EU will delay Brexit until February if Johnson fails to ratify deal this week - The Sunday Times

[Forethat]

1 minute ago, Bruntoid said:

One thing I genuinely don’t understand - BoJo is statistically the worst PM EVER having lost every single vote he’s put forward, he has stood up in Parliament and stated TEN times I will not request an extension, shortly before requesting an extension. The EU has outwitted him every step of the way without actually doing anything, and the strategies BoJo comes up with are so easily defeated it’s embarrassing. In an open sack he would head downwards. 

 

So can someone please enlighten me as to why Dominic Cummings is regularly touted as a brilliant strategist ??? ????

Perhaps you'll have to wait until next GE to gain 'some' level of understanding?

[melvinmelvin]

4 minutes ago, Forethat said:

Perhaps you'll have to wait until next GE to gain 'some' level of understanding?

don't think so,

guess both Tory and Labour will receive quite fat support

 

there is a saying that humans do not learn from the mistakes of others,

they need to do the mistakes themselves before they learn,

brits are different, any number of gross mistakes do not hamper their ways, Tory and Labour will enjoy an interesting future

well backed by the plebs

 

 

[beautifulthailand99]

14 minutes ago, Forethat said:

Perhaps you'll have to wait until next GE to gain 'some' level of understanding?

tactical voting 

nats + lib dem surge

Brexit Party chews tories in labour heartlands where they need to advance

could well be hung parliament / remain majority despite tories getting the biggest % share

back to square one - and 2nd ref - remain and move on is as good as anybody's guess.

[SteveB2]

A restrained explanation by the Lord Chief Justice, explaining how the Brexit debacle is causing everyone to ignore the elephant in the living room. Namely what history tells us happens when a population loses trust in their traditional representatives. 

 

 

[david555]

16 minutes ago, beautifulthailand99 said:

tactical voting 

nats + lib dem surge

Brexit Party chews tories in labour heartlands where they need to advance

could well be hung parliament / remain majority despite tories getting the biggest % share

back to square one - and 2nd ref - remain and move on is as good as anybody's guess.

The ghost of Brexit shall be as dark shadow  over next G.E. and possible very  soon so expect a almost 50/50 result or 47/ 47,5 or any other likely result , as your next G.E. shall be the reckoning about Brexit done or not done …. sad & hopeless 

[evadgib]

No 10 have just confirmed BJ will contact the EU 27 this evening confirming HMGs decision to leave as planned on 31st.

 

[david555]

3 minutes ago, evadgib said:

No 10 have just confirmed BJ will contact the EU 27 this evening confirming HMGs decision to leave as planned on 31st.

 

I thought I never would be wishing Boris luck to get the numbers , but it is the most needed thing to do , in which way ever , but that this Brexit get concluded at last

[beautifulthailand99]

8 minutes ago, evadgib said:

No 10 have just confirmed BJ will contact the EU 27 this evening confirming HMGs decision to leave as planned on 31st.

 

source ? 

 

 

Laura Kuenssberg

 

@bbclaurak

·

3h

 

No 10 source says, 'if Parliament votes again for delay by voting down the programme motion, and the EU offers delay until 31 Jan -- then we will pull the Bill, there will be no further business for Parliament and we'll move to an election before Christmas'

[melvinmelvin]

16 minutes ago, evadgib said:

No 10 have just confirmed BJ will contact the EU 27 this evening confirming HMGs decision to leave as planned on 31st.

 

joke?

 

[beautifulthailand99]

3 minutes ago, melvinmelvin said:

joke?

 

555 ?

[david555]

17 minutes ago, beautifulthailand99 said:

source ? 

 

 

Laura Kuenssberg

 

@bbclaurak

·

3h

 

No 10 source says, 'if Parliament votes again for delay by voting down the programme motion, and the EU offers delay until 31 Jan -- then we will pull the Bill, there will be no further business for Parliament and we'll move to an election before Christmas'

Source ..: it just appeared now on SKY news running news ticker under " breaking "

[beautifulthailand99]

13 minutes ago, david555 said:

Source ..: it just appeared now on SKY news running news ticker under " breaking "

Disingenuous as he has asked that the EU offer no more extensions not that he will leave - if extension is offered and the Eu have said that they will then that will be that. He knows as the EU knows that No Deal now will be disastrous. It's about the optics to position himself as "I would have left but parliament and the Eu wouldn't let me" - now vote for me. 

 

A No.10 source says Prime Minister Boris Johnson will call EU leaders tonight to say that the Government's policy remains that the UK leaves on 31 October and that no Brexit delays should be offered

 

https://www.standard.co.uk/news/politics/brexit-branded-waste-of-time-and-energy-by-jeanclaude-juncker-while-donald-tusk-insists-he-bloc-a4267421.html

 

Meanwhile, European Council president Donald Tusk said a no-deal would "never be" the EU's decision and that he was talking to fellow bloc leaders on how to respond to Britain's request for an Article 50 extension.

"We should be ready for every scenario. But one thing must be clear: as I said to Prime Minister Johnson on Saturday, a no-deal Brexit will never be our decision."

