Do you believe in God and why

[sunnyboy2018]

17 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

You do not appear to believe in the existence of "God", so how can you believe in hell?

Hell can't exist unless there is a heaven, and for there to be a heaven there has to be "God".

Who said that the god in the Bible is the only depiction of the creator?

"God" can appear in many forms.

Jesus said "there are many rooms in my father's house".

Just cos Jesus was Mexican does not mean he's always right about everything! Maybe he was robbing the house!

Edited October 24, 2019 by sunnyboy2018

[sunnyboy2018]

8 hours ago, frantick said:

@CMNightRider, you continue to bring up DNA in your posts.  So, assuming the possibility of 'intelligent design', what makes you think, and what proof do you have, that the 'God' of the Bible is the 'God' that created life; ie DNA?

 

I can't believe my sweet little Thai friend is going to rot in hell...

Better than living in heaven with muslims and evangelical bigots

[thaibeachlovers]

1 minute ago, sunnyboy2018 said:

Better than living in heaven with muslims and evangelical bigots

What are you smoking? It must be pretty good stuff!

[stevemac]

I'm certainly not trying to convince you of anything. 
Some posters on here are so outraged that anyone would believe in something they don't believe in that there are 209 pages of their outrage. I was answering the OP, which is "do I believe" and I do, but whether any others do or not is irrelevant to me except I'm a bit bemused that others would spend so much energy trying to convince me that I'm wrong when they can't prove anything related to God. Simple reason for that is that "God" is unproveable.
It even makes me chuckle that anyone thinks they can prove that something capable of making life, the universe and everything has to conform to whatever they think "God" is. WE know nothing, Jon Snow.

People are not necessarily trying to prove YOU wrong, but stating why they think the things you believe in are not right for THEM. A subtle difference. Dont think it's about (convincing) you.
It's all opinion, and I respect yours, even if I choose not to believe it.

Sent from my SM-G965F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[Tagged]

1 hour ago, thaibeachlovers said:

You do not appear to believe in the existence of "God", so how can you believe in hell?

Hell can't exist unless there is a heaven, and for there to be a heaven there has to be "God".

Who said that the god in the Bible is the only depiction of the creator?

"God" can appear in many forms.

Jesus said "there are many rooms in my father's house".

Earth is heaven and hell, it is just a matter of time place and life cyclus where you are at the time of being, and where you are at your life. 

 

 

[yodsak]

didn't upload

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited October 25, 2019 by yodsak

[yodsak]

 

On 10/12/2019 at 12:20 PM, canuckamuck said:

For a creator God to exist, he would need some extraordinary abilities.

Millions of people believe he has.  

           

A 3000 year old book, written by people that knew nothing about the universe vs modern science. Quite a few discrepancies.

 

 

 

 

 

[CMNightRider]

12 hours ago, frantick said:

@CMNightRider, you continue to bring up DNA in your posts.  So, assuming the possibility of 'intelligent design', what makes you think, and what proof do you have, that the 'God' of the Bible is the 'God' that created life; ie DNA?

 

I can't believe my sweet little Thai friend is going to rot in hell...

If you were to take time to read the Bible and research what it says, you will be able to answer your own question.  After reading the Bible, the only logical conclusion one could possibly come to "is God of the Bible, is the God that created life."  "John 3:16 For God so loved the world, He gave his only begotten Son, whosoever believeth in Him should not perish, but have everlasting life." 

[WhatupThailand]

On 10/23/2019 at 1:44 PM, giddyup said:

Possible isn't a fact.

Fact is, Anything you can think of is possible.

But You can not think of the Impossible, because it does not exist, in any form.

So where do Ideas come from ?

Can you think of GOD ?

[VincentRJ]

5 hours ago, WhatupThailand said:

Fact is, Anything you can think of is possible.

But You can not think of the Impossible, because it does not exist, in any form.

So where do Ideas come from ?

Can you think of GOD ?

Everything we experience and think about involves the reception of stimuli from one or more of the five senses of sight, hearing, smell, taste and touch. Such stimuli are processed and interpreted by the brain.

