Central American caravan moves on in spite of Mexico jobs offer

[rooster59]

Central American caravan moves on in spite of Mexico jobs offer

By Delphine Schrank

 

A caravan of thousands of migrants from Central America, en route to the United States, makes its way to San Pedro Tapanatepec from Arriaga, Mexico October 27, 2018. REUTERS/Ueslei Marcelino

 

ARRIAGA, Mexico (Reuters) - A U.S.-bound caravan of Central American migrants pressed on through southern Mexico on Saturday, in spite of government offers of jobs, as authorities stepped up efforts to disperse the convoy that has angered U.S. President Donald Trump.

 

Mexican police in riot gear briefly blocked the march of men, women and children as they neared Oaxaca state before dawn, to relay the offer of temporary identification papers, jobs or education for those seeking asylum in Mexico.

 

Trump has threatened to send troops to the U.S. border and cut aid to Central America to try to stop the group of several thousand people that left Honduras two weeks ago.

 

Estimates vary significantly on the group's size, which has morphed as some migrants return home and newcomers join.

At least 150 migrants travelling separately were detained by Friday near Guatemala's border, a Mexican official said.

 

More than 1,700 people in the convoy have applied for asylum, while others have returned home, according to Mexico's government. The Honduran ambassador said on Friday the group officially had 3,500 members. Other estimates go much higher.

 

By Saturday, more than 100 Honduran migrants opted to seek refugee status and enter the temporary work programme proposed by President Enrique Pena Nieto on Friday, said Mexico's National Migration Institute. Many others rejected the offer.

 

"We're going to the United States. Because that's our dream," said 28-year-old Honduran Daniel Leonel Esteves at the head of a 50-person wide column of migrants snaking down a highway into the hills.

 

Others echoed his goal to cross the border, declining Mexico's offer.

 

"Our destination is the United States," said migrant Francisco Ramirez.

 

A police official on a road just south of Oaxaca, where migrants were proceeding north from the town of Arriaga in Chiapas state, said authorities intended to keep presenting the asylum offer.

 

"We think it's very important that every person in the caravan knows these benefits, so that they stop putting their safety at risk crossing these roads," said federal police commissioner Benjamin Grajeda.

 

Trump and his fellow Republicans have sought to make the migrant caravan and immigration major issues before the Nov. 6 elections, in which Republicans are battling to keep control of Congress.

 

Honduras said 4,500 of its citizens attempting to emigrate have returned to the country in recent days.

 

 

-- © Copyright Reuters 2018-10-28

 

[Phuketshrew]

Must be a bloody big caravan to fit that lot inside ????

[mcambl61]

so once Again, they prove they don't want asylum, unless they can get it in the USA.

immediately disqualified for asylum as they are economic migrants.

[attrayant]

Well I guess that ties it.  They must be coming to vote in the mid-term elections like Trump says.  Even though they're still a thousand miles away and the elections are next week.

 

4 minutes ago, mcambl61 said:

so once Again, they prove they don't want asylum, unless they can get it in the USA.  Immediately disqualified for asylum as they are economic migrants.

 

If they're disqualified, it'll be by an immigration judge during an interview for asylum as per the law.  You got a problem with following the law?

[mcambl61]

7 minutes ago, attrayant said:

Well I guess that ties it.  They must be coming to vote in the mid-term elections like Trump says.  Even though they're still a thousand miles away and the elections are next week.

 

 

If they're disqualified, it'll be by an immigration judge during an interview for asylum as per the law.  You got a problem with following the law?

no problem at all, but claiming asylum in the USA after refusing it elsewhere is obviously not a truthful application for asylum

[how241]

They violate laws and then want to use and hide behind the law.  You can't have it both ways. Block them from entering the US. Use the military. Don't arrest them but just block them and that will keep them on Mexican soil.  Lots of tear gas and water hoses will convince them that they are not wanted and will not be accepted unless they go thru the proper legal channels... 

Edited October 28, 2018 by how241

[Ulic]

As with most, economic migrants, not asylum seekers looking for safety. 

[phkauf]

Can't build that <deleted> Wall fast enough!!! This nonsense has to stop. 

My grandparents and great grandparents were all immigrants to America, but they followed the rules. These people want to skip the line while others who follow the rules wait patiently. It's absurd. 

Similar to the folks here in Thailand who don't follow the Visa rules and then complain when they get caught. I've got no, zero, nada sympathy for these types of people.

[j8k]

They should be allowed in. Can't believe how many Trumps we have here! They are human beings looking for a better life from war torn countries.

 

Have a heart!

[janclaes47]

22 minutes ago, j8k said:

They should be allowed in. Can't believe how many Trumps we have here! They are human beings looking for a better life from war torn countries.

 

Have a heart!

I didn't know there was a war in Honduras, but what I know is that it's full with violent criminals and murderers, you sure don't want that kind of population enter a civilized country.

 

Have a heart brain.

Edited October 28, 2018 by janclaes47

[j8k]

15 minutes ago, janclaes47 said:

I didn't know there was a war in Honduras, but what I know is that it's full with violent criminals and murderers, you sure don't want that kind of population enter a civilized country.

