Insurgents Burn Female Villager Alive

[endure]

His name was Salman Rushdie and it wasn't a translation of the Qur'an, it was a novel called 'The Satanic Verses'.

[solent01]

His name was Salman Rushdie and it wasn't a translation of the Qur'an, it was a novel called 'The Satanic Verses'.

Thats it thanks bmanly/endure, and I did hint my memory was a little foggy

Edited April 11, 2007 by solent01

[taxexile]

news updates on the story.

Villagers parade body of victim; call for justice

More than 1,000 Yala residents carried the charred remains of a murdered woman in a procession to Yala's city hall, where junta chief Sonthi Boonyaratkalin was on a one-day visit about the southern unrest.

The body of Patcharaporn Boonmat, who was shot and burned earlier this week, was paraded through the streets to Yala city hall.

Protesters called for 15 more defence volunteers to be stationed in each village. They also demanded that soldiers stay in the area to provide security and asked officials to bring the perpetrators of the killing to justice.

Patcharaporn was shot by drive-by killers in Yala municipality Wednesday morning. The attackers set her body alight before fleeing.

Gen Sonthi met protesters and saw the charred body. He orderedCol. Shinawatra Mandej, commander of the 1st Yala Regiment task force to tighten security to protect local villagers and speed up working to arrest the gunman.

Gen Sonthi visited Yala Wednesday afternoon to meet with Pranai Suwannarat, head of the Southern Border Provinces Administrative Centre (SBPAC) and Fourth Army Region Commander Lt-Gen Viroch Buacharoon.

Gen Sonthi listened to solutions in addressing the unrest and followed up on the result of the officials' operations.

Insurgents incited the unrest and spread rumours that attacks were the work of government officials, the general said, but local leaders are close to the villagers. They can talk to local people to prevent misunderstanding, he said.

Although the number of insurgent attacks has dropped, the attacks are more violent, and the attackers try to create fear. Gen. Sonthi asked all sides to be patient and to not fall into the trap of insurgents.

Officials surrounded areas and conducted searches in the target areas where curfew has been imposed, he said, so they could seize weapons and arrest suspects.

However, there are some loopholes, so insurgents can still launch attacks, Gen.Sonthi said.

Meanwhile, in Pattani, a roadside bomb exploded in Yarang district, wounding two revenue officials in a van.

The police believe that the bomb was targeting military units patrolling the areas, but the van overtook the soldiers' transport vehicle at the time the bomb was detonated. (TNA)

and

Grisly murder, angry relatives greet Sonthi

BANGKOK POST and REUTERS

Yala _ A Buddhist woman was shot and then set on fire as army chief Gen Sonthi Boonyaratkalin began his inspection tour of the deep South yesterday. On learning of Gen Sonthi's presence, outraged relatives accompanied by about 300 neighbours bore her charred body to the provincial hall in Muang district.

They demanded improved security and tougher action against those responsible for the ongoing violence.

Patcharaporn Bunmas, 26, was attacked before 8am while driving her motorcycle to work at a car inspection firm, Yala police said. She was shot and then set ablaze while still alive, some reports said. Her body was charred beyond recognition.

Grief-stricken relatives also demanded authorities not release suspects after they arrest them.

''It is the most cruel and brutal thing I've seen in my life,'' said Jaran Kongchuay, one of the demonstrators.

''Beheading or burning alive, no one is arrested!'' one of the placards read.

''Will the government please pay closer attention to the three southern border provinces?'' another said.

''It's the work of the same group of militants who are active in this village,'' a police officer said.

Gen Sonthi met the demonstrators' representatives, and had a look at Patcharaporn's body.

He later ordered all military units to improve security for local residents.

In talks with security authorities, community leaders and local politicians, the army chief also ordered an increase in the number of rangers operating in Yala's Bannang Sata district. The area is mountainous and many communities are in isolated valleys, making them convenient hide-outs for separatist militants.

Gen Sonthi said separatist groups in the deep South wanted to trigger divisions among Thai people. He asked people not to be taken in by separatists' efforts to cause disputes between Muslims and Buddhists.

