Govt allays fears on privacy as it prepares to launch Covid-19 app on May 15

[holy cow cm]

This is way over the top. 

Edited May 15, 2020 by holy cow cm

[Krataiboy]

The pandemic has provided the perfect pretext for the powers-that-be to speed up progress towards the creation of a panopticon state.

 

And don't imagine you can beat Big Brother by saying you can't afford a smartphone or tossing your existing digital ball and chain into the bin.

 

The Canadian province of Vancouver is actually giving away phones to draw the homeless poor to into the surveillance dragnet.

 

Just hope they're smart enough to realise there's no such thing as a free lunch.

 

https://steemkr.com/news/@pressfortruth/bc-government-gives-away-3-500-smartphones-to-contact-trace-the-homeless

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[SooKee]

55 minutes ago, phkauf said:

Yes, but Apple & Google are not Thai, so there is the need for Thais to completely re-invent the app from the beginning. That's why everything in Thailand works so much better than the rest of the world. Have you not learned Thai history?

It's a scary that I would trust Google more to protect my privacy than the Thai app. At least Google pretends to care.

And of course the drones that design the Thai version are too thick to realise that not everyone who lives in Thailand either is, or can read, Thai.  And of course the app only has Thai language.  Epic fail yet again.  Why am I surprised LOL.  Derrrrrrr.

[overherebc]

11 hours ago, PETERTHEEATER said:

I have a set of semaphore flags if you're interested......

 

[JCP108]

I have a Thai wife. Therefore, I don't have my own smartphone anymore (why bother?). So, now I have to get my own just for this tracking app?

[grantbkk]

My question is on which super secure server is my super secure info stored? Is all the info in my phone mined by the government or can it be accessed by a hacker? Who pays when the system is breached? Asking for a friend.

[JCP108]

This is May 16, right?

[Heppinger]

21 hours ago, grantbkk said:

My question is on which super secure server is my super secure info stored? Is all the info in my phone mined by the government or can it be accessed by a hacker? Who pays when the system is breached? Asking for a friend.

While your country may have extensive data protection laws "ThisCompany" may also own servers located in several other countries.

[JCP108]

Was supposed to launch yesterday. Anyone encounter the need for this app at a store yet?

 

I still have no phone and need to go to HomePro to get some stuff for a project. Can't find any new info about this online other than the articles from a couple of days ago saying it would start May 15. 

[tlock]

Same question as the poster above.  Have we clarified whether this app is mandatory or not?

 

[wasabi]

I just experienced this today when shopping in BKK. Since the days of Snowden's reveal I know I am being tracked everywhere if I use a smartphone. I don't like it but accept it. This QR code check in/check out effort seems to be accomplishing nothing my Smartphone can't already do with GPS and my MEID & my Sim card. If you want to track me, go ahead that has been beyond my control for years. But to make people stand in line, check in and check out seems to be futile and possibly even increasing the risk of viral transmission by interrupting the steady flow of people and creating choke points.

 

I wanted to see what it was all about so I tried it. At the mall I used the LINE program to scan a QR code and check in. I then had to enter my Thai phone number and got a delightful green check mark on my phone and a sticker applied to my shirt.  If I scanned in with LINE why did I then need to enter the number again? If you did not have LINE or something capable of reading the QR codes you were permitted to go to another line and write down your information  (using the same pen and pad of paper hundreds of others were using)

 

Thinking I was done I went about my merry way. Nope! I then had to check in and check out of every store I went to! Both QR code AND phone number. I saw people who'd been to numerous stores have a chestful of stickers lol. I wanted to cry and laugh. When leaving the mall I had to then check out and then had to answer a bunch of questions in Thai. I can read Thai but slowly. There was a long line behind me so I just checked yes to everything! IDK. If they want to track us I believe technology exists right now to avoid ALL of  these extra manual steps. I don't see the benefit. It is not simply the potential infringement on freedom but the futility of it that bothers me. I took some pictures but sorry they are not the clearest. Is this going to be nationwide? Strange days.

Edited May 17, 2020 by wasabi

[JCP108]

I went out to HomePro and CDC and had the same experience as wasabi. However, I don't have a smart phone right now with an active sim. When I told them I didn't have a phone, I had to write my name (used my own pen) in a log with my phone number and at CDC also had to record my temp as read by the infrared device. Wife checked in with her phone at both places. She had to check out at both places but I didn't. 

Edited May 17, 2020 by JCP108

[DrTuner]

Another problem is, how many have actually used their own passport/ID to get a sim card. Will look funky when you're a 7-11 clerk and in multiple places all over Thailand at the same time.

Edited May 17, 2020 by DrTuner

[JCP108]

2 minutes ago, DrTuner said:

Another problem is, how many have actually used their own passport/ID to get a sim card. Will look funky when you're a 7-11 clerk and in multiple places all over Thailand at the same time.

