Whats The Correct Respectful Term For "thais Of Chinese Descent"

[MiG16]

teacup and others....

i would not use the word 'khon chek'

infact its very rare that i would make reference to what ethnicity someone is....easier to just say khon thai unless we are speaking of some specific ancestral aspect, then a reference will be made to what roots someone might be from

[samran]

would very much stress that 'Jek' is a lot stronger than 'farang'.

The former, if used is usually used to be rude/insulting. The latter isn't - more a catch all classifier for people of European decesnt (though there will be farang who get called it and obviously disagree).

[ThaiGoon]

Well certainly…“kon thai” is the most polite one

But “kon jek” seems to be the common preference when referring to the thai-chinese, among thais

Agreed, especially the wealthy real Thais.

They don't like the word "jek" but still call us "farang". Hilarious once on the BTS when I overheard Thai chinese slagging off foriegners. I said something aloud about "jek" - that there were a lot of chinese tourists and they were all funny little people. man you should have seen their faces and the rest of the Thais in the compartment thought it very funny.

FYI, farang is not a derogaroty term. Jek is.

[cdnvic]

Jek isn't any better than saying "chink" or "gook"

[ThaiGoon]

would very much stress that 'Jek' is a lot stronger than 'farang'.

The former, if used is usually used to be rude/insulting. The latter isn't - more a catch all classifier for people of European decesnt (though there will be farang who get called it and obviously disagree).

Thanks krab Samran. As a Thai, I don't understand how white people could get offended by this farang term. It's just how we call white people. It's just like you call black people, black or Asian people Asian. It doesn't have any hidden racially discriminatory undertone at all. And Cdnvic is right. Calling Chinese Thais Jek is like calling them (us) chinks or gooks.

EDIT: I can't type.

Edited April 18, 2007 by ThaiGoon

[jumnien]

I think one of the point of this thread is that there are no indigenous or original or "real" Thais. As with the folks that herald from the United States, everyone is a mix of ancestors from somewhere else.

[Tod Daniels]

If you ask most thais they will almost to a person allude to the fact they are "thai-chinese", as it denotes a higher class of people or some mythical quality of inherent wealth, social status, etc.

I find it remarkable so many lay claims to their chinese ancestry. Population wise the country has more people speaking Lao than the national Bangkokian Thai language.

The people who moved here generations ago from china are now thai, NOT chinese, not chinese-thai, not thai-chinese. That's just how that stuff works out.

Given the extreme xenophobia which grips this small country and it's various people, it is humorous so many profess chinese heritage. Again, as I stated it is a face gaining tactic, best to be completely overlooked. People born here are thai, plain and simple. I do and would refer to them as คนไทย.

And BTW, a simple research into the origin of the word farang would show originally it did not have a negative context in usage. However, as with all things; context especially a word will change its definition over time. Certainly in today's society that term can and often does carry extreme negative and prejudicial qualities.

I not shy about pointing out the error of their ways when I am referred to as a farang. I'll often ask if they would rather I call them small dark skinned asians or if they prefer thai. That, along with the statement I am AMERICAN seems to clear up any misunderstanding.

In a very small or rural village where I realize I am dealing with predominantly uneducated people I accept the term, as their exposure to the constant stream of tourists is small. I will still point out my heritage as American on occasion. In the tourist areas of Krung Thep there is NO excuse for being referred to as a farang. That said; bad manners know no nationality or borders. Do not be duped into the acceptance of a term because a thai says; that's how we call all fair skinned foreigners. They have names for EVERY countries people, but choose to use the blanket term for unknown reasons.

[jumnien]

My guess would be that the Lao or Issan people have a large part of their ancestry from China as opposed to other countries. Remember, it's not like the Issan people just sprung up from the Korat plateau. That said, they are as fine a genetic mix as their is!

[Pepe']

Well certainly…“kon thai” is the most polite one

But “kon jek” seems to be the common preference when referring to the thai-chinese, among thais

Agreed, especially the wealthy real Thais.

