Slip

^^ Mine didn't - she's from Brighton.

Is this still open?

My apologies IJWT, cross posted. Not only open, but mod-approved

(Spelling)

Again this happens. Obtuse 'reasoning' by the red shirt apologists. What TAWP is trying to explain to you Jayboy, is that the right to free speech involves letting people say what they want. If at some time society (i.e, the powers that be) decide that what is being said is detrimental to the society, then they will revoke the right to free speech for some individuals, within (hopefully) transparent boundaries. Thai society has not yet decided that the propagation of Dr Tui's views are unacceptable, therefore he is free to speak and travel where he wishes, no matter how repulsive you, I or Tawp may or may not find the man. You're right; the Dr's character is of interest, but not central to the issue. His views are by no means 'precisely the point'

So in Thailand "the powers that be" define what is free speech and what is or isn't tolerated, and what is detrimental to society.And there unwittingly you have identified why Thailand is on the verge of civil war with millions of Thais now prepared to tell the "powers that be" to take a hike.

In every country the 'powers that be' make these decisions. Like Thailand's government, they are (hopefully) legally in power. Yes, when governments believe that their citizens have crossed a line, they will take action against them. I'm not sure that the revolution you're predicting is quite ready to fly. The millions of Thais who want to tell anyone to go will have an opportunity at the next election like the civilised people that they are. (I believe it might be early due to the adroit handling of Phi Abhisit).

Anyone?

Kosovo? Bosnia? External interventionists (usually) only intervene when things have already got really bad - so the external forces coming in often seem as though they have created the chaos that was already developing. I can't see the UN sending troops to Thailand, surely? (Might be good for the battered Tourist industry though... plenty of R&R dollars to spend...)

LOL- Surely if the UN (or anyone else for that matter) sent troops to Thailand, the problem would be over in 2 quick shakes. No more internal squabble required.

[EDIT: Fixed quote as it was not showing who said what]

Aren't we all meant to drink 'Magnas' now?

Disclaimer- I've been out of the Yuk for 10 years now, so I've never even tried the stuff.

<snipped to stay in quote limits>

You try so hard that your face turns red...how fitting.

So by calling me a Red, is this your way of dodging the Dr Tui issue? Do you have a view on Dr Tuiu? I should be interested to hear it.

You are confused.

It doesn't matter if he is The Devil himself, he still has the right to travel to the town without threat of violence.

You call him a fascist but support actions that are carried out by fascist-like groups, interesting...

His views are not the point, his right to express them is.

So as I expected you duck out of giving a view.His views are precisely the point.I agree also in free speech as a general principle.However, since I was earlier talking about Thammasat in 1976, I wonder whether your apparently unqualified belief in free speech would include the late Khun Samak urging the fascist thugs on to murder university students and radicals?

Again this happens. Obtuse 'reasoning' by the red shirt apologists. What TAWP is trying to explain to you Jayboy, is that the right to free speech involves letting people say what they want. If at some time society (i.e, the powers that be) decide that what is being said is detrimental to the society, then they will revoke the right to free speech for some individuals, within (hopefully) transparent boundaries. Thai society has not yet decided that the propagation of Dr Tui's views are unacceptable, therefore he is free to speak and travel where he wishes, no matter how repulsive you, I or Tawp may or may not find the man. You're right; the Dr's character is of interest, but not central to the issue. His views are by no means 'precisely the point'

I am always willing to learn - my search for education and depth of knowledge rarely ceases

You have enlightened me on two fronts and your education is much appreciated........I am lazy when it comes to back ground political research because until I identify tangible results I do not tend to swallow any 'party line'.....you see I have nothing I want to sell, and as stated only in the market to buy when tangible evidence is presented.......so you are correct I maybe better avoiding the complex issues........ ........any figures on how much real revenue this 'land tax' will flush from the wealthy? Would the cost not reduce their tax payments on profits......is the tax more than the annual increase in the land value?

Nice Geo ---- You sell the Red party -line but claim not to sell anything. You admit that you don't know the complicated issues but feel free to challenge the government's plans and accomplishments. What do you base those challenges on? Research? No, not by your admission.

So tell me Geo ---

What has PPP/PTP done for the poor? If you decide they did in fact, accomplish something. How did that manifest itself across the ENTIRE country in a sustainable way? You may feel free to answer for TRT as well but please remember the sustainable portion of the question!

If you want to see results it would behoove the reds to go home and see the results. They have, after all, been offered elections a whole year early!

It would also be good if you spoke up about the behaviour of the reds .. and what you think the consequences of said behaviour should be. Or would that require information that you don't possess?

Indeed JD, contrary to his statement, Geo seems to have swallowed a very definite party line, and is desperately flogging it like a low grade street girl.

^^And Jerry, it must be pointed out to you again, That we are talking about Thailand and the Thais, NOT Cheese eating surrender monkeys.

Godammit- Km

Knew that title was too good to be true!

Remember when the PAD cracked down with riot police during Mr.Samak's administration, leaving two PAD fellows dead, and dozens of polices were brutally assaulted in October 2008?

