Thailand to declare war on plastic bags - by charging for them

[Airbagwill]

People still concentrating on supermarket/ convenience store bags which in a country like Thailand are a relatively small part of the problem.

Even a reduction in frequency of use is unlikely to have significant effect until disposal.....or rather storage .....  of plastics is properly organized.

The also need to address the using street vendors, rhot khen, etc.

[Dumbastheycome]

5 hours ago, Airbagwill said:

People still concentrating on supermarket/ convenience store bags which in a country like Thailand are a relatively small part of the problem.

Even a reduction in frequency of use is unlikely to have significant effect until disposal.....or rather storage .....  of plastics is properly organized.

The also need to address the using street vendors, rhot khen, etc.

It  needs  to  start  somewhere.  Street  vendors  do  not regularly  purchase  from convenience  outlets  but   from  bulk  wholesale outlets which  do  not  themselves  provide   plastic   bags ! (   Makro as  an  example )

Plastics  in the  form of   films  are  not  an issue  in terms  of   bulk.

Nor  are  they  such an issue  in terms  of  disposal than  that in  the still  too  common disposal systems  of   landfill   that  they are  conveniently  allowed  to  defeat the  decomposition of   contents by  being  left  intact.

Currently  the    bulk  of   recyclable plastics globally in  the multitudious forms derived  from   petrochemicals is  in excess of demand  for  economically viable byproduct. 

A  major  problem  in  that  is  the  introduction   of  so  called  "bio  degradable" plastics which is actually a  misnomer  for  self  disentegrating  but  not   bio  degraded  compounds. Such  compounds  have  been  identified  in  creating  environmental disturbances that  in the  long  term  are   as serious  if  not  more  so than landfill issues.

Plastics in  the film form of  convenient  disposal  is  a  pollutant  that  needs  to  be  expunged   rapidly  if  not  immediately !

That  the  general  public  has  been  deceived into  the  expectation that a  plastic  bag  is  a normal  and  viable  part  of   every and any  transaction is  purely  in the  interests of  the  manufacturer and  associated marketeers. 

The  sad reality  is  that  on the  part  of  the  consumer who  only  requires  2  items is  compelled  to  buy  10 in  pre  packaged sealed plastic  format which  is  the  dutifully presented  in at  least  one  plastic  bag  if  not  two to  the  satisfaction  of  the  customer who as  dutifully   disposes  of   same  to  the  ground sometime  later could  be  solved  quickly  by   introducing a  prohibitive  tax  on  the  dispensors  of  plastic  bags !

 

 

 

 

[phuketjock]

14 hours ago, Dumbastheycome said:

It  needs  to  start  somewhere.  Street  vendors  do  not regularly  purchase  from convenience  outlets  but   from  bulk  wholesale outlets which  do  not  themselves  provide   plastic   bags ! (   Makro as  an  example )

Plastics  in the  form of   films  are  not  an issue  in terms  of   bulk.

Nor  are  they  such an issue  in terms  of  disposal than  that in  the still  too  common disposal systems  of   landfill   that  they are  conveniently  allowed  to  defeat the  decomposition of   contents by  being  left  intact.

Currently  the    bulk  of   recyclable plastics globally in  the multitudious forms derived  from   petrochemicals is  in excess of demand  for  economically viable byproduct. 

A  major  problem  in  that  is  the  introduction   of  so  called  "bio  degradable" plastics which is actually a  misnomer  for  self  disentegrating  but  not   bio  degraded  compounds. Such  compounds  have  been  identified  in  creating  environmental disturbances that  in the  long  term  are   as serious  if  not  more  so than landfill issues.

Plastics in  the film form of  convenient  disposal  is  a  pollutant  that  needs  to  be  expunged   rapidly  if  not  immediately !

That  the  general  public  has  been  deceived into  the  expectation that a  plastic  bag  is  a normal  and  viable  part  of   every and any  transaction is  purely  in the  interests of  the  manufacturer and  associated marketeers. 

The  sad reality  is  that  on the  part  of  the  consumer who  only  requires  2  items is  compelled  to  buy  10 in  pre  packaged sealed plastic  format which  is  the  dutifully presented  in at  least  one  plastic  bag  if  not  two to  the  satisfaction  of  the  customer who as  dutifully   disposes  of   same  to  the  ground sometime  later could  be  solved  quickly  by   introducing a  prohibitive  tax  on  the  dispensors  of  plastic  bags !

