1 minute ago, Rookiescot said:

Facts is it?

 

Shortages of beds. Shortages of staff. Shortages of PPE. 

 

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/mar/21/doctors-warn-coronavirus-could-overwhelm-nhs-intensive-care

And the Coronavirus was so predictable, how did Boris miss it when the rest of us saw it coming 500 years ago.

Keep up the Boris Bashing.

19 minutes ago, vogie said:

Trying your hand at being Septic Pegg now, you just contradict anything that anyone says.

No he doesn't (????)

5 minutes ago, vogie said:

And the Coronavirus was so predictable, how did Boris miss it when the rest of us saw it coming 500 years ago.

Keep up the Boris Bashing.

 

Absolutely, the Robert Koch Insitute published a paper in 2012 warning of a coronavirus pandemic.

 

It was very predictable, and it was predicted.

 

But governments didn't listen.

9 minutes ago, evadgib said:

No he doesn't (????)

Oh yes I do ????

11 minutes ago, vogie said:

And the Coronavirus was so predictable, how did Boris miss it when the rest of us saw it coming 500 years ago.

Keep up the Boris Bashing.

It was when we could see what was happening in China and Italy.

But the government has handled this so badly that we dont even have enough PPE for NHS staff.

Read the article I linked to.

I suppose all those experts like the BMA must be Boris bashing too?

1 hour ago, Opl said:

i would like you to substantiate and above all share a link so that I can understand. Thanks.    

French border guards impound trucks filled with 130,000 face masks bound for Britain for NHS workers battling coronavirus

One of several seen yesterday.

HTH

The German government got a paper that predicted it in 2012:

 

https://www.disclose.tv/pandemic-research-paper-by-the-german-government-from-2012-389626

5 minutes ago, Rookiescot said:

It was when we could see what was happening in China and Italy.

But the government has handled this so badly that we dont even have enough PPE for NHS staff.

Read the article I linked to.

I suppose all those experts like the BMA must be Boris bashing too?

Oh come on, nobody will know how this has been handled for quite some time to come, some of us might not be so fortunate to be around to see the outcome, but it is the PMs job to instill confidence in the country and he and his team are just doing that. Alarm and despondency helps no-one.

Hindsight is a wonderfull thing, nobody saw this coming therefore it is impossible to plan and prepare for such a worldwide pandemic. In Boris we trust.

 

Saying one day 'This could be over in 12 weeks' and the next day 'We will be overwhelmed, the numbers are stark'....does not instill confidence.

 

It does the opposite, as the panic buying pandemic in the UK shows.

33 minutes ago, vogie said:

And the Coronavirus was so predictable, how did Boris miss it when the rest of us saw it coming 500 years ago.

Keep up the Boris Bashing.

Yes. The rest of us saw lack of leadership skills, being a populist/Putinist boy way ahead of all this

coming.

 

True that.

 

3 minutes ago, vogie said:

Oh come on, nobody will know how this has been handled for quite some time to come, some of us might not be so fortunate to be around to see the outcome, but it is the PMs job to instill confidence in the country and he and his team are just doing that. Alarm and despondency helps no-one.

Hindsight is a wonderfull thing, nobody saw this coming therefore it is impossible to plan and prepare for such a worldwide pandemic. In Boris we trust.

 

Johnson was well warned. He could see what was happening the same as the rest of us.

He chose to protect the economy not people.

We were and still are two weeks behind Italy. The measures Italy put in place two weeks ago should have been implemented in the UK immediately so we could get ahead of the contagion and be proactive. This would have saved lives.

In stead we got some nonsense about herd immunity and carry on regardless. 

1 minute ago, Rookiescot said:

Johnson was well warned. He could see what was happening the same as the rest of us.

He chose to protect the economy not people.

We were and still are two weeks behind Italy. The measures Italy put in place two weeks ago should have been implemented in the UK immediately so we could get ahead of the contagion and be proactive. This would have saved lives.

In stead we got some nonsense about herd immunity and carry on regardless. 

The economy is important too, ask any remainer.???? 

 

I don't think we should be looking at Italy as an example, although when I wash my hands now I sing Nessum Dorma instead of 'Happy Birthday to you.' and I prefer to put our trust in the top experts on this subject than a bunch of armchair virologists.

8 minutes ago, Rookiescot said:

Johnson was well warned. He could see what was happening the same as the rest of us.

He chose to protect the economy not people.

We were and still are two weeks behind Italy. The measures Italy put in place two weeks ago should have been implemented in the UK immediately so we could get ahead of the contagion and be proactive. This would have saved lives.

In stead we got some nonsense about herd immunity and carry on regardless. 

 

Go BoJo.

 

He’s doing a great job; just the man for the job.

 

 

Fortunately, your politicised opinion counts for Jack. Boris will be judged on his actions/results and I think he will come out fine.

 

Get over it. As a hater you can hate....... but it counts for zilch.