Good point. Hadn't thought of that. When I got a sim back in 2012, I got it with my own ID. Thereafter, never was allowed to do that since I don't have a yellow book. The last sim I got for my phone wife had to buy. Last sim I got for my iPad, same thing. 

[Pattaya46]

On 5/15/2020 at 7:13 AM, khunPer said:

Apple & Google already has a Covid-19 app working with anonymous IDs via blue tooth.

But Apple & Google are from USA.

Why should we trust these foreign companies ?

When someone says "Big Brother", they are the 2 of 3 names most people will think about ????

[wasabi]

From what I know this QR code check-in/check out process is already in practice from our big brother to the East. I suspect even though it is superfluous given all the technology to track people have existed for years now as a well known secret within our present digital ecosystem... This ostentatious effort will give comfort to the coming wave of tourists from preferred demographics . They will feel yes Thailand cares about my health. They are doing it like I am accustomed and I am safe let me open my wallet and spend, spend spend. I believe it is theater (just like the robot dogs) as are many of the countermeasures worldwide that are too imprecise, inconsistently applied or just plain naïve to make us safer. I am not singling out Thailand. We see variations of this happening in most nations. The typical reaction to this pandemic is a sad testament to cowardice and incompetence of my fellow man.

Edited May 17, 2020 by wasabi

[JCP108]

1 hour ago, Pattaya46 said:

But Apple & Google are from USA.

Why should we trust these foreign companies ?

When someone says "Big Brother", they are the 2 of 3 names most people will think about ????

I trust Apple more than Google. Google smart speakers and apps (including Kindles) listen to you all the time and sell the info that they hear. Same with gmail. I have an Apple Homepod smart speaker and have yet to have it trigger ads like the Google-related devices. I trust both of them more than any app in Thailand as they tend to operate where there is the rule of law (though often weaker than we want) which has allowed lawsuits to impinge significantly on their free reign with our data. No such thing exists here. 

Edited May 17, 2020 by JCP108

[Brigand]

Went to a local mall today and they had this fascist nonsense at the door. Might as well just issue everyone with an ankle bracelet. Can't believe the locals just put up with this BS. Not an environment that is attractive to live in and brings up some serious questions regarding the future ... but I guess it all hinges on whether this rubbish is rescinded at a timely juncture or if it is quietly kept in one form or another. That's the $64k question and it will be interesting to see if they have the sense to hand back the freedoms they have taken. I'm a cynic so won't hold my breath but the Thai youth look like they want something different than military oppression in civilian society.

Edited May 17, 2020 by Brigand

[wasabi]

 

18 minutes ago, Brigand said:

Went to a local mall today and they had this fascist nonsense at the door. Might as well just issue everyone with an ankle bracelet. Can't believe the locals just put up with this BS. Not an environment that is attractive to live in and brings up some serious questions regarding the future ... but I guess it all hinges on whether this rubbish is rescinded at a timely juncture or if it is quietly kept in one form or another. That's the $64k question and it will be interesting to see if they have the sense to hand back the freedoms they have taken. I'm a cynic so won't hold my breath but the Thai youth look like they want something different than military oppression in civilian society.

 

I have tolerated many things I don't like or understand in Thailand because I recognize I am here by choice and the good outweighs the bad for me. I enjoy the company of the Thai people I know and that makes me want to continue to be tolerant of the things I am less enthusiastic about.

 

Even with what I think is a bizarre effort to control something that can't be controlled (the virus) with QR codes. Even though I think people grouping together to scan in and out likely increases risk as well as opens a pandoras box of privacy problems... I still think the good outweighs the bad in Thailand. But any chance of me buying a condo or putting down roots here is gone. I recognize I can't avoid the QR gateway to commerce entirely but  but I will end up going to malls MUCH less and spending LESS money because of this. If the goal is to make people feel "Covid Safe" and march back to the shopping malls well I don't need to be Covid Safe beyond wearing a mask and cleaning my hands. I used to feel more free in the land of smiles. Sadly, not anymore. But there are reasons beyond that for me to stay so as long as those reasons hold I will.

Edited May 17, 2020 by wasabi

[Heppinger]

On 5/15/2020 at 5:06 PM, Krataiboy said:

The pandemic has provided the perfect pretext for the powers-that-be to speed up progress towards the creation of a panopticon state.

Do you actually still believe there was ever any threat from a pandemic?

[Guderian]

In operation in Central Mall Pattaya already today. The future clearly lies in online shopping. Maybe they'll give the women working in the Coconut Bar a QR  code each too, lol. But hey, even if they do, there's always Thai Friendly and so on. 

[JCP108]

1 hour ago, Brigand said:

Went to a local mall today and they had this fascist nonsense at the door. Might as well just issue everyone with an ankle bracelet. Can't believe the locals just put up with this BS. Not an environment that is attractive to live in and brings up some serious questions regarding the future ... but I guess it all hinges on whether this rubbish is rescinded at a timely juncture or if it is quietly kept in one form or another. That's the $64k question and it will be interesting to see if they have the sense to hand back the freedoms they have taken. I'm a cynic so won't hold my breath but the Thai youth look like they want something different than military oppression in civilian society.

