Under Consideration Period - Can Extend?

[Mattd]

I have an issue that could end up costing me a fair bit of money, my extension of stay based on work expires on 28th March 2018 and the work permit expires 21st March 2018.

For reasons best known to my company, they have been dragging their feet on the renewal of both this year compared to last year and today the ball finally started rolling on the renewal of both.

The problem is, I have a holiday booked overseas from 10th April until 21st April, which is non-refundable if I cancel.

The visa agents that the company use are not the best in terms of their full understanding of both the renewal and English.

I had a meeting with them late this afternoon to try and explain that the renewal dates and the holiday dates do not work together, as I will be outside of Thailand when the under consideration period ends and I am expected to report back to immigration to get the final stamp.

The absolute latest we can go to immigration to start the extension process is 21st March, as the Labour department need the new extension of stay application to be in process in order to renew the work permit (according to the visa agents), so the under consideration period will end around 19th April 2018 and therefore the reentry permit will as well (will get this immediately after the under consideration stamp), not good for my 21st April arrival back to Thailand!

 

The visa agents seem to think that immigration MAY add another 7 days max. to the consideration period if I show the outbound and inbound tickets and explain why it is needed.

 

Anybody know if this is the case? I've never heard of them doing this, but it would just about work out if they can and will.

[Mattd]

No one any clue as to whether immigration can give this additional 7 days?

[ubonjoe]

I have never heard of it being extended.

They could make it longer than 30 days but not any longer than 30 days after your current permit to stay ends as stated in the police order for extensions.

[Mattd]

10 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

I have never heard of it being extended.

They could make it longer than 30 days but not any longer than 30 days after your current permit to stay ends as stated in the police order for extensions.

Joe, thanks, I've never heard of it either and TBH do not really trust the visa agents, unfortunately I have no choice but to go along with them.

All I can do really is go on the 21st and see if they will play ball and allow the consideration period to be up to 23rd / 24th April, which is still under 30 days from the end of my current extension.

I checked last year's consideration period and it was 29 days, initially went on 1st March and report back date was 29 March.

 

Another thing, minor, but stupid thing, when I was signing all of the zillions of immigration / work permit forms for the agent yesterday, all of them had my age wrong by 1 year (older), I tried to correct the agent on this, but she INSISTS that immigration will make the calculation by using this year minus your birth year, so in my case 2018 - 1963 = 55.

I know Thai's do sometimes think that you are 1 at birth, but that is daft, she insisted they would refuse if put the correct age of 54!

[Mattd]

A thought, could I request 60 days to visit my children to gain the extra time?

[ubonjoe]

4 minutes ago, Mattd said:

A thought, could I request 60 days to visit my children to gain the extra time?

It is possible if immigration will do it since you will be extending your current permit to stay. That would only delay the date you have to apply for a new one year extension of stay.

[Mattd]

1 hour ago, ubonjoe said:

It is possible if immigration will do it since you will be extending your current permit to stay. That would only delay the date you have to apply for a new one year extension of stay.

Thanks, I will use this as the absolute last resort, it could actually get quite complicated because my extension of stay work wise is handled by Chaengwattana and both of my boys are in a Tabien Bahn in Chonburi, so not sure that CW office would be interested in that case, Jomtien could be an issue due to the TM.30 requirement and as far as I know their Mother is not in Thailand right now, making that more difficult.

Should have taken the opportunity of getting PR years ago, when my old company wanted to sponsor it!

[ubonjoe]

12 minutes ago, Mattd said:

Thanks, I will use this as the absolute last resort, it could actually get quite complicated because my extension of stay work wise is handled by Chaengwattana and both of my boys are in a Tabien Bahn in Chonburi, so not sure that CW office would be interested in that case,

Their tambien ban registry does not have to be for where you are applying for the extension. You only have to prove that is where you are living.

At least one of your children would have to be with you when you apply for the extension.

[Mattd]

1 minute ago, ubonjoe said:

Their tambien ban registry does not have to be for where you are applying for the extension. You only have to prove that is where you are living.

At least one of your children would have to be with you when you apply for the extension.

Not a problem to bring one of them along with me, the proving that is where I am living bit could be a little harder though, I have bills etc. in my name for the house in Chonburi, however, no rental contract, as it was the marital home, my ex. wife is named in the TB as the head, like I said, she isn't in Thailand, or at least I don't think so.

