim work. If that falls short, try additionally adjusting those stock market indices for changes in the dollar index. And now that none of that has made the 17 year claim sound any less silly, let's try restating the stock market indices in terms of the price of gold, or the Zimbabwa dollar -- there's bound to be some way to make it sound reasonable...

You are confusing me with the great Naam. He mentioned the 19 year wait so far for the Nikkei to rebound to 39,500 I made no claims about 17 years. I just pointed out that inflation needs to be accounted for.

In my opinion the final result of all these government bail outs will eventually be another bout of high inflation to pay for it, but that is another topic.

Here is an interesting chart from Dogs of Dow. Somehow."Dow up to 1000" doesn't have the same ring to it as up to 14,000.

The following Dow chart compares the Dow (1900 - Present) to an inflation-adjusted Dow (1925 - Present). Click here for many more insightful Dow charts

Point of Interest - To better demonstrate the true magnitude of the great bull and bear markets of the last century, it is necessary to adjust the Dow Jones Industrial Average for inflation. What the CPI (Consumer Price Index) adjusted Dow chart shows is that the 1966 to 1982 bear market was almost as severe as that of the early 1930s. And since 1982, a true and great bull market has ensued (even when adjusted for inflation).

@'VegasVic'

Here is the truth my friend, the overall market had an irrational exeuberance leading up to its highs in August 1987 and the tumble started, from those lofty highs in August 1987 the DOW did not set a new high for about another 1 1/2 years (not 17 years as you proposed or perhaps you meant 1.7 years?) The market recovered from what people called the October crash of black monday within a few weeks (it actually recovered most in the next day or two) and the DOW actually ended 1987 higher than it began it. When I said the DOW recovered within weeks I was talking about the black monday crash itself, however as I have said even though the DOW was overinflated when it hit its highs in August 1987 it made new highs a little more than 1 1/2 years later, not 17 years later!!! Now since you obviously have a computer, I would suggest that you use it and do a litttle research before you post outrageous falsehoods again Anybody buying a consevative basket of stocks today may not double their money 18 months from now but they will likely make 50% + returns

This needs a little more analysis. Presumably, you are referring to the raw index and is not the inflation adjusted. Some previous house price and market collapses in the UK were followed by rampant inflation which meant that nominal prices recovered but real prices did not.

The stock market indices are designed to go up not down. Poorly performing companies are removed and fast growing good performing companies are added.

The net effect is that the index goes up but unless your holding exactly matches the index, the value of your particular stocks may decline or even evaporate.

So your advice to buy a 'conservative basket of stocks today' may require very good luck in picking the right conservative stocks.

6.65% tax free offshore does me OK for the moment.

"The NORTH STAR LIBRARY was established as a library for foreigner's and Thai's. It has books covering all kinds of subjects, and in many languages. It is for you.

The library is located on Sukhumvit Road, between Pattaya Central Road and North Pattaya Road, on the Pattaya Bay side of the road - look for the sign "North Star Library", next to the Redemptorist Center, and opposite the Index Furniture store. Please call them for information and directions at 038-716-755.

It is open at the following times:

Mondays - 12.00–20.00,

Thursdays - 12.00-16.00

Fridays - 12.00-16.00,

Saturdays - 12.00-20.00

Sundays - 10.00-14.00.

The Library often has classes in beginning Thai, and computer training for those new to computers. The computer courses are given frequently, are in English, are usually from 8:00 AM to noon for one full week, Monday thru Friday, and are free to members of the Library. Please call them at 038-716-755 for more information. There is a support fee to join the library, based on a 6 or 12 monthly membership. The library operates on the fees it receives, plus donations, and happily accepts volunteer help. A half year membership costs 800 baht for a single person, 1200 baht for a family membership. A one year membership costs 1200 baht for a single person, and 2000 baht for a family membership.

The library has an interesting range of fiction, and reference books, including some out-of-print early Thai books. The extensive video library (VCR only) is now available for rent, and has some excellent old movies and classics, as well as modern movies.

Thursday afternoon activities include mahjong playing, from 1:00 PM onwards. A fee of 50 baht applies for non members.