 

 

 

 

I'm sorry , if you think Makro do not provide plastic bags then you do not use Makro very often or are

decidedly unobservant.

All of the locals and many expats, including myself, go straight to the veggie/fruit section to pick up 

as many of the large plastic bags that they think they may need and pack their purchases in them at

the check out.

Have a look around you if you ever actually use Makro?

It is not a plastic bag issue it is a litter awareness education issue.

[Dumbastheycome]

8 hours ago, phuketjock said:

I'm sorry , if you think Makro do not provide plastic bags then you do not use Makro very often or are

decidedly unobservant.

All of the locals and many expats, including myself, go straight to the veggie/fruit section to pick up 

as many of the large plastic bags that they think they may need and pack their purchases in them at

the check out.

Have a look around you if you ever actually use Makro?

It is not a plastic bag issue it is a litter awareness education issue.

Of  course   Makro  provides  plastic   bags   for  loose  items. But  in the  most  part  in a  practical  sense. Would  you  cope  with  unfrozen  or  frozen  meat  or  fish or vegetables an  alternative  way? At  end  point  of  sale  Makro  does   not  multi  bag purchased  items.

And  yes, it is  a litter  awareness  issue. 

And  the   quickest  effective   method  to  introduce  some  awareness  is  to  make it   cost  !  By  far  the   majority  of  plastic  bags  dispensed  are  an  expected free  unnessecary . 

So if  people  such as  yourself  deliberately scab   bags  intended   for loose  product  simply as  a  convenience then I  question  why   you  have  any  justifiable  input  in  this  topic.

And  what  do  you  do  with  the  copius   number  of   bags   you  scab  for  your   personal  convenience? Responsibly   add  them  to    a  garbage   bin ?  Better  than  the   usual  release  to  the  wind. But  obviously   not  retain  them  for  the  next   visit  to  Makro !

40 plus   years  ago  I attained an  Industrial  Plastics  Engineering Technology  qualification. It   was  somewhat  controversial  at  end  because  I  was  required  to  submit  a "report" on  my  experience  of  the   Plastics  Industry.

In  that  report  i  submitted  my  opinion  that  it  would   eventuate   that  plastic  films  would  become  an issue.

At  that  time  there  was  no  simple  reference  to  the   wondrous  internet so  my  submission was  based  on   quite  extensive  research  and  reading  from  written material from  library and  industrial materials.

As  a  junior  employee being  given  subsidized education   I was called  to  Head  Office  and  roundly chastized.

Not so strange   now  that  that  same   issue  has  come  forth as a reality because  my report  was  based  on prediction by  people  who  knew  even  back  then   the  hazard  of  this  form of  plastics. And   that  goes  way  beyond the  issue  of   waste  but   much  further  into the   long  term  concerns as  to  the  introduction  of insidious  poisons in food  by   low  grade toxic  compounds which  I  can assure  you  is   common.

I  attained  the   qualification  in   conjuction  with  two  others.  The  Plastics   tech  I  abandoned thereafter.

I  have  no  rancour  as  to  your  reply  but  I  will say  that  I  am  in a  position    way   beyond  "looking  around " at  what  happens  at  Makro.  I  frequent  Makro  very  often  in  fact.

Makro  may  not issue   multiple  plastic  bags  as any  consideration of  the   environmental issue  but  at  last  they  do  minimize  it.

 

[surangw]

will the provide a receipt ?

or the money goes directly in someones pocket ?

 

[sambum]

31 minutes ago, surangw said:

will the provide a receipt ?

or the money goes directly in someones pocket ?

 

In the UK (from memory) the 5p per bag was included on the receipt. However TIT and therefore who knows?

[Airbagwill]

sing recycled plastic to build roads

 

 think that again the Thai approach is too simplistic as it is with most of their problems with modernity.

Firstly they should be looking at how they dispose of garbage in general - this if done badly just allows plastic bags to fly off in the wind.

Secondly they should be giving serious thought to the various recycling technologies available.

 

It is no coincidence that up to 50% of industrial waste in Thailand is disposed of illegally.

 

 

 

 

 

I

[Dumbastheycome]

6 minutes ago, Airbagwill said:

sing recycled plastic to build roads

 

 think that again the Thai approach is too simplistic as it is with most of their problems with modernity.

Firstly they should be looking at how they dispose of garbage in general - this if done badly just allows plastic bags to fly off in the wind.

Secondly they should be giving serious thought to the various recycling technologies available.

 

It is no coincidence that up to 50% of industrial waste in Thailand is disposed of illegally.

