Tabian ban in name of condo company???

[sikishrory]

For years I have rented the same condo in pattaya from a japanese guy where I live with my Thai wife.

Always staying on succesive non-o visas based on the marriage.

The first or second year I remember going to the pattaya office with wife to try and get the extension instead of a new visa each year.

It was refused on the grounds that the tabian ban was not in my landlords name but in the name of a company.

I assumed it was the landlords property company or something as he has a lot of condos. Gave up.

Awhile ago I discovered it is actually the company name of the condo.

Being in pattaya there's a bunch of westerners married and retired or whatever living in the same condo..

I guess I am wondering if that is common for the tabian ban to be in the name of the condos company or if anyone else has a similar problem or experience.

If it is normal then there must be tens of others with the same problem in my condo.

I'm outside country now but unable to get the extension it makes no sense to bother jumping hoops to go back for 3 months only to have to leave again.

It doesn't really bother me but curious about this incase in future I am in a position to try the extension again.

 

[blackcab]

Perhaps you should re-check the Tabien Baan. They cannot have the name of a Juristic Person or Limited Company in them.

 

The blue book is a register of Thai citizens and permanent residents who live at the address.

[jackdd]

The house book doesn't show ownership, it only shows who is living there.

As blackcab already said, only real persons can live there.

Edited September 5, 2020 by jackdd

[sikishrory]

Thanks for replies. I rechecked it, comparing it to my wifes. I think what's happened is I only had the first page of it which doesn't have the names of residents or whatever like the other pages do.

I don't have those pages but he will probably give me a copy if I ask.

[Susco]

1 hour ago, blackcab said:

Perhaps you should re-check the Tabien Baan. They cannot have the name of a Juristic Person or Limited Company in them.

 

The blue book is a register of Thai citizens and permanent residents who live at the address.

My previous house was registered in company name, and I was told that was the name on the first page of the blue book.

 

There were no Thai people registered on the following pages.

 

My current property is in Thai name, but since the owner doesn't live here, the first page is blanc

[blackcab]

1 hour ago, sikishrory said:

I don't have those pages but he will probably give me a copy if I ask.

 

What you probably need is:

 

1. A copy of the first page of the Tabien Baan of the house you live in

 

2. A copy of the Tabien Baan of the owner (first page and page with their registration details)

 

3. A copy of the condo title deed to prove they own the property

 

4. A copy of the owner's Thai ID card or Passport (if the owner is not Thai)

 

All copies to be signed by the owner.

 

You may need less - check with your local immigration office.

[Metropolitian]

53 minutes ago, sikishrory said:

Thanks for replies. I rechecked it, comparing it to my wifes. I think what's happened is I only had the first page of it which doesn't have the names of residents or whatever like the other pages do.

I don't have those pages but he will probably give me a copy if I ask.

Do you have the yellow tabien ban with your name in it?

The first page is the house page with the details.

Peoples are in the following pages.

 

The owner of the property is not always in the tabien baan, only if he/she registered as living there.

The owner is on the deed.

 

In the Tabien baan you can see who is the house master (Chao baan) but not the owner if he/she is registered elsewhere.

 

If the ''name of the condo company'' is in the book, then it is registered with the name of the legal juristic person of the condo company.

Not the name of the condo company itself. Maybe the condo company carries the name of the person.

[blackcab]

44 minutes ago, Susco said:

My previous house was registered in company name, and I was told that was the name on the first page of the blue book.

 

I've not yet seen a company name on the first page of a house book, and I've seen a few hundred house books by now. Many of the properties I am referring to are owned by limited companies.

 

House books don't even have building names on the first page - just the address as recorded in the District Office database.

[Metropolitian]

It's possible that the Japanese guy has the condo in lease and not bought in full.

Until the condo is fully paid off, the condo company stays on the deed.

The same as when the condo is bought with a loan from the bank, it is theirs until fully paid off.

 

As the owner is not Thai, things are a bit trickier and need more copies but can be done.

[blackcab]

4 minutes ago, Metropolitian said:

If the ''name of the condo company'' is in the book, then it is registered with the name of the legal juristic person of the condo company.

Not the name of the condo company itself. Maybe the condo company carries the name of the person.

 

Juristic Persons and Limited Companies are not listed in Tabien Baans.

[blackcab]

2 minutes ago, Metropolitian said:

It's possible that the Japanese guy has the condo in lease and not bought in full.

Until the condo is fully paid off, the condo company stays on the deed.

The same as when the condo is bought with a loan from the bank, it is theirs until fