Retirement Visa - Joint Bank Account Invalid

[thaireg]

I have extended my visa for retirement purposes for the previous 2 years with no problems using the same 3 month bank account in my name and my Thai wife's name.

Last week I made the trip to Chiang Mai Immigration with my wife and the official told her that I could no longer use a joint bank account for my application and that it has to be an ordinary savings account in my name only.

I had to return home and, the following day, open a new savings account in my name and get a new letter from the bank.

On my return to the immigration office the new account book was accepted but it was pointed out that the funds I was declaring had not been in the account for 3 months prior to my application. Obviously not, as it was a new account.

I was given a 3 month extension to my visa and told that if the funds were still in the account when the 3 months expired they would extend the visa for a further 9 months.

I queried this change of account procedure with a high ranking officer and she agreed that this was now a requirement.

Of course, I have to pay twice for my visa and have the inconvenience of another trip in 3 months.

[aussiestyle1983]

I have extended my visa for retirement purposes for the previous 2 years with no problems using the same 3 month bank account in my name and my Thai wife's name.

Last week I made the trip to Chiang Mai Immigration with my wife and the official told her that I could no longer use a joint bank account for my application and that it has to be an ordinary savings account in my name only.

I had to return home and, the following day, open a new savings account in my name and get a new letter from the bank.

On my return to the immigration office the new account book was accepted but it was pointed out that the funds I was declaring had not been in the account for 3 months prior to my application. Obviously not, as it was a new account.

I was given a 3 month extension to my visa and told that if the funds were still in the account when the 3 months expired they would extend the visa for a further 9 months.

I queried this change of account procedure with a high ranking officer and she agreed that this was now a requirement.

Of course, I have to pay twice for my visa and have the inconvenience of another trip in 3 months.

Well done guyham for your excellent two posts!

It sucks to here what happened. I know the money has to be in the account 3 months in advance, but then they told you to open a new account in your name only so obviously the money would of just been transfered in. It would of been nice if they said "just show us the transfer slip from you old to your new account, this will be ok because this is what WE SAID YOU HAVE TO DO"

But then, they were just following the RULES, you know it is very very important for govnt officials to follow rules here in LOS........................

Edited April 8, 2007 by aussiestyle1983

[astral]

It would be good if changes in the rules, like this one, were publicized, not just sneaked in.

[cruyff]

i live here in thailand for 5 years with a retirement visa. But this year i will not be able to extend my visa because of my to low bankaccount. I am married with a thai woman and we have 2children. Is it possible that i can change my visa for a visa based on married with a thai woman. I have a monthly pension of more than 40k per month. Thanks in advance for the answer

[IMA_FARANG]

I have extended my visa for retirement purposes for the previous 2 years with no problems using the same 3 month bank account in my name and my Thai wife's name.

Last week I made the trip to Chiang Mai Immigration with my wife and the official told her that I could no longer use a joint bank account for my application and that it has to be an ordinary savings account in my name only.

I had to return home and, the following day, open a new savings account in my name and get a new letter from the bank.

On my return to the immigration office the new account book was accepted but it was pointed out that the funds I was declaring had not been in the account for 3 months prior to my application. Obviously not, as it was a new account.

I was given a 3 month extension to my visa and told that if the funds were still in the account when the 3 months expired they would extend the visa for a further 9 months.

I queried this change of account procedure with a high ranking officer and she agreed that this was now a requirement.

Of course, I have to pay twice for my visa and have the inconvenience of another trip in 3 months.

I'm about to be doing my first retirement visa process in about 12 months or so. I've been watching this forum carefully for any details or changes to the procedure. I think it was said about 6 months ago(?) that the requirement for first time applicants was a bank account in the applicants name only, not a joint account. I currently have a joint account which I use to transfer money for my Thai family. As i recall at that time the question of non first time applicants was assumed to be that they would be "grandfathered" in if they already had a joint account.

Seems like any "grandfather" hope is now out of the window.

