Britain could still reverse Brexit, former minister Heseltine says

[transam]

8 minutes ago, pitrevie said:

Nope that was accomplished long before Heseltime was involved. If you recall MacGregor was appointed by Margaret Thatcher and proceeded with Scargill's help destroying the coal industry.

Could be, but H nailed the coffin instead of fixing stuff for UK workers, but he chose cheap Polish imports..

[baansgr]

42 minutes ago, transam said:

But fact...

Yes it is a fact. The days of consevatives liking cheap labour and keeping the working class down are now long surpassed by the never ending stream of wage supressing EU nationals causing untold harm on workers rights that the Labour luvvies like. 

[sandyf]

23 hours ago, baansgr said:

And wasn't a state of emergency called at least twice more within the first few years of joining. A lot at that time can be accounted to the oil crisis.

So you accept that there was pain before the EU.

The last time a state of emergency was declared was in March 1974 when the UK government re-established direct rule in Northern Ireland. It was only the 3 day week at the end of 1973 that had anything to do with oil.

 

During the Conservative government of Edward Heath there were five declarations of emergency under this Act, by far the most any government. The first was in July 1970 over a dockers strike, the second in December 1970 over an electricians strike, the third in February 1972 over a miners strike, the fourth in August 1972 over another dockers strike and the fifth time in October 1973, which lasted for four months.

In the total time it was on the statute book this Act was used twelve times, the last time being in 1974 and mainly used in times of industrial unrest (i.e. strikes).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emergency_Powers_Act_1920

[sandyf]

1 hour ago, pitrevie said:

Nope that was accomplished long before Heseltime was involved. If you recall MacGregor was appointed by Margaret Thatcher and proceeded with Scargill's help destroying the coal industry.

Scargill would have destroyed the industry without anyone's help. I went on a trade mission to the Transvaal in 1985 and the SA coal industry was fully automated, a complete contradiction to what he tried to portray. Automation was the last thing that Scargill wanted, in his eyes workers were just pawns in a power struggle.

[SheungWan]

1 hour ago, baansgr said:

Yes it is a fact. The days of consevatives liking cheap labour and keeping the working class down are now long surpassed by the never ending stream of wage supressing EU nationals causing untold harm on workers rights that the Labour luvvies like. 

Lots of experts here who have never run or managed a company/department/anything very much/ in their lives.

[sandyf]

3 hours ago, vogie said:

Sorry to dissapoint you SW, but one of your colleagues asked for examples of stupid EU regs/directives, I simply provided a few of the many inane laws. Even you must admit the stupidity of laws?

That last comment sounds just like my old boss.

"What have customers, their concerns or their safety got to do with anything"

 

As far as he was concerned EU directives were nothing more that a barrier to profit.

[sandyf]

Is this what taking back control really meant?

 

A late-night Commons vote to secure the Conservatives the muscle to use so-called “Henry VIII powers” to make new laws – behind the backs of MPs – will be staged next week.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-latest-theresa-may-powers-grab-plans-parliamentary-system-fix-a7935276.html?S2ref=1532332

[sandyf]

1 hour ago, baansgr said:

Yes it is a fact. The days of consevatives liking cheap labour and keeping the working class down are now long surpassed by the never ending stream of wage supressing EU nationals causing untold harm on workers rights that the Labour luvvies like. 

" wage supressing EU nationals causing untold harm on workers rights"

Please provide the source of this statement as there appears to be some contradiction.

 

“It showed that immigration had very little impact on wages or employment. But this was suppressed by the Home Office under Theresa May, because the results were inconvenient.”

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/theresa-may-immigration-studies-suppress-uk-workers-wages-jobs-vince-cable-prime-minister-liberal-a7932001.html

[notmyself]

5 minutes ago, sandyf said:

That last comment sounds just like my old boss.

"What have customers, their concerns or their safety got to do with anything"

 

As far as he was concerned EU directives were nothing more that a barrier to profit.

 

It's a question of finding the right balance and not just a black & white end result. This was perhaps the biggest lie (?) started by those who wished to remain and was very effective. Throwing out some unnecessary regulations would be a good thing but Brexit was cast as throwing out all regulations in order to scare people.

 

[vogie]

36 minutes ago, sandyf said:

That last comment sounds just like my old boss.

"What have customers, their concerns or their safety got to do with anything"

 

As far as he was concerned EU directives were nothing more that a barrier to profit.

Was your boss a green grocer, were you in the banana or the cucumber dept?

[tomacht8]

5 hours ago, baansgr said:

Interesting reading today about the Eastern Bloc EU countries on there stance about accepting asylum seekers and economic migrants. Seems like a one way street sometimes, maybe a 2nd referendum is a good idea to clear up once and for all that the majority of the UK that vote prefer to exit.

How exactly the brexit looks like, until today - nobody knows.

 

But would be good to make a referendum after the negotiations, after all the details are clear. Then people could vote about something concrete. 

 

At the moment, there is not even a clear line among the Brexitians. Fact.

Edited September 8, 2017 by tomacht8

[baansgr]

2 hours ago, sandyf said:

" wage supressing EU nationals causing untold harm on workers rights"

Please provide the source of this statement as there appears to be some contradiction.

 

“It showed that immigration had very little impact on wages or employment. But this was suppressed by the Home Office under Theresa May, because the results were inconvenient.”

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/theresa-may-immigration-studies-suppress-uk-workers-wages-jobs-vince-cable-prime-minister-liberal-a7932001.html

Oh, The Independent again.....The source is from people I know living in an area where wages have barely increased in 10 years whereas rents have almost doubled due to the massive increase in the population. 