The Library has a meeting room available throughout the week for a nominal rental charge.

There is a play group for children up to 3 years old which is open Monday, Wednesday and Friday mornings from 10.00 am to 12.00 noon. There is a fee of 250 baht per morning for this group.

"

Cheer up Brits. All is not lost.

Lets have some of that Brit spirit. Look how HerMadge has adjusted to the credit crunch and the new socialist policies of GWB.

On your bikes. The sun will still shine tomorrow in Pattaya.

Will one take fries with that?

McQueen.bmp

Economist: I have good news and bad news.

The good news is that there is still plenty of money out there to pay for all the bailouts so far and the new bailouts that will be required to sort out the mess caused by the bailouts.

The bad news is that the money is still in your pockets.

It is possible to buy Index Linked Savings Bonds from www.nsandi.com ie UK treasury.

They are linked to the RPI (not CPI) and guarantee to keep up with inflation as measured by the RPI.

They are sold in 3 and 5 year issues and also have interest added after 12 months.

The drawback is that you are limited to 15k UK pounds each issue, so you can only buy 30k right now. When the next issue is launched, you can buy another 30k.

NS and I are very user friendly as you can cash in at any time by post and receive index linking up to that day. They are therefore guaranteed by the UK Government to at least keep up with the RPI.

The BBC item speculates that the RPI has peaked and will now decline. If that is correct then a one year tax free return of 6.65% from Nationwide International may be a better bet. HSBC Offshore is offering Premier customers (total savings 60k plus) 6% for new cash in a fixed term 6 month account.

Its all a question of what your judgement is regarding future UK inflation rates. If bank rates are reduced to counter recession then these rates may disappear from the market soon.

The other less predictable factors are the future exchange rate of pound versus baht and relative inflation here and in UK.

Crystal ball anyone?

[Now, if you would be so kind to inform me about your business experiences ? I am all ears since I'm never too old to learn something new from others.

LaoPo

This could be a whole new thread but I will answer here as it is clearly related to the European Banking Crisis.

My mum and dad were also in the Iron and Steel business. Mum ironed and dad stole.

My own first business experience at age 5 years was selling yesterdays paper from a cardboard box hung round my neck with a piece of string to innocent and good hearted passers by. I think my first days profit was five old pence.

In my teens I made my first million. (Turkish lira). But blew it all in a poorly judged investment in a cinema date including two ice creams with a totally unsuitable girl.

By my twenties, entrepreneurship was second nature to me.

My own company was listed in the Misfortune 500 four years running.

I was told that money doesn't make you happy and I was determined to test the hypothesis.

It looked like I would have to tell any grand kids that I started out with nothing and still had most of it left!

Then a stroke of entrepreneurial genius (if you will pardon my boasting).

I married into money. It worked for me.

A terrific piece of research Wonderboy. Thank you and well done.

Here are pictures of the Holiday Inn on the north end of beach road which is up over the 22nd floor and will complete soon judging from the workers on site each day and night. The Amari Tower is now fully operational.

The first picture shows the completed Amari Tower with the Holiday Inn shell behind it taken July 08.

The middle pic shows the Tower under construction in January 2006 and the cranes starting the foundations for the Holiday inn to the right.

The third shows the fast growing Holiday Inn from Soi One where a new low rise hotel has just opened. (It has already claimed its first suicide? from floor 4). Windows are being fitted to the Holiday Inn now. In the picture they are about half way up.

There is still room for another tower or two and its a very popular location. Occupancy factors are always high. It would make a very convenient location for another quality condo building.

FWIW:

In forum support, George mentioned there is a software bug which causes problems with links....I suppose we have to wait before we can open them.

LaoPo

IMHO.This video is worth copying and pasting into your browser.

Included in the discussion is the statement that 'if...the Irish government is allowed to do this guarantee and it stands..then the euro will collapse within five years'.

It seems that the potential total value of the guarantee may exceed the Irish GDP by a factor of two!

The guarantee is of course only as good as the Government giving it. Ireland ranks at 17 on the Corruption Perceptions Index FWIW, worse than most other European states. This is probably a function of its small size where everyone knows everyone else and its particular history of internal strife and Church politics.