 

All ideas, works of literature, scientific theories, conceptions of a Creator God, are products of the human mind, and such products have proliferated and become more sophisticated over time as a result of the human capacity to develop a spoken language, and later a written text.

 

The main issue that should concern us, is how our theories and interpretations from our five senses, fit with reality, and that's not just an issue addressed by modern science, but a basic issue that all creatures address at some level in order to survive. A particular type of plant or berry might appear very attractive, but also might be deadly poisonous. This reality has to be learned by all creatures, including humans, if they are to survive.

 

It's quite understandable that people in ancient civilizations who observed the sun rising on one side of the horizon, in early morning, then observed it traveling slowly across the sky to disappear on the opposite side of the horizon, at sunset, would assume that the sun revolved around the Earth. That's the obvious explanation.
Likewise, during night time, the stars would be observed to move slowly across the sky. Is it any wonder that the theory of Geocentrism, that the sun and the stars revolved around the Earth, prevailed for thousands of years, until the development of the Methodology of Science took place, and later the development of the telescope.

 

However, the idea that the Earth revolved around the sun and that the Earth also rotated as it encircled the sun, producing the illusion that the sun revolved around the Earth every 24 hours, existed long before this theory was confirmed by astronomers and mathematicians such as Copernicus, Kepler, and Galileo.

 

The rotating Earth theory was proposed at least from the 4th century BC by followers of Pythagoras, and a fully developed heliocentric model was developed by Aristarchus of Samos in the 3rd century BC.
Unfortunately, Aristotle did not accept this 'heliocentric' theory, and Aristotle was a very famous and brilliant philosopher, so it was thought by the Catholic church and others that he must be right. ☹️

 

This issue, and the forcing of Galileo by the Catholic Church to renounce his theories despite the soundness of his evidence, represents the problem with 'pure' faith and belief. Religious faith and belief do not require sound evidence, and can flourish in the absence of sound evidence. Evidence which tends to produce uncertainty, will naturally be either ignored or destroyed by those who perceive their faith as being under threat by the new evidence, such as evidence supporting the theory of evolution.

 

Religious Faith cannot accept doubt. That is the problem. Yet doubt, or Skepticism, is a fundamental requirement for scientific progress and the development of modern societies. If something works as predicted, then that's fine. One can have a degree of faith in it. When it fails to work as predicted, then one should examine the integrity of the product or process, and re-adjust one's faith.

 

[thaibeachlovers]

12 minutes ago, VincentRJ said:

This issue, and the forcing of Galileo by the Catholic Church to renounce his theories despite the soundness of his evidence, represents the problem with 'pure' faith and belief. Religious faith and belief do not require sound evidence, and can flourish in the absence of sound evidence.

You are confusing religion and faith. Religion is a human invention by men in funny hats to control the population and gain wealth and power.

Faith is something that one finds within, and that comes from "God", which is unprovable by human science which is as advanced in cosmic terms as the invention of fire by rubbing two sticks together was 50,000 years ago. We humans know nothing, but we are too arrogant to admit that we know nothing. We can't even cure cancer, or stop killing each other- a very primitive species indeed. If it were provable by mere human beings, an insignificant species living on an insignificant planet, "God' wouldn't be very powerful at all. Certainly not capable of creating life the universe and everything.

People are so arrogant they think they can actually "prove" that the creator does not exist. LOL.

[thaibeachlovers]

6 hours ago, WhatupThailand said:

Fact is, Anything you can think of is possible.

But You can not think of the Impossible, because it does not exist, in any form.

So where do Ideas come from ?

Can you think of GOD ?

In the beginning, life was as advanced as a cow, then somehow humans just "happened" to develop a big brain with the capacity to love, hate, create, think about the meaning of life. An accident, or something designed? Up to you.

[yodsak]

On 10/20/2019 at 11:17 AM, CMNightRider said:

There is overwhelming evidence for the existence of Jesus Christ,

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[thaibeachlovers]

On 10/25/2019 at 2:00 PM, yodsak said:

A 3000 year old book, written by people that knew nothing about the universe vs modern science. Quite a few discrepancies.

A book written by men in funny hats that desired a way to persuade the populace that they should be in charge.