''Don't fall into their trap. Villagers must be patient. The militants want to create a sectarian war,'' he said.

Community leaders and local politicians were expected to help build up understanding between the people and state authorities.

Gen Sonthi said the violence was less frequent of late, but the degree of the violence had intensified. The attackers intended to put fear into people's hearts and to show their influence.

In the area under curfew, security authorities had pressured separatist militants by surrounding and searching communities suspected of being militant hide-outs. As a result, authorities had been able to arrest more suspects and seize more weapons, the army chief said.

Shortly before police found Patcharaporn's body yesterday, a house belonging to Awae Naenoolae, 44, was torched in Yala's Than To district. Police blamed militants.

In Raman district, Wirut Maneeprawat, 19, was shot dead while driving his motorcycle on a local road. His pillion rider, Samun Phetchoengkhao, 47, was injured.

In Pattani's Yarang district, a bomb planted on the roadside exploded, damaging a van transporting five provincial revenue officials. Two of them were injured, M.L. Chanuwat Srithawat, 45, and Somphit Bunpok, 33.

Edited April 12, 2007 by taxexile

[Flysiam]

And no - the insurgents are everything else than nutters - they are highly organized, well trained, calculating - and at the present moment they have the initiative. That should be proof enough for their capabilities.

I appreciate your insight and comments on this topic. Forgive my ignorance on this, but if they are so highly organized, who is their leader? Do they have 'ONE'? I do not believe I have ever seen one that stood out amongst all the 'insurgents' as the leader for whom any negotiations could take place with.

[canuckamuck]

ColPyat I have a question: Yesterday you proved quite decisively that you felt the government was essentially incompetent. How is it that on this issue, you feel they have got the situation cased? At least you seem pretty confident that they know the situation and are making the right moves.

Just seems a bit odd.

[ColPyat]

ColPyat I have a question: Yesterday you proved quite decisively that you felt the government was essentially incompetent. How is it that on this issue, you feel they have got the situation cased? At least you seem pretty confident that they know the situation and are making the right moves.

Just seems a bit odd.

Personally, regarding the South, i believe that grave mistakes have been made by every government, including this one. That doesn't mean though that everything they are doing is incompetent.

[terry57]

These people are not human.

They are animals.

They should be hunted to extinction.

buddhists are a peace loving people with a wonderful religion that they follow, and these muslims down there are killing them. in the most horrific way.

where's this going. ?

you having a laugh right thai buddist peace loving. not the ones in Samui. Muslim relegion is also a peacefull religion. good and bad in all religions

well, at least they dont go around burning and killing people because they arn't buddist's and thats my point.

[ColPyat]

And no - the insurgents are everything else than nutters - they are highly organized, well trained, calculating - and at the present moment they have the initiative. That should be proof enough for their capabilities.

I appreciate your insight and comments on this topic. Forgive my ignorance on this, but if they are so highly organized, who is their leader? Do they have 'ONE'? I do not believe I have ever seen one that stood out amongst all the 'insurgents' as the leader for whom any negotiations could take place with.

I would not know that at the present time. I believe though that there are people in the government, and people who have in the past tried to negotiate who have that knowledge.

One thing that is clear to say is that the attacks are very well coordinated, and executed, including immediate propaganda activities after the attacks. That shows that there is a very intelligent leadership behind this.

[terry57]

These people are not human.

They are animals.

They should be hunted to extinction.

buddhists are a peace loving people with a wonderful religion that they follow, and these muslims down there are killing them. in the most horrific way.

where's this going. ?

Where did the post says that these people were Muslims? It is so easy to do anything and put the blame on Muslims.

oh im very sorry and it must of been "SANTA CLAUS"

i'll give him a good rogering next time im in los.

[Thaddeus]

Call me stupid if you like...... but, if you took out all the insurgents quickly, by whatever means, any civil war would be more than a little on-sided and short-lived...... with far less 'collateral damage' than the current situation..

