SMART Visa Detailed

[lkv]

I know you guys have been waiting for this for a while now, so here we go (pdf file attached also).

 

Enjoy! ?

 

http://www.boi.go.th/index.php?page=Smart_visa

 

BOI-brochure-2018-smart-visa-EN-20180125_97687_87299.pdf

Edited February 1, 2018 by lkv

[SicTransit]

This visa looks too smart for its own good to me. But any government effort on trying to accomodate people willing to spend their hard-earned cash in The Kingdom is appreciated.

Edited February 1, 2018 by SicTransit

[lkv]

I'd say that the Smart Visa -S is doable for people under 50 that can prove 600K in funds and have the "intention" of starting a company. Although that solves it for a year only, the second year they want to see the company formed.

 

Also, the only type of smart visa that requires insurance (not clear which, but I am guessing similar to the non O-X ripoff insurance). Funny enough, experts (scientists, etc) and investors (20MB) that can apply for the other categories don't seem to require this insurance.

 

 

smartvisadocumentsS_19450.pdf

Edited February 1, 2018 by lkv

[BritTim]

I agree the SMART Visa S could be interesting for those genuinely wishing to start a new company here. A question I would have is whether it will be easy to get a work permit to go with it.

 

The SMART Visa T, which I think was interesting to digital nomads, looks like a dud. I cannot imagine who would go to the trouble to get this over the easier Non B (unless the plan is to make Non B visas much harder to get to push people towards the new visa type).

[wobalt]

I agree the SMART Visa S could be interesting for those genuinely wishing to start a new company here. A question I would have is whether it will be easy to get a work permit to go with it.

If you would be approved no work permit is necessary.
In case of the “talent” type -if you work for the government, a salary of THB 200.000 +, seems to be not required . No indication about costs for the visa so far.


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[JackThompson]

2 hours ago, wobalt said:

In case of the “talent” type -if you work for the government, a salary of THB 200.000 +, seems to be not required .

Ahhh - so "riff-raff" techs who don't rank USD $75K/yr (in Thai wages) are welcome, after all - as long as they work "for the government."  

 

So much "smarter" would be:

• 500K in the bank (can't touch it)
• min 70K / mo transferred into Thailand (bank verified)
• pay taxes on min 70K (including withholding)
• verified degree in tech
• don't have to be working for any particular company - or working "in Thailand" at all

Then watch the magic happen, as the minds converge in Thailand.

 

[wobalt]

Ahhh - so "riff-raff" techs who don't rank USD $75K/yr (in Thai wages) are welcome, after all - as long as they work "for the government."  
 
So much "smarter" would be:

• 500K in the bank (can't touch it)
• min 70K / mo transferred into Thailand (bank verified)
• pay taxes on min 70K (including withholding)
• verified degree in tech
• don't have to be working for any particular company - or working "in Thailand" at all

Then watch the magic happen, as the minds converge in Thailand.
 

Most likely no government agency in Thailand would be able to pay such high salaries of 200k+, especially if the talent is integrated in the organizational structure. Would cause a big mismatch.


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[wobalt]

I'd say that the Smart Visa -S is doable for people under 50 that can prove 600K in funds and have the "intention" of starting a company. Although that solves it for a year only, the second year they want to see the company formed.
 
Also, the only type of smart visa that requires insurance (not clear which, but I am guessing similar to the non O-X ripoff insurance). Funny enough, experts (scientists, etc) and investors (20MB) that can apply for the other categories don't seem to require this insurance.
 
 
smartvisadocumentsS_19450.pdf

If you have a company contract some sort of insurance would be usually be included.


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[samran]

None of the visas will be a walk in the park.

 

while the BOI will be the single desk handling the applications, depending on the visa applied for, a number of science and technology related government departments will need to vet the credentials of the applicant as well as check whether the projects they are working on are endorsed. 

 

While some may see that a traditional Non immigrant visa may still be easier, for the first time this new system won’t always need to tie the applicant to a company. In some instances just working for or on a project might be enough. 

 

 

[lkv]

1 hour ago, JackThompson said:

Ahhh - so "riff-raff" techs who don't rank USD $75K/yr (in Thai wages) are welcome, after all - as long as they work "for the government."  

 

So much "smarter" would be:

• 500K in the bank (can't touch it)
• min 70K / mo transferred into Thailand (bank verified)
• pay taxes on min 70K (including withholding)
• verified degree in tech
• don't have to be working for any particular company - or working "in Thailand" at all

Then watch the magic happen, as the minds converge in Thailand.

 

I don't think so. Tax on 70K at 20% is 14K per month, so 168K per year.

 

Would not be so attractive cost wise compared to other options.

 

A company called Iglu does something similar, they will take care of your visa if you are willing to "run an income" through them of I believe 2K USD per month.

 

Btw, tax on 200K is 30% if I am not mistaken, incurring a cost of 720K per employee in tax.

 

I think the magic will happen in other places i.e. Singapore, Hong Kong etc where the minds actually do converge ?