 

 

 

 

 

I

It is  true  that  Thailand has a  need  to  seriously  consider  the  rapid  expansion  of   waste  and  plastic  waste  in general as  a component  factor  of  economic/industrial/consumer growth  second  only  to  Indonesia  in   S.E A.

A primary cause  is  the complete  lack  of education/information as  to  the  impact of pollution in general.

Whereas  there  is a  thriving  industry in   general  recycling  for  almost all  items the single most  and  extremely  damaging   ignored  component  is  plastic   film  products  in the  form  of  plastic  bags.

Simply  because there  exists   no  viable  recyclable profit advantage which  is  the  basis  of   any  concern  in  this  world.

Decomposing  products  which   provide   an illusion  of biodegradable have actually added an insidious  environmental disruption .

So  sadly  while  Thailand insists  on an xenophobic mentality  while  not  so  coincidentally pursuing a  global pursuit of economic expansion it  already  faces  the  same global issues.

The  excess  of  plastic  packaging is slightly  removed  from the  plastic  carrier  bag issue.

In  the  distribution  of   food  product it  is  difficult  to  consider viable  alternatives. Maybe  not  so  for  other items. But  the  bulk pollutive  issue  of   carrier   bags which  do indeed often get  caste to  the wind  could  be  solved   by  simply  banning  them outright.

If  that  could  be  achieved then progress  on  the reduction  of plastic containment  purely  for  excessive "added  value" might  be  possible.

 

[01322521959]

Oh about time! I often try to tell people here how we charge for the bag in the UK. Spoke to a friend in Kenya and theres a complete ban there and you can face a fine for using them. How on earth will they enforce this? Have they seen the local markets?

[01322521959]

On 12/17/2017 at 7:28 AM, Samui Bodoh said:

It is about bloody time that this idea gets discussed and (hopefully!) implemented in Thailand; the sheer number of plastic bags in this country is both shocking and disgusting.

 

I am a figure of awe when I go to my local market, buy my stuff, then whip a used plastic bag out of my pocket for my purchase.

 

"GASP!" "Look at that!" "Wah!" "I didn't know you could do that!" "Double Wah!"

 

Make it five baht a bag, and watch the use of plastic bags plummet. Please.

 

I have the same experience.Always take a bag when shopping. I produce it with a flourish hoping to guilt trip others. I have become rather holier than thou here I'm afraid. I was using a couple of white computer bags until er'indoors said she wouldn't go shopping with me if I didn't get a bag for life as the computer bags were getting smelly!

[xtrnuno41]

I got a plastic bag, it is now about 25 years old and every week i do my shopping with it. Also used it when going to beach and get things with me like drinks and towels and so on.

And if have to get something else, i also take with me a plastic bag (as i have more then 1 somehow got it, but solid and reusable)  just plan to take it with me for what i want. Seldon i use throwable bag and if i have i reuse, aswell for taking it with me for second round. I hate to have a pile of plastic bags and have to throw them away(which i mostly cant, so make it less as possible) .   

[aussie11950]

On 17/12/2017 at 7:28 AM, Samui Bodoh said:

It is about bloody time that this idea gets discussed and (hopefully!) implemented in Thailand; the sheer number of plastic bags in this country is both shocking and disgusting.

 

I am a figure of awe when I go to my local market, buy my stuff, then whip a used plastic bag out of my pocket for my purchase.

 

"GASP!" "Look at that!" "Wah!" "I didn't know you could do that!" "Double Wah!"

 

Make it five baht a bag, and watch the use of plastic bags plummet. Please.

 

Bloody oath.

When I say no to a plastic bag and pull out one of my own (when I remember to bring one), they are shocked too!

 

[Airbagwill]

the more I look, the more I see there are alternatives to petrochemical plastics.

I imagine cost and  mass production are hindrances and of course the political will.

With the EEC, Thailand and Prayuth sees this as a personal legacy project - is going to vastly increase the already huge petrochemical industry in Chonburi and Rayong provinces.

So what chance does a product like THIS have?

 

 

here i8s a company website for cassava bags...

http://www.avanieco.com/product/eco-bags

 

Another possible solution  suitable for Thailand.....

 

https://www.globalcitizen.org/en/content/kenya-plastic-bags-banana-leaves-creative-hilda-ga/

 

Banana leaves - already a traditional wrapping in Thailand.

Edited January 14, 2018 by Airbagwill

[Dumbastheycome]

12 hours ago, Airbagwill said:

the more I look, the more I see there are alternatives to petrochemical plastics.

