Chicken carcass for dogs, any solution to break them easily ?

[Lacessit]

On 6/19/2019 at 8:56 PM, myjawe said:

 

There is clearly no problem to feed dogs with bones, or the whole web would be retarded.

But of course nobody with a brain feeds any cooked bones to dogs.

 

 

My GF cooks cheap chicken carcasses from Big C for our dog, boils them up in a pot. When cool, she strips the flesh and cartilage off the bones quite easily. That's served up with rice and the broth from the pot. Our dog loves it.

[Lacessit]

On 6/20/2019 at 10:11 AM, wayned said:

Yep, cow bones are macerated at the slaughterhouse when they are butchered and used in animal feed and possibly a filler in McDonald's hamburgers.

McDonalds chicken nuggets are ground-up chicken skin, so you are probably close to the mark.

[myjawe]

2 hours ago, CGW said:

I shall inform my wife, all she has ever fed our three dogs is chicken carcass, the oldest dog in human years is 15, the next is 14 years and the other is 6 years, they are all remarkably healthy ???? 

 

Yes inform her, I am not surprised that she knows nothing and live as if Internet did not exist, she is Thai. And anyway many foreigners are not smarter / aware than them.

 

 

 

 

Edited June 21, 2019 by myjawe

[myjawe]

2 hours ago, Lacessit said:

McDonalds chicken nuggets are ground-up chicken skin, so you are probably close to the mark.

 

KFC "chicken" includes feet and bones.

 

 

[wayned]

We have a Wednesday walking market.  there is a lady there that sells fried chicken. pieces.  she also has whole deep fried breaded carcasses.  when somebody buys one she Chops it into pieces and then puts the pieces through a big professional meat grinder.  i  once asked whAt they do with it and they told me dog food, but i wouldn't be surprised if the Thais ate it.

[myjawe]

5 hours ago, grollies said:

OK fella, where do you get off calling people liars?

 

Tell you what, give me a couple of weeks and I'll post up a 'Chicken 101' topic on the farming forum. Someone suggested it a while back.

 

It sounds like you are anti-commercial broiler farms wherever they are, in which case I won't persuade you.

 

I assume you are vegetarian or vegan? Nothing wrong with either but it woud be interesting to hear why you dislike this way of farming worldwide.

 

Do I trust my organic veg supplier? I don't seek out organic vegetables per se where we are but Makro (a three hour round trip) has a hydroponic section and I'd trust those vegetables to be OK. Buying vegetables locally, my wife looks at leafy greens that have some signs of insect damage when told they are chemical-free. There are a couple of hydroponic farms popping-up round here and, having seen one at a local worm farm -yes, they have these too in Thailand, selling wormcast to vegetable growers here - I'd trust those also. The two small farms I've seen use mozzie netting to keep pests out.

 

There is a growing market amongst some Thais who are looking for, not organic, but chemical-free foods. We recently found a lady locally selling chemical-free cashew nuts and peanuts.

 

You come across as a bit of a Thai-hater which begs the question 'why are you here?'

 

Try to get out from your soi a bit more and look what is happening in rural areas.

 

Thanks for your reply, it's 05:30 now and I'm off to kick some chickens around.

 

 

Sorry, but you can trust if you are happy to trust, but I still know that you are wrong.

 

Even in EU where checks are supposed to be serious, all organic products show pesticides and chemicals, and you are going to repeat that anything that grows in Thailand is safe ? so funny... it's clear that you have no experience in agriculture at all.

 

And about animal respect, just visit anywhere and you will also understand that you are dreaming.

 

But up to you ! Many people like to dream, but I do not.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[grollies]

1 hour ago, myjawe said:

 

 

Sorry, but you can trust if you are happy to trust, but I still know that you are wrong.

 

Even in EU where checks are supposed to be serious, all organic products show pesticides and chemicals, and you are going to repeat that anything that grows in Thailand is safe ? so funny... it's clear that you have no experience in agriculture at all.

 

And about animal respect, just visit anywhere and you will also understand that you are dreaming.

 

But up to you ! Many people like to dream, but I do not.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I agree totally regarding pesticide and herbicide residues in organic (and all) produce in the West and it is the same in Thailand. Glyphosate is the current favourite.

 

I think you misunderstand my comments regarding sourcing pesticide-free produce here. We simply do the best we can to buy vegetables that haven't obviously been blasted with pesticide and herbicide. I am not that naive to think my vegetables are perfect and residue-free.

 

I'm going to assume you either eat nothing at all or grow your own produce in hermatically sealed conditions.

 

You have zero understanding of the way my chickens are raised. Zero.