Doesn't matter if it was correct or not. All it had to do was convince the peasants that they should support the men in funny hats. Apparently they did, and the men in funny hats prospered and grew wealthy and well fed. Job done.

[thaibeachlovers]

5 minutes ago, yodsak said:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

If people only believed in "God" because it was provable, their faith would be meaningless. The entire point of "faith" is believing without "proof".

We have a new religion now, with the believers claiming that we HAVE to believe because the prophets of the new religion say it is so, even though they haven't actually proven anything much.

The new religion- climate change.

[thaibeachlovers]

On 10/25/2019 at 12:22 PM, stevemac said:

People are not necessarily trying to prove YOU wrong, but stating why they think the things you believe in are not right for THEM. A subtle difference. Dont think it's about (convincing) you.
It's all opinion, and I respect yours, even if I choose not to believe it.

Sent from my SM-G965F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app
 

Thank you. I respect your opinion too, even if I choose not to believe it.

No one is forcing anyone to believe, so I find it astonishing that there are now 212 pages of posters trying to convince me I'm wrong.

Were not for them, this thread would have died after about 10 pages.

[Tagged]

56 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

You are confusing religion and faith. Religion is a human invention by men in funny hats to control the population and gain wealth and power.

Faith is something that one finds within, and that comes from "God", which is unprovable by human science which is as advanced in cosmic terms as the invention of fire by rubbing two sticks together was 50,000 years ago. We humans know nothing, but we are too arrogant to admit that we know nothing. We can't even cure cancer, or stop killing each other- a very primitive species indeed. If it were provable by mere human beings, an insignificant species living on an insignificant planet, "God' wouldn't be very powerful at all. Certainly not capable of creating life the universe and everything.

People are so arrogant they think they can actually "prove" that the creator does not exist. LOL.

It is not arrogant to stand up to foolish beliefs, it might arrogant to dismiss god, but dismiss peoples beliefs and faith until proven is not arrogant, it is sound and healthy for the peoples best. 

 

God have to, and should prove himself. The earth the nature, and the physics do every day, and maybe we should pay more attention to what we do to this planet, and how rubbish our mindsets are to aknownledge the nature as our god. Without our nature and the nature we are apart of, we are nothing. 

Edited October 29, 2019 by Tagged

[thaibeachlovers]

2 hours ago, Tagged said:

It is not arrogant to stand up to foolish beliefs, it might arrogant to dismiss god, but dismiss peoples beliefs and faith until proven is not arrogant, it is sound and healthy for the peoples best. 

 

God have to, and should prove himself. The earth the nature, and the physics do every day, and maybe we should pay more attention to what we do to this planet, and how rubbish our mindsets are to aknownledge the nature as our god. Without our nature and the nature we are apart of, we are nothing. 

Seems all we do is allow foolish beliefs in this brave new world- the belief that climate can be changed by building some windmills, imposing taxes and using electric cars powered by polluting batteries is IMO as barmy as they come, yet a lot of people  believe we can.

 

God doesn't have to do anything. Why should the creator have to "prove" his/ her/its existence to a primitive people that can't even cure cancer?

 

Without our nature and the nature we are apart of, we are nothing. 

Indeed, and if a decent sized asteroid happens to strike earth, we will be nothing.

 

 

[Tagged]

1 hour ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Seems all we do is allow foolish beliefs in this brave new world- the belief that climate can be changed by building some windmills, imposing taxes and using electric cars powered by polluting batteries is IMO as barmy as they come, yet a lot of people  believe we can.

 

God doesn't have to do anything. Why should the creator have to "prove" his/ her/its existence to a primitive people that can't even cure cancer?

 

Without our nature and the nature we are apart of, we are nothing. 

Indeed, and if a decent sized asteroid happens to strike earth, we will be nothing.

 

 

I aggree this climate change hysteria brings alot on table that reminds me of our scripts where our religion is based on. Same same manifistation, and same methods to bring us in to believ. 

 

However we can not dismiss humans as an factor in what happening right now, but the methods used, Im all in for some debate, same as I would never dismiss a god, but Im dismissing the tora, bible, and koran as the truth. 

[VincentRJ]

5 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

You are confusing religion and faith. Religion is a human invention by men in funny hats to control the population and gain wealth and power.