A tenth as many people died in the U.S. in 9/11 and quite a lot of liberties were quickly taken away by the PATRIOT Act and never returned. Trillion dollar wars (against people who had nothing to do with the attacks were started) and our grandchildren won't even get those paid off. People are still putting up with that as though it's completely fine two decades later. 

 

58 minutes ago, wasabi said:

 

 

I have tolerated many things I don't like or understand in Thailand because I recognize I am here by choice and the good outweighs the bad for me. I enjoy the company of the Thai people I know and that makes me want to continue to be tolerant of the things I am less enthusiastic about.

 

Even with what I think is a bizarre effort to control something that can't be controlled (the virus) with QR codes. Even though I think people grouping together to scan in and out likely increases risk as well as opens a pandoras box of privacy problems... I still think the good outweighs the bad in Thailand. But any chance of me buying a condo or putting down roots here is gone. I recognize I can't avoid the QR gateway to commerce entirely but  but I will end up going to malls MUCH less and spending LESS money because of this. If the goal is to make people feel "Covid Safe" and march back to the shopping malls well I don't need to be Covid Safe beyond wearing a mask and cleaning my hands. I used to feel more free in the land of smiles. Sadly, not anymore. But there are reasons beyond that for me to stay so as long as those reasons hold I will.

Same here. Still feel fairly sure I want to stay here. However, if you'd asked me six months ago if I would buy or build a house here I would've told you more than likely, yes. Today, no way. Renting may be better for other reasons, anyway. But, tying up a lot of wealth here when we farangs might have to flee in some future crisis seems stupid. 

[DrTuner]

39 minutes ago, Guderian said:

The future clearly lies in online shopping. 

Excellent, put a few tons of explosive charges in Central and destroy the monstrosity. Build beer bars there instead. And while at it blow up the stupid road between sea and the to-be beer bars. Then you might get some tourists.

[Pattaya46]

7 minutes ago, DrTuner said:

Excellent, put a few tons of explosive charges in Central and destroy the monstrosity. Build beer bars there instead. And while at it blow up the stupid road between sea and the to-be beer bars. Then you might get some tourists.

Removing beach Road to make a nice long promenade would be a great idea.

But putting beer bars would be a very bad one ! It's not what tourists want nowadays.

This Covid-19 is an opportunity for Pattaya to get rid of most of these ugly beer bars. A good thing for its future IMHO

[TeaMonkey]

As an IT project this is an extremely complex data gathering and mining operation. If it even works it must have come from China. 
I wonder how well the population will support this invasion of privacy. 

[JCP108]

4 hours ago, TeaMonkey said:

As an IT project this is an extremely complex data gathering and mining operation. If it even works it must have come from China. 
I wonder how well the population will support this invasion of privacy. 

Resistance is futile. 

 

Aside from the loss of privacy, I wonder how long until people subvert it for selfish reasons. For example, what if a person felt sick (expecting to have a high temp read at the store entrance) or got an elevated score/color/flag and worried their movement would be restricted and they did something like put a screenshot of a normal "all clear" screen on their phone which they then would show to the hapless store checker at the front door. Those store employees wouldn't know that the app user was showing them a screenshot instead of the real time final screen. Then the potentially infected person would freely get into the building subverting the purpose of the whole thing. 

 

Maybe I'm reaching here. Thailand has a lot of disciplined rule following. 

[BritManToo]

On 5/14/2020 at 3:13 PM, RobertHima said:

You used your ID card / passport to get that phone number, there goes the "only" part.

My daughter used her ID card to get that phone number .........

[BritManToo]

On 5/16/2020 at 9:00 AM, JCP108 said:

I have a Thai wife. Therefore, I don't have my own smartphone anymore (why bother?). So, now I have to get my own just for this tracking app?

Just avoid shops that participate in this nonsense.

If shops see customer numbers dropping it'll soon be gone.

[wasabi]

I went to Tesco today of course they had the QR code system in place. I scanned my phone as I did yesterday but this time was not required to enter my Thai phone number. Seems Big Brother already knows all about me.

[phkauf]

While I don't generally object to them knowing if I go into a store in a mall, my problem is the ability to track me wherever I may go. Google already does this and it's quite scary if you pull up your history. From what I understand this app only tracks you when you scan a QR Code, but I have my doubts given the nature of the current regime. At the very least, I will disable any tracking functionality and bluetooth functions. 

I think what I will do is download the app whenever I need it to go into a store and then immediately delete it once I leave. Rinse and Repeat each time.  Tech heads - do you think this works as a solution?

or Plan B is to use my old phone with a tourist SIM card from 7.