Thousands of people trapped in Australian coastal town by huge wildfires

[AussieBob18]

4 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Well said. Prevention is always the best way.

Wonder if things will change now, or if we'll be reading the same stories in a couple of years time.

Bank on it - while children are being taught inclusion and environmentalism in schools, and not history and maths, things will not change.  

[Lacessit]

2 minutes ago, Chazar said:

No please  dont , eucalypt  trees   burn very well but also re grow  very fast also

It's true eucalypts regrow shoots of leaves on the trunks a few months after a fire. It's a bit more difficult for them to do that when they are burnt down to a stub.

[AussieBob18]

15 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

It's not any different to those people who live on transient land on the Florida Keys in the path of hurricanes. People live in the bush because they like it.

I think you will find many people living in high fire risk areas take steps to defend their property. The first thing any authority such as the CFA does in a fire situation is cut electricity to the affected area, so a householder better have an independent backup generator or pump ready, with tank water available. There are those who choose to wing it, and they are usually the ones who lose their houses.

While I agree controlled burning is necessary, there are areas in the Victorian Alps that are simply inaccessible for that purpose.

I was once told by a CFA captain any stick the thickness of a little finger was a potential ember, and could travel up to 5 km before the flame front.

Having said that, I think the precursor conditions for these latest fires are unprecedented. The elephant in the room is climate change.

https://www.smh.com.au/national/fined-for-illegal-clearing-family-now-feel-vindicated-20090212-85bd.html

[Odysseus123]

Just now, Lacessit said:

It's true eucalypts regrow shoots of leaves on the trunks a few months after a fire. It's a bit more difficult for them to do that when they are burnt down to a stub.

..and there isn't any rain..

[Momofarang]

For Frakk's sake it's called a BUSHFIRE !!

[AussieBob18]

6 hours ago, RJRS1301 said:

Agree I was in Lorne in 1983 (Ash Wednesday) the firestorm came down the hillside in moments, house next door exploded, all precautions had been taken in the days leading up to the devastation, some homes even had sprinklers installed in the roofs, and were not burned but exploded.

One of our cars melted in the driveway, the other was at the beach with us.

Most terrifying time to live through and I have been in cyclones.

 

You both know what you are talking about.

The only prevention from a fire storm is to clear fire breaks before the fires and even then you have to hope - never stay and fight if you have not cleared 50-100m around your house and dont have a safe house.  3 friends of mine stayed in the Canberra fires - they nearly died from lack of oxygen - they blacked out but luckily they woke up - but they also saved theirs and several other houses by putting out all the small fires once the storm had past - they all saoid they would never do it again. Quite a story they had for years afterwards.

 

[Don Mega]

Just now, Odysseus123 said:

Well..fair enough as you don't want 'em on your tail.????

I actually feel ashamed to be an Aussie given all the whinging and outrage expressed towards ScoMo... Absolutely disgusting.

[AussieBob18]

13 minutes ago, Odysseus123 said:

Try reading my post above yours.

You can believe that if you like. But they always say the same thing - not our fault - we did evertything by the book.  Lies, Damn Lies and Statistics.  See the story about the guy who was fined $50K for clearing trees - his house is one of only a few still standing.  That is proof that they are lying - and there is a lot more - a lot more - but in 1-2 weeks it will all be forgotten.  https://www.smh.com.au/national/fined-for-illegal-clearing-family-now-feel-vindicated-20090212-85bd.html

 

 

 

[kevvy]

On 12/31/2019 at 9:15 AM, thaibeachlovers said:

I fail to understand how a fire can get that close to a population center without the chainsaws and bulldozers removing the fuel BEFORE it could be a problem. Do they not have chainsaws, bulldozers and people to use them in that town, or is there some reason they could not attempt to save the town?

Have you ever been caught in a bush fire , my family and I lost our home it was called "black Saturday"   and nothing stops it . The embers carry for hundreds of metres, and heat from the fire is incredible.

https://www.9news.com.au/national/nsw-bushfires-cctv-shows-embers-at-charmhaven-rain-down-on-homes/edf662ee-c8b5-411c-a331-1af1ed2d92c2

[Salerno]

28 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

The first thing any authority such as the CFA does in a fire situation is cut electricity to the affected area,

Where did you hear that <deleted>?