 

PM me and you are welcome to visit our farm any time we have chickens in house. I've 19,000 birds in at the moment for the next month. You can see for yourself the conditions they are raised in, the feeding, lighting, vaccination, medication and water regimes. You can experience how they are treated and, if you come in around three weeks time you can even have, FOC, half a dozen 2.8kg birds, antibiotic-free, hell, I'll even dress them for you.

 

But please could you tone down the insulting way you post to me and others here. We are all free here to comment politely and try to help each other. I could have flagged your comment about me being a liar to a mod but I'd much rather engage in an informed debate.

 

Lighten up dude.

Edited June 22, 2019 by grollies

[Farangwithaplan]

On 6/20/2019 at 3:25 PM, Speedo1968 said:

I have worked in farming for years, in many different countries.

Can you be sure that the chicken you buy for dogs is from a young broiler bird and not from a spent layer ?

Having seen dogs in Thailand choke on chicken bones, especially leg bones, then I would suggest caution in what you give your friend.

I take it you missed the part of my post about taking it with a dash of fish sauce.

 

But feel free to take it up with the vet in question, i can find his details and you can demand he stop the propoganda that is obviously leading to mass canine genocide.

 

I stopped feeding my friend after he stopped breathing some time ago.

 

 

[Speedo1968]

23 hours ago, grollies said:

You may want to revise your opinion and bring it up to date regarding Thai commercial broiler welfare.

 

Commercial broilers are not treated cruelly. Mistreatment equals stress equals dead birds equals lost income.

 

Welfare standards are higher here than the west regarding stocking density, especially the USA.

 

Hormone and antibiotic growth-promotors are no longer used in Thailand. Neither is animal protein.

 

Whilst antibiotic is used to treat birds with infections, antibiotic treatment is never given after day 25 (of 45 days growth before slaughter) in order any residues clear their system by the slaughter date.

 

Much of the chicken produced here goes for export to Japan, Middle East and Europe.

 

I run a commercial broiler farm in Thailand.

 

Do yourself a favour and save on your grocery budget..this from the Australian govt site:

 

http://www.foodstandards.gov.au/consumer/generalissues/hormonalgrowth/Pages/default.aspx

Having started with poultry in the 1960's - and later with duck - working as a freelance advisor since the 1980's including 20 years in the ASPAC / China area I would accept that standards as in the written form have changed considerably, so also has the advertising to suggest a product is safe.

 

I agree with your point regarding the consequences of external sources of stress, remember the animal is already under a great genetic stress.

 

Welfare standards may be higher than other countries and if they are strictly followed it will certainly add to the shelf price of the product.    

If one is under the strict contracts of some Poultry Companies standards are high and difficult to meet.    There are of course contract growers who have contract growers.

 

I have seen antibiotics in various forms ( both those specifically for livestock and for humans ) given to both poultry and ducks well in to the grow out stage.

I have seen growth promoters meant for one form of livestock given to others.

 

Yes, poultry produce ( meat and eggs ) produced here does go in to Europe and Asia, for which we expect it to be antibiotic residue free.      However, that which you may buy in your local fresh or cooked markets may not be.   Neither may it be of general good health etc.

 

There may also be a further issue where poultry / ducks are housed over fish ponds.

 

On the point about calcium you can always use dried and ground egg shells.

 

This is getting a long way away from the original topic about bones for dogs and I am as guilty as others of having done something "not good" in my almost 50 years in farming: as a vegan for much of that time I have endeavoured to teach compassion irrespective of the animal.

 

My point about giving bones to dogs remains the same - be careful.

 

 

 

[nanglong218]

I bow to the weight of evidence regarding feeding cooked bones to dogs. This is my first experience of dog ownership and am following the local habit of chop it all up and chuck it in a pot  Also they had no trouble with bones, the crunching and cracking sounds were quite offputting.   I will now follow the advice given here.

Someone suggested a thread on these matters which I would welcome. TW has just just returned from a day with her mates, says the whole thing is a load of rubbish.  Constant uphill battle.

[myjawe]

On 6/22/2019 at 1:58 PM, Farangwithaplan said:

I take it you missed the part of my post about taking it with a dash of fish sauce.

 

But feel free to take it up with the vet in question, i can find his details and you can demand he stop the propoganda that is obviously leading to mass canine genocide.

 

I stopped feeding my friend after he stopped breathing some time ago.

 

 

 

So funny that people trust most vets who mostly know nothing. This is why they recommend dry food most of the time, because they get paid for it.

Read the truth about dog feeding maybe:

 

 

 

[metisdead]

A post in which the quoted content had been altered has been removed as per the following forum rule:

 

16) You will not make changes to quoted material from other members posts, except for purposes of shortening the quoted post. This cannot be done in such a manner that it alters the context of the original post.

 

 

An inflammatory post and a reply was removed as well.