I have personal experience of dealing with the Irish bureaucracy to receive a legacy from a distant relative. The obstacles put in my way nearly made me give up and let them keep it. I persevered out of sheer anger at their intrusive unwarranted questions and bloody mindedness. It took over a year to obtain what was clearly mine from day one.

Throughout the procedure I was dealing with an office that took the line 'we can not proceed unless you give us the information we require'. In essence, they wanted me to prove that the money had been legitimately earned and tax paid on it.

If that authoritarian mindset is applied to the terms of the savings deposit guarantee, whatever they may turn out to be, then it might not be as good as people hope.

A possible good outcome is that other Governments feel the need to match it. Unfortunately, there are no free lunches. we will probably all pay with a massive surge of inflation. Two or three years at 15-20% and the real value of cash is greatly reduced.

It beats worrying about global warming or nuclear war.

So when someone asks, Allied Irish, yes or no, I say why not. I would open an account with them for a sum I felt comfortable with, in fact I've sent them the paperwork already but I reckon a surge in new business means I may have missed my opportunity.

The problems facing the market are serious but they are not made any easier by the media and extreme "what if" discussions. If we're not careful we may find that the fear of what could happen is much greater than the reality of what sensibly will happen.

I think the question stevemcqueen asked is ANGLO IRISH, yes or no.

Allied Irish is a rather different bank altogether. see my post 57.

jersey offshore accounts have no protection , but the parent onshore banks usually offer protection to their offshore company based on the 35000 uk protection , i wouldnt like to have to rely on that should any of these banks go under , which is doubtful ....... but these are uncertain times and anything could happen.

I just received this from Offshore HSBC in Jersey which confirms what you say.

Is it realistic to think that if HSBC fails and defaults then the world economy would have collapsed. In other words money would have no real value anyway.

It is food for thought though. If there is a run of transfersof savings accounts to guaranteed deposits could even the mighty HSBC be shaken?

Thank you for your recent e-mail.

We regret that there is no compensation scheme for your funds.

HSBC is one of the World’s largest banks, serving over 100 million customers in 85 countries and territories.

The Group’s financial strength is built on maintaining a solid capital base, ensuring strong liquidity (including holding over USD1,000 billion customer deposits worldwide), a conservative appetite for risk and well diversified earnings both by geography and business type.

This primary focus on maintaining financial strength throughout our long history means that we are well-placed to navigate periods of economic and market instability.

Should you have any further queries please do not hesitate to contact us.

Yours Sincerely

Customer Service Team

International Direct Banking

HSBC Bank International Limited

HSBC House

St Helier

Jersey

JE1 1HS

Channel Islands

The Allied Irish Bank has a very chequered history.

Just have a look at Wikipedia.

Among their banking indiscretions are Overcharging customers in several ways including FX transactions.

quote "AIB announced on 27 September 2006 that the final outlay in respect of restitution and interest arising from overcharging amounted to €65 million and that this included a donation of €20.6 million on behalf of its customers to an unspecified charity that it was unable to identify. No employee or officer of the banks is to be disciplined ^[13]."

ALSO.

"Apart from FX, the Financial Regulator discovered, following an anonymous tip-off, that AIB overcharged customers €8.6 million^[14]. The account categories involved were:

• Surplus Builder, variable rate mortgage product with savings; 4,200 customers impacted; financial impact €3.6 million
  
• Student and Graduate facilities: 34,000 customers impacted; financial impact €1.4 million
  
• Overdraft limit amendments, fees incorrectly applies: 24,000 customers impacted; financial impact €600,000
  
• Financial & Leasing, early termination of consumer leases: 950 customers impacted; financial impact €230,000
  
• Personal Savings Plans Products, loan discounts: 2,436 customers impacted; financial impact €196,000
  
• Overdraft interest in Foreign Currency Hold Accounts, incorrect reference rate applied: 200 customers impacted
  
• Merchant Terminal Rental Charges: 155 customers impacted
  
• PPI Mortgage Top Ups: 573 customers impacted"
  

You may regard these as trivial and perhaps rather typical of the small scale, corrupt Irish Economy.

Perhaps more worrying.

Charles Haughey and the Moriarty Tribunal

In 2006, the Moriarty Tribunal published its report into the financial affairs of former Taoiseach Charles Haughey. Mr. Justice Moriarty found that AIB had settled a million-pound overdraft with Haughey on favourable terms for the politician shortly after he became Taoiseach in 1979; the tribunal found that the leniency shown by the bank in this case amounted to a benefit from the bank to Haughey. According to the report, the bank showed an extraordinary degree of deference to Mr. Haughey despite his financial excesses.^[16]

Personally I agree with Naam. If they are offering more than the going rate you have to ask...how and why.

Offshore HSBC pay lower rates. HSBC for me.

The four items are

1. Check business objectives of the company. If it is found that the company is doing real estate business while there is a foreigner holding company shares together with some Thai nominees or there is a foreigner being a director of the company, the Land Official will investigate to a source of the investment of the Thai nominees. However, the Land Official will refuse to register of such an application by practice.

2. It is appearing that the company was organised by a foreigner or appearing his name in the company's memorandum or appearing his shares being preference shares having majority right to vote in the company or there is a Thai lawyer or Broker holding the main shares in the company, The Land Official will investigate to a source of the investment in such company.

3.It is a requirement that the registered capital of a company must be more than the purchase price of any property. Otherwise, the Land Official will investigate to the source of the investment.

4. In case a company leases a piece of land in a long term basis, investigation will be made to proof whether the land lease is made to benefit or the company is holding the property to the benefit of any foreigner.

Pattaya Expat magazine 16-30 Sept 08 contains an article by Mr Kamnod Soponvasu of Thai Legal and Associates.Pattaya.

It summarises an Official Land Department circular letter marked Most Urgent, sent on 21st July 2008 to all Provincial Governors regarding 'the registration of land ownership or buying land for the benefits of foreigners by using company's name or having a Thai national as a shareholder nominee in the company'.

It outlines four items that will lead to the refusal by the Land Official to register such an application.

The author notes that the measures are almost the same as Foreign Business Act which was postponed last year. "Meanwhile the above measures are temporarily put in use prior the enactment of the Foreign Business Act".

saw extremely low tides this past weekend

what gives????

Autumn Equinox. see tide tables.

Dear ThaiBob OldLover

Your comment (pouring cement unevenly) or form the news article "however when cement was placed on the second floor of the construction, it was not evenly spread and the weight is thought to have collapsed the structure". Is a bunch a BS!

I sent my summer and vacation from the age of 16 working in construction and at a concrete plants. They are pouring this concrete so wet that the "slump" is so high it flows like water. It can not pile up enough to cause a collapse. So don't try to BS use about the collapse.

Also, today after work stared, at 8:55 AM a large tuck came to VT7 building sight carrying about 30 plus workers. I bet it came from their other construction sight which was close for 30 days?

ThaiBob OldLover you need to get back on subject!

Hello VT7/lookat.

Can anyone now use your name?

Clearly the above post was made by someone other than the person/persons/committee that has made the previous incomprehensible garbled, illiterate postings under your various names.

Keep it up. It makes for much easier reading.

[

It's toast. Any semblance of support it had it's falling through with nary a pause. These charts don't reflect todays action:

Intermediate term expanding triangle:

Again, has it seen point "c" or "e". Again, I think it's the latter. Could be wrong, maybe. Or is it 1992 all over again?

lannarebirth, For the benefit of those of us who are not familiar with FX charts and analysis. What exactly 'is toast"? Do you mean the pound or the baht or what?

Why do charts with names attached ie 'expanding triangle' give any indication of future events. They merely describe in a graphical form what has taken place so far. Which chartists predicted recent volatility in the markets from their charts alone?

Isn't it just a form of fortune telling or voodoo?

Fours ago I built an extensive property in East Pattaya. No sooner was it built than all this nominee stuff emerged. There is absolutely no doubt in my mind that if I had known about all this in advance, I would never have built the house.

And nothing ever came of it...to live in Thailand, you need a strong constitution!

Given all that is currently going on in Bangkok I think you could say that Thailand needs a strong constitution too.

Thailand Crisis came up with the item below yesterday. Is it just more white noise or is it real? Whatever the outcome it does seem that rental gives a certain peace of mind and flexibility and buying requires a certain frame of mind to get the benefits of owning your own castle.

Knock ! Knock ! Who is back ? The Foreign Business Act of course !

This famous Thai Saga (between the Benny Hill Show and Monthy Python) continues to excite the politicians. It’s a never ending story. Here is the latest episode.

The Junta started in 2006 an inane amendement process of the law (read my special dossier here) before to back off. Humiliated.

This story of the “40 000 companies to be investigated” is not new.

In september 2007, they’ve made a similar announcement.

It came just after the decision from the government to withdraw the amendement… Face saving exercise I asked at that time.

So one year later they start again, even though it’s a new government. Who is going to believe them ?

We rarely hear the other side though, and when we do it tends to get glossed over and forgotten very quickly. Like the taxi driver that finds a fogotten bag/purse/etc full of money and returns it. Or the baht bus driver that not only helped me load the back of his bus with furniture at Big C, but helped me carry up the 3 flights of stairs to my apartment.

There have probably been a number of good stories over the years, but bad news sells, so that is what gets the headlines.

Hi Kerryd.

Here is another one to add to the list.

Three cheers for the TaxiMeter men.

Omani Tourist praises honest taxi driver as missing waist bag containing thousands of Dollars is returned to him.

On Monday Night, an extremely anxious Omani Tourist made his way to Pattaya Police Station after he had lost his waist bag which contained the equivalent of almost 500,000 Baht in cash. Mr. Hahim Essa aged 50 was accompanied by his friends and he explained to the officer at the Information Desk that he had hired a Pattaya Metered Taxi to take him and his friends from Soi 7 on Pattaya Beach Road to the Beverly Plaza Hotel located on the Pratamnuk Road close to Walking Street. He arrived at the Hotel in the Taxi holding license number 17 and forgot his waist bag on the back seat. The bag contained Mr. Essa and his friends' passports, three air tickets, 14,000 US Dollars and 8,000 Baht in cash. Mr. Essa feared the worse until, moments later, the driver of the taxi, Khun Jakarin aged 52, came to the station to hand in the bag which still contained all the money and other items. Mr. Essa explained to us that he was extremely grateful to the honest taxi driver who was financially awarded for his honesty before all parties left the station.

I use metered taxis all the time when in Bangkok, but never in Pattaya.

No meter, no go.

No meter, no go.

It has a certain ring to it!

Jingthing are you and SmartFarang related? (Smarty your number one supporter and fan).

Are you twins?

Your dogs appear to be.

Are you the same person?

Regarding the meters. They will never be used until the metered fares are fixed at a level that the drivers believe can make them a profit and pay for those brand new and expensive cars. They are just trying to make a living. They don't have a duty to make losses to make a few expat farangs happy.

Of course not. You don't get it.

These cars as anyone can see SIT IDLY MOST of the time. They wait for the big sucker fares. It has become known that they don't deal fair, so only the truly desperate engage them, and of course, tourists. They are LAZY. They could make a big public campaign that they use METER fares similar to Bangkok and then drive around all day moving people. Working alot harder. Making alot more money. I know, I know, not the Thai way, but it happened in Bangkok.

BTW, cities throughout the world regulate the acceptable behavior of their metered taxis. The penalties are money fines and losing their license to drive.

Maybe its you that just doesn't get it?

We live in Pattaya (thank Buddha) to enjoy the relative freedom of a very lightly regulated city where people can do lots of things they want without interference. This is less true of Bangkok which you want to emulate.

Its a sort of cowboy economy but produces lots of willing buyers and lots of willing sellers. Its a breath of fresh air to many who felt stifled and nannied to death in their countries of origin.

The taxi situation is just one aspect of this. If taxis were heavily regulated and controlled as they are in many places then some of the Magic of Pattaya would be lost.