10 minutes ago, Rookiescot said:

Johnson was well warned. He could see what was happening the same as the rest of us.

He chose to protect the economy not people.

We were and still are two weeks behind Italy. The measures Italy put in place two weeks ago should have been implemented in the UK immediately so we could get ahead of the contagion and be proactive. This would have saved lives.

In stead we got some nonsense about herd immunity and carry on regardless. 

And where did the advice about herd immunity come from 

Sir Patrick said he hoped the government's approach to tackling the virus would create a "herd immunity in the UK".

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-51865915

2 hours ago, vogie said:

he cannot do any more.

Bojo is the voice of the Tories and the Tories could have done a lot more for the NHS over the last decade. Was his statement on Mar 3rd misleading or misinformed?

 

"UK Prime Minister Boris Johnson says the country is well prepared for the "likely" spread of coronavirus."

https://www.bbc.com/news/av/uk-51706391/coronavirus-pm-boris-johnson-says-the-uk-is-well-prepared

 

Bojo himself could have reacted better as soon as the problem became apparent in China but arrogance ruled the day.

Back in 2002, Europe was protected to a great extent from the SARS outbreak by the Asian countries and a much lower level of human traffic. Arrogance in the west sees problems in the east as of their own making and couldn't possibly happen to them.

Bottom line here is he underestimated the problem and overestimated the ability to cope.

Didn't even pay attention when Italy started to replicate China, something that will cost the UK dearly.

1 hour ago, evadgib said:

French border guards impound trucks filled with 130,000 face masks bound for Britain for NHS workers battling coronavirus

One of several seen yesterday.

HTH

Thanks.

 

All countries face the same shortage in protective gear for Hospitals, the needs are huge. China, India, are the main providers and can't meet the demand due to the pandemic.

China banned the exports of coronavirus PPE restricting supplies to the rest of the world. 

 http://www.pulsetoday.co.uk/clinical/clinical-specialties/respiratory-/ban-on-chinese-exports-of-coronavirus-ppe-restricting-supplies-to-uk/20040385.article

 

"On the frontline are hospitals and health workers, who are already under strain in parts of Europe and facing shortages of medical equipment, particularly in Italy, which has become the epicentre of the pandemic. To protect its own supplies for the fight against the coronavirus, the European Commission on Sunday imposed restrictions on exports of masks and other protective medical equipment as it seeks. 

“We adopted today an export authorisation scheme for protective equipment. This means that such medical goods can only be exported to non-EU countries with the explicit authorisation of the EU governments,” von der Leyen said.

 

France alone needs 24 Millions masks per week just for professionals in Hospitals - and for them only. You as an individual can't buy them in France.

There were about 3 weeks available (86 M and among them 5M of PPE)  so, the  French government decided  the requisition of all the masks,   

March, 3,  France's Macron has announced the government will take control of current and future stocks of face masks to ensure they could go to health workers and coronavirus patients. 

  

France has 3 factories left manufacturing PPE that managed to tripple their productions, 24/7 and it's still not enough and far from it. They actually strive to speed up and increase their supplies, France is testing  40 other types of masks. to meet the global needs.      

One of these factory is Valmy. Here I translate what it's CEO said; " What happened was that three or four weeks ago, when the first cases were detected in the UK, the NHS, the British health care system, immediately activated its plan to fight the pandemic. This required the delivery of several million masks that we produced. , scheduled over several weeks. And there we face a big problem. The requisition does not allow us to deliver them and this is a problem because the NHS is the biggest customer for our masks all year long , "

 

If I refer to the situation you decribed as France stealing NHS supplies..( your post n° 20 quote: " This might explain why France has been caught deliberately stopping and trying to divert (ie steal!) lorryloads of PPE destined for NHS hospitals ")    then,  my answer is that there is a hierarchy in the scam and this is not a correct description of the reality.

Italy, then France, are   4, 3 weeks ahead / UK in the coronavirus spread, and the general interest demands this requisition   

 

France is not alone, Germany did it too, 

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-03-09/germany-faces-backlash-from-neighbors-over-mask-export-ban

 

Sorry for this long post  

 

 

Edited March 22, 20206 yr by Opl

2 hours ago, david555 said:

No , true …..But there was a certain opposition leader who hammered and hammered on the crippling of the NHS already before Corona disaster happened ,...blaiming the Conservatives government …...

 

That Also may be said !

 

It is true, but until you answer my question I asked a few days ago I will be selective like you. So no response from me.

1 minute ago, sandyf said:

Bojo is the voice of the Tories and the Tories could have done a lot more for the NHS over the last decade. Was his statement on Mar 3rd misleading or misinformed?

 

"UK Prime Minister Boris Johnson says the country is well prepared for the "likely" spread of coronavirus."

https://www.bbc.com/news/av/uk-51706391/coronavirus-pm-boris-johnson-says-the-uk-is-well-prepared

 

Bojo himself could have reacted better as soon as the problem became apparent in China but arrogance ruled the day.