War is wrong, killing is wrong...... but when you are in one that isn't of your own making, you have to fight using the same rules as the opposition, trying to stick to the established 'how to fight a war' rules laid down in the west years ago, or trying the negotiation table, obviously just doesn't work against terrorist/insurgents. You don't need a report to see that, it is all around us, every day somewhere.

[ColPyat]

ColPyat, I have been reading all your posts and find that your responses are very informative and probably correct. There is only one question, "what is the answer"? What do you think would be the most effective way to end this ongoing problem and bloodshed?

I have no idea.

There is no answer. To illustrate the huge difficulties - Buddhist villagers want a larger Army presence, but Muslim villagers feel that a large Army presence will increase the attacks and would prefer to protect themselves. And both sides have a point there. Any way the Army moves - they will piss off one side.

The only answer is that it will take considerable time before things get better. And i tend to believe that things will most probably get a whole lot worse before they have a chance to be solved on the negotiation table.

Ideally, i believe that a solution similar to Aceh might be the answer one day - no separation, but greater autonomy for the three provinces, with full protection for the Buddhist villagers.

[taxexile]

and do you think that the separatists will settle for a solution that does not include full separation , given the vengeance with which they are pursuing this cause .

there is no compromise with these people.

[canuckamuck]

No the answer is: Killers must be held accountable, and everybody needs to see them held accountable. And Thailand needs to show that it takes it sovereignty seriously. If you give them a piece than this is going to go on and on forever; murder is an unacceptable form of protest. Compromise now and compromise forever.

[ColPyat]

These people are not human.

They are animals.

They should be hunted to extinction.

buddhists are a peace loving people with a wonderful religion that they follow, and these muslims down there are killing them. in the most horrific way.

where's this going. ?

you having a laugh right thai buddist peace loving. not the ones in Samui. Muslim relegion is also a peacefull religion. good and bad in all religions

well, at least they dont go around burning and killing people because they arn't buddist's and thats my point.

Terry - you are very wrong there.

The Tak Bai massacre was done by the Thai state (mostly Buddhist) against Muslim demonstrators. The Buddhist army officers responsible for the terrible decision to stack people on lorries that caused the death of 80 something are still free. There is a long history of oppression, and there is a long list of Muslims who have disappeared without trace during the last years, and are suspected to have been made disappear by the authorities. The lawyer Somchai is the most famous one. High ranking Buddhist police officers are directly implicated.

There were already cases of Buddhist villagers having committed retaliation attacks for the murdered Buddhists against innocent Muslims.

[ColPyat]

No the answer is: Killers must be held accountable, and everybody needs to see them held accountable. And Thailand needs to show that it takes it sovereignty seriously. If you give them a piece than this is going to go on and on forever; murder is an unacceptable form of protest. Compromise now and compromise forever.

So, what do you suggest?

When you don't have evidence, you just create it, and sent the whole army in?

Much good has that sort of strategy done in places such as Iraq.

I really think you should include in your travels Southern Thailand, in order to appreciate the difficulties and the therefore so far fruitless strategies of the government. You can do that - the area is not closed, you just have to go there on your own risk.

[ColPyat]

and do you think that the separatists will settle for a solution that does not include full separation , given the vengeance with which they are pursuing this cause .

there is no compromise with these people.

In Aceh these sort of separatists have compromised, and there the two parties have ended the war with a compromise. There is a clear precedent for such a compromise.

For such a compromise it needs both parties willing to do that. So far though both sides have not yet shown to be ready to do that, not just the separatists. Prem, for example has refused the recommendation of the NRC to ease the tensions by allowing the use of Yawi as a second official language in the three provinces.

[canuckamuck]

So, what do you suggest?

When you don't have evidence, you just create it, and sent the whole army in?

Much good has that sort of strategy done in places such as Iraq.

I really think you should include in your travels Southern Thailand, in order to appreciate the difficulties and the therefore so far fruitless strategies of the government. You can do that - the area is not closed, you just have to go there on your own risk.

