Brexit to harm UK's cherished health service, experts say

[Bullie]

4 hours ago, samran said:

And blue passports. Don’t forget the blue passports...

 

As for the trade deals. They have to leave the EU first. Then people will be queueing up around the block to sign them the very next day. Promise!

Britain could have had it's blue passports all along, but they CHOSE not to, plus they decided to have them printed in france because it was cheaper over there...

 

Very few nations will be queuing up, I'm afraid due to the fact that they have very interesting trade deals in place with the rest of the world already, thank you very much. Any deals with the U.K. will come at a hefty price because, at the end of the day, Britain is just this teeny weeny little island nation with little or no clout in the world left.

Sure, there's very scary bombs. But now that even the most backward nation in the world (North Korea) has got some in their sweaty little hands it sort of loses it's deterring power, don't you think?

 

As to the subject in hand: The main problem with the NHS is the lack of capable staff. Now that the very capable EU nurses have been chased off very effectively, back to the mainland they went, and any financial inducement for British girls to become a nurse has long ago just as effectively been cut off, you're in a bit of a bind, I'm afraid. Smiling Phillipina girls are equally not as enthusiastic to join the English nurse front anymore either, due to better prospects elsewhere.

You'll just have to go it alone, then, I'm afraid. Tally Ho!

[mickymouse1]

I take some of these expected shortages in medicine and other supplies even staff as opportunities for the UK to expand its pharmaceutical industry as well as for the NHS to recruit and train more Doctors and nurses etc...It is high time to start producing more without restriction or imposed quotas and EXPAND THE ECONOMY.

[mickymouse1]

8 minutes ago, Bullie said:

Britain could have had it's blue passports all along, but they CHOSE not to, plus they decided to have them printed in france because it was cheaper over there...

 

Very few nations will be queuing up, I'm afraid due to the fact that they have very interesting trade deals in place with the rest of the world already, thank you very much. Any deals with the U.K. will come at a hefty price because, at the end of the day, Britain is just this teeny weeny little island nation with little or no clout in the world left.

Sure, there's very scary bombs. But now that even the most backward nation in the world (North Korea) has got some in their sweaty little hands it sort of loses it's deterring power, don't you think?

 

As to the subject in hand: The main problem with the NHS is the lack of capable staff. Now that the very capable EU nurses have been chased off very effectively, back to the mainland they went, and any financial inducement for British girls to become a nurse has long ago just as effectively been cut off, you're in a bit of a bind, I'm afraid. Smiling Phillipina girls are equally not as enthusiastic to join the English nurse front anymore either, due to better prospects elsewhere.

You'll just have to go it alone, then, I'm afraid. Tally Ho!

Most of the pinay girls are not genuinely qualified and those who are "real nurses" need retraining to be up to the British Std.

Simply you need to recruit and train new nurses by offering a better and attractive salaries.My ex was getting £3200.00/a year, back in 1981 while undergoing studies and training as  a SRN.Patheti but there were young recruits then.

[Chomper Higgot]

14 minutes ago, mickymouse1 said:

I take some of these expected shortages in medicine and other supplies even staff as opportunities for the UK to expand its pharmaceutical industry as well as for the NHS to recruit and train more Doctors and nurses etc...It is high time to start producing more without restriction or imposed quotas and EXPAND THE ECONOMY.

Have you any idea how long it takes to ‘expand’ a pharmaceutical business.

 

If you had you’d not need reminding of the horrors of ‘validation’.

[samran]

1 hour ago, Laughing Gravy said:

Tell me where have I said about shiny trade deals????

 

You have obviously just gatecrashed these threads as those that follow them will know, I am what is called a hard brexiteer now. It use to be a leave voter but a term used by remainers who can't accept the Referendum result.

 

I don't care about deals and as you should know, none can be done until we leave the EU. We haven't left yet.

 

So answer the first line and I will reply. I have a feeling it will be a long time though.

Ah, gatecrashing! That is a new one. Am I not supposed to be here? Please explain why that is? Talk about arrogance.