[RJRS1301]

14 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

It's true eucalypts regrow shoots of leaves on the trunks a few months after a fire. It's a bit more difficult for them to do that when they are burnt down to a stub.

In most cases in many places, the roots have been burned, the ground is now sterile due to extreme heat, no nutrients left, no wildlife in may cases koala populations decimated, insects shriveled, bird life devastated, bats falling  from trees from thirst

[RJRS1301]

13 minutes ago, AussieBob18 said:

You can believe that if you like. But they always say the same thing - not our fault - we did evertything by the book.  Lies, Damn Lies and Statistics.  See the story about the guy who was fined $50K for clearing trees - his house is one of only a few still standing.  That is proof that they are lying - and there is a lot more - a lot more - but in 1-2 weeks it will all be forgotten.  https://www.smh.com.au/national/fined-for-illegal-clearing-family-now-feel-vindicated-20090212-85bd.html

 

 

 

In some cases it has been already been going on for MONTHS, not weeks or days.

Borree ridge house burned one month ago (sisters), and had over a kilometer of cleared land around it.

Look at Russell Crows property on line on line

Edited January 1, 2020 by RJRS1301

[Odysseus123]

Just now, AussieBob18 said:

You can believe that if you like. But they always say the same thing - not our fault - we did evertything by the book.  Lies, Damn Lies and Statistics.  See the story about the guy who was fined $50K for clearing trees - his house is one of only a few still standing.  That is proof that they are lying - and there is a lot more - a lot more - but in 1-2 weeks it will all be forgotten.  https://www.smh.com.au/national/fined-for-illegal-clearing-family-now-feel-vindicated-20090212-85bd.html

 

 

 

Yes..you can cut down all the trees-and you will be fined if you do so without permission..hmm..where to start..

This is a fairly typical northern NSW coastal valley.

 

 

[Odysseus123]

5 minutes ago, RJRS1301 said:

In most cases in many places, the roots have been burned, the ground is now sterile due to extreme heat, no nutrients left, no wildlife in may cases koala populations decimated, insects shriveled, bird life devastated, bats falling  from trees from thirst

... and the massive (unavoidable) use of salt water for water bombing..the pastures and the forests have been salted-just like Rome did to Carthage.

[AussieBob18]

2 minutes ago, Odysseus123 said:

Yes..you can cut down all the trees-and you will be fined if you do so without permission..hmm..where to start..

This is a fairly typical northern NSW coastal valley.

 

 

Yep - not an easy thing to stop.  But doing noting is worse.  Not allowing farmers and homeowners to clear around their homes, plus not clearing away the underbrush in those hills (reserves) where the fires come from is the main factor, but you are right - they will always jappen - the issue is how bad they are.

[AussieBob18]

4 minutes ago, RJRS1301 said:

In some cases it has been already been going on for MONTHS, not weeks or days.

Borree ridge house burned one month ago (sisters), and had over a kilometer of cleared land around it.

Look at Russell Crows property on line on line

Agree - but doing soemthing is better than nothing - stopping clearing and burn backs is not a good strategy. 

[Lacessit]

17 minutes ago, Don Mega said:

I actually feel ashamed to be an Aussie given all the whinging and outrage expressed towards ScoMo... Absolutely disgusting.

Well, when you see an idiot brandishing a lump of coal in Federal Parliament as part of his climate change denial shtick, then taking off to Hawaii in the middle of a national crisis, I'm fairly disgusted too.

[Lacessit]

17 minutes ago, Salerno said:

Where did you hear that <deleted>?

From a CFA captain. Think about it. If you were a firefighter, would you want collapsing live wires falling on you?

Edited January 1, 2020 by Lacessit

[RJRS1301]

2 minutes ago, Don Mega said:

My comment was based upon all the outrage and whinging (social media and news outlets) he was on holiday as though if was not on holiday the bushfires would be under control.