Well my wife just came back from a 7 day trip through Hat Yai, Nokorn Sri Tamarat, and a few other spots. I just asked her if she could see any evidence of the army or any action that would suggest the area is at war, like you admit is. She said she never saw any army activity. She said the people there told her they know who the killers are. It’s just that there is no will or no orders to pursue them.

I think if a couple of thousand people had been killed any where else in the world, you would have a very obvious military escalation in the area. In Thailand this is news for page five or six.

I was down there myself about a year ago, I never saw anything at all to suggest any trouble.

[PhilHarries]

I realize that it's a small percentage that are radicals.....but why does the majority remain silent?

One simple reason : FEAR. The majority are largely family people, would any of us stand up and denounce these fanatics if we knew that by doing so we were putting our parents, spouses and children in mortal danger?

Well if majority of the population doesnt support them, I think its high time they stand up and do smth about it. Shear numbers would certainly put these nutters out of business.

Fine in principle but the known insurgents have a multitude of non-operational informants and the protection of the army and police will not be on a 24/7 basis.

Someone queried whether the insurgents were receiving support from their Malaysian cousins, well given that Pattani and the Islamic Malaysian states were once one unified state I think that can be almost stated as a hard fact. Whether all the support and funding comes from this source is open to debate and maybe we should be a little relieved that the more violently radical Islamics are tied up fighting the infidel in another theatre.

[ColPyat]

So, what do you suggest?

When you don't have evidence, you just create it, and sent the whole army in?

Much good has that sort of strategy done in places such as Iraq.

I really think you should include in your travels Southern Thailand, in order to appreciate the difficulties and the therefore so far fruitless strategies of the government. You can do that - the area is not closed, you just have to go there on your own risk.

Well my wife just came back from a 7 day trip through Hat Yai, Nokorn Sri Tamarat, and a few other spots. I just asked her if she could see any evidence of the army or any action that would suggest the area is at war, like you admit is. She said she never saw any army activity. She said the people there told her they know who the killers are. It’s just that there is no will or no orders to pursue them.

I think if a couple of thousand people had been killed any where else in the world, you would have a very obvious military escalation in the area. In Thailand this is news for page five or six.

I was down there myself about a year ago, I never saw anything at all to suggest any trouble.

Are you joking?

Hat Yai is not within the area, and neither is Nakhorn Sri Thammarat.

The insurgency is in Pattani, Yala and Narathiwat, and a few districts of Songkhla. There are huge activities by the army, especially in the red zone areas. Some districts of Yala have a curfew from 8pm to 4am, there are roadblocks everywhere, with barbed wire and the works, there are Humvees and other armored vehicles all over.

Army from all over the country is in one year rotation in the three Changwats, Special Warfare Command and Border Police is stationed permanently in large numbers, and so are Rangers.

[ThaiGoon]

If there was a civil war going on right now, I don't think you could see this kind of activities down there:

Taken from http://www.2bangkok.com/07/south07mar.shtml

[ThaiGoon]

And these (from the same website):

[ColPyat]

If there was a civil war going on right now, I don't think you could see this kind of activities down there:

And why not? People still live there.

Anyhow - it still has not reached yet the stage of civil war. So far it is still an insurgency. It's very deceptive down there - everything is fine, but any moment there could be an attack. The cities look rather normal but the outskirts and red zone villages are very frightening, especially in the morning hours and in the evening.

[Mai Krap]

These people are not human.

They are animals.

They should be hunted to extinction.

buddhists are a peace loving people with a wonderful religion that they follow, and these muslims down there are killing them. in the most horrific way.

where's this going. ?

you having a laugh right thai buddist peace loving. not the ones in Samui. Muslim relegion is also a peacefull religion. good and bad in all religions

well, at least they dont go around burning and killing people because they arn't buddist's and thats my point.

Terry - you are very wrong there.

The Tak Bai massacre was done by the Thai state (mostly Buddhist) against Muslim demonstrators. The Buddhist army officers responsible for the terrible decision to stack people on lorries that caused the death of 80 something are still free. There is a long history of oppression, and there is a long list of Muslims who have disappeared without trace during the last years, and are suspected to have been made disappear by the authorities. The lawyer Somchai is the most famous one. High ranking Buddhist police officers are directly implicated.