 

As for the mention trade deals. I'm sorry I didn't mean to imply you had mentioned them. Its pretty clear you have no clue nor care for what comes next.

Edited February 26, 2019 by samran

[Laughing Gravy]

4 minutes ago, samran said:

Ah, gatecrashing! That is a new one. Am I not supposed to be here? Please explain why that is? Talk about arrogance.

 

As for the mention trade deals. I'm sorry I didn't mean to imply you had mentioned them. Its pretty clear you have no clue nor care for what comes next.

So from your post it is clear that you don't know my views as I have been a very prominent poster ion this subject before the referendum. I have never stated that you are not supposed to be here,. if I have I look forward to seeing that.

 

That's OK as you say you didn't mean to imply I had mentioned trade deals. We agree on that point.

 

As for what comes next. I am as clear as anyone else here. I have opinions but no crystal ball. Of course I care what comes next. I would say you are presuming a lot from me without anything to support it.

 

But if you are relating to the project fear, from everything to no food to the sky turning green, I have heard it before, so I am skeptical.

[samran]

2 hours ago, Laughing Gravy said:

You have obviously just gatecrashed these threads....

Gatecrashing: " enter (a party or other gathering) without an invitation "

14 minutes ago, Laughing Gravy said:

 I have never stated that you are not supposed to be here.

 

clearly.... #hashtag #coffeedrinkingemoji.

Edited February 26, 2019 by samran

[damascase]

7 hours ago, Laughing Gravy said:

It is project fear.

Another left wing lecturer no doubt.  I would love to know if he or his department get to benefit for writing this. Funding by any chance.

Any arguments concerning the message, or is shooting the messenger sufficient?

[Baerboxer]

7 hours ago, Laughing Gravy said:

It is project fear.

Another left wing lecturer no doubt.  I would love to know if he or his department get to benefit for writing this. Funding by any chance.

 

Yeah right. All be wonderful thanks to all that money Boris and Farage promised will be pumped into the NHS after Brexit.

 

The real issue with the NHS is the chronic mismanagement by a vastly too large non medical management who suck out too much money on salary packages, are inefficient and ineffective, and worst still are unaccountable for performance. 

 

But supply chains for medicines, equipment, consumables and labor will be affected for sure. Too what extent will depend on the expertise of their procurement teams - which to date as not exactly even been average. 

 

Expect lots of useless statistics showing how good things are whilst a plethora of patients complaints emerges.

[Baerboxer]

1 hour ago, mickymouse1 said:

I take some of these expected shortages in medicine and other supplies even staff as opportunities for the UK to expand its pharmaceutical industry as well as for the NHS to recruit and train more Doctors and nurses etc...It is high time to start producing more without restriction or imposed quotas and EXPAND THE ECONOMY.

 

Dream on!

 

You think a pharmaceutical industry can spring up overnight with replacement drugs and medicines - just like that!

And you think they'll be queues of eager recruits - with the intelligence levels and skill aptitudes necessary - just like that!

 

Brexiters - the Tommy Cooper of reality. All problems solved - just like that! Once we leave the EU!

[samran]

1 hour ago, mickymouse1 said:

I take some of these expected shortages in medicine and other supplies even staff as opportunities for the UK to expand its pharmaceutical industry as well as for the NHS to recruit and train more Doctors and nurses etc...It is high time to start producing more without restriction or imposed quotas and EXPAND THE ECONOMY.

Yeah, cause training doctors and nurses was somehow being restricted by those evil people in Brussels! 

[Baerboxer]

1 hour ago, champers said:

The only way to improve funding for the NHS is by increasing taxes.

Labour will increase taxes but won't put it in their manifesto.

The Tories will increase taxes but will say in their manifesto that they will cut taxes.

The LibDems will increase taxes and will say so in their manifesto. Nobody will vote them in.

 

Improving funding won't necessarily improve the NHS. It simply gives a bigger pot to be mismanaged.

