Numbers In Thai..

[rainman]

okay, its 1:30am and i'm stuck in some of the numbers in thai. i have them all memorized but something doesn't make sense (maybe its just too late). i know 20 should be "yee sib", but where does the "yee" come from? for example, 40 is "see sib", which translated is "four ten". shouldn't 20 be "song sib" ?

[Basher]

Don't even try mate, it makes no sense.

Just learn it and the use it to wind up your missus/mr when you want to.

Numerical Basher

[rainman]

well, 10, 30, 40, 50, etc. all make sense...just the 20 doesn't.

[SeaVisionBurma]

i know 20 should be "yee sib", but where does the "yee" come from? for example, 40 is "see sib", which translated is "four ten". shouldn't 20 be "song sib" ?

well, 10, 30, 40, 50, etc. all make sense...just the 20 doesn't.

Umm, cant believe I'm reading this.

Look at numbers in English for a start. Given we say FORTY, SIXTY, SEVENTY, EIGHTY, etc then by your respective logic above why don't we say TWO-TY, THREE-TY, FIVE-TY for 20, 30, 50, etc??

Explain our logic in the names of english numbers first, before embarking on a fruitless study of why the Thais dont call 20 "SONG-SIP"

bizarre

[Basher]

Don't even try mate, it makes no sense.

Just learn it and the use it to wind up your missus/mr when you want to.

Numerical Basher

I reiterate

Bash

[dr_Pat_Pong]

i know 20 should be "yee sib", but where does the "yee" come from? for example, 40 is "see sib", which translated is "four ten". shouldn't 20 be "song sib" ?

well, 10, 30, 40, 50, etc. all make sense...just the 20 doesn't.

Umm, cant believe I'm reading this.

Look at numbers in English for a start. Given we say FORTY, SIXTY, SEVENTY, EIGHTY, etc then by your respective logic above why don't we say TWO-TY, THREE-TY, FIVE-TY for 20, 30, 50, etc??

Explain our logic in the names of english numbers first, before embarking on a fruitless study of why the Thais dont call 20 "SONG-SIP"

bizarre

The Thai are unlikely to modify the number system coz someone on Thaivisa doesn't agree with the logic. So lets all get on with life.

[ajahnlau]

So confusing already. You can also say "sow baht" meaning 20baht

[dr_Pat_Pong]

So confusing already. You can also say "sow baht" meaning 20baht

Yeesip is etched in my memory Ajahn. Additional education will addle my brain forever

[Up2U]

So confusing already. You can also say "sow baht" meaning 20baht

Yeesip is etched in my memory Ajahn. Additional education will addle my brain forever

And you can say 'yee-ha' for twenty five instead of 'yee-sip-ha'

Go with the flow.

[rainman]

I'm not trying to change it I was just wondering if there's something really obvious i'm missing or if there is a reason why its not "song sib". It could be that "song sib" means something really nasty, you never know...

[taxexile]

I was just wondering if there's something really obvious i'm missing

got it in one.

[maerim]

So confusing already. You can also say "sow baht" meaning 20baht

This is true but if you say it in Bkk an awful lot of people won't know what it means.

[meadish_sweetball]

Most people in Bangkok do know what "sao" means, because they are from the Northeast, North or Laos.

Yii-sip is Central Thai, sao is Lao (the Isarn dialects are dialects of Lao, not Thai, and Northern Thai is also closer to Lao than Central Thai).

There is probably a reason why 20 is irregular and the rest are not, but I don't know. I'll check it up for you.

[dr_Pat_Pong]

So confusing already. You can also say "sow baht" meaning 20baht

Yeesip is etched in my memory Ajahn. Additional education will addle my brain forever

And you can say 'yee-ha' for twenty five instead of 'yee-sip-ha'

Go with the flow.

Yip-Har

[Edward B]

... where does the "yee" come from?

ยี่ (yee, falling tone) is an archaic word for two. Much of the Thai language (NOT the writing) comes from Chinese. It's possible that this is where it came from. Why and when they changed it to สอง (sorng, rising tone) is a mystery to me.

[dr_Pat_Pong]

Most people in Bangkok do know what "sao" means, because they are from the  Northeast, North or Laos.

Yii-sip is Central Thai, sao is Lao (the Isarn dialects are dialects of Lao, not Thai, and Northern Thai is also closer to Lao than Central Thai).

There is probably a reason why 20 is irregular and the rest are not, but I don't know. I'll check it up for you.

You are always a mine of great information Mr Sweetball. Some of my Viking friends mess up on the English a heck of a lot. Whereas you have made a good fist of parsar Thai. Well done.

[Up2U]

So confusing already. You can also say "sow baht" meaning 20baht

Yeesip is etched in my memory Ajahn. Additional education will addle my brain forever

And you can say 'yee-ha' for twenty five instead of 'yee-sip-ha'

Go with the flow.