Back in January, you complained of being asked for 150baht for a journey from Bali Hai to Jomtien. Hardly a "big sucker fare". 150 baht!!! 150!!! According to your report you did not try to haggle but slammed the door and walked away to catch a 10 baht bus.

Me: To Jomtien please

Taxi: 150 baht

Me: (pointing to the big Taxi Meter sign on top) You are taxi METER, correct?

Taxi: Yes

Me: You have meter?

Taxi: Yes.

Me: Meter works, correct?

Taxi: Correct.

Me: Why you no use meter?

Taxi: Me wait a long time.

Me: Now you wait longer. You mafia, correct?

Taxi: No mafia.

(SLAM DOOR)

Up to you of course but 150 baht sounds like a bargain to me. Were you alone? If there had been two or three passengers it would have been positively cheap! With inflation taking off again, it will soon seem like the good old days when you could get from Pattaya to Jomtien in an air conditioned taxi for 150 baht.

But getting back to your point of whether or not 'I get it'. You must have heard the Thai response to people who try and get a discount because its low season and there are few customers around? "Can not. Have little customer, must charge more to make same".

This of course goes against our western grain but if you think about it, is a very sensible and pragmatic approach. Many places and businesses here do the same. Less customers means higher prices. Can't sell a house/condo ....then put the price up then and wait.

From the cabbies point of view, Why drive round like a blue arsed fly with a cab full of cheap charlies who probably don't tip well, when a few well chosen and negotiated trips will produce the same income with much less wear and tear on the vehicle and himself.

Most tourists would probably regard 150 baht fare as an absolute steal. To haggle over that fare would only occur to an Indian but I hear them haggle over the 10 baht fare also.

Your dream of turning Pattaya into a well regulated and consequently expensive city will surely come about one day. I imagine we will all be long gone by then; either to somewhere more amenable and cheap or passed on.

DR Penguin is an entertainer/magician who has ably entertained the Pattaya City Expats Club at Henry J Beans several times.

He outlined those events in the Open Forum at the Sunday morning meeting two weeks ago.

Clearly there are two sides to every story, as has been pointed out but this incident took place and has greatly upset Dr Penguin. One of the factors that he stressed at the City Expats meeting was that despite phoning THREE police and helpline numbers he was unable to get any assistance. The 24 hour helpline service did not reply. When asked about this, he checked that he had dialled the correct numbers by looking at his cellphone at that meeting.

Although I have never been threatened or assaulted by a taxi driver I have boarded a baht bus in Soi Beakow which was driven very recklessly. Two Thai women who got on at the junction with Klang got off immediately at the corner of Second Road calling out to me that the driver was 'mow' and 'ting tong'.

I also got off shortly afterwards as he screamed the engine and raced down the outside lane of Second Road. He was clearly under the influence of drink or drugs or both!

Regarding the meters. They will never be used until the metered fares are fixed at a level that the drivers believe can make them a profit and pay for those brand new and expensive cars. They are just trying to make a living. They don't have a duty to make losses to make a few expat farangs happy.

If you know the movie, you know that the reason Terry Malloy never made it was that the fight was fixed -- by the mobster Johnny Friendly. Seems an apt comparison to Jomtien.

Very good

You may very well think that; I couldn't possibly comment.

The game isn't over yet.

The odds of Ocean 1 being built as planned are now probably less than fifty/fifty.

I will be very disappointed if the project fails but I am sure you will be delighted. Good luck to you.

The drawback of gloating too much over another development's problems is that we are all subject to the same underlying forces. The economic and financial tsunami that is washing around the world doesn't just affect projects we either love or hate. It impacts on everyone. Better that we all succeed than fail.

The shakeout that is overdue may stop Ocean 1 but may very well leave Ocean 1/2. After all, twenty five percent of the units have been sold. A fifty floor tower which was often discussed at the start of the project may be the final outcome.

We must all wait and see.

It will be a great opportunity lost if you are correct. To borrow Marlon Brando's words from On The Waterfront "You don't understand. Jomtien could have had class. Jomtien could have been a contender. It could have been somewhere not a bum place".

But as I said. Its not over yet!