[citybiker]

Heseltine is one of the most vindictive politicians known within the establishment.

Being the main instigator behind getting Thatcher out of No10, with friends like that who needs enemies.


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[brewsterbudgen]

Heseltine is one of the most vindictive politicians known within the establishment.

Being the main instigator behind getting Thatcher out of No10, with friends like that who needs enemies.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Let's face it, he did the country a huge favour in expediting the exit of that evil woman.

[nauseus]

3 hours ago, tomacht8 said:

How exactly the brexit looks like, until today - nobody knows.

 

But would be good to make a referendum after the negotiations, after all the details are clear. Then people could vote about something concrete. 

 

At the moment, there is not even a clear line among the Brexitians. Fact.

Brexitians? Oh you must mean the Old Brexitians, good bunch of chaps with a mean front row and a great bar!  

[nauseus]

18 minutes ago, brewsterbudgen said:

Let's face it, he did the country a huge favour in expediting the exit of that evil woman.

Not really, when you consider her successors!

[tomacht8]

7 minutes ago, nauseus said:

Brexitians? Oh you must mean the Old Brexitians, good bunch of chaps with a mean front row and a great bar!  

No i mean the old people, living on the country and voted last year for something called Brexit.
The term Brexit is nevertheless quite unclear, what it exactly meant / was.
Is also a historical event with consequences for the whole of Europe.

Edited September 8, 2017 by tomacht8

[nauseus]

3 minutes ago, tomacht8 said:

No i mean the old people, living on the country and voted last year for something called Brexit.
The term Brexit is nevertheless quite unclear, what it exactly meant / was.
Is also a historical event with consequences for the whole of Europe.

Oh those old people! No young ones at all?

[citybiker]

Let's face it, he did the country a huge favour in expediting the exit of that evil woman.

Not a Thatcher fan I presume.

There's been far worse than her however evil she wasn't.


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[Dene16]

1 hour ago, citybiker said:

There's been far worse than her however evil she wasn't.

 

I wish she were here now doing the Brexit negotiations

Although she would never of allowed us to be in this position

[nauseus]

2 hours ago, Dene16 said:

 

I wish she were here now doing the Brexit negotiations

Although she would never of allowed us to be in this position

Correct!

[SheungWan]

6 hours ago, brewsterbudgen said:

Let's face it, he did the country a huge favour in expediting the exit of that evil woman.

 

6 hours ago, nauseus said:

Not really, when you consider her successors!

Classic retirement talk.

[pitrevie]

7 hours ago, Dene16 said:

 

I wish she were here now doing the Brexit negotiations

Although she would never of allowed us to be in this position

Correct she would never have got herself in this position as she was opposed to referendums. While she was PM none of those such as Lawson, Tebbit, Lamont ever voted against any European legislation including the SEA which Thatcher introduced.

[nauseus]

4 hours ago, SheungWan said:

 

Classic retirement talk.

Typically incorrect guess. 

[nauseus]

1 hour ago, pitrevie said:

Correct she would never have got herself in this position as she was opposed to referendums. While she was PM none of those such as Lawson, Tebbit, Lamont ever voted against any European legislation including the SEA which Thatcher introduced.

By 1990 she had just woken up to the reality of the real EC ambition of federalism. If she had stayed in power the UK would not have signed Maastricht and we would have been been out of the EU 25 years ago. 

[sandyf]

15 hours ago, baansgr said:

Oh, The Independent again.....The source is from people I know living in an area where wages have barely increased in 10 years whereas rents have almost doubled due to the massive increase in the population. 

Of course shoot the messenger, they obviously carried out the studies.

Obviously you believe your circle of mates are more credible than the Institute of Fiscal Studies, up to you.

[sandyf]

17 hours ago, notmyself said:

 

It's a question of finding the right balance and not just a black & white end result. This was perhaps the biggest lie (?) started by those who wished to remain and was very effective. Throwing out some unnecessary regulations would be a good thing but Brexit was cast as throwing out all regulations in order to scare people.

 

Same old argument, everything was intended to scare people irrespective of any validity. Nobody ever said that any regulations would be thrown out, just "corrected" to suit the new regime.

The writing is on the wall.

 

Without the fix, it would be impossible to force through up to 1,000 “corrections” to EU law as intended through the EU (Withdrawal) Bill – the reason for the accusations of a power grab.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-latest-theresa-may-powers-grab-plans-parliamentary-system-fix-a7935276.html?S2ref=1532332

[dick dasterdly]

21 hours ago, tomacht8 said:

How exactly the brexit looks like, until today - nobody knows.

 

But would be good to make a referendum after the negotiations, after all the details are clear. Then people could vote about something concrete. 

 

At the moment, there is not even a clear line among the Brexitians. Fact.

"But would be good to make a referendum after the negotiations, after all the details are clear. Then people could vote about something concrete."

 

I agree, as long as one of the options is 'leave - under WTO regulations'.

[SheungWan]

Just now, dick dasterdly said:

"But would be good to make a referendum after the negotiations, after all the details are clear. Then people could vote about something concrete."

 

I agree, as long as one of the options is 'leave - under WTO regulations'.

Oh Look! Its Mr Fence Sitter!

[dick dasterdly]

As for Heseltine - he's in the same 'box' as Blair IMO, although from different perceptives.

 

Heseltine wanted the low paid/unemployed to 'get on their 'bike' - wheres Blair had the power to issue lies that would convince 'patriots'.