[phil2407]

If you're a UK citizen and paid your NI even though abroad that entitles you to free NHS treatment and goes towards your pension (if it exists then) 

 

[Snow Leopard]

Why can't we just simply import these medicines from non-EU countries? Jesus what nonsense. 

[Loiner]

Ramping up Project Fear again for the benefit of the MPs as we near another amendment vote.
Some will lap it up as reinforcement of their Remain agendas. Others will swing towards accepting Theresa’s deal.
A LIB Remainer was on the radio yesterday also trying to forecast disaster for the NHS in case of a 70 second delay for isotopes delivery. Lol Some of them actually believe each other!


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[joecoolfrog]

10 hours ago, Laughing Gravy said:

It is project fear.

Another left wing lecturer no doubt.  I would love to know if he or his department get to benefit for writing this. Funding by any chance.

This ' project fear ' nonsense has become as tedious as Trump's cries of ' fake ' news whenever a fact emerges that he dislikes.

Farage said that leaving with a good deal would be easy , some of us said that the EU would squeeze the UK hard as a lesson for others. 

We were right , not a case of project fear , simply unbiased common sense.

[bomber]

11 hours ago, samran said:

And blue passports. Don’t forget the blue passports...

 

As for the trade deals. They have to leave the EU first. Then people will be queueing up around the block to sign them the very next day. Promise!

palastine,iran,chile,botswana and iceland,now what worthwhile products does the uk produce to sell to these nothing nations.

[bomber]

8 hours ago, TopDeadSenter said:

Well you read some right old rubbish on the internet. How on earth would stopping the flow of freeloading foreigners coming to the UK to avail themselves of our free healthcare harm the NHS? If anything it will help to save our NHS if it goes back to treating Brits like it was designed to do. 

iam sure benidorm,magaluf,malia,malaga hospitals look like liverpool and sunderland general hospitals over the summer months and even the winter months,but iam sure you dont understand.

[bomber]

8 hours ago, simple1 said:

Really?

 

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-45112872

no wonder the BoE predicted inflation would surge,lots of products to cost a lot more and then add on another 10% due to the pound taking a hit,would sent the UK into recession in 6-12 months even before all the big companies moved out,anyone who thinks different needs help.

[sawadee1947]

This is not true. Fake story. 

Ask Nigel Farage. 

He promised all saved money will go to NHS. 

Or is this a lie? 

[Loiner]

4 minutes ago, sawadee1947 said:

This is not true. Fake story. 

Ask Nigel Farage. 

He promised all saved money will go to NHS. 

Or is this a lie? 

Yep, a lie. He didn't promise that.

[Jaggg88]

Brexit experts? How do you become an expert on this subject? Is there a degree course based on examples of the previous Brexits? So far so-called experts have all got their sums wrong - Governor of the Bank of England, IMF etc. So what makes these quacks think they're experts? Nobody is an expert in this subject but I do know brinksmanship negotiating is being undermined by these so-called experts.

The pound has hit a 21 month high against the euro and trading at its highest level against the US dollar since October 2018. mmmm funny old game investing - wonder why the investors don't think it all going wrong. You'd think they would be ditching the GBP.

Edited February 26, 2019 by Jaggg88

[nontabury]

19 hours ago, RuamRudy said:

I am not sure what papers you read, but our health professionals have been protesting loudly for years about successive governments' disdain for the NHS. The experts have been very vocal. 

 

I,ve always been very proud of our NHS. And during my 20yrs in Thailand my pride only became  greater, comparing the madical care available in Thailand, be they the so called international hospital or the state hospitals against those ran by our NHS. Now back in the U.K my eyes have been opened, and I have to tell you with great sorrow, that the NHS is in a complete mess.

 Speaking with a consultant last month, he admitted that the service has become top heavy with over paid Bureaucrats, who are stifling the efficiency of the NHS with petty red tape.

 Is the answer to privatize or semi privatize the NHS I do not know, but something certainly needs to be done, and I don’t mean throwing more money at it.