 

Are they heading thru to Canada now?

 

[bristolboy]

18 minutes ago, tomazbodner said:

Well, now US can see how that looked in Europe when "Syrian refugees" were en route to Germany and Sweden...

Acttually, illegal immigration has declined massively at the USA's southern border since 2000. It's roughtly 1/8th of what it was then. Mexican undocumented immigrants have acgtually been exiting faster than they've been entering.

[Guest]

When did this forum commenters walked 200 meters, let alone 2 kilometers? That's hard and heavy stuff. 

 

When you get a group of people walking 2 million meters to get to your doorsteps, I think it's fair to invite them to do do your gardening and other dirty works, which, you, who don't want to walk the 200 meters, is not likely ever do.

 

For those who are wondering what 2 million meters means, it's 2000 kilometers. Practically 4 million steps on odometer. A lot. 

[direction BANGKOK]

Objects in motion tend to stay in motion. 

[Scott]

13 hours ago, mcambl61 said:

so once Again, they prove they don't want asylum, unless they can get it in the USA.

immediately disqualified for asylum as they are economic migrants.

That is false and continuing to post false information will get you suspended.   Under UN regulations, you should apply in the first country, but you are not barred from asylum for not doing so.   Here's a snippet from the USCIS website:

 

Simply passing through another country on your way to the U.S. is not enough to warrant a refusal of asylum; nor spending longer there, if it didn't lead to any legal right to remain.

[Scott]

14 hours ago, mcambl61 said:

no problem at all, but claiming asylum in the USA after refusing it elsewhere is obviously not a truthful application for asylum

Again, false.   The only time a rule about that kicks in is you were resettled in a country.   Those who seek asylum in Mexico and have it granted would have a dubious claim for asylum if they then tried to enter the US.   Even then, it does not necessarily bar you from applying, but will be taken into account in assessing the claim.

 

Edit:   Troll, bickering posts and replies removed.

 

Edited October 28, 2018 by Scott

[Prairieboy]

19 hours ago, Phuketshrew said:

Must be a bloody big caravan to fit that lot inside ????

I know you are being facetious.  For the rest of you Brits and Aussies there is another definition of caravan:

 

Definition of caravan 

(Entry 1 of 2)

1a : a company of travelers on a journey through desert or hostile regions also : a train of pack animals

b : a group of vehicles traveling together (as in a file)

[mcambl61]

4 hours ago, Scott said:

Again, false.   The only time a rule about that kicks in is you were resettled in a country.   Those who seek asylum in Mexico and have it granted would have a dubious claim for asylum if they then tried to enter the US.   Even then, it does not necessarily bar you from applying, but will be taken into account in assessing the claim.

 

Edit:   Troll, bickering posts and replies removed.

 

right, so basically we have to accept this nonsense because we have a group of congressional stooges that think this is an acceptable policy. no wonder executive orders get issued so many times.

[EVENKEEL]

Could someone explain the process of 5000+ asylum seekers crossing the border into US at the same time. Will they be issued a ticket no, given a date and turned loose? Where will they live, how will they eat, do they have medical insurance? If they are to be held for their hearings, how and where will this happen?

 

 

[bristolboy]

1 minute ago, EVENKEEL said:

Could someone explain the process of 5000+ asylum seekers crossing the border into US at the same time. Will they be issued a ticket no, given a date and turned loose? Where will they live, how will they eat, do they have medical insurance? If they are to be held for their hearings, how and where will this happen?

 

 

Given past performance most likely they'll do something un-American like get jobs and live with relatives until they accumulate enough cash to live in their own homes,

[mcambl61]

7 hours ago, oilinki said:

When did this forum commenters walked 200 meters, let alone 2 kilometers? That's hard and heavy stuff. 

 

When you get a group of people walking 2 million meters to get to your doorsteps, I think it's fair to invite them to do do your gardening and other dirty works, which, you, who don't want to walk the 200 meters, is not likely ever do.

 

For those who are wondering what 2 million meters means, it's 2000 kilometers. Practically 4 million steps on odometer. A lot. 

irrelevant, this is not an empathy contest

[Scott]

22 minutes ago, mcambl61 said:

right, so basically we have to accept this nonsense because we have a group of congressional stooges that think this is an acceptable policy. no wonder executive orders get issued so many times.

Unless the laws are changed or the US wants to withdraw from the UN Conventions on Refugees and Asylum seekers, we do.   Congress sets the number of immigrants allowed to be admitted to the US and the President takes from that the number of  refugees to be admitted.

 

I believe that the current number of refugees admitted is set at 50,000 (down from 100,000 from the previous administration).   Asylum seekers, however, are not a part of that number, at least not until they are legally granted refugee status.

 

 

 

[EVENKEEL]

21 minutes ago, bristolboy said:

Given past performance most likely they'll do something un-American like get jobs and live with relatives until they accumulate enough cash to live in their own homes,

Not an answer, I'm talking 5000+ people at one time. And, if this is allowed the gate will never close.

