Royal Thia Embassy Divorce Hk Vaild Or Not

[yorkieb]

Dear Forum

My fiancee and I are flying to BKK in a week to marry in BKK and apply for a spouse visa. Yes she is with me in the UK now and I know that seem back to front, but for our background please read RADWAN v RADWAN in a previous topic.

Well our only option now as I have said is to marry in Bkk. We believe from the Royal Thai embassy in HK( where her previous divorce was obtained, originaly married in Thailand) and from legal advice in Bkk that her thai divorce is in acordance with Thai law and therefore she is free to marry in Thailand. I am 100% free to marry.

My question is, ok we marry in Thailand in the correct way and interms of Thai law we are 100% married. But when we go to the embassy my fear is that a cenario may occur. Will the case officer take a view that we cant enter the UK because her divorce was not caperble of recognition in the UK due to the fact that it was obtained in the Thai embassy in HK and therefore if so she could not be seen as available in the UK to marry and therefore contradicts valid issue of a spouse visa ot enter the UK. Irrespective of the fact we are validly married in thailand.

My hope is that after the Thai marriage is valid it anulls any previous divorce issues and an Amphur marraige is without question.

Any help on this technicality would be appreciated

Yorkie

[the scouser]

If you simply marry in Thailand without addressing the dodgy divorce at the Thai embassy in Hong Kong, the core issue will still remain, and it is more than likely that the British embassy will refuse a spouse visa on the basis that they don't accept that your wife was free to marry, therefore the marriage is not valid.

However, perhaps speak to a Thai lawyer once you get to Thailand.

Scouse.

[yorkieb]

If you simply marry in Thailand without addressing the dodgy divorce at the Thai embassy in Hong Kong, the core issue will still remain, and it is more than likely that the British embassy will refuse a spouse visa on the basis that they don't accept that your wife was free to marry, therefore the marriage is not valid.

However, perhaps speak to a Thai lawyer once you get to Thailand.

Scouse.

Hi, Scouser

Thanks for the info. The dodgy divorce you refer to is 100% legit in thai law we have checked this. does that make any difference do you think

yorkie

[yorkieb]

If you simply marry in Thailand without addressing the dodgy divorce at the Thai embassy in Hong Kong, the core issue will still remain, and it is more than likely that the British embassy will refuse a spouse visa on the basis that they don't accept that your wife was free to marry, therefore the marriage is not valid.

However, perhaps speak to a Thai lawyer once you get to Thailand.

Scouse.

Advice from Thai lawyer...... what do you think... is the core iss still the same

Yorkie

Re: Marriage Advice

Dear XXXXXXXXX

We contacted the registrar of the District Office on 2 March 07 to determine if they would certify the divorce certificate. The registrar informed us that if the divorce certificate is issued from the Thai Embassy in Hong Kong is divorce it is consistent with Thai Law and the divorce would not be certified by the Thai registrar in Thailand again.

The Thai Embassy in Hong Kong may have sent the details of the divorce to the District Office within Thailand and we may be able to request a copy of the divorce record from the registrar in Thailand. The copy would normally be certified by the registrar. However, it probably would need be deemed to be a new “order” of divorce originating in Thailand for your purposes.

Your best alternative appears to be to marry your fiancée in Thailand because your divorce appears consistent with Thai Law.

We can also request a copy of the divorce certificate in Thailand that shows the Thai stamp certification. You may be able to use this with the British authorities but we cannot guarantee that the Hong Kong Embassy has sent the records back or that this procedure would work.

We looking forward to hearing from you again.

Best Regards,

XXXXXXXXX

(Attorney at Law)

[yorkieb]

Oh one more thing all the papers were correctly sent to the district office in Chombri some 4 years ago and embassy in HK als confirm divorce was completed correctly.

Therefore isnt she single and able to go forward with aclean sheet. I could accept possible if the marriage was originally in UK or HK embassy but it was not it was in Chambri amphur office in Thailand????????

Yorkie

[the scouser]

Yorkie,

What did your UK brief say? I ask this because it doesn't really matter a jot whether the divorce is acceptable in Thailand, it's a question of whether it's recognised in the U.K. The GRO has already stated that it's not recognised and unless you tackle that root issue, it'll still be invalid. Any new marriage which is based on the embassy divorce is going to be on a shaky UK legal footing.