Back in 2002, Europe was protected to a great extent from the SARS outbreak by the Asian countries and a much lower level of human traffic. Arrogance in the west sees problems in the east as of their own making and couldn't possibly happen to them.

Bottom line here is he underestimated the problem and overestimated the ability to cope.

Didn't even pay attention when Italy started to replicate China, something that will cost the UK dearly.

Yes keep on hating Boris, that'll make this horrible virus go away. Everything is down to Big Bad Boris. Boris cannot just wave a magic wand and this nightmare will go away, we as citizens have to take some responsibility for are own health. 

I have just ordered my voodoo Boris Doll off Lazada, have you got any pins left?

33 minutes ago, vinny41 said:

And where did the advice about herd immunity come from 

Sir Patrick said he hoped the government's approach to tackling the virus would create a "herd immunity in the UK".

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-51865915

Doesn't make it the right approach. When Andrew Marr asked Matt Hancock if it was government policy he evaded the question, wonder why.

Would the public support a policy that meant sacrificing many of the elderly so the workload on the NHS would be reduced in years to come.

3 minutes ago, vogie said:

Yes keep on hating Boris, that'll make this horrible virus go away. Everything is down to Big Bad Boris. Boris cannot just wave a magic wand and this nightmare will go away, we as citizens have to take some responsibility for are own health. 

I have just ordered my voodoo Boris Doll off Lazada, have you got any pins left?

Do not try and claim that Boris Johnson was well prepared and in control - it is fake news.

4 hours ago, Logosone said:

The Robert Koch Institute published a paper in 2012 warning of a coronavirus pandemic and its implications.

Mystic Meg are you. Yes institutes get funding for all sorts from aliens landing to Large Rodent rats overtaking the world.

 

It does not mean every single study is acted upon and studies are conducted for financial gain.

 

I suspect many countries health systems will be struggling regardless as the virus is just too contagious and systems cant cope.

 

So please don't try to make it a political point of view.

Edited March 22, 20206 yr by Laughing Gravy

a person having developed covid-19 and is being treated in hospital;

 

do the hospitals have ways and means to speed up recovery? (compared to staying at home)

or is the treatment in hospital largely limited to O2 enriched air?

 

does it take less time to recover in hospital than at home?

 

5 hours ago, TheDark said:

Europe thanks PM Johnsson for basically kicking out EU healthcare workers from the UK by his gang's actions and culture they brought with them.

 

There are now more healthcare workers in the EU side. Please continue to kick out pesky EU foreigners outside from the UK.

 

 

 

How many health workers have left the UK since the Brexit referendum? How many of those were EU citizens entitled to work in other EU countries? How many non EU citizen health workers left the EU?

 

If you haven't got those facts available then you're making stories up.

The comments by Boris Johnson and UK health officials on coronavirus testing this month are pictured in the graphic, following advice in January that the 'risk to the public remains low'

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8133207/How-Boris-Johnsons-government-changed-tune-coronavirus-testing.html

8 minutes ago, sandyf said:

Do not try and claim that Boris Johnson was well prepared and in control - it is fake news.

 

Do not try and claim that Sturgeon was / is. Or that Corbyn would've been. Or any other world leader is.

 

The chaos and panic has been fueled by fake news, but shows how inept political leaders really are when confronted by emergencies like this. Their risk management planning is <deleted>. All of them.

 

 

1 hour ago, rvaviator said:

Problem with your statement is defining 'who the so called adults are ...' ....

That's easy to answer. Adults are the people who understand that with powers comes responsibilities.

 

 

11 minutes ago, sandyf said:

Do not try and claim that Boris Johnson was well prepared and in control - it is fake news.

The country is behind Boris and his team, that's all you need to know, and wash your hands for 20 seconds and keep a good distance from other people in your proximity. Listen to what Boris is telling you and hopefully some of us might come out of this in one piece. 

And whatever you do, if you are going to sing Auld Lang Syne don't hold hands, especially on the cross over.

7 minutes ago, Baerboxer said:

 

Do not try and claim that Sturgeon was / is. Or that Corbyn would've been. Or any other world leader is.

 

The chaos and panic has been fueled by fake news, but shows how inept political leaders really are when confronted by emergencies like this. Their risk management planning is <deleted>. All of them.

 

 

Nice deflection. This is about the NHS and its capability to cope, not about what Corbyn could have done, let alone about other 'leaders'.

2 minutes ago, Baerboxer said:

 

Do not try and claim that Sturgeon was / is. Or that Corbyn would've been. Or any other world leader is.

 

The chaos and panic has been fueled by fake news, but shows how inept political leaders really are when confronted by emergencies like this. Their risk management planning is <deleted>. All of them.

 

 

"Do not try and claim that"

 

If you wish to comment, keep it in context, nothing claimed in respect of any other name..

Could be....it is!!!!