 

Not sure what these delusional people thought he could dob y coming home but here we are.

 

Now crawl back in you hole oldmate.

It was another demonstration of his cloth ears, his inability lead, and his inability to initiate ideas, his refusal to listen to his fire commissioners past and present.

His ability to send prayers and wishes for a miracle.

His demonstration of being a happy clapping incompetent

[Olmate]

20 minutes ago, Don Mega said:

I actually feel ashamed to be an Aussie given all the whinging and outrage expressed towards ScoMo... Absolutely disgusting.

I am ashamed at your lack of knowledge of Australia then sport, especially bush fire prevention.But do tell us how good is scomo, guess your into franking credits too?

[Salerno]

5 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

From a CFA captain. Think about it. If you were a firefighter, would you want collapsing live wires falling on you?

You misunderstood or he's talking <deleted>. We're talking about a bushfire here not structural. No way in hell does CFA ask power companies (and yes, they have to ask) to cut off whole communities. As you said, "think about it".

[Lacessit]

5 minutes ago, Salerno said:

You misunderstood or he's talking <deleted>. We're talking about a bushfire here not structural. No way in hell does CFA ask power companies (and yes, they have to ask) to cut off whole communities. As you said, "think about it".

Obviously I am wasting my time trying to explain facts to you, goodbye.

[Salerno]

3 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

Obviously I am wasting my time trying to explain facts to you, goodbye.

Please try and explain a fact, I'm listening.

[Chazar]

1 hour ago, Lacessit said:

It's true eucalypts regrow shoots of leaves on the trunks a few months after a fire. It's a bit more difficult for them to do that when they are burnt down to a stub.

There are  many  hundreds  of varieties of  Eucalypts in fact I  have a 3  volume set on these trees. Most  have lignotubers and they will resprout

Edited January 1, 2020 by Chazar

[Sujo]

27 minutes ago, Salerno said:

You misunderstood or he's talking <deleted>. We're talking about a bushfire here not structural. No way in hell does CFA ask power companies (and yes, they have to ask) to cut off whole communities. As you said, "think about it".

No they dont have to ask. They have authority. And yes, they do cut powerlines.

 

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-australia-50483410

Edited January 1, 2020 by Sujo

[RJRS1301]

13 minutes ago, Chazar said:

There are  many  hundreds  of varieties of  Eucalypts in fact I  have a 3  volume set on these trees. Most  have lignotubers and they will resprout

Good, tell that to the arbourists and others who are currently looking at the devastation in many areas

The roots have been burned , soil sterile. I am sure they will value your expertise and skills.

Have you been here for the past 3 weeks to witness the devastation, and see the soil samples at the UNSW and SCU?

Not to mention many of the trees have exploded in the heat

I lived through Ash Wednesday, and saw much regeneration, yes they in some circumstances do re sprout, but the heat remaining in the ground after these fires in many areas is much worse. Nothing in recorded european history, the ground is smoldering at Borree ridge 3 weeks after the fires were extinguished. Peat fires in Northern NSW have been reigniting for 3 months now.

 

Edited January 1, 2020 by RJRS1301

[Salerno]

4 minutes ago, Sujo said:

No they dont have to ask. They have authority. And yes, they do cut powerlines.

 

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-australia-50483410

That's SA not Vic. and yes CFA have to ask and get confirmation from power companies that the power is off when required e.g. structural fires, incidents involving downed powerlines.

Edited January 1, 2020 by Salerno

[Lacessit]

1 minute ago, Salerno said:

That's SA not Vic.

It seems you have never heard of the aphorism that when you are in a hole, you should stop digging.

[Salerno]

If you say so mate.

[Chazar]

6 minutes ago, RJRS1301 said:

Good, tell that to the arbourists and others who are currently looking at the devastation in many areas

The roots have been burned , soil sterile. I am sure they will value your expertise and skills.

Have you been here for the past 3 weeks to witness the devastation, and see the soil samples at the UNSW and SCU?

Not to mention many of the trees have exploded in the heat