They don't like the word "jek" but still call us "farang". Hilarious once on the BTS when I overheard Thai chinese slagging off foriegners. I said something aloud about "jek" - that there were a lot of chinese tourists and they were all funny little people. man you should have seen their faces and the rest of the Thais in the compartment thought it very funny.

FYI, farang is not a derogaroty term. Jek is.

-------------------

Depends the way it's used.

[jumnien]

I'm a farang American living in Thailand for 10 years now. I have never heard "farang" used derogatorily, at least not toward myself. I have often, and deservedly so, heard "American" used with disdain and disgust. I am far more proud to be farang than American.

[cdnvic]

Ask any of my in-laws or their friends about being Thai-Chinese and you will be given a very insistant "We are Thai!" response.

Many of these people are not exceedingly wealthy, as is often stereotyped. They often went through considerable hardship coming to Thailand, and spent many years gaining acceptance. They feel they are as Thai as anyone else and have a right to call themselves such.

Edited April 18, 2007 by cdnvic

[ThaiGoon]

Todd needs medical attention IMHO.

Here is another gem from him:

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?sh...14557&st=45

[ThaiGoon]

I think one of the point of this thread is that there are no indigenous or original or "real" Thais. As with the folks that herald from the United States, everyone is a mix of ancestors from somewhere else.

That's true. These days, we are all Thai.

[ThaiGoon]

-------------------

Depends the way it's used.

Like what way? Remember that the term, white trash, doesn't make the word, white, a racial slur. Same thing with farang keenok.

[teacup]

The term “jek” is not a derogatory term, yes I agree with depending how it’s used as 'pepe' said and certainly “not” a bad word when I was growing up anyway. Our family did not find it at least offensive when we heard the locals always referred to us as that. We’re a typical thai-chinese family and many locals at the market always referred to my father as “kon jek in the yellow house”, or when they came to borrow some money then they would addressed my father as “ar-sear”, or “nai haang”.

Unless you’re using it with malicious meaning/attention/purpose, then it’s bad, just like the term “farang” used by some thais with sometime has a normal meaning and sometime has a bad meaning of reference, depending on the situation

[Naam]

And BTW, a simple research into the origin of the word farang would show originally it did not have a negative context in usage.

in India i am a "Ferangi" or an "Angres" (although there's nothing british in me) and in an arab country i am called a "Franji". there's nothing wrong being called a "Foreigner" and i prefer "Farang" any time to the term "Alien" although -being a Klingon- the expression applies to me.

[ThaiGoon]

The term “jek” is not a derogatory term, yes I agree with depending how it’s used as 'pepe' said and certainly “not” a bad word when I was growing up anyway. Our family did not find it at least offensive when we heard the locals always referred to us as that. We’re a typical thai-chinese family and many locals at the market always referred to my father as “kon jek in the yellow house”, or when they came to borrow some money then they would addressed my father as “ar-sear”, or “nai haang”.

Unless you’re using it with malicious meaning/attention/purpose, then it’s bad, just like the term “farang” used by some thais with sometime has a normal meaning and sometime has a bad meaning of reference, depending on the situation

If it wasn't a derogatory term, why didn't the locals just call your dad "jek" when they wanted to borrow his money? And "Nai Haang" is the term that's used for wealthy Thais of Indian descent, imo, not Chinese. I, myslef, have never heard of anyone call Thai Chinese "Nai Haang." This is surely the first.

Edited April 18, 2007 by ThaiGoon

[gummy]

Ask any of my in-laws or their friends about being Thai-Chinese and you will be given a very insistant "We are Thai!" response.

Many of these people are not exceedingly wealthy, as is often stereotyped. They often went through considerable hardship coming to Thailand, and spent many years gaining acceptance. They feel they are as Thai as anyone else and have a right to call themselves such.