There were already cases of Buddhist villagers having committed retaliation attacks for the murdered Buddhists against innocent Muslims.

Not many seem interested in the true reality of the current situation. Few even took notice that the army and police have used Buddhist Wats for the firearms training of Buddhist civilians. We continue to hear the constant moan from those who want justice, those who bitch about the local Muslims not taking a stand against terrorism but in the cases where the Buddhist Military and Police used terrorist tactics against unarmed civilians not one single case has reached any level of justice. When Somchai was defending those who were falsely arrested in his capacity as a lawyer instead of letting the case go to trial the police decided to kidnap, torture, and murder the lawyer for the defendants. I have to laugh when I hear those who love freedom cry for justice when all they really desire is tyranny.

[ThaiGoon]

And why not? People still live there.

Anyhow - it still has not reached yet the stage of civil war. So far it is still an insurgency. It's very deceptive down there - everything is fine, but any moment there could be an attack. The cities look rather normal but the outskirts and red zone villages are very frightening, especially in the morning hours and in the evening.

So it's not a civil war then. Thank you.

[ColPyat]

And these (from the same website):

Your last image though is rather telling - Special Warfare Command soldiers (with the red berets) giving a haircut to kids in one of their hearts and minds operations. Note the soldier in the back (with helmet) giving back up in case of an attack.

[Scott]

The problems in the South are complex. One of the big problems is the oppression of the local population. I had lived in Thailand for quite a few years and wasn't even aware of any problems down there. I was posted to the Middle East and when I would talk about Thailand (fondly), I was informed of the oppression of the Muslim people. The people I talked to couldn't even find Thailand on a map, but they knew of injustices by the gov't perpetrated on the people, by the Thai gov't (army)--these included being forced to kneel and kiss statues of Buddha and being forced to eat pork.

This is pretty mild compared to the killings, but even then, in the early 90's the rest of the Muslim world knew of the oppression. No doubt, some people are willing to give money and support to help their oppressed brothers & siters.

Another problem is the continuing hatred bred by the acts of violence. For every one of those killed at Tak Bai, their are relatives who want revenge! Multiply this by years of killing, missing persons, mistreatment and you get a lot of angry people--ripe recruits for further violence. Then add to that a large population base of young men.

They need the army, but to 'walk softly and carry and big stick.' They need negogiations as well. Both a carrot and a stick and a lot of time.

[ThaiGoon]

Your last image though is rather telling - Special Warfare Command soldiers (with the red berets) giving a haircut to kids in one of their hearts and minds operations. Note the soldier in the back (with helmet) giving back up in case of an attack.

He might have been giving back up, or he just wanted to be in the picture, or he was on his way to grab some lunch, or he was just looking at his friend cutting the kid's hair. Yeah, it's pretty telling.

Edited April 12, 2007 by ThaiGoon

[ThaiGoon]

The people I talked to couldn't even find Thailand on a map, but they knew of injustices by the gov't perpetrated on the people, by the Thai gov't (army)--these included being forced to kneel and kiss statues of Buddha and being forced to eat pork.

This is pretty telling as well.

[ColPyat]

Your last image though is rather telling - Special Warfare Command soldiers (with the red berets) giving a haircut to kids in one of their hearts and minds operations. Note the soldier in the back (with helmet) giving back up in case of an attack.

He might have been giving back up, or he just wanted to be in the picture, or he was on his way to grab some lunch, or he was just looking at his friend cutting the kid's hair. Yeah, it's pretty telling.

It is standard procedure in those operations there to have several armed soldiers guarding the others. Don't just argue for the sake of an argument.

[ThaiGoon]

It is standard procedure in those operations there to have several armed soldiers guarding the others. Don't just argue for the sake of an argument.

Yeah, shocking isn't it? Armed soldiers guarding one another in the areas where there have been attacks by the insurgents.

No one is claiming that it's safe everywhere down there, but it's still not a civil war as some on here want others to believe. That's the point why I posted the pictures.