Thanks for giving us the valid info now. It looks like the screws are being slowly tightened on retirees also.

Edited April 8, 2007 by IMA_FARANG

[ProThaiExpat]

I hope lopburi3 weighs in on this thread as I see an ambiguity or lack of information being promulgated.

Clearly, a single retiree seeking a one year extension must have a sole owner bank account. This thread seems to indicate that married men must likewise have a single owner bank account.

However, if a falang is married to a Thai, why would he seek a retirement visa, where a higher balance is required, than obtain a visa based on his marriage to a Thai or a visa in support of a Thai? I just don't know the answers to these questions.

[pnustedt]

However, if a falang is married to a Thai, why would he seek a retirement visa, where a higher balance is required, than obtain a visa based on his marriage to a Thai or a visa in support of a Thai? I just don't know the answers to these questions.

The imm. officer will normally try to persuade an applicant who qualifies for an extension based on retirement to go down that route because it is less hassle. For an extension based on marriage the imm. officer has to get police a report and the applicant has to go back a month later (or maybe several times) before the extension for a year is granted, whereas the retirement extension can be granted on the spot. When I originally applied for an extension I had to insist that it was to be based on marriage.

[lopburi3]

Below answers several posts:

I have never heard of any immigration officer demanding the account be passbook savings for retirement (for old support Thai wife yes). In fact most have been happy to accept fixed deposit accounts. So am not sure this is general policy or policy of Chiang Mai.

A joint account has always been accepted but the account balance had to be twice the normal amount - for retirement the account would have to hold 1,600 and could be used as the basis of retirement visas for a couple. If only 800k available it should be only in applicants name. It may be that Chiang Mai policy is now not to allow any joint account (which I personally believe would be a bad decision for those married).

There is no option anymore to seek extension of stay on basis of bank account for those married but not already in the system.

Having 40k income/pension, letter from embassy and being married you could change to that extension of stay - remember to bring the wife and all the papers.

[thaireg]

However, if a falang is married to a Thai, why would he seek a retirement visa, where a higher balance is required, than obtain a visa based on his marriage to a Thai or a visa in support of a Thai? I just don't know the answers to these questions.

I switched from a "Thai Wife" extension 2 years ago for 2 reasons.

1. Same-day service, less hassle.

2. In the past retirement extensions have been grandfathered but Thai Wife extensions have not (e.g. increased required amount from 200,000 to 400,000 baht)

A joint account has always been accepted but the account balance had to be twice the normal amount - for retirement the account would have to hold 1,600 and could be used as the basis of retirement visas for a couple. If only 800k available it should be only in applicants name. It may be that Chiang Mai policy is now not to allow any joint account (which I personally believe would be a bad decision for those married).

I repeat that I have used my original joint account book on 2 previous occasions with no problem. There was less than 800,000 baht in the account but, taking my pension into account, I had enough to satisfy the qualification requirements.

[tomallison]

A topic that interests me. thaireq does not state the amount that he had in the joint account.

As previously stated, up to now I have had retirement extensions with a joint account (below 16k baht).

Now I am concerned that my next application will be refused with the same joint account.

As I still have several months to go, I will raise the question with my local Imm Officer during my next visit.

Will keep you posted.

[tomallison]

Just to correct my previous post, my joint account figure should read (below 1600k baht) Obviously it was 800k baht plus (no pensions) this satisfied the Immigration Officers requirements then.

[phuketrichard]

i live here in thailand for 5 years with a retirement visa. But this year i will not be able to extend my visa because of my to low bankaccount. I am married with a thai woman and we have 2children. Is it possible that i can change my visa for a visa based on married with a thai woman. I have a monthly pension of more than 40k per month. Thanks in advance for the answer

Hey

I to am in the same situation as I have had my retirement extension for 5 years as well.

I do not have the 800,000 so i went to immigration here in phuket and i asked about getting one cause i have a thai kid... they said sure. (no wife) They asked me why i didn't get the same retirement visa and i told them i didn't have enough money. They asked how much do u have , I said 100,000 :-)

They know me so knew i was joking.

