rooster59 Posted May 18, 2019 Share Posted May 18, 2019 No sewing please, we're sex workers: Thai prostitutes battle stigma Rina Chandran CHIANG MAI, Thailand (Thomson Reuters Foundation) - A group of women sit around a table making dreamcatchers with colorful bits of yarn, chatting about their families, work and the thick smog enveloping Chiang Mai city in northern Thailand. Just another workplace scene, except the women are all sex workers who meet their clients at Can Do Bar, which they own as a collective, benefitting from health insurance, fixed hours and time off - which are typically denied to sex workers. The bar was set up in 2006 by Empower Foundation, a non-profit founded in Bangkok’s Patpong red-light district for sex workers who are still stigmatized despite widespread tolerance of Thailand’s thriving sex industry. Thousands of Thai and migrant sex workers have learned from Empower to negotiate with bar and massage parlor owners for better conditions, and to lobby the government to decriminalize their work to improve their incomes, safety and wellbeing. “People say we should stop doing what we do, and sew or bake cookies instead - but why are only those jobs considered appropriate?” said Mai Chanta, a 30-something native of Chiang Mai, who has been a sex worker for about eight years. “This is what we choose to do, and we feel a sense of pride and satisfaction that we are just like other workers,” said Mai, dressed in a calf-length skirt and a t-shirt that reads “United Sex Workers Nations”. Millions of women across the world choose sex work to make an income. Yet only a few countries - including Australia, New Zealand, Germany, the Netherlands, Senegal and Peru - recognize it as legal, leaving prostitutes elsewhere vulnerable to abuse. In Thailand - where stigma against sex work is deep-rooted as across much of Asia - prostitution is illegal and punishable by a fine of 1,000 baht ($32) and customers who pay for sex with underage workers can be jailed for up to six years. There are 123,530 sex workers in Thailand, according to a 2014 UNAIDS report. Advocacy groups put the figure at more than twice that number, including tens of thousands of migrants from neighboring Myanmar, Laos, Cambodia and Vietnam. RAIDS Thailand’s modern sex industry is believed to have been established with the setting up of Japanese military bases during World War II. It expanded quickly during the Vietnam War, when U.S. troops came to Bangkok for their recreation breaks. Over the years, the country has come to be known for sex tourism, with large numbers of male visitors frequenting bars, massage parlors and karaoke lounges that have multiplied as tourist numbers soared. Although prostitution has been illegal since 1960, the law is almost invariably ignored as the lucrative business provides pay-offs to untold numbers of officials and policemen. But sex workers in Thailand have struggled to grow a movement to demand their human, civil and labour rights, in the same way others did, from Canada to Australia, in the 1970s. Since a military government took charge in 2014, Thailand’s ubiquitous brothels have been hit by a spate of police raids as tourism authorities pledged to transform the country into a luxury destination for moneyed tourists. Increased global efforts to combat trafficking often provide a pretext to crack down on sex workers, human rights groups say. “Raid and rescue” operations by the police and charities often use laws related to migrant workers and trafficking to fine, detain, prosecute and deport sex workers, said Liz Hilton at Empower Foundation. “The authorities justify the raids saying there is trafficking, but most sex workers in Thailand are in it because it pays more than many other jobs that are accessible to them,” she told the Thomson Reuters Foundation. “These women have families to support; legalizing sex work would mean they can work with dignity, and without judgment or fear,” she said. The majority of sex workers are women, who can earn between two and 10 times the daily minimum wage - which is 325 baht in Bangkok - according to Empower Foundation. A government official said the raids are meant to check trafficking of migrants and underage prostitution and that authorities have provided sex workers with healthcare and vocational training. “We have discussed legalizing prostitution, but it is not an option, as we do not want to be seen as encouraging it,” said Pornsom Paopramot, inspector general at the social development ministry. “We want to send out the message that sex tourism is not something that we want to be known for. Legalising prostitution will not back that message,” she said. DEVIANT Legalising prostitution could reduce the stigma that sex workers are “deviant and immoral”, improve their work conditions and help combat trafficking, said