I imagine cost and  mass production are hindrances and of course the political will.

With the EEC, Thailand and Prayuth sees this as a personal legacy project - is going to vastly increase the already huge petrochemical industry in Chonburi and Rayong provinces.

So what chance does a product like THIS have?

 

 

here i8s a company website for cassava bags...

http://www.avanieco.com/product/eco-bags

 

Another possible solution  suitable for Thailand.....

 

https://www.globalcitizen.org/en/content/kenya-plastic-bags-banana-leaves-creative-hilda-ga/

 

Banana leaves - already a traditional wrapping in Thailand.

Banana  leaves   "used to  be " traditional  wrappings. Long   supplanted  by  the  convenience of  plastic.

Now mostly  limited  to  traditional steamed  food  items  for  special  occasions.

But  in  Indonesia   still used  most  commonly  for  street  food wrapping unlike  Thailand. 

[Dumbastheycome]

12 hours ago, Airbagwill said:

the more I look, the more I see there are alternatives to petrochemical plastics.

I imagine cost and  mass production are hindrances and of course the political will.

With the EEC, Thailand and Prayuth sees this as a personal legacy project - is going to vastly increase the already huge petrochemical industry in Chonburi and Rayong provinces.

So what chance does a product like THIS have?

 

 

here i8s a company website for cassava bags...

http://www.avanieco.com/product/eco-bags

 

Another possible solution  suitable for Thailand.....

 

https://www.globalcitizen.org/en/content/kenya-plastic-bags-banana-leaves-creative-hilda-ga/

 

Banana leaves - already a traditional wrapping in Thailand.

The  conversion  of   organic   materials also  involves processes  which  at  end  may  result  ina   bio  degradable   product.  But  what  information  is  provided  as to  the   pollutive aspect  in the  creation  of  that product?

Toilet   tissue  is  an example in  that  the   industrial  process the  pollutive  waste is  significant. Same  applies  to  almost  any modern paper  product.

[Kieran00001]

On 12/17/2017 at 4:47 PM, xtrnuno41 said:

People ALLREADY paid for bag, now you have to pay extra. No shop will give for free, its in the price.

Thai dont have garbage cans and use the plastic bags for household garbage.

Thailand doesnt have a real system of garbage handling.

If they have , like on koh Samui, then it is broke and will not fix it. SO what happens? Its thrown in the Gulf, i cant explain otherwise why this year there was a big amount of garbage in the Gulf floating and 100 tons of garbage on Hua Hin beach.

Everywhere in THailand you see they make something, but no maintenance, so when its broke, its broke and no fix.

It breaks down again to dust in long time

But Thailand is not the only one with this problem, Indonesia (Bali) is also covered with garbage. Guess there are way more countries covered with plastic. Guess they also dump it int he ocean, as there are islands of plastic floating as big as the state of Texas.

It is government who lack to do something about it, as it costs. 

If they would make water to drink out of the tap, you can by using RO systems and UV light fed by solar power, save 

billions of plastic bottles used for drinking water.

 

Most people just get the RO water in the refillable 30L bottles, having your own system is ridiculous when you can get 30L for 9 baht.

[harrry]

Plastics a wonder material.  We have global warming so we must all collect all the plastic bagss and other plastics we can,  They can be used to make flood barriers to stop our cities being inundated.

[ZeVonderBearz]

Still getting my chewing gum in a plastic from 7/11, this new crack down clearly has not started yet. Convenient that there is no time frame mentioned in the article as it will never happen in this life or the next 

Edited January 26, 2018 by ZeVonderBearz

[Will E Vormer]

Buy a sausage roll at starbucks and see the amount of unnecessary crap that comes with it..

Sent from my SM-G950F using Tapatalk

[xtrnuno41]

13 hours ago, Kieran00001 said:

 

Most people just get the RO water in the refillable 30L bottles, having your own system is ridiculous when you can get 30L for 9 baht.

I dint say anyone should have his own system, you can have one system for whole city(ies). However you can have your own system.

Do you know what water you buy in the 30 ltr bottles? Who is checking it? Could be just plain city water with no filtering at all. Still many people buy the water bottles, specially tourists. You know how many tourists come to Thailand ? I believe it is 4 times the amount of people who live in Thailand. Make the calculation then.

[elephant45]

Thais seem to have some bizarre obsession with the way things are packaged, wrapped. Its like some form of disrespect not get everything triple wrapped, all the straws, then poof there they go into the wind. The pride and conceit here of the individual is destroying or has already destroyed this country.