They told me i could do it if i had 500,000 in the bank 3 months in advance. I told them the law says i don't need any money in the bank and they just smiled.

So although u can get it in Bangkok with Sunbelts help and with no money in the bank I have yet to hear of anyone getting it on their own.

Since i am in Phuket it would cost me over 15,000 baht to go and have them do it in Bangkok so cheaper to borrow the money i need and pay interest.

You should be able to apply for the extension as ur married to a thai and as your pension quailifies you

AS to dif between the previous extension based on marriage vs retirment.

NOTE this applies to PHUKET

for marriage they have to send all the paperwork to bangkok, same as if u applied for extension based on SUPPORT of thai child.

Retirement extension could be issued that day ( usually takes about 45 mon for everything)

NOW u are allowed to apply for an extension

if ur over 50 and have a thai child LAW states no money needed in the bank but as i siad Phuket wants to see 500,000 in for 3 months.

Has anyone gotten this extensionn based on a thai child EXCEPT those that Sunbelt helped?

I have asked before and no one has responded,

Each immigration is a law unto themselves...

Edited April 9, 2007 by phuketrichard

[h5kaf]

Phuket Richard has a very good point for those in Phuket. I also have made the necessary enquiries and got the same answer. I have had a variety of extensions over the years, at least 2 on being married to a Thai, and the rest on retirement. I have a Thai born daughter and therefore e-mailed Sunbelt to find out if I could get the extension on this basis, but do everything from their Phuket Office (I assume they have one). I have had no reply to my e-mail. It seems that Sunbelt will answer on the Forum (good publicity??) but private e-mails go unanswered. Oh well.

[phuketrichard]

Hey'

they did respond to my email and told me to come to bangkok. There office in Phuket does not do immigration only land deals

so

6,500 for them

7,500 for airfare

1,500 for a room for the night

500 for taxi's

500 for food

easier to borrow to make up the dif..

Edited April 9, 2007 by phuketrichard

[samtam]

I have just (4 April) applied for my first retirement visa based on funds on a three month fixed deposit in a joint account. I was applying with my partner, and he also got the visa on the same funds basis. The funds total was over THB1.6m, in two deposits each of THB800k, both in joint names. The letter from the bank (one for each of us in our own names) stated that we had over THB1.6m in total. There was absolutely no problem. Our application was processed at Suan Plu. I was slightly nervous about the joint account situation, but my fears were unfounded. Maybe Chiang Mai Immigration applies different rules, or maybe the bank letter you used needs to be more "creative", showing that you are the owner of at least THB800k.

[Teatea]

Hi Santam

Did you need to prove that your 800k came from oversea?

I have worked in Thailand for 12 years (work permit) and therefore I have over 800K in my local bank account to meet the retirement requirement. It would be silly if I have to send my money oversea and then send it back paying fees unnecessary.

Teatea

I have just (4 April) applied for my first retirement visa based on funds on a three month fixed deposit in a joint account. I was applying with my partner, and he also got the visa on the same funds basis. The funds total was over THB1.6m, in two deposits each of THB800k, both in joint names. The letter from the bank (one for each of us in our own names) stated that we had over THB1.6m in total. There was absolutely no problem. Our application was processed at Suan Plu. I was slightly nervous about the joint account situation, but my fears were unfounded. Maybe Chiang Mai Immigration applies different rules, or maybe the bank letter you used needs to be more "creative", showing that you are the owner of at least THB800k.

[applesple]

i live here in thailand for 5 years with a retirement visa. But this year i will not be able to extend my visa because of my to low bankaccount. I am married with a thai woman and we have 2children. Is it possible that i can change my visa for a visa based on married with a thai woman. I have a monthly pension of more than 40k per month. Thanks in advance for the answer

Hey

I to am in the same situation as I have had my retirement extension for 5 years as well.