Edited February 2, 2018 by lkv

[wobalt]

I don't think so. Tax on 70K at 20% is 14K per month, so 168K per year.
 
Would not be so attractive cost wise compared to other options.
 
A company called Iglu does something similar, they will take care of your visa if you are willing to "run an income" through them of I believe 2K USD per month.

That depends..there are possibly certain tax exemptions in place..


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[jackdd]

Is it possible to have more than one director in a company? Then you could just share the costs for the company with some friends and everybody has a quite nice visa.

[lkv]

2 minutes ago, jackdd said:

Is it possible to have more than one director in a company? Then you could just share the costs for the company with some friends and everybody has a quite nice visa.

For the S startup visa, it appears that the applicant has to form the company within a year to qualify for a further extension and own at least 25% of the shares. So two foreigners in the same company would not both qualify for this type of visa because they go over 49%.....

 

If I am understanding this correctly ?

[samran]

41 minutes ago, lkv said:

I don't think so. Tax on 70K at 20% is 14K per month, so 168K per year.

 

Would not be so attractive cost wise compared to other options.

 

A company called Iglu does something similar, they will take care of your visa if you are willing to "run an income" through them of I believe 2K USD per month.

 

Btw, tax on 200K is 30% if I am not mistaken, incurring a cost of 720K per employee in tax.

 

I think the magic will happen in other places i.e. Singapore, Hong Kong etc where the minds actually do converge ?

yeah, the head of the BOI is aware of Iglu. She wasn't happy when told...

[jackdd]

7 minutes ago, lkv said:

For the S startup visa, it appears that the applicant has to form the company within a year to qualify for a further extension and own at least 25% of the shares. So two foreigners in the same company would not both qualify for this type of visa because they go over 49%.....

 

If I am understanding this correctly ?

They say 25% "or" the position of a director

[Mattd]

58 minutes ago, lkv said:

I don't think so. Tax on 70K at 20% is 14K per month, so 168K per year.

Just to be correct, the income tax on 70,000 THB per month for a single person would be 53,150 THB per year.

The first 169,000 THB is deducted for personal allowance, expense & social security payments, the next 150,000 THB is tax free, then scaling up from initially 5% to a max. rate of 15%. 

[lkv]

Deleted. I will look into this and calculate myself for 200K ?

 

 

Edited February 2, 2018 by lkv

[Mattd]

9 minutes ago, lkv said:

How would the personal income tax be calculated on 200K per month out of interest? Or what's the final value?

Total tax owed on 2,400,000 income per year would be 455,300 THB based on the same assumption, single person, no kids etc.

CORRECTION: it would be 434,300 THB per year, first time I forgot to increase the allowances etc. to the new rates.

Edited February 2, 2018 by Mattd

[wobalt]

Be aware that we possibly talking here about BOI start up companies, where certain incentives(8 y corporate tax free) and regulations (100% ownerships) might apply.


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[lkv]

30 minutes ago, jackdd said:

They say 25% "or" the position of a director

This reminds me of some post that I cannot locate anymore either here or on Facebook about someone saying they would "qualify" via agent at a rate of 75K first year and 45K starting with the second year. 

[jackdd]

So it seems possible to have multiple directors in a company.

How does it work with the minimum salary? On google i found that the minimum salary is required to qualify for a Non B visa or work permit, obviously with the Smart S you don't need either. So can the directors of a company get no salary (or something like 1thb) or are they still required to get the minimum salary of like 50 or 60k and thus have to pay tax on it?

[lkv]

19 minutes ago, jackdd said:

So it seems possible to have multiple directors in a company.

How does it work with the minimum salary? On google i found that the minimum salary is required to qualify for a Non B visa or work permit, obviously with the Smart S you don't need either. So can the directors of a company get no salary (or something like 1thb) or are they still required to get the minimum salary of like 50 or 60k and thus have to pay tax on it?

Another question I would have is, what's the workaround for 4 and 5 at qualifications.

 

Does anybody have a friend at the Digital Economy Promotion agency? ?

Edited February 2, 2018 by lkv

[wobalt]

I worked more than a decade for relevant Thai government agencies so certainly I have some contacts. However you should be aware that the segments in focus of digital economy are well defined in the application, ranging from AI to smart grids.


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[jackdd]

25 minutes ago, lkv said:

Another question I would have is, what's the workaround for 4 and 5 at qualifications.

I think if you found a company and then apply for this visa you don't need to do anything listed under 4/5, these points are just for candidates who don't found a company beforehand.

Edited February 2, 2018 by jackdd

[lkv]

1 hour ago, jackdd said:

So it seems possible to have multiple directors in a company.

Yeah, as far as the number of directors is concerned, it seems that: 

-  no minimum or maximum number of directors is required in private limited companies.

- There is no age restriction for directors in private limited companies, but a minor must obtain prior permission from his legal representative before becoming a director. In public limited companies, a director must be over 20 years old or have been lawfully married before 20 years old. There is no maximum age limit in both types of companies.