The school system is completely guilty. If they would take some time away form playing on their cell phones (teachers) and eating maybe they could teach the children something new that almost every other country in the world has adopted. Imagine India 1.3 billion people and no plastic bags. And many many other worse off countries have no plastic bags.

 

[Dumbastheycome]

17 hours ago, xtrnuno41 said:

I dint say anyone should have his own system, you can have one system for whole city(ies). However you can have your own system.

Do you know what water you buy in the 30 ltr bottles? Who is checking it? Could be just plain city water with no filtering at all. Still many people buy the water bottles, specially tourists. You know how many tourists come to Thailand ? I believe it is 4 times the amount of people who live in Thailand. Make the calculation then.

In  the  area  I stay  the  water producers   are  indeed  checked  by  the  Thai  Public  Health  Authority.

And  now  competition  is  very  strong so  producers  are  very  careful  to  not  be  found  to  have  contaminated  water. Similar  to   ice  producers. Problem  with  ice  is  not  the  production   but  the   on  handling which  has  been  found  to be  a problem.

But  the  issue  here  is  about  plastic   film  bags  which   are an environmental  disaster  in  progress unlike  plastic  water  bottles  which  are  generally  recycled and  even if  not   are  not as damaging as bags.

 

[Colabamumbai]

18 hours ago, xtrnuno41 said:

I dint say anyone should have his own system, you can have one system for whole city(ies). However you can have your own system.

Do you know what water you buy in the 30 ltr bottles? Who is checking it? Could be just plain city water with no filtering at all. Still many people buy the water bottles, specially tourists. You know how many tourists come to Thailand ? I believe it is 4 times the amount of people who live in Thailand. Make the calculation then.

You are correct. I have purchased those sealed bottles to find them full of ants, and who knows what else is in the water. It may be cheaper at 10 or 12 Baht, whats a life worth. I refuse to buy them. The water could easily be drawn close to feces infected water.

[Colabamumbai]

I had a cloth bag that I take into stores taken from my motorcycle, but I don't think people knew what it was for. Surely they would not take it to a store when they can get a free bag to put their garbage in, before they through in on the soi.

[Airbagwill]

2 hours ago, Colabamumbai said:

You are correct. I have purchased those sealed bottles to find them full of ants, and who knows what else is in the water. It may be cheaper at 10 or 12 Baht, whats a life worth. I refuse to buy them. The water could easily be drawn close to feces infected water.

The producers a surprising well monitored.....your paranoia of faeces infected water shows little understanding of where they get the water from.

It's not more risky than any other purified water as it mostly comes from the same source.

I'm very careful about food poisoning and f related diseases....for instance I never clean.my teeth with tap water, but I've used the plastic dragons for nearly 20 years without noticeable I'll effects attributable to that source.

I would suggest any ants in the water are not linkeda to anythe potential fault in the purification processes.

[wayned]

I drink rain water run off from the roof.  It flows into a guttering system on the back of the house into 12 Ongs.  I have a pump that pumps water from one directly into a second faucet on the kitchen sink.  The intake pipe is about 2/3 down into the tank and the only filtering is sediment sinking to the bottom.  When the tank gets low I fill it from another tank using a submersion pump.  The wat5er is also used to fill the tank for the house pump when the local water supply is off.  15 years ago it happened quite often, but I bought the village a new pump and it doesn't happen very often but the pressure is zilch since I'm the last house on the water line about 1 kilo,\meter from the supply tanks.!

[rubik101]

11 December 2025! Good to see that all plastic bags now cost a small amount. Has it changed the behaviour of the Thai shoppers, do you think? 

[metisdead]

An off topic post has been removed. 

[realenglish1]

 This is the easy liberal way out Just charge for plastic bags and that will reduce the use.

Reality is we need to go to a biodegradable plant-based bag

 

https://www.weforum.org/agenda/2018/05/this-plastic-bag-is-100-biodegradable-and-made-of-plants/

 

This solves the whole problem

[Kieran00001]

9 hours ago, realenglish1 said:

 This is the easy liberal way out Just charge for plastic bags and that will reduce the use.

Reality is we need to go to a biodegradable plant-based bag

 

https://www.weforum.org/agenda/2018/05/this-plastic-bag-is-100-biodegradable-and-made-of-plants/

 

This solves the whole problem

 

It couldn't be less related to liberalism as it allows those with more money to avoid doing their bit, it would very much be a conservative way out.