I do not have the 800,000 so i went to immigration here in phuket and i asked about getting one cause i have a thai kid... they said sure. (no wife) They asked me why i didn't get the same retirement visa and i told them i didn't have enough money. They asked how much do u have , I said 100,000 :-)

They know me so knew i was joking.

They told me i could do it if i had 500,000 in the bank 3 months in advance. I told them the law says i don't need any money in the bank and they just smiled.

So although u can get it in Bangkok with Sunbelts help and with no money in the bank I have yet to hear of anyone getting it on their own.

Since i am in Phuket it would cost me over 15,000 baht to go and have them do it in Bangkok so cheaper to borrow the money i need and pay interest.

You should be able to apply for the extension as ur married to a thai and as your pension quailifies you

AS to dif between the previous extension based on marriage vs retirment.

NOTE this applies to PHUKET

for marriage they have to send all the paperwork to bangkok, same as if u applied for extension based on SUPPORT of thai child.

Retirement extension could be issued that day ( usually takes about 45 mon for everything)

NOW u are allowed to apply for an extension

if ur over 50 and have a thai child LAW states no money needed in the bank but as i siad Phuket wants to see 500,000 in for 3 months.

Has anyone gotten this extensionn based on a thai child EXCEPT those that Sunbelt helped?

I have asked before and no one has responded,

Each immigration is a law unto themselves...

I never heard that anyone get a visa under SUPPORT thai child. Anyway, i also once ask Province Officer and Bangkok Officer about this type of Visa, They both said now thialand not open to apply yet. "You can not get a Visa just only you support Thai child then every Farang have a Thai child"

If Subbelt got a visa in this case, please can you kindly to give me a suggestion.

[phuketrichard]

Each immigration is a law unto themselves...

I never heard that anyone get a visa under SUPPORT thai child. Anyway, i also once ask Province Officer and Bangkok Officer about this type of Visa, They both said now thialand not open to apply yet. "You can not get a Visa just only you support Thai child then every Farang have a Thai child"

If Subbelt got a visa in this case, please can you kindly to give me a suggestion.

First;

It matters not where the money came from as long as, for retirement extesnion, 800,000 is in the bank for 3 months in ur name

second

There is no longer a extension for supporting a thai child. That was last year and u had to show 400,000 in the bank. If u had it before your grandfathered in and can get it again.

There is a NEW section that allows a extension to be issued if your over 50 and HAVE (NOT suppport) a thai child

No money is required in the bank and Sunbelt has said they have obtained this visa in Bangkok for clients/

They charge 6,500 for thier service

I have yet to see anyone post that they obtained it on their own.

Immigration knows the law as you can show it to them in thai BUT they choose to not follow it.

Edited April 9, 2007 by phuketrichard

[samtam]

Hi Santam

Did you need to prove that your 800k came from oversea?

I have worked in Thailand for 12 years (work permit) and therefore I have over 800K in my local bank account to meet the retirement requirement. It would be silly if I have to send my money oversea and then send it back paying fees unnecessary.

Teatea

No, I did not have to prove that the money came from overseas. In fact they didn't seem terribly curious about the funds, but as I suggested, the letter from the bank, (HSBC) was very explicit, so maybe that is what clinched it.

[patinseoul]

just turned fifty, so went to bank of ayudaha in phuket to open an account to start the ball rolling for the retirement visa.

i have to say that the notice:

must have land or work permit to open a new account

was nicely printed ( in english) and well displayed inside the the new accounts cubicle.

i asked about the new account so i can start the process for a retirement visa, but they said:

must have land or work permit to open a new account.

you wanna buy land?

no

you working?

no

you can open account with thai person

maybe too strong a no, but did not say f-no or no <deleted> way

two signatures needed all the time!

no thanks

alot of silence and it's som tam time smiles

ok thanks, bye

bye

[phuketrichard]

Hey go to the new branch of the bangkok bank in Junk Ceylon. No problem opening an acocunt there. Good friend of mine works there

Cant belive it said must have land.. Farang can not own/have land LOL

[Teatea]

Hi Santam

Did you need to prove that your 800k came from oversea?