Plus I rent a condo in BKK which is the address that CW office have, as well as the one in the work permit.

I generally only go to Chonburi at weekends.

Complicated life!

 

Will just keep this idea in my mind for now.

 

Best option is that CW do extend the consideration period by 7 days to allow me to get back to Thailand and attend immigration.

[Evilbaz]

I can't comprehend why people don't clear their permission to stay requirements before booking holidays.

It happens so frequently.

[Mattd]

16 hours ago, Evilbaz said:

I can't comprehend why people don't clear their permission to stay requirements before booking holidays.

It happens so frequently.

Really, that is not a valid statement in my case at all.

My extension of stay ENDS on 28th March 2018, I had every expectation that it would have been extended at the same time as it ends, there was no reason for me to think otherwise, none at all.

Last year it was all done and dusted on 29th March, so a clear 12 days before this holiday, which BTW was booked 3 months ago.

The extension can be started as much as 45 days before the end of the current extension, 30 days would have been reasonable to expect, which would have aligned with the end of my current extension, which is for work, so it should be seamless, again, no reason to expect it not to be.

Remembering that I also travel a lot for work, a lot, sometimes without any notice, hence why I always have a ME reentry permit and even more reason why it should be seamless.

The company dropped the ball here, despite several reminders from me, which is all I can realistically do, it is impossible for me to do alone due to the majority of the documentation needed has to come from them.

If it was down to me to do the extension, then believe me we would not be discussing this topic, as it would have been extended and finished.

Edited March 10, 2018 by Mattd

[Crossy]

It never hurts to ask. I've had similar issues but could only get 30 days from the end of my current extension (rather than from the date I applied).

 

In my case this was just enough, on my return the officer at Swampy asked if I really did want to be stamped in for one day

 

Don't forget you will need a new re-entry permit based upon the Under Consideration period.

 

[Mattd]

8 minutes ago, Crossy said:

It never hurts to ask. I've had similar issues but could only get 30 days from the end of my current extension (rather than from the date I applied).

 

In my case this was just enough, on my return the officer at Swampy asked if I really did want to be stamped in for one day

 

Don't forget you will need a new re-entry permit based upon the Under Consideration period.

 

Thanks, this is what I am going to do, go there on the 21st March complete with both air tickets and politely explain the situation and ask for their help.

 

Yes, re-entry permit side is in hand, though thanks for the reminder.

Edited March 10, 2018 by Mattd

[BritTim]

19 minutes ago, Mattd said:

Thanks, this is what I am going to do, go there on the 21st March complete with both air tickets and politely explain the situation and ask for their help.

 

Yes, re-entry permit side is in hand, though thanks for the reminder.

Chaeng Wattana tend to be reasonable about such things, as long as what you are asking is within the rules. I think the chances are good that they will agree to an under consideration period ending April 27. Make sure they do know that you do not want to apply for the work extension at this stage if they want the under consideration period to end April 20 or so. If you need the 60-day extension, I would still suggest Chaeng Wattana rather then Jomtien.

[Mattd]

12 minutes ago, BritTim said:

Make sure they do know that you do not want to apply for the work extension at this stage if they want the under consideration period to end April 20

My current understanding is that I will be applying for the extension of stay based on work on 21st March, this is critical to the work permit extension, which expires on 21st March.

However, what I am going to ask them to do is to basically give me a 37 days under consideration period, which as far as I am aware, is still within the rules, as it is not more than 30 days past the original date the extension of stay expires.

Hence why I'm delaying the application until 21st March, the later the better in that way, but cannot go past 21st.

I get back to here on Saturday 21st April, so no problem to go to CW on the 23rd or 24th April.

 

I really want to avoid the 60 day extension if at all possible, as I feel like it is just delaying the problem, not solving it, in fact this may cause more problems.

I'm a little wary that if I extend the current stay for 60 days based on one of my boys, then at the end of this try to re-extend due to work, this would confuse things, it also takes the whole renewal out of sync.

Edited March 10, 2018 by Mattd

[BritTim]

31 minutes ago, Mattd said:

I'm a little wary that if I extend the current stay for 60 days based on one of my boys, then at the end of this try to re-extend due to work, this would confuse things, it also takes the whole renewal out of sync.