Yip-Har

Not if you come from Texas - always 'Yiiii Haaaaar'

[Richard W]

Yip-Har

Are you sure of the vowel length of the first syllable of 'yip haa'? I thought it was short, and got ridiculed for that at thai-language.com.

[Richard W]

... where does the "yee" come from?

ยี่ (yee, falling tone) is an archaic word for two. Much of the Thai language (NOT the writing) comes from Chinese. It's possible that this is where it came from. Why and when they changed it to สอง (sorng, rising tone) is a mystery to me.

However, if you look at Numbers in Sino-Tibetan Languages, you'll find that "yii-sip-et" (can't hack Thai entry in my lunch hour) for '21' matches some of the Chinese froms quite well. The best match for Thai seems to be a blend of Middle Chinese and Hakka.

[Richard W]

There is probably a reason why 20 is irregular and the rest are not, but I don't know. I'll check it up for you.

'20' being irregular makes as little sense as ' three score years and ten' = '70 years'.

[Richard W]

Umm, cant believe I'm reading this.

Look at numbers in English for a start. Given we say FORTY, SIXTY, SEVENTY, EIGHTY, etc then by your respective logic above why don't we say TWO-TY, THREE-TY, FIVE-TY for 20, 30, 50, etc??

Explain our logic in the names of english numbers first, before embarking on a fruitless study of why the Thais dont call 20 "SONG-SIP"

bizarre

Funny, I had the same reaction to these comments. The questions about English were, of course, answered long ago.

[MadFrankie]

i know 20 should be "yee sib", but where does the "yee" come from? for example, 40 is "see sib", which translated is "four ten". shouldn't 20 be "song sib" ?

well, 10, 30, 40, 50, etc. all make sense...just the 20 doesn't.

Umm, cant believe I'm reading this.

Look at numbers in English for a start. Given we say FORTY, SIXTY, SEVENTY, EIGHTY, etc then by your respective logic above why don't we say TWO-TY, THREE-TY, FIVE-TY for 20, 30, 50, etc??

Explain our logic in the names of english numbers first, before embarking on a fruitless study of why the Thais dont call 20 "SONG-SIP"

bizarre

The Thai are unlikely to modify the number system coz someone on Thaivisa doesn't agree with the logic. So lets all get on with life.

lol

[RDN]

What is this thread doing in "Farang Pub" Come on George, give us a Thai Language forum!

[samran]

... where does the "yee" come from?

ยี่ (yee, falling tone) is an archaic word for two. Much of the Thai language (NOT the writing) comes from Chinese. It's possible that this is where it came from. Why and when they changed it to สอง (sorng, rising tone) is a mystery to me.

probably cantonese. I have noticed that most of the counting system from 1 to 100 is quite similar in both languages.

[MadFrankie]

What is this thread doing in "Farang Pub" Come on George, give us a Thai Language forum!

thats about the most sensible thing thats been posted on here since christmas

[meadish_sweetball]

probably cantonese. I have noticed that most of the counting system from 1 to 100 is quite similar in both languages.

They are very similar. Some ethnolinguists maintain that Guangdong was likely dominated by a Tai-speaking group before falling under the influence of the Han Chinese - this would explain some phonetic similarities in Thai and Cantonese.

Sorry, I have no source to back up that statement as I cannot remember where I read it.

[rainman]

i know 20 should be "yee sib", but where does the "yee" come from? for example, 40 is "see sib", which translated is "four ten". shouldn't 20 be "song sib" ?

well, 10, 30, 40, 50, etc. all make sense...just the 20 doesn't.

Umm, cant believe I'm reading this.

Look at numbers in English for a start. Given we say FORTY, SIXTY, SEVENTY, EIGHTY, etc then by your respective logic above why don't we say TWO-TY, THREE-TY, FIVE-TY for 20, 30, 50, etc??

Explain our logic in the names of english numbers first, before embarking on a fruitless study of why the Thais dont call 20 "SONG-SIP"

bizarre

you cant blame me, my native language isn't english i have no problems with yee sib it was just 2am and i was wondering if there was something i was missing or if its really just the 20 that's different.

[meadish_sweetball]

you cant blame me, my native language isn't english  i have no problems with yee sib  it was just 2am and i was wondering if there was something i was missing or if its really just the 20 that's different. 

Just twenty. Also "ten thousand" and "hundred thousand" are separate words, once you get up to those numbers. In other words, you can't say "one hundred and fifty-four thousand" in Thai, you need to say "one hundredthousand, five tenthousands, four onethousands".

154,325

neung sae:n ha: meu:n si: phan sa:m raw:y yi: sib ha:

low rising falling mid low mid rising high falling low falling

Colons indicate long vowel sound.

[Boon Mee]

As Basher noted, don't try to figure it out. My AUA teacher long ago made a point to tell us don't ask "why" something when learning Thai. It just slows down the process.

[andy...mp]

?jjj