I have worked in Thailand for 12 years (work permit) and therefore I have over 800K in my local bank account to meet the retirement requirement. It would be silly if I have to send my money oversea and then send it back paying fees unnecessary.

Teatea

No, I did not have to prove that the money came from overseas. In fact they didn't seem terribly curious about the funds, but as I suggested, the letter from the bank, (HSBC) was very explicit, so maybe that is what clinched it.

Samtam,

Thanks for your information. However, to be clear, did the bank state that your money came from oversea? Sunbelt personnel in Bangkok office told me I need to transfer 800,000 Baht from oversea to the local bank account for three months to meet the requirement for first time retirement visa application?

Teatea

[samtam]

Hi Santam

Did you need to prove that your 800k came from oversea?

I have worked in Thailand for 12 years (work permit) and therefore I have over 800K in my local bank account to meet the retirement requirement. It would be silly if I have to send my money oversea and then send it back paying fees unnecessary.

Teatea

No, I did not have to prove that the money came from overseas. In fact they didn't seem terribly curious about the funds, but as I suggested, the letter from the bank, (HSBC) was very explicit, so maybe that is what clinched it.

Samtam,

Thanks for your information. However, to be clear, did the bank state that your money came from oversea? Sunbelt personnel in Bangkok office told me I need to transfer 800,000 Baht from oversea to the local bank account for three months to meet the requirement for first time retirement visa application?

Teatea

No, (as I said above), the bank did not state where the funds came from.

[marshbags]

Below answers several posts:

I have never heard of any immigration officer demanding the account be passbook savings for retirement (for old support Thai wife yes). In fact most have been happy to accept fixed deposit accounts. So am not sure this is general policy or policy of Chiang Mai.

A joint account has always been accepted but the account balance had to be twice the normal amount - for retirement the account would have to hold 1,600 and could be used as the basis of retirement visas for a couple. If only 800k available it should be only in applicants name. It may be that Chiang Mai policy is now not to allow any joint account (which I personally believe would be a bad decision for those married).

There is no option anymore to seek extension of stay on basis of bank account for those married but not already in the system.

Having 40k income/pension, letter from embassy and being married you could change to that extension of stay - remember to bring the wife and all the papers.

Hiya Lopburi

Following advice from my local Kasikorn branch regarding the best way to ensure my wife gets control of my bank account and be able to use it as her registered account for transferable pension purposes ect. ect.

I opened a joint account, transfering the money from the original one, that was in my sole name over 3 years ago.

They told / advised me if i didn,t do this then my wife would have to engage a lawyer to sort it out and she would have to pay him act on her behalf, will or no will by the way.

There was no question of the bank not acting in our best interests as they genuinely where and i feel sure they will be distressed by the implications of this new ruling.

There has never been any objections or even the slightest hint of this not being acceptable on my previous yearly visas.

Am i now, as it appears going to be refused my renewal in " 8 " weeks time due to this new situation ?

It is not helped by the fact that i am about to go back home and the time factors are well against me at this late stage to act on changing things.

Is it officially nationwide and if it is can i get a visa for being over fifty and officially registered as having sole custody of my daughter who was conceived by a previous marriage.

Can you or Sunbelt locate the official version on the sudden change in circumstances that the O.P. has experienced or is once again down to the respective areas one uses please ?

I won,t panic yet but my bums already chewing me chair seat. and

Thanks in advance for your patience and understanding.

marshbags

Edited April 12, 2007 by marshbags

[lopburi3]

I would ask the office you plan to use but I suspect this was a local decision or misunderstanding. It may be there was little or no account activity/funds transferred in from overseas and they made a decision to use this as an excuse. I can see no reason for those married not be be able to use a joint account (but can understand if they say twice the money must be in it).