 Anyway slightly of topic, but with a medical slant, a poster from home.

 

 

 

 

 

[nontabury]

14 hours ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Have you any idea how long it takes to ‘expand’ a pharmaceutical business.

 

If you had you’d not need reminding of the horrors of ‘validation’.

We could have started 2 and a 1/2 years ago,but unfortunately we were burdened with a P.M who is a remainer intent on overturning the people’s vote.

[thaibeachlovers]

22 hours ago, webfact said:

It found that one major problem from Brexit under all scenarios would be staff recruitment and retention - in part because few provisions have been made for immigration of health workers to the UK or for long-term recognition of professional qualifications.

IMO that is rubbish. When I worked in the NHS 10 years ago, they were recruiting large numbers of Filipinos and Africans to work in my hospital ( I assume also every other hospital ), none of which are from the EU. I don't remember any workers from the continent.

If they can't retain staff, that is down to the NHS management which were appalling when I worked in it. Pay and conditions were rubbish as well.

I have no idea what they mean by "long-term recognition of professional qualifications."

[thaibeachlovers]

16 minutes ago, nontabury said:

Speaking with a consultant last month, he admitted that the service has become top heavy with over paid Bureaucrats, who are stifling the efficiency of the NHS with petty red tape.

10 years ago, management were more concerned with building impressive buildings and little empires than they were with patient care. I had a major operation, so I saw at first hand how terrible the care is. Also, the wards were filthy.

After Brown wasted 6 billion quid on the NHS, they used it to create 2 new middle management places in my hospital department, neither of which were needed.

[Bullie]

14 hours ago, Snow Leopard said:

Why can't we just simply import these medicines from non-EU countries? Jesus what nonsense. 

Well, that will not only take quite a while to set up (nothing has been done yet in that respect), deals with 

pharmaceutical firms will have to be struck. So expect patients dying unneeded for quite a while yet after brexit, and be prepared to pay triple the previous price of the drugs. These companies are there to make money, and once they have you over a barrel.... Well, you know what happens next, don't you?

[soalbundy]

19 hours ago, Laughing Gravy said:

Have you forgotten the 'project fear from George Osborne and how he was proved wrong?

 

As for the EU has failings I am glad you see that but I disagree with its the best we have. We haven't had a chance to be independent of the EU and the EU don't want to give us that chance.

We were independent before we joined, if we were doing so well why did we ? Britain is better of now than before Brexit. How has Osborne been proved wrong, we haven't left yet, armageddon is still waiting in the wings. 

[Bullie]

2 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

IMO that is rubbish. When I worked in the NHS 10 years ago, they were recruiting large numbers of Filipinos and Africans to work in my hospital ( I assume also every other hospital ), none of which are from the EU. I don't remember any workers from the continent.

If they can't retain staff, that is down to the NHS management which were appalling when I worked in it. Pay and conditions were rubbish as well.

I have no idea what they mean by "long-term recognition of professional qualifications."

"I remember no workers from the continent'". That's because your working days were apparently over, 10 years ago.

In 2016, 6,382 fully qualified EU nurses entered Britain, followed by a staggering 9,389 in 2017. All this due to the fact that the british government decided not to pay for the education of british nurses, it was cheaper to have them educated at EU cost in Europe, and then have them come to britain.

Now, they are leaving in their droves: 4000 last year, 2019 will probably be worse, and there are only 800 new applications this year from EU nurses that want to come to England.

 

As to Non-EU recruitement: pay peanuts, get monkeys.

 

And you have your own government to thank for it.

Edited February 27, 2019 by Bullie

[soalbundy]

2 hours ago, nontabury said:

We could have started 2 and a 1/2 years ago,but unfortunately we were burdened with a P.M who is a remainer intent on overturning the people’s vote.

Never overestimate the wisdom of a people who are addicted to 'East Enders' and 'Love Island' and whose favourate past time seems to be getting completely drunk and drugged up over the weekend. Their information comes from the Daily Mirror, the Sun and the Daily Express, what do you expect.