 

[CG1 Blue]

4 minutes ago, beautifulthailand99 said:

Disingenuous as he has asked that the EU offer no more extensions not that he will leave - if extension is offered and the Eu have said that they will then that will be that. He knows as the EU knows that No Deal now will be disastrous. It's about the optics to position himself as "I would have left but parliament and the Eu wouldn't let me" - now vote for me. 

 

A No.10 source says Prime Minister Boris Johnson will call EU leaders tonight to say that the Government's policy remains that the UK leaves on 31 October and that no Brexit delays should be offered

What I heard BJ say when i was watching the Commons debate earlier is that if MPs don't vote through his (31st Oct) timetable, he will withdraw the Withdrawal Agreement Bill completely, and then move for a GE.

So there are 2 votes due this evening - 1 to pass the WAB to kick of scrutiny and debate over the deal, and 1 to approve his timetable. If the government lose that vote on the timetable then the WAB comes off the menu. 

[beautifulthailand99]

4 minutes ago, CG1 Blue said:

What I heard BJ say when i was watching the Commons debate earlier is that if MPs don't vote through his (31st Oct) timetable, he will withdraw the Withdrawal Agreement Bill completely, and then move for a GE.

So there are 2 votes due this evening - 1 to pass the WAB to kick of scrutiny and debate over the deal, and 1 to approve his timetable. If the government lose that vote on the timetable then the WAB comes off the menu. 

So any no dealers with a hard-on I would put the box of tissues away for the time being unless it's for your tears. The EU should call his bluff and say 'ok then'.

[david555]

14 minutes ago, beautifulthailand99 said:

Disingenuous as he has asked that the EU offer no more extensions not that he will leave - if extension is offered and the Eu have said that they will then that will be that. He knows as the EU knows that No Deal now will be disastrous. It's about the optics to position himself as "I would have left but parliament and the Eu wouldn't let me" - now vote for me. 

Whatever is the reason for it  , this is the Sky breaking news ticker text :

 

"A number 10 source says PM Boris Johnson will call E.U. leaders tonight to say that the government policy remains the U.K. leaves on 31 October and no Brexit delays should be offered "

[david555]

17 minutes ago, beautifulthailand99 said:

So any no dealers with a hard-on I would put the box of tissues away for the time being unless it's for your tears. The EU should call his bluff and say 'ok then'.

it has nothing to do with the E.U. now , as they just have to accept what will be in that case …..as the E.U. can only react on a demand to give or to not give extension , not by their own action 

We can not keep U.K. in " hotel California" against your own choice ….. but if you never check out ….. just pass the cashier to arrange the needed GBP...for the prolonging days/month's ….year ?????

[beautifulthailand99]

Read and be inspired 

 

https://www.newstatesman.com/politics/uk/2019/10/uk-set-give-best-deal-any-eu-member-state-has-ever-had

 

In a little-noticed piece, Dominic Cummings, Boris Johnson’s senior adviser and Vote Leave’s campaign director, argued last year that an EU referendum was a choice, not a necessity. “The idea that there was an irresistible force for a referendum is pushed by Farage’s and Cameron’s supporters,” Cummings wrote. “They are both wrong. The country supported one but without any passion outside the small fraction who had long been passionate about it. Most Tory MPs did not want it.”

 

But this avoids a more revealing comparison: the deal the UK already has. At present, Britain enjoys full membership of the single market and the customs union as well as opt-outs from the euro, the borderless Schengen Zone and home affairs policy, and a £4.9bn budget rebate. It received – and then rightly reversed – an exemption from the Social Chapter, which guaranteed workers a minimum of 28 days’ paid holiday per year, maternity and paternity leave and equal rights for part-time employees.

[beautifulthailand99]

7 minutes ago, david555 said:

it has nothing to do with the E.U. now , as they just have to accept what will be in that case …..as the E.U. can only react on a demand to give or to not give extension , not by their own action 

BJ has sent the letter albeit unsigned and photocopied. They know one last roll of the dice would be 2nd ref and remain one at which however frayed there would give one last try. They know there will be GE and or ref very soon and a few months more are neither here or there. An extension will be granted. Tactically I almost hope for a no -deal , I'm wealthy enough and well positioned to not be too bothered by the fallout painful that it would be. But a few months of chaos and trashing of the pound , medicine shortages etc would be a salutary lesson to the British electorate as to what the EU does for us. Maybe that is what is needed so we crawl begging back to the Eu and avoid a possible Johnson victory at the polls. Though all the fallout would be blamed on remainers. 

[melvinmelvin]

32 minutes ago, beautifulthailand99 said:

555 ?

no,

it is not 555 if the PM determines to shait on the national assembly,

that is pretty serious

brats like BJ shouldna run states

 

[beautifulthailand99]

1 minute ago, melvinmelvin said:

no,

it is not 555 if the PM determines to shait on the national assembly,

that is pretty serious

brats like BJ shouldna run states

 

we are in full agreement melvinmelvin. 

[SheungWan]

Leaving is pretty unambiguous if you ask me - we LEAVE all the institutions of the EU. How we do that most expediently and rapidly was never discussed, or probably even contemplated - to our collective chagrin.
 