I agree and my wife's family also consider themselves Thai even though my Father-in-law was sent from China to Thailand when he was 11 to avoid the political turmoil during the late 1930's. I think most people are aware that Chinese nationality is lost once you permanantly emigrate to a foreign country so to exaggerate your nationality lineage is superfluous for most Thais. It is a pity that the same philosphy can not be accepted by children of immigrants to most Western contries. Lets face it we can all trace our lineage back to to a differant nation from where ourselves were born if we go back far enough. Ultimately we are all related to the same pair of aliens I guess beamed down as an experiment.

[teacup]

The term “jek” is not a derogatory term, yes I agree with depending how it’s used as 'pepe' said and certainly “not” a bad word when I was growing up anyway. Our family did not find it at least offensive when we heard the locals always referred to us as that. We’re a typical thai-chinese family and many locals at the market always referred to my father as “kon jek in the yellow house”, or when they came to borrow some money then they would addressed my father as “ar-sear”, or “nai haang”.

Unless you’re using it with malicious meaning/attention/purpose, then it’s bad, just like the term “farang” used by some thais with sometime has a normal meaning and sometime has a bad meaning of reference, depending on the situation

If it wasn't a derogatory term, why didn't the locals just call your dad "jek" when they wanted to borrow his money? And "Nai Haang" is the term that's used for wealthy Thais of Indian descent, imo, not Chinese. I, myslef, have never heard of anyone call Thai Chinese "Nai Haang." This is surely the first.

Thaicoon, I know you like spending your times here on this TV for the sake of arguments, but I’m not going to play the word game with you today, I’m too old for this. If you’re a thai and think you know everything about Thailand and don’t believe me that some local called my father as “nai haang” just because you know absolutely for sure that the term reserved exclusively for only wealthy-indian decent?, then it’s up to you.

Why don’t a few members(if you’re curious) on this forum go and ask their thai wife on the meaning of the word “nai haang” and report back? Just to prove my point that the word refers to/or describes a person with considerable wealth (med-old age men) in general, doesn’t matter which decent.

Edited April 18, 2007 by teacup

[cdnvic]

Why don’t a few members(if you’re curious) on this forum go and ask their thai wife on the meaning of the word “nai haang” and report back? Just to prove my point that the word refers to/or describes a person with considerable wealth (med-old age men) in general, doesn’t matter which decent.

I was curious. My wife says it's common to use nai haang to refer to a respected older man, usually an employer or maybe a landlord.

[teacup]

Why don’t a few members(if you’re curious) on this forum go and ask their thai wife on the meaning of the word “nai haang” and report back? Just to prove my point that the word refers to/or describes a person with considerable wealth (med-old age men) in general, doesn’t matter which decent.

I was curious. My wife says it's common to use nai haang to refer to a respected older man, usually an employer or maybe a landlord.

Curious CV

If you just look at the word “haang”, in thai it also means store, or shop. And the word “nai” means something like “a person” or mr. Then put the two meanings together it also refers to the owner of the store/ shop and when the store/shop has employee (s), sometime the employee will call his/her boss (the owner) “nai haang”, and this what our employees calls my father also - not by the real name or by title but simply as "nai haang". Of course this does not applied by all employees of every shops/stores/business in thailand, only some

Edited April 18, 2007 by teacup

[Neeranam]

The term “jek” is not a derogatory term, yes I agree with depending how it’s used as 'pepe' said and certainly “not” a bad word when I was growing up anyway. Our family did not find it at least offensive when we heard the locals always referred to us as that. We’re a typical thai-chinese family and many locals at the market always referred to my father as “kon jek in the yellow house”, or when they came to borrow some money then they would addressed my father as “ar-sear”, or “nai haang”.

Unless you’re using it with malicious meaning/attention/purpose, then it’s bad, just like the term “farang” used by some thais with sometime has a normal meaning and sometime has a bad meaning of reference, depending on the situation

Straight from the horse's mouth.

Excellent post.