I actually think the biggest concern is that your labor department might (although they have no legitimate reason to do so) refuse to renew your work permit based on an extension of stay to visit your child. Although you would still be on an extension of your non immigrant entry, they could claim the work permit should not be issued as you are no longer on a work extension. The later extension based on working ought to go smoothly if you get that far.

[Mattd]

17 minutes ago, BritTim said:

I actually think the biggest concern is that your labor department might (although they have no legitimate reason to do so) refuse to renew your work permit based on an extension of stay to visit your child.

True and also a consideration, although I understand that the labour department in Bangkok are a little more clued up on the regs, the work permit is renewed at their HQ.

 

[Mattd]

Now then, I do have another question, because we are going to go to CW on 21st March, then I have to extend based on work, I'll have no choice that day, because of the work permit, unless I bring one of my boys with me.

So, presuming that I do apply to extend for work purposes and they do not give me the extra 7 days, then can I extend at a later date based on the children, i.e. before I depart for the holiday.

I would think not, as that would be extending an under consideration period of a new extension application, not the original extension?

[BritTim]

24 minutes ago, Mattd said:

Now then, I do have another question, because we are going to go to CW on 21st March, then I have to extend based on work, I'll have no choice that day, because of the work permit, unless I bring one of my boys with me.

So, presuming that I do apply to extend for work purposes and they do not give me the extra 7 days, then can I extend at a later date based on the children, i.e. before I depart for the holiday.

I would think not, as that would be extending an under consideration period of a new extension application, not the original extension?

Presumably, if possible at all, this would involve canceling you request for an extension based on working  (with its under consideration period) and the same day applying for the 60-day extension. I wonder if this would affect the work permit? This is probably such a rare situation that (even if someone could say what happened to them) you might not be able to rely on your immigration official and labor department having the same interpretation of the rules.

[Mattd]

9 minutes ago, BritTim said:

Presumably, if possible at all, this would involve canceling you request for an extension based on working  (with its under consideration period) and the same day applying for the 60-day extension. I wonder if this would affect the work permit? This is probably such a rare situation that (even if someone could say what happened to them) you might not be able to rely on your immigration official and labor department having the same interpretation of the rules.

I am not overly worried in that situation about the work permit, because that would have been extended already, based on the work extension application, it doesn't really break any rules as I am allowed to work on a non-immigrant entry.

TBH I don't think that way is doable though, just by the fact of the under consideration part.

It is looking more like hoping for the best on getting immigration to agree to extend the under consideration period to its max and if they don't, well I'll just have to cancel the holiday and lose the cash already paid out, at the end of the day, the extension is the most important thing.

[Mattd]

An update, as I went to CW today, as planned.

Not the best of visits, although the extension of the consideration period was a breeze, the initial IO who was reviewing the documents just asked me when do I get back to Thailand and when do I want to go back to CW for the final extension stamp, 21st & 25th I said.

No problem report back date set to 25th, too easy!

 

I did experience a couple of minor issues, both out of my control, but worth passing on the experience.

In 2017 I took some leave without pay, when the IO was doing her checks, she took my monthly salary x 12 and therefore came up with a different annual figure than the total annual figure that was actually earned and tax was paid on, moral, make sure that the company submit a signed statement explaining the difference, even though the PND.1 documentation is correct and accepted by the RD.

The approving IO now took exception to the fact that my work permit expires today as well, he stamped the under consideration in to my passport, on the proviso that the agent returns today before they close up shop and shows that the work permit has been extended, otherwise they will cancel the extension of stay application.

 

The last part was very minor, but one that I had already warned the agent about, the address that they were using for my application is different to my actual address, so all of the immigration paperwork was using an old address and my 90 day report (online) was in the new address, this came to light, as I suspected it would, so we had to fill in a Thai only form, didn't seem to be a problem for the IO though. (I told HR about this change in May 2016!!!)

 

Lastly, they have changed the queuing system since I was last there, in that no more plastic bottles or bags to reserve the space in the queue, you now have to queue around the inside perimeter wall and get a queue number to enter, these start issuing at 7 am, the agent got there before 6 am, I got there at 6.55 am, we ended up with queue number 124 to get inside, you start queuing again at 8.10 am, with officers ensuring that you are in the right order number wise, doors open as normal at 8.30, we ended up as queue number 15 at the M desks for the business extensions, was at the reentry desk about 11 am, where I just had to show my face, the agent will take care of that part and the WP etc. without me.