Immigration busy fining Thais and foreigners - US man pays 5,000 baht fine for not doing 90 day report

[moto77]

1 minute ago, Gecko123 said:

runaway slaves is more like it.

Meh, just run. 

No one has come to track me down and drag me back yet, mate. 

[ttrd]

 An American man was also fined 5,000 baht for not making a 90 day report.

 

In Kanju sub-district of Muang, Petchabun three Thai householders were fined a total of 6,000 baht for failing to report foreigners staying at their addresses in contravention of Article 38, 1979.

 

In Saraburi immigration went to a construction site in Nong Pring sub-district and fined Preeda Ninthida, aged 70, 1,600 baht for not reporting a foreigner at their address. 

 

-----------------

 

So the foreigner paid 5000thb, 3 thais paid 2000thb each and 1 thai paid 1600thb and this for the same infringement ... ????

 

Not surprising that Thailand has a 2 price system in general when it is performed on the top of the pyramid ...

Edited June 13, 2019 by ttrd

[StevieAus]

6 hours ago, EricTh said:

There are still tons of foreigners who still want to stay long term in Thailand after all these harassment akin to a police state.

 

Yes and this is one of them, it’s not hard to comply with the requirements if you want to.

When I lived in Australia there were plenty of fines as there are in every country for relatively minor indiscretions such as overstaying on a parking meter by five minutes, being caught on a speed camera for traveling 3kms per hr over the limit lodging a government form one day late etc etc

Its called revenue raising governments are masters at the art.

[edwardflory]

The tm30 onus is .. not .. on the renter, it's just convenient to fine him instead.

 

The onus is on YOU ( per regulations ) to insure ALL YOUR PAPERWORK is in order.  I agree 100% it is the landlords "responsibility" to file the TM-30, but YOU get fined if the landlord doesn't.  Before all this crazed TM-30 stuff, MANY offices did NOT bother with a TM-30 or a TM-28 - ( SOME offices substituted the TM-47 for the TM-28 ) 

 

Now we have to live with the polices / regulations that are NOW being enforced OUR LOCAL IO.

Edited June 13, 2019 by edwardflory
Reply

[bkk6060]

49 minutes ago, Stoker58 said:

Here’s the thing that gets me. They can put all this effort into enforcing a completely pointless requirement because it means taking money off farangs, but they’re completely incapable of enforcing road safety that costs the lives of at least 60 Thai human beings every single day.

  No helmets, no seatbelts, riding in the back of pickups? No, go and spend your time checking where the farang spends every night.

Very naive uneducated comments.

There are many factors related to the traffic deaths here.  Few of them are related to the police "enforcing road safety".

The no seatbelt, no helmet blah blah.  There are checkpoints set up all over the popular cities enforcing this.  It is big money for the Thai police as they get a "bonus" at the end of each month for the number of paid citations written.  So in fact, there is tremendous incentive for them to "enforce the law". 

But of course, then all the whiners regarding these police check points will complain and cry about why the police are not out "stopping real crime".

But hey, when in doubt blame it on the police.

Certainly a world wide small box phenomenon..,

Edited June 13, 2019 by bkk6060

[stanleycoin]

10 minutes ago, bkk6060 said:

No.

As there will be many jobs in the future catering to Chinese and other tourists.  In fact, a predict a shortage of tourism workers.

Sorry, but Falang priorities and wanting to be "treated like Kings" are a thing of the past.

I'm sure any short fall in staff, will be sorted quickly  by the Rub and Tug crews. 

[evadgib]

17 minutes ago, GeorgeCross said:

 

and yet 191 other countries managed to do it.

 

strange.

No they didn't.

Edited June 13, 2019 by evadgib

[SammyT]

4 minutes ago, bkk6060 said:

Very naive uneducated comments.

There are many factors related to the traffic deaths here.  Few of them are related to the police "enforcing road safety".

The no seatbelt, no helmet blah blah.  There are checkpoints set up all over the popular cities enforcing this.  It is big money for the Thai police as they get a "bonus" at the end of each month for the number of paid citations written.  So in fact, there is tremendous incentive for them to "enforce the law". 

But of course, then all the whiners regarding these police check points will complain and cry about why the police are not out "stopping real crime".

 

Agreed. Plus the obvious absurdity that Immigration Police aren't responsible for enforcing the road rules. 

[ThomasThBKK]

14 minutes ago, herwin1234 said:

you are not being "critical" not even mentioning the new(harsh) rules u r merely ranting about mafioso in Italy and police in London and how happy u r in London. the usual cynical unfair rant of another farang who chose to live here, married his favorite bargirl, is treated nice bythe Thai, yet knows nothing better to do than being an ungrateful dog to his new country. 

again, stupid remark about the police. and bottpm line,it still stands, if u r so happy in London and so unhappy here, nobody forces u to live here.

and thats totally different than being "critical".

 

 

I am not married. Never was. 

 

Also i don't have any affiliation with london or the UK at all, except going there on holidays months ago. 

 

The rest of your post are equaly dumb assumptions. 

 

 

 

[watcharacters]

5 hours ago, quandow said:

Am I required to do a new TM30 every time I rent a room?

 

Sounds like it.

 

 

[rexall]

5 hours ago, SammyT said:

<snip> Me personally, I'd rather focus on the things I like about Thailand and not come across as the bitter man with the "white people smart, Thai people stupid" complex that plenty on here have. 

This is the first honest thing you have said in this thread; and you are certainly entitled to your preferences for what you would rather focus on and how you would like to come across.  I seem to recall that Nazis, Soviets, Milošević's Serbia and other places were about as white as you can possibly get, but had no compunctions about instituting similar draconian measures regarding freedom movement and privacy as we see in Thailand today. 

As I have said before on these forums, I do a continuing cost-benefit analysis of my situation in Thailand, and if the red line ever tips more to the disadvantages column than the advantages, I out of here, and don't stand in the doorway lest you get trampled on my way out! However, just because I remain here and have things that I like and do not like, that does not mean that  I should shut my mouth and only focus on the things that you prefer me to focus on, thank you very much.  

[Bournville]

1.600 vs 5.000 baht for basically the same problem. Farang tax once again. So very wrong. 

[SammyT]

2 minutes ago, singking said:

I’m about to move to Thailand and I’ve noticed one overriding factor with a lot, not all, Thai Visa members that they bitch and scream endlessly about their problems in Thailand. Why do you guys come here or live here??
I totally understand the whinging POM analogy because that’s what Pommies do, but if you don’t like what your confronted with, then why on earth did you come to Thailand in the first place? Research is as easy as it gets these days. So I can only assume ignorance is bliss. If you came here for a cheap chic or to boost your failing ego then try America out! It’s soon to be a 3rd world country


Sent from my iPhone using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

I've been trying to work the same out for a few years now. If it's any consolation, most expats you meet in real life don't generally hate Thailand quite like the vocal few on here do. Yes, Thailand comes with it's frustrations - immigration being one, but it's generally a very good place to live. Don't let naysayers on here tell you otherwise. 

 

Those same guys who time and time again keep threatening to take their massive pension payments to another country that wants them more are still here. 

[HHTel]

6 hours ago, SammyT said:

Surely move to London then, if you love it that much? Or would you rather stay here and complain about everything, just because the cost of living and the cost of romance is cheaper? Take the good with the bad, my friend. 

Another one with no sense of humour!!

[stanleycoin]

9 minutes ago, singking said:

I totally understand the whinging POM analogy because that’s what Pommies do, but if you don’t like what your confronted with, then why on earth did you come to Thailand in the first place?

Right on cobber.

I come to Thailand when it was friendly and stayed.

after 21 years should i just piss off. ?

If so why ?

 

BTW, you will be having so many surprises coming your way soon.

and 500 more after you spunked most of your money a few year down the road. 

What a Newbie.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited June 13, 2019 by stanleycoin

[Bournville]

5 minutes ago, singking said:

I’m about to move to Thailand and I’ve noticed one overriding factor with a lot, not all, Thai Visa members that they bitch and scream endlessly about their problems in Thailand. Why do you guys come here or live here??
I totally understand the whinging POM analogy because that’s what Pommies do, but if you don’t like what your confronted with, then why on earth did you come to Thailand in the first place? Research is as easy as it gets these days. So I can only assume ignorance is bliss. If you came here for a cheap chic or to boost your failing ego then try America out! It’s soon to be a 3rd world country


Sent from my iPhone using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

Ha ha ha. Get back to us all after a year or so. As for your comment about POMS... I'm in Bali at the moment... Australians are not my cuppa tea at all. 

[luckyluke]

6 minutes ago, evadgib said:

No they didn't.

The Consulate I use since 15 years, didn't change nothing in their way to check my income, put lately they put the words "It is hereby certified" in their Letter of Income. 