[Joe Mcseismic]

47 minutes ago, Prairieboy said:

I know you are being facetious.  For the rest of you Brits and Aussies there is another definition of caravan:

 

Definition of caravan 

(Entry 1 of 2)

1a : a company of travelers on a journey through desert or hostile regions also : a train of pack animals

b : a group of vehicles traveling together (as in a file)

Still recovering from your triple sense of humour bypass operation, I see.

[mcambl61]

10 hours ago, j8k said:

They should be allowed in. Can't believe how many Trumps we have here! They are human beings looking for a better life from war torn countries.

 

Have a heart!

do you know how irresponsible allowing people in just because they want in is?

 

sovereignty does not care about your feelings.

[Sir Dude]

All countries have the right to admit people or not as they see fit...including the US. Due to exploding populations everywhere and a general sense of entitlement by all now, who think it is their "right" to do and go wherever the hell they want regardless, means there has to be stronger controls on migration. Many countries (not only the US) are suffering from immigration fatigue and the tsunami of, often mostly of completely unsuitable types, economic opportunists. 

Another reason for blocking entry to many is that it can, and does, get politically explosive as many indigenous people of a country don't like it as values and culture is often eroded. What do you think has facilitated the surprisingly rapid rise of the right everywhere in the last 10 years? Pretty obvious to me. Top-and-tail-of-it is that some migration is necessary and can be a good thing but there are two types of migrant, the right type with skills and something to offer and, well, the wrong type with nothing to offer and just wants to sponge...all too often we see the later, which is what we are seeing in this "caravan" of people and is also why Europe is on it's knees. The western world (except Australia and Russia) will end up as dysfunctional dystopias which quite a few think we are already well on the way to.    

How about these people sort out their own countries from the hole they are in? Revolt, fight for your freedom and country and you will get change. Yes, it costs and true freedom, prosperity and democracy always comes at a cost but the western world has paid dearly in lives for their countries to have it like it is.

Even Thailand is no longer the land of the smiling welcome that it used to be and I suspect that the present crackdown on illegals here is a belated attempt by the Thai authorities to keep a lid on the slowly growing frostiness of the locals towards visitors. 

[bristolboy]

55 minutes ago, Sir Dude said:

Pretty obvious to me. Top-and-tail-of-it is that some migration is necessary and can be a good thing but there are two types of migrant, the right type with skills and something to offer and, well, the wrong type with nothing to offer and just wants to sponge...all too often we see the later, which is what we are seeing in this "caravan" of people and is also why Europe is on it's knees. T

It may be obvious to you but it's wrong. On the one hand anti-immigration faction claims immigrants are taking jobs away from American workers or making it possible for employers to pay very wages. On the other, they're spongers. If there's one thing the evidence shows is that these immigrants are not spongers. 

[EVENKEEL]

2 hours ago, bristolboy said:

It may be obvious to you but it's wrong. On the one hand anti-immigration faction claims immigrants are taking jobs away from American workers or making it possible for employers to pay very wages. On the other, they're spongers. If there's one thing the evidence shows is that these immigrants are not spongers. 

Do you or have you ever lived in a part of the US that was impacted by the illegals? In Calif the educational system is failed, low wages, before I started working for DOD I held many manual labor jobs in Ca. and I had to compete with the illegals for that. And you'll have them in the Emergency Rooms being treated for the common cold, while those of us who pay for Insurance and need care get to wait in line with the illegals.

 

We hear terms used like well statistically speaking, evidence shows...…. I'm giving cold hard, lived it, experienced it explanation of why we can't keep this up. 

[bristolboy]

2 hours ago, EVENKEEL said:

Do you or have you ever lived in a part of the US that was impacted by the illegals? In Calif the educational system is failed, low wages, before I started working for DOD I held many manual labor jobs in Ca. and I had to compete with the illegals for that. And you'll have them in the Emergency Rooms being treated for the common cold, while those of us who pay for Insurance and need care get to wait in line with the illegals.

 

We hear terms used like well statistically speaking, evidence shows...…. I'm giving cold hard, lived it, experienced it explanation of why we can't keep this up. 

Blaming California's educational problems in illegal immigrants is nonsense. California used to have the best educational system in the country, maybe the world. Then Californians voted in proposition 18 that capped taxation and forced huge slashes in the education budget. Studies repeatedly show that on balance, illegal immigrants are a net benefit to the USA. Of course, measures could be taken, like imposing a living minimum wage and penalizing employers who hire illegals with jail time and fines. But I haven't seen Trump proposing anything like that. I wonder why?

[EVENKEEL]

1 minute ago, bristolboy said:

Blaming California's educational problems in illegal immigrants is nonsense. California used to have the best educational system in the country, maybe the world. Then Californians voted in proposition 18 that capped taxation and forced huge slashes in the education budget. Studies repeatedly show that on balance, illegal immigrants are a net benefit to the USA. Of course, measures could be taken, like imposing a living minimum wage and penalizing employers who hire illegals with jail time and fines. But I haven't seen Trump proposing anything like that. I wonder why?

Again I ask do you or have you lived there? Please don't parrot studies about the benefits of illegals. Minimum wages didn't used to be meant to equal a living wage. Everyone seems to think illegals only work in the fields or such. Today that's not the case.  The laws are already in place, they just need enforcing.