 

- There is no nationality restriction on directors, except that at least half of the total number of directors of a public limited company must be Thai resident. 

 

There is no quota, restriction, particular policy or special treatment relating to the gender of directors.

 

Does a director have to get paid a salary or can it be 1 baht as jackdd stated earlier? 

 

Can someone in the know comment on this?

Edited February 2, 2018 by lkv

[jackdd]

Actually if you look at this document it seems quite easy: http://www.boi.go.th/upload/smartvisadocumentsS_19450.pdf

 

- Medical / Criminal / Police record from home country and get it translated is probably the most annoying point on the list.

- 600k THB on a bank account, can also be in home country

- Health insurance, should everybody have anyway, policy probably also needs a translation

- Pay a lawyer 20-30k THB to found my company "The smart digital flying automotive company", and then whatever the monthly cost is to file papers for tax or whatever, probably not more than 1-2k THB? (This cost could be splitted with as many people as one wishes if there is no required minimum salary for a director, this is unclear yet)

- Send in the documents and get a one year multiple entry visa with address reporting once a year and then renewable by up to 2 years every time

 

Did i miss anything? Sounds at least better than the existing solutions for people who are not married and under 50. And you even have a company with which you also could do something, besides on just having it.

Edited February 2, 2018 by jackdd

[lkv]

 

18 minutes ago, jackdd said:

Actually if you look at this document it seems quite easy: http://www.boi.go.th/upload/smartvisadocumentsS_19450.pdf

 

- Medical / Criminal / Record from home country and get it translated is probably the most annoying point on the list.

- 600k THB on a bank account, can also be in home country

- Health insurance, should everybody have anyway, policy probably also needs a translation

- Pay a lawyer 20-30k THB to found my company "The smart digital flying automotive company", and then whatever the monthly cost is to file papers for tax or whatever, probably not more than 1-2k THB? (This cost could be splitted with as many people as one wishes if there is no required minimum salary for a director, this is unclear yet)

- Send in the documents and get a one year multiple entry visa with address reporting once a year and then extendable by 2 years

 

Did i miss anything? Sounds at least better than the existing solutions for people who are not married and under 50. And you even have a company with which you also could do something, besides on just having it.

Criminal record has to be from home country, medical can be from here.

 

If funds are overseas that needs to be certified (by embassies notaries whatever). Not your overseas online banking printout like in some Consulates in the region.?

 

Health insurance, as you said, it's relevant what policy. That could be an imposed ripoff that would make the Elite visa look attractive.

 

You do send in the documents, but then those documents are sent for further approval to relevant government agencies and they come back with yes / no.

 

Edited February 2, 2018 by lkv

[JackThompson]

3 hours ago, lkv said:

A company called Iglu does something similar, they will take care of your visa if you are willing to "run an income" through them of I believe 2K USD per month.

33% taken for Iglu - on "gross receipts" - so even higher than the 'tax' option - and I don't think your tax-figures on the 70K include deductions most would/could take (though I could be wrong 
EDIT: just saw @Mattdhas it figured at 53K/yr on 70K/mo - which sounds closer for a not-rich-income tax-rate here).

 

3 hours ago, lkv said:

I think the magic will happen in other places i.e. Singapore, Hong Kong etc where the minds actually do converge ?

Given they have set the bar at 200K/mo - yes, correct - might as well live there with that income.    Anyone working/earning that sum for a Thai company would never touch the paperwork-side of things (immigration / labor paperwork), so this isn't even remotely helpful / tempting. 

At my suggested 70K/mo, the cost-of-living savings in Thailand vs Singapore/HK would be a significant factor.  But, that would encourage more young foreigners to live here, which is the last thing some in authority want to see happen.

Edited February 2, 2018 by JackThompson

[samran]

2 minutes ago, JackThompson said:

33% taken for Iglu - on "gross receipts" - so even higher than the 'tax' option - and I don't think your tax-figures on the 70K include deductions most would/could take (though I could be wrong).

 

Given they have set the bar at 200K/mo - yes, correct - might as well live there with that income.    Anyone working/earning that sum for a Thai company would never touch the paperwork-side of things (immigration / labor paperwork), so this isn't even remotely helpful / tempting. 

At my suggested 70K/mo, the cost-of-living savings in Thailand vs Singapore/HK would be a significant factor.  But, that would encourage more young foreigners to live here, which is the last thing some in authority want to see happen.

The Smart S visa needs 600,000 in the bank at all times. However there is no income threshold needed to maintain the visa.

 

I went to a couple of the consultations in the past 12 months on this. While they aren't wanting, to use their words 'anyone with a laptop', they have been presented with case study after case study of the young foreigners here 'doing their thing'....and are interested. Otherwise the 'S' category would have never been on the agenda.

[wobalt]

Criminal record has not be done in the home country if your residency is in Thailand. In that case a police record is demanded. However do not think that the approval is such easy. It needs exordinary achievements in certain segments to get the approval. Have a look in the application documents.


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