Equally, if we were to remain now in 2019 - how much of the existing and ongoing EU policy do we subsrcibe to? For example - when we voted to leave in 2016 there was no EU army - not overtly anyway. The claims that this was being assembled behind our backs were mockingly derided and vociferously denied by Clegg, Cameron, Juncker and others. Now the unveiling of these plans has finally happened and prior suspicions have been confirmed. Go back only 17 years and the 'status quo' of the union at that time would have been conspicuously devoid of true fiscal and currency union, with European nations all having their own currencies intact. Go back just 7 years before the Germany EU initiated its disastrous 'refugees welcome policy' under Chancellor Merkel and the continent's appearance and atmosphere were palpably different to today. Go back to 2008 pre-Lisbon treaty introduction and the EU's foreign policy, commercial policy, customs union and legal jurisidicions were all very different or yet to enter into existence. These are all major existential changes and if we had had the referendum in say, 2001, none of the above would have been part of the narrative.
 
Hence the ambiguity lies in how much things have changed since just 2016 and how much things will continue to change going forward - to what extent does the UK as a nation remain subject to the edicts of the ECJ and to supranational EU policy? As these things have been numerous and rapid in their introduction over the years and will continue to be.      
 
 
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/european-leaders-push-angela-merkel-for-joint-eu-army-a7211861.html

More if this, if that routine.

Sent from my SM-N935F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[melvinmelvin]

51 minutes ago, david555 said:

Whatever is the reason for it  , this is the Sky breaking news ticker text :

 

"A number 10 source says PM Boris Johnson will call E.U. leaders tonight to say that the government policy remains the U.K. leaves on 31 October and no Brexit delays should be offered "

he doesn't have to disturb 'em by calling

he can just paste it on some twitter or facebook <deleted> that befits the UK PM

 

[Jan Dietz]

The year is 2192.

The British Prime Minister visits Brussels to ask for an extension of the Brexit deadline.
No one remembers where this tradition originated, but every year it attracts many tourists from all over the world.

 

[oldhippy]

8 minutes ago, Jan Dietz said:

The year is 2192.

The British Prime Minister visits Brussels to ask for an extension of the Brexit deadline.
No one remembers where this tradition originated, but every year it attracts many tourists from all over the world.

 

I would prefer:

The year is 2192.

The British Prime Minister visits Brussels to apply for membership of the European Union.
No one remembers where this tradition originated, but every year it attracts many tourists from all over the world.

[Bluespunk]

Result of tonight’s votes. 
 

The Speaker says WAB is “in limbo”. 
 

Debacle is a better term

[david555]

7 minutes ago, oldhippy said:

I would prefer:

The year is 2192.

The British Prime Minister visits Brussels to apply for membership of the European Union.
No one remembers where this tradition originated, but every year it attracts many tourists from all over the world.

And I would like to know :

how many times the E.U. rejected them already in The Year 2192 ???? became the rejection also a tradition ….?

[oldhippy]

4 minutes ago, david555 said:

And I would like to know how many times the E.U. rejected them already in The Year 2192 ???? became the rejection also a tradition ….?

of course!

[DannyCarlton]

5 hours ago, evadgib said:

No 10 have just confirmed BJ will contact the EU 27 this evening confirming HMGs decision to leave as planned on 31st.

 

Did you dream this? EU are now confirming that the EU 27 will be asked to acceed to Boris's letter and extend to January 31st. Highly likely to be approved.

 

What next? The addition of a couple of amendments to the bill. Remain in CU and a people's vote on Boris' bill vs. remain. Johnson is trying to prevent this by suspending debate on the bill.

 

It's going to be a long time before the fat lady sings or us knowing the song that she'll be singing.

[sandyf]

21 hours ago, DannyCarlton said:

May be you should take more note of them. The honourable member for Don Valley consistently voted for the war in Iraq and now consistently votes with the government on Brexit. A complete disgrace (nice knockers though). Husband (and father to her kids) was a Tunisian stockbroker who got busted for violent disorder and deported.

 

 

Why? They were predominantly Labour which was of little interest and not adverse to encouraging militancy.

In 1985, before CF's days, I went on a C of C mission to South Africa and the departure location had to be secretly altered to avoid the protesters that had been stirred up by would be politicians. My cousin worked in David Blunkett's office when he went to Education, not a pleasant experience.

[sandyf]

22 hours ago, CanterbrigianBangkoker said:

 

'I am not failing to recognise anything' - Seems patently obvious that you are. Do you disagree that the EU has devolved into a mess over the last 30 years or that the many issues being faced on the continent are not - at least in part - due to the supranational authoritarianism of the EU?

 

48 referendums held since its creation, regarding a multitude of aspects of the EU and its constitution etc. The UK being the only extant 'union of nations' to hold such a referendum. What is your point? 

Brexiteer tactics - go off at a tangent with generalisation.

Obviously you can give dates for the 48 referendums that included all member states. That was the answer you gave to the question I put, but you probably thought it clever to answer a different question.