Borislav Gerasimov, an expert with the Global Alliance Against Traffic in Women (GAATW). Thailand is a source, transit and destination country for trafficking, with an estimated 610,000 people living in conditions of modern slavery, according to the Global Slavery Index 2018 by charity Walk Free Foundation. The U.S. State Department recognized Thailand’s “significant efforts” to eliminate trafficking with a new task force, and more prosecutions and convictions, by upgrading it to Tier 2 in its latest Trafficking in Persons report. But while human trafficking is prevalent in industries such as fishing, the government’s pursuit of sex workers is keeping it from better protecting them, said Anna Olsen at the International Labour Organization (ILO) in Bangkok. “Trafficking for the purpose of sexual exploitation is a serious issue, but it is distinct from sex work,” she said. “The conflation of the two fails to recognize that working in the sex industry is a practical decision for many.” The general election in March saw several LGBT+ candidates promising to decriminalize sex work. The women at Can Do Bar are hopeful, said Ping Pong, a founder member of Empower Foundation. “When we started, we were told, ‘You are sex workers - you can’t get social security, you can’t get time off.’ But we did,” she said. “We are not going to sit around waiting for someone else to do things for us. There is a new government now, and we are ready to knock on the new labour minister’s door,” she said. ($1 = 31.5057 Thai baht) -- © Copyright Reuters 2019-05-19 Follow Thaivisa on LINE for breaking Thailand news and visa info Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ezzra Posted May 18, 2019 Share Posted May 18, 2019 Strange rehabilitation methods to allow the bar girls to own and operate a bar, so with this wisdom, will you advise a drug addicts to cultivate or produce their own cannabis and meth? of get alcoholics to set up a distillery as long as the keep good hours and the profits? strange indeed... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YetAnother Posted May 18, 2019 Share Posted May 18, 2019 47 minutes ago, rooster59 said: despite widespread tolerance of Thailand’s thriving sex industry. What is the problem, as natural and human is it gets Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AGareth2 Posted May 18, 2019 Share Posted May 18, 2019 1 hour ago, ezzra said: Strange rehabilitation methods to allow the bar girls to own and operate a bar, so with this wisdom, will you advise a drug addicts to cultivate or produce their own cannabis and meth? of get alcoholics to set up a distillery as long as the keep good hours and the profits? strange indeed... great idea when are you standing for PM? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prairieboy Posted May 19, 2019 Share Posted May 19, 2019 1 hour ago, rooster59 said: sex tourism is not something that we want to be known for. Too late - why else is the country flooded with male tourists from all corners of the globe? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BritManToo Posted May 19, 2019 Share Posted May 19, 2019 1 hour ago, rooster59 said: Thailand’s modern sex industry is believed to have been established with the setting up of Japanese military bases during World War II. It expanded quickly during the Vietnam War, when U.S. troops came to Bangkok for their recreation breaks. I believe there was a book from an 18th century explorer that mentions the sex scene in Siam. So don't blame the Japanese. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RotBenz8888 Posted May 19, 2019 Share Posted May 19, 2019 2 hours ago, rooster59 said: The majority of sex workers are women, who can earn between two and 10 times the daily minimum wage And no need to get up in the mornings, unless she's sleeping with an early riser....???? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongTang Posted May 19, 2019 Share Posted May 19, 2019 3 hours ago, ezzra said: Strange rehabilitation methods to allow the bar girls to own and operate a bar, so with this wisdom, will you advise a drug addicts to cultivate or produce their own cannabis and meth? of get alcoholics to set up a distillery as long as the keep good hours and the profits? strange indeed... What rubbish.. This was done to avoid them being exploited by the bar owners who gives them no health insurance and no resting days. And If you want to make an analogy with your drug addicts(Stupid as it is..), then how about Handing free an sterile needles.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongTang Posted May 19, 2019 Share Posted May 19, 2019 3 hours ago, rooster59 said: Millions of women across the world choose sex work to make an income. Yet only a few countries - including Australia, New Zealand, Germany, the Netherlands, Senegal and Peru - recognize it as legal, leaving prostitutes elsewhere vulnerable to abuse. Indeed one should praise these countries for not taking the Hypocritical stand of some Scandinavian, European and north American countries that force women to work in hidden and unsupervised places or migrate to much more dangerous countries. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
setbkk Posted May 19, 2019 Share Posted May 19, 2019 Interesting how UNAIDS claims 123,530 hookers, accurate to 4 significant figures as if they did a bar-by-bar, brothel-by-brothel census. Idiots. They would be more credible if they just said 100,000 with a large uncertainty. Amazing how "authorities" throughout Thailand can produce such drivel once they learned how to push buttons on a calculator. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jak2002003 Posted May 19, 2019 Share Posted May 19, 2019 22 minutes ago, LongTang said: Indeed one should praise these countries for not taking the Hypocritical stand of some Scandinavian, European and north American countries that force women to work in hidden and unsupervised places or migrate to much more dangerous countries. The women are 'forced' to do that job? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pilotman Posted May 19, 2019 Share Posted May 19, 2019 so let me get this inane report straight, "stigma against sex working is deep rooted", but "policemen and other officials ignore it", as do all the population who know what goes on and indeed, supply the girls. The girls go back home and buy farms and get married and if lucky, marry a farang, which is what the family hope will happen. The bars all do a roaring trade and the officials ignore it. So that stigma is not deep rooted at all is it? The only deep rooted thing about it is the hypocrisy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orton Rd Posted May 19, 2019 Share Posted May 19, 2019 They can earn between 650 baht and 3.250 baht a day? in the last century not this one, unless they are talking about diseased oldies hanging around lumpini Park. I knew girls that were earning 80k a month in 2001. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongTang Posted May 19, 2019 Share Posted May 19, 2019 15 minutes ago, jak2002003 said: The women are 'forced' to do that job? You may misread it at your own pleasure.. The women are forced to work at hidden places or move to other dangerous countries as working in a safe and regulated environment is something these countries do not permit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongTang Posted May 19, 2019 Share Posted May 19, 2019 The Sad reality is that there are two types of solutions to this problem, The Bad Ones and The Horrible Ones... Making women work underground where criminal organizations can easily hurt and exploit them is definitely from the Horrible ones. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pilotman Posted May 19, 2019 Share Posted May 19, 2019 8 minutes ago, LongTang said: You may misread it at your own pleasure.. The women are forced to work at hidden places or move to other dangerous countries as working in a safe and regulated environment is something these countries do not permit. Not true, many of them are now going to Japan, Korea and Taiwan to earn much more than they can earn in Thailand and for often doing a lot less to earn it. It's also safer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongTang Posted May 19, 2019 Share Posted May 19, 2019 15 minutes ago, Pilotman said: Not true, many of them are now going to Japan, Korea and Taiwan to earn much more than they can earn in Thailand and for often doing a lot less to earn it. It's also safer. Read my original post, I was not referring to Thai women. And for that matter, Japan, Korea and Taiwan should be praised as well for providing safe environment for these women. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
car720 Posted May 19, 2019 Share Posted May 19, 2019 Rooster59 said: It expanded quickly during the Vietnam War, when U.S. troops came to Bangkok for their recreation breaks. Now there is an understatement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wwest5829 Posted May 19, 2019 Share Posted May 19, 2019 5 hours ago, ezzra said: Strange rehabilitation methods to allow the bar girls to own and operate a bar, so with this wisdom, will you advise a drug addicts to cultivate or produce their own cannabis and meth? of get alcoholics to set up a distillery as long as the keep good hours and the profits? strange indeed... Workers collectively owning the business? Smacks of socialism, profit sharing schemes, unionization and the like. Downright anti capitalist model. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
holy cow cm Posted May 19, 2019 Share Posted May 19, 2019 Chiang Mai land is back up on the rise again. It has made so many transitions. Last before this looked like a gay boys street and before that massages opening up, and then before that normal; trading business moving in as seen as a prospective area with also the places they brought the Chinese to make them buy goods... I avoid it in later daytime as is crowed to the gills with school mommies picking up their kids. Night time, just couldn't be buggered as have a better more discreet way to get home. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaksimMislavsky Posted May 19, 2019 Share Posted May 19, 2019 4 hours ago, BritManToo said: I believe there was a book from an 18th century explorer that mentions the sex scene in Siam. So don't blame the Japanese. Back then London, for instance, was no much different. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monkeycu Posted May 19, 2019 Share Posted May 19, 2019 The 2 workers in the photo will need more than a dream catcher 2 to attract many men ???? On another level, how can the women run a bar that sells sex Isn't this against the law Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Borzandy Posted May 19, 2019 Share Posted May 19, 2019 6 hours ago, rooster59 said: There are 123,530 sex workers in Thailand They forgot at least one 0. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
donnacha Posted May 19, 2019 Share Posted May 19, 2019 Old news. That bar opened in 2006 with NGO funding, back when Western feminist organizations were still willing to entertain that idea that, in certain circumstances, women should have the right to decide what to do with their bodies. Since then, with the Left's swing towards puritanism and intolerance for other-think, sex work has been rebranded as sex trafficking and groups of homely Diversity Studies lecturers have decided that all such women are being exploited whether they realize it or not. It is worth noting that Chiang Mai is not a good night-life destination. Harshly enforced early closing times have knocked the Hell out of any fun there once was. You will, however, definitely get f*cked by the air pollution. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hansnl Posted May 19, 2019 Share Posted May 19, 2019 2 hours ago, Orton Rd said: They can earn between 650 baht and 3.250 baht a day? in the last century not this one, unless they are talking about diseased oldies hanging around lumpini Park. I knew girls that were earning 80k a month in 2001. Times change, prices are under pressure, less customers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiwiken Posted May 19, 2019 Share Posted May 19, 2019 2 hours ago, LongTang said: Indeed one should praise these countries for not taking the Hypocritical stand of some Scandinavian, European and north American countries that force women to work in hidden and unsupervised places or migrate to much more dangerous countries. Prostitution is legalised in New Zealand but only for New Zealand Citizens. Foreign Women who come to NZ are still prosecuted under NZ law. The sad thing is even though these laws were changed in order to protect the Sex Workers. many are still forced onto the street by holier than thou Councils which prohibit them setting up Bordellos. With a "Not in my neighbourhood attitude" Central Government can change laws but you cannot change closed minds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BritManToo Posted May 19, 2019 Share Posted May 19, 2019 5 hours ago, BritManToo said: I believe there was a book from an 18th century explorer that mentions the sex scene in Siam. So don't blame the Japanese. Found some stories ........ "The Austrian visitor in 1623, Christoph Carl Fernberger, though he only visited Ayutthaya in Siam, where commercial prostitutes worked near the docks, felt the Siamese women were “excessively lewd… they are always approaching the men and urging them to go with them into their houses and have sex with them”.Read more at https://www.thephuketnews.com/phuket-history-sex-in-early-siam-67436.php#OLjRyufWfX886w7v.99 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I am More Thai Than You Posted May 19, 2019 Share Posted May 19, 2019 7 hours ago, rooster59 said: “When we started, we were told, ‘You are sex workers - Bless you. Don't you ever forget it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atyclb Posted May 19, 2019 Share Posted May 19, 2019 if they really want to rehabilitate then make it mandatory for applicable gogo dancers to enroll in weight reduction centers and the government will pay for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burma Bill Posted May 19, 2019 Share Posted May 19, 2019 Interestingly, I thought prostitution was technically illegal in Thailand!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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