[marshbags]

I would ask the office you plan to use but I suspect this was a local decision or misunderstanding. It may be there was little or no account activity/funds transferred in from overseas and they made a decision to use this as an excuse. I can see no reason for those married not be be able to use a joint account (but can understand if they say twice the money must be in it).

Thanks Lopburi.

I hope to be able to make an appt. to see the officer in charge and see if i am o.k. or what options i might have should it come to it.

Nong Khai has in the past always been a decent Place over the years.

I,ve always kept well over the 400,000 baht requirement in my current account and have additional back up for emergencies, along with swift facilities.

I also understand your logic on the twice as much in a joint account when the wife is contributing to it,s upkeep.

On another way of looking at it, when it,s obvious that it,s funded from my U.K. sources of which they ask for proof of course re money laundering ect.

I cannot see the single / joint situation being different if you apply as a married person using one or the other for support, otherwise they have to apply the same line of thought surely ?????

Not a criticism of your interpretation Lopburi, just my logical side of things trying to do the impossible and figure their objectives out.

T.I.T. , but still cannot get my head around it.

They determined that ex amount was needed for supporting purposes ( in my case 400,000 ) no mention of it being double ( I think ??????????? ) when they introduced the latest deposit requirements.

It reminds me of the lack of incentive to get legally married in the U.K. as it saves money to live together as 2 individuals, and yes pop pickers this is Thailand and not another country, i know, i know, i knowwww

Never mind, what will be, will be

marshbags

Edited April 12, 2007 by marshbags

[Teatea]

Hi Santam

Did you need to prove that your 800k came from oversea?

I have worked in Thailand for 12 years (work permit) and therefore I have over 800K in my local bank account to meet the retirement requirement. It would be silly if I have to send my money oversea and then send it back paying fees unnecessary.

Teatea

No, I did not have to prove that the money came from overseas. In fact they didn't seem terribly curious about the funds, but as I suggested, the letter from the bank, (HSBC) was very explicit, so maybe that is what clinched it.

Samtam,

Thanks for your information. However, to be clear, did the bank state that your money came from oversea? Sunbelt personnel in Bangkok office told me I need to transfer 800,000 Baht from oversea to the local bank account for three months to meet the requirement for first time retirement visa application?

Teatea

No, (as I said above), the bank did not state where the funds came from.

Thanks Samtam

Teatea

[dinfisher]

I have just (4 April) applied for my first retirement visa based on funds on a three month fixed deposit in a joint account. I was applying with my partner, and he also got the visa on the same funds basis. The funds total was over THB1.6m, in two deposits each of THB800k, both in joint names. The letter from the bank (one for each of us in our own names) stated that we had over THB1.6m in total. There was absolutely no problem. Our application was processed at Suan Plu. I was slightly nervous about the joint account situation, but my fears were unfounded. Maybe Chiang Mai Immigration applies different rules, or maybe the bank letter you used needs to be more "creative", showing that you are the owner of at least THB800k.

I asked my lawyer about a new rule that invalidates joint bank accounts for renewal of retirement visas and he said he has heard of no such law but states that each immigration office and indeed each officer in those offices has his own interpretation of the rules. I married my farang wife in Thailand in 1970 when I was working here and we have 3 marriage certificates including one from a Thai Amphur in Bangkok. I did show this document initially when I got my first retirement visa and it was at this stage when I was making preparations for one for my wife who was coming in later that the Singkhon immigration office siad that I should go away and change my account to a joint one and then the 800,000 baht would do for both mwe and my wife. That worked and has done ever since so it is a shock to hear that there may be a new regulation that means I have to have 1.6 million or more in 2 separate accounts! David Fsiher

[lopburi3]

If you received two retirement extensions of stay on one joint account of 800k you were very lucky indeed. It requires 800k each to receive a retirement extension of stay. But there is no need for a retirement extension of stay for those married couples and the non retirement spouse can extend on the basis of the retirement extension spouse. Are you sure that is not what you actually have done? If not it was an individual office/officer decision and does not seem to have been policy from other accounts.