Faith is something that one finds within, and that comes from "God", which is unprovable by human science which is as advanced in cosmic terms as the invention of fire by rubbing two sticks together was 50,000 years ago. We humans know nothing, but we are too arrogant to admit that we know nothing. We can't even cure cancer, or stop killing each other- a very primitive species indeed. If it were provable by mere human beings, an insignificant species living on an insignificant planet, "God' wouldn't be very powerful at all. Certainly not capable of creating life the universe and everything.

People are so arrogant they think they can actually "prove" that the creator does not exist. LOL.

I don't think I am confusing religion with faith. As with most common words, there is a spectrum of meaning depending on the context. Faith is commonly associated with religion, but not exclusively. Most people need a degree of faith in many aspects of their lives. An absence of any degree of faith in anything and everything would result in extreme anxiety.

 

Whenever I drive my car, I have a reasonable degree of faith that I will not have an accident. But this is not an absolute or complete faith. I'm aware that there is always a risk, and do my best to reduce that risk by driving carefully. Synonyms of 'faith' are 'belief' and 'trust'.

 

Here are some examples of dictionary definitions of 'faith'.
1. Complete trust or confidence in someone or something.
2. A high degree of trust or confidence in something or someone
2. Strong belief in the doctrines of a religion, based on spiritual conviction rather than proof.

 

Faith is something that one finds within...

 

Every idea, thought and experience always comes from within. There are usually external factors which initially stimulate our thoughts, experiences and sensations, through the 5 senses, but the interpretation and emotional response to those external stimuli are always from within, without exception.

 

For example, we describe most types of grass and leaves as having the colour green, as though the greenness is a property of the grass or leaf. The truth is, leaves have no colour. The colour of any object we look at, or perceive through our sense of sight, is purely an experience in the human mind or brain. It is an experience or sensation from within, as is everything we think, smell, taste, see, hear and feel.

 

Even the Buddha realized this, 2500 years ago. ????

[CMNightRider]

10 hours ago, yodsak said:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Whatever the reasons why people reject Jesus Christ, their rejection has disastrous eternal consequences. “There is no other name under heaven given to men by which we must be saved” than the name of Jesus (Acts 4:12), and those who reject Him, for whatever reason, face an eternity in the “outer darkness” of hell where there will be “weeping and gnashing of teeth” (Matthew 25:30).
 

[CMNightRider]

Some people do not think they need a savior. These people consider themselves to be “basically good” and do not realize that they, like all people, are sinners who cannot come to God on their own terms. But Jesus said, “I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me” (John 14:6). Those who reject Christ will not be able to stand before God and successfully plead their own case on their own merits.
 

[frantick]

14 minutes ago, CMNightRider said:

Some people do not think they need a savior. These people consider themselves to be “basically good” and do not realize that they, like all people, are sinners who cannot come to God on their own terms. But Jesus said, “I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me” (John 14:6). Those who reject Christ will not be able to stand before God and successfully plead their own case on their own merits.
 

Some people have a savior, consider themselves to be forgiven because they believe, and do not realize that many of the "basically good" people sin much less and cause much less grief to others than themselves. Oh, I forgot, no ranking on sins. To me, repentance is more important than belief; thus I can not sign on with those who believe the opposite.

 

I've read your book.  Didn't do anything for me, even though 'he' said it would. I assume you'll say my heart was in the wrong place. Seek, and didn't find. 

[WhatupThailand]

6 hours ago, frantick said:

Some people have a savior, consider themselves to be forgiven because they believe, and do not realize that many of the "basically good" people sin much less and cause much less grief to others than themselves. Oh, I forgot, no ranking on sins. To me, repentance is more important than belief; thus I can not sign on with those who believe the opposite.

 

I've read your book.  Didn't do anything for me, even though 'he' said it would. I assume you'll say my heart was in the wrong place. Seek, and didn't find. 

You Read what Book ?

Which "He" do you refer to ?

 

Sorry but you are too vague to be believed.

 

[canuckamuck]

8 hours ago, frantick said:

Some people have a savior, consider themselves to be forgiven because they believe, and do not realize that many of the "basically good" people sin much less and cause much less grief to others than themselves. Oh, I forgot, no ranking on sins. To me, repentance is more important than belief; thus I can not sign on with those who believe the opposite.