Scouse.

[yorkieb]

Yorkie,

What did your UK brief say? I ask this because it doesn't really matter a jot whether the divorce is acceptable in Thailand, it's a question of whether it's recognised in the U.K. The GRO has already stated that it's not recognised and unless you tackle that root issue, it'll still be invalid. Any new marriage which is based on the embassy divorce is going to be on a shaky UK legal footing.

Scouse.

Hi, Scouse.

Thank for your view. Uk brief is not expert in affairs of the BKK embassy unfortunatly.

However after talking with my GF over the weekend she has highlighted her fears to me that she feels the embassy would rather us come back and try to marry in BKK and apply the spouse visa. In the email we got from the embassy previously it stated that it was not their fault that the fiancee visa was issued but her responsibility to produce correct papers. She is fearfull that they may now feel that she has embarassingly managed to deceive them. So going back through their process will give them the opportunity to refuse her over the shakky embassy paper and cancel out thier mistake. Maybe a bit paranoid in my view but its her country and she probably knows better than me..

So to my question if we apply FLR(O) in the UK. The advice is decision in 24hrs in person if straight forward case (I guess this isnt us). 4 weeks 70% 13 weeks 90%. However my GF would like to go back to see her family end of march early April. She has to go out and come in again before 20 April as TB cert expires. Is it ok to apply FLR(O) in the last 2 weeks of her valid visa. And what happens if they take 4 weeks and her visa and TB has expired. We are going to initiate new divorse proceedings on 8th March (5 years after original div paper as ex-husband cant legaly object) and detail this in the FLR(O). Should we try extemd now and take the chance that she will get a decision in time to go back and see her family b4 TB up. And would this look better.

Your advise on what we should do and in which order would be appreciated.

Yorkie

[GU22]

Uk brief is not expert in affairs of the BKK embassy unfortunatly.

No, but hopefully s/he is an expert in UK law and so should be able to tell you whether a marriage in Thailand would be recognised under UK law!

As I see it, the divorce is not valid under UK law because it is not valid in the country where it took place, Hong Kong.

However, it is valid in Thailand and so she can marry in Thailand, and that marriage would be valid under Thai law.

Under the Foreign Marriages Act, any marriage that is valid in the country where it took place is also valid in the UK.

Therefore, if she were to marry you in Thailand that marriage would be valid under Thai law and so would also be valid under UK law, so she could apply for, and should receive, a spouse visa to the UK.

However, this is only my reading on the matter and I am not a qualified lawyer.

I strongly advise you to get an opinion from a suitably qualified lawyer in the UK before proceeding any further.

If she applies to extend her fiance visa whilst you try to sort this out, then don't worry if her current visa expires before the decision is received as it will automatically be extended until the decision is made.

She should not need a new TB certificate, as this is only required with the initial application. However, if you were to marry in Thailand and apply for a spouse visa they may require a new one. I would check with the embassy.

Edited March 5, 2007 by GU22

[yorkieb]

Thanks GU22

I guess this is kind of my take on the recognition of a Thai marriage based on the HK divorce paper. I have put this directly to the Entry clearance manager at the Bkk Embassy and am awaiting a reply. If we get a reply confirming this then I guess we will have the confidence to travel.... Scouse seems to think we are still on doggy ground and from reading this forum I have a huge amount of respect for his opinion but I guess I kind of follow you logic through the issue of is a Thai marriage valid in our case. I can see his point however, that the embassy would think the divorce was not recognised in HK in there eyes. But what the hel_l. we are not getting married in their juristdiction and would be getting married in a juristdiction where it is. In internation law due to some hague convention in 1978 states that if it meets the countrys criteria and is processed correctly them it is valid and i believe th Uk signed up to this.

Will keep u updated when I hopefully get a reply from the embassy but in mean time thanks for you advise.

Yorkieb

[the scouser]

Likewise, I will add that I am no expert on divorce, and what I've written here amounts to my own thoughts, so do take the advice of someone better qualified in such matters.

All the best,

Scouse.