 

Everybody happy :

Immigration, me and Consulate (I pay 1500 Thb for this letter). 

 

[Burma Bill]

Interesting to read about the 90 day report problems. I have not done one for years. Each time I renew my retirement extension, I also renew my multiple re-entry permit, and as a regular visitor to neighboring ASEAN countries (all within a 90 day period) I get a new TM6 every time on re-entry and, as you know, it is 90 days from the date on the latest TM6.

[Gecko123]

24 minutes ago, bkk6060 said:

Very naive uneducated comments.

There are many factors related to the traffic deaths here.  Few of them are related to the police "enforcing road safety".

The no seatbelt, no helmet blah blah.  There are checkpoints set up all over the popular cities enforcing this.  It is big money for the Thai police as they get a "bonus" at the end of each month for the number of paid citations written.  So in fact, there is tremendous incentive for them to "enforce the law". 

But of course, then all the whiners regarding these police check points will complain and cry about why the police are not out "stopping real crime".

 

Total BS bkk6060. Lack of road safety enforcement is the number one reason for high traffic casualty rates. Most of those traffic stops you cited are to verify registrations are up to date, OK maybe in some areas helmet laws are enforced, but in huge swathes of Thailand there's effectively no enforcement of traffic safety like speeding, drunk driving, reckless driving, no licence checks, etc. The police should be prioritizing their efforts based on number of lives saved and crimes prevented. Contrasting lax traffic safety enforcement with hyper-enforcement of domicile reporting for foreigners here on retirement and marriage visas is a totally legitimate criticism. Why is there this intense police focus on foreigners when there are glaring problems like traffic safety, drug abuse, domestic violence, property crime, illegal logging, human trafficking, etc., which don't receive anywhere near the same amount of attention?

 

As mentioned in an earlier post, while Thailand acts like they have a major security breach on their hands if a foreigner doesn't report his address within 24 hours, they completely ignore the millions of Thais who remain registered on their birthplace house registry for decades after they have established permanent residence elsewhere. Why is where foreigners are domiciled being so closely monitored when they represent such a tiny percentage of the total population? Those are legitimate questions.

Edited June 13, 2019 by Gecko123

[sandmonster]

5 hours ago, CMNightRider said:

The Thai government do not want westerners living in Thailand anymore.  Their loony requirement to deposit 800,000 in a Thai bank is an example of how to rid westerns from Thailand.  

 

Westerners tend to pose a problem for police state governments.  Westerners think they are entitled to free speech, right to a fair trial and other crazy ideas, which police states bristle at the mere thought of.  The party is over for westerners.  The Thai leaders would prefer to have Chinese citizens to replace them.  These people are used to living in a restrictive environment. ???? 

So it is cheaper than 800K for chinese to stay. Do they get special exemptions against breaking the law ?  

[edwardflory]

35 minutes ago, asiaexpat said:

90 day report (TM47) does not replace the TM30 requirement. 

Or the TM-28 NOW being enforced by many offices.

 

Side note TM-47:  I ALSO agree that this paperwork is not efficient.  I have a friend living in the same house with the same Thai wife for over 20 years.  I would suggest if you live at the same location for say 3-5 years, you only report your address with your "extension renewal", UNLESS you move, more logical I would think.

[The Preacher]

A friend went to Immigration in Phitsanulok today.  He missed his 90 day report deadline.  The immigration officer told him the fine is 5,000 baht.  My friend said he thought it was 2,000 baht.  The immigration officer told him that is the price with no receipt.   He did not get a receipt.

Edited June 13, 2019 by Jai Dee
Oversized emoticons removed

[nikov]

I would opt in paying 5,000 baht every three months instead of wasting my time with reporting. Too bad one can't tell if there will be other consequences than the fine. Eg. more difficult to apply for a permanent residency.

[SammyT]

3 minutes ago, rexall said:

This is the first honest thing you have said in this thread; and you are certainly entitled to your preferences for what you would rather focus on and how you would like to come across.  I seem to recall that Nazis, Soviets, Milošević's Serbia and other places were about as white as you can possibly get, but had no compunctions about instituting similar draconian measures regarding freedom movement and privacy as we see in Thailand today. 

As I have said before on these forums, I do a continuing cost-benefit analysis of my situation in Thailand, and if the red line ever tips more to the disadvantages column than the advantages, I out of here, and don't stand in the doorway lest you get trampled on my way out! However, just because I remain here and have things that I like and do not like, that does not mean that  I should shut my mouth and only focus on the things that you prefer me to focus on, thank you very much.  