 

I've read your book.  Didn't do anything for me, even though 'he' said it would. I assume you'll say my heart was in the wrong place. Seek, and didn't find. 

You say repentance is more important than belief, the Bible would suggest that repentance and belief are intrinsically connected.

Belief without repentance is not belief at all. 

But I do agree that repentance without belief is possible. And, that it is better than belief without repentance because the repentance is a recognition of a moral absolute. 

[frantick]

15 hours ago, canuckamuck said:

...

Belief without repentance is not belief at all. 

...

I agree, but have found many JF's that spout the "everyone sins, but I am forgiven" attitude while doing some real nasty things; some done to me, some done to others.

 

I've also met some very nice JF's, and @CMNightRider may be one of them, and you can tell that they are very good people and practice being good as much as the belief.

[frantick]

17 hours ago, WhatupThailand said:

You Read what Book ?

Which "He" do you refer to ?

 

Sorry but you are too vague to be believed.

 

"Bible"

"God"

[thaibeachlovers]

On 10/29/2019 at 10:29 PM, VincentRJ said:

I don't think I am confusing religion with faith. As with most common words, there is a spectrum of meaning depending on the context. Faith is commonly associated with religion, but not exclusively. Most people need a degree of faith in many aspects of their lives. An absence of any degree of faith in anything and everything would result in extreme anxiety.

 

Whenever I drive my car, I have a reasonable degree of faith that I will not have an accident. But this is not an absolute or complete faith. I'm aware that there is always a risk, and do my best to reduce that risk by driving carefully. Synonyms of 'faith' are 'belief' and 'trust'.

 

Here are some examples of dictionary definitions of 'faith'.
1. Complete trust or confidence in someone or something.
2. A high degree of trust or confidence in something or someone
2. Strong belief in the doctrines of a religion, based on spiritual conviction rather than proof.

 

 

 

 

Every idea, thought and experience always comes from within. There are usually external factors which initially stimulate our thoughts, experiences and sensations, through the 5 senses, but the interpretation and emotional response to those external stimuli are always from within, without exception.

 

For example, we describe most types of grass and leaves as having the colour green, as though the greenness is a property of the grass or leaf. The truth is, leaves have no colour. The colour of any object we look at, or perceive through our sense of sight, is purely an experience in the human mind or brain. It is an experience or sensation from within, as is everything we think, smell, taste, see, hear and feel.

 

Even the Buddha realized this, 2500 years ago. ????

I agree with most.

I use faith as evidence, FOR ME, that a creator exists, but one that is unprovable by such primitive means as humans possess. We know nothing, but some think we do.

 

We call grass green because we have the ability to think about such things, which IMO is god given ability. A cow does not think about grass- it just eats it because that is all it is capable of thinking.

Comes down to it, as we are animals and descendants of the same species as the apes originated from, how did we become able to understand concepts such as philosophy? If not for something that happened, we would be as intelligent as apes. That something, IMO, was "God".

Some apparently think it was just some fluke that we developed big brains, some great cosmic accident. Perhaps we are the only intelligent life in the universe, as no other planet had the same accident happen to a species, and on them the most intelligent life is a beetle.

 

The Buddha believed in Nirvana, did he not? Nirvana would not be possible without a creator, IMO. Perhaps Nirvana IS "God".

[thaibeachlovers]

On 10/30/2019 at 4:07 AM, frantick said:

I've read your book.  Didn't do anything for me, even though 'he' said it would. I assume you'll say my heart was in the wrong place. Seek, and didn't find. 

You read, but did not understand. The book only recorded what Jesus said. The answer is not in a book, it is in yourself.

[thaibeachlovers]

On 10/29/2019 at 10:29 PM, VincentRJ said:

Whenever I drive my car, I have a reasonable degree of faith that I will not have an accident.

I didn't in LOS. I always assumed I'd have an accident, given the way they drive. That I didn't usually I put down to dumb luck. They certainly did their best to kill me, several times.

When I had my accident I was hit by someone looking behind him, instead of where he was going.