The Chulalongkorn Hospital's doctors (one also held position in Thai Red Cross), proclaimed he wouldn't treat any sick, injured police officers at any cause. He said it was unacceptable that police officers used force against the PAD who surrounded the parliament house and threatened to kill the member of PPP inside.

people also say soldiers were moving in and ran off. more propaganda or just different propaganda

there is a thread running on a site not controlled by government

http://asiapacific.anu.edu.au/newmandala/2...native-account/

There is zero based on fact in that opinion piece. Even so, you are justifying one wrong by claiming there was another. "Whatever the Reds do is okay, because we can always dig up (insert new claim that the yellows did something X number of years ago)". What about responsibility for one's actions? Wait, I know what your reply is - "what about the yellows...?" This isn't about the yellows, its about the reds.

you demostrate you have been here less than 2 years. this happen and only a newb will not know this.

welcome to thailand.

Are you being deliberately obtuse? Netfan doesn't say this didn't happen, he says it does not give justification to the reds to say "well the Yellows did so and so, so we can"

^^. I just saw that- what a fool of a man.

That completely sucks. Sorry to hear this sad news.

I keep in touch with the UK/US press as well as Al Jazeera (in my opinion the best unbiased news source) and some of the Asian publications like New Mandala....it's pretty clear that Thailand isn't exactly high on the list of priorities or newsworthiness in much of the world....the UK is absorbed with the upcoming election, the UK is absorbed with itself, EU is absorbed with Greece's financial meltdown...the Guardian has had a couple of blogs on the subject and one editorial but neither raised much in the way of comments...ditto for the Independent....the Times had an article this week...and the Economist has had a couple of articles...all of the articles/editorials/blogs I read were broadly sympathetic to the idea of elections...what I've been surprised at is the issue of free speech, the world doesn't seem to be aware that all red supporting media have been closed down, but they are not buying into the yellow government propaganda....

The best article by far is in the New Mandala about the Royal Thai Army...it's a well researched article written by people who know something of the complexities of the military relationships...and beats hands down all the simplistic drivel from the yellow blind posters on TVF....

Just what this thread needed- some red propoganda!

Is this a gay poll? I didn't vote as I'm not gay. If I had then I'd have to admit I know who she is. (My father in law who used to celebrate 'gay Friday' with his son every week told me about her).

Frankly I prefer Mika.

EDIT: Do I get a toaster?

^^Who?

^yes those shoplifting scum deserved what they got! Luckily the CTV proved KP correct - mind you doesnt excuse the extortion attempt, but never the less.

Spoken like a true ex-pig Britmaveric.

For the record I spent 4k b on a pair of Raybans in their shop in Suvanapun. The lenses decayed in about 4 months- snide for sure.

Of course, there is no honour amongst thieves.

Every ~ism is rife in Thailand. Happily, judging by your experiences, I still have about 10 years left in me before the knacker's yard. (Mind you I don't run a pub- anymore).

Good luck in your search.

I visited an English Language school in BKK.

The teacher (English guy) was supposed to be one of their 'top boys'.

I listened in...expecting to hear a master class from this language expert..........

he said " today we have farang come from England.

He come long way. He want live here....etc etc etc.

I thought, 'and this guys teaching English'!!!!

Chicken or the egg

Chicken or the egg!!!!

This is a problem. Your 'top boy' teacher was making a serious pedagogical mistake. He has probably been here a long time. Anyone can slip into this hole when they speak mostly to Thais rather than English speakers. Perhaps it wasn't a very good language school, or he wasn't really a very good teacher. Regardless, all teachers who have lived in this country need to actively guard against this happening IMO. It sneaks up on you.

Why you so serious???

Abhisit has made a complete and utter fool of himself.

The danger is that his refusal to hold an election for fear of getting voted out may result in a split in the army with potentially disatrous consequences.

He is very stubborn , i would agree with you . It is sad , result may be civil war , and army mutinies . And the guy owes his job to a military coup to start with .

Wait a minute, you have confused cause and effect. Blame the Tai Rouge for not compromising and negotiating. Any blood that has flowed and will flow is on their hands as a result.

According to your logic, if I disagree with someone from your family (as an example) and refuse to negotiate with them, then someone from your family decides to shoot someone from my family, the blood is on my hands?

Ridiculous, as ever. what the hel_l are you going on about man.

Good article.

no, sorry-it's utter gumph.

And how do you know who handed them out? Or are you another colour coded apologist of red or yellow on here?

All I know is a lot of people who are neither red or yellow believe that aim. Who handeed them out I will leave to the conspiuracy theorists and red and yellow cheerleaders of whom there are enough on here

I doubt Red shirts handed the stickers out. Thaksin has forcefully denied it. Nor do I believe this is the real issue at hand.

Dont see how it could be anything else but a political smear tactic.

Thanks for the coffee all over my screen dude.

...... Pity that you didn't think to proof read after you put your grammar nazi hat on.

It's You're, not your. But C+ for a first attempt at humor. Or do you really know my not?... whatever that is

So that's the extent of your argument is it? Fool!

I think you'll find, when and if a true record of this chapter of Thai history is written, that Abhisit will have spent more of his time fighting "elites" on behalf of the poor, than he will have been fighting the poor on behalf of elites.

[/quote

Yes, well said. If it ever comes to light that is what will be shown I think.

^^ This is my point. It would be a brave news editor who ignored the hateful content of the speeches. Once aware they would no doubt get their own translations. But why hasn't it happened already?