The term "jek" was ok many years ago but as more and more Chinese came they took a dislike to it.

Exactly the same as farang IMHO will be in 10 or 20 years when Thai/Farang start to rule the country.

Edited April 18, 2007 by Neeranam

[soundman]

The term "jek" is not a derogatory term, yes I agree with depending how it's used as 'pepe' said and certainly "not" a bad word when I was growing up anyway. Our family did not find it at least offensive when we heard the locals always referred to us as that. We're a typical thai-chinese family and many locals at the market always referred to my father as "kon jek in the yellow house", or when they came to borrow some money then they would addressed my father as "ar-sear", or "nai haang".

Unless you're using it with malicious meaning/attention/purpose, then it's bad, just like the term "farang" used by some thais with sometime has a normal meaning and sometime has a bad meaning of reference, depending on the situation

Straight from the horse's mouth.

Excellent post.

Just to expound a little on teacup's post - my wife (and thai family) are as thai chinese as they come.....

I asked my wife today if their is any special term for a thai - chinese. She said no.

The term "jek" could easily be replaced by the thai word "loong" meaning basically uncle. Two of my uncles here are refered to as "jek" another is refered to as "loong" (personal tastes on their behalfs).

Some other commonly used thai - chinese names..

gong - grandfather

amah - grandmother

tao gair - number one boss - head of family in area

Where I live the thai chinese population is quite high. You hear all these terms everyday, and most are spoken with respect. Never heard these terms being spoken in a derogatory fashion.

Cheers,

Soundman.

[steveromagnino]

an extremely interesting topic! that raises the question "how does one address a Kiwi who has a maori grandfather, a british grandmother and lives in southern Germany close to the austrian border?"

You mean like in the street or when you meet him in a high class restuarant?

In both cases I think this should suffice.

Hey youse.

Too simple.

What else can we assertain?

After all, ThaiVisa visitors after spending just 1 day - 20 years in Thailand seem quite able to make assumptions that 'all Thai people are this or that'. This is based on the complex calculation of ethnic preferences.

So what can we learn about our Kiwi friend? Well obviously the British heritage precludes bathing and involves not paying for anything, while the Maori side is always up for a bit of a sing song and likes a bit of Lion rouge.

So there you have a smelly Kiwi in the middle of Germany, who wants to get drunk but doesn't want to pay for it.

[Naam]

So there you have a smelly Kiwi in the middle of Germany, who wants to get drunk but doesn't want to pay for it.

:D

[Naam]

The term "jek" could easily be replaced by the thai word "loong" meaning basically uncle.

in my opinion a wise move. we stupid and inexperienced farangs might pronounce it "jerk".

[cdnvic]

So there you have a smelly Kiwi in the middle of Germany, who wants to get drunk but doesn't want to pay for it.

What does Geography have to do with it?

[ThaiGoon]

Curious CV

If you just look at the word “haang”, in thai it also means store, or shop. And the word “nai” means something like “a person” or mr. Then put the two meanings together it also refers to the owner of the store/ shop and when the store/shop has employee (s), sometime the employee will call his/her boss (the owner) “nai haang”, and this what our employees calls my father also - not by the real name or by title but simply as "nai haang". Of course this does not applied by all employees of every shops/stores/business in thailand, only some

TeaCup, my family has been doing business with Indian Thais for years. So I'm pretty sure I know what "Nai Haag" means. Try asking people who are in "sarong" and "pa-te" textile business, or go to Indian or Hindu town in Bangkok (Pahurat) and see what the people there tell you.

[Richard W]

By the way, sorry to kidnap the post, but I thought khon (i.e. aspirated) was body hair, and kon unaspirated) was person. Guess I should google but I'm not just ignorant, I'm lazy too...

Both are aspirated. The first has rising tone, the second common tone.

[hgma]

Thai - chi perhaps????

practicly all thais from chinese decent practiscg it to!

hgma

I've seen it written like that a few times and was wondering.