Everything I've said in this thread is honest, so I'm struggling to see how you assess that is the first honest thing I've said. 

 

Agree with the fact it's a continual cost/benefit analysis and if it reached a tipping point I'd leave. My question is - what does griping on the internet messageboard achieve? Because I'm not telling you to shut your mouth as you're implying I am, all I'm saying is - has anything changed because you had a whinge on here? TVF has over 200k followers from all walks of life. Why not try and gather momentum and make meaningful change if you're that concerned. It would probably amount to nothing but at least you tried. 

 

Comparing one small aspect of 2019 Thailand to Nazi Germany, Soviets and Bosnia doesn't lend any credibility to your argument though. Has anyone put you in a concentration camp recently?

[Sparkles]

7 hours ago, SammyT said:

Do your 90 day check in then, like the rest of us do. It's not rocket science. It's not even particularly hard.  

Do it in person,online or by mail from nearest PO.Seriously I wonder how some people get through life

[rexall]

5 hours ago, GeorgeCross said:

 

yep all true thailand didn't change the rules until forced too after various govs refused to provide the evidence needed by them. they could have just said "your problem" and made everyone affected switch to 800K method (or go home) but came up with another avenue that should only have been a minor inconvenience to those applying within the current rules.

 

no one is forcing anyone to use it though or making things tougher (more money,etc)

 

thats my take anyway

 

 

 

 

Huh? No, Thailand didn't change the rules. Not such an easy thing to do, and why bother if the embassies stop issuing income affidavits? It is quite clever and elegant, actually. Do you really think the motivation to stop issuing affidavits spontaneously occurred in the several countries during the same two week period? They just woke up one morning and decided to stop issuing affidavits?  Of course not!  There must have been  some kind of a deal or politics or  pressure applied by the Thais, and the embassies chose to comply.  I would love to know more about what actually went on and how the decisions came about.

[SunsetT]

7 hours ago, SammyT said:

 

Yes they will. Just the lazy ones won't. My landlords during my time in Thailand have been great, and fully compliant with the law. In return I treat his house with respect. It's a relationship that works well.  

Yes they will but when it suits them and not having to drop everything if they are busy.  Imm. are being really pushy I think, saying it must be done within 24 hours. Many Thais will not like this. My landlady does it but last time it was a few days later, as I needed to go with her to register for the 1st time.

[The Preacher]

3 minutes ago, nikov said:

I would opt in paying 5,000 baht every three months instead of wasting my time with reporting. Too bad one can't tell if there will be other consequences than the fine. Eg. more difficult to apply for a permanent residency.

You can actually do that.  The fine is a flat rate.  So miss all the days you want, then go in an pay 5 grand.  But if they catch you out, the fine goes up.  How about this? Go into any immigration office and offer to take one of the officers out to lunch.  Suggest that if you do an online bank transfer of 5,000 from your account to his every three months (strictly a gift -- no receipt), then, upon seeing the deposit, he automatically sends you the completed 90 day report slip.  A win win for everybody.  You are happy, the officer is VERY happy.  You never have to go in.

 

I know another guy that claims that when he goes in for his marriage extension every year, he never has the 400 grand in the bank.  Instead, he stays, he hands over an envelope with 6,000 baht inside in lieu of the bank deposit.  He says he has been doing it for years.  I do not know if it is true.

 

Personally, I stay squeaky clean.  I go by the book and I neither ask for favors nor pay bribes.  People that do are asking for problems down the road and they'll get no sympathy from me.

[evadgib]

17 minutes ago, luckyluke said:

The Consulate I use since 15 years, didn't change nothing in their way to check my income, put lately they put the words "It is hereby certified" in their Letter of Income. 

 

Everybody happy :

Immigration, me and Consulate (I pay 1500 Thb for this letter). 

 

That isn't disputed. I'm saying that your Income wasn't verified other than by your say so + whatever evidence you supplied in support.

[rexall]

5 hours ago, SammyT said:

I don't think you understand the true definition of a police state. I've been able to live my life hassle and worry free, throughout all coups and martial law. 

Not all "police states" are alike, and a state does not have to be Nazi Germany to be a police state:

https://www.dictionary.com/browse/police-state

police state

 

WORD ORIGIN

SEE MORE SYNONYMS FOR police state ON THESAURUS.COM

---

noun

a nation in which the police, especially a secret police, summarily suppresses any social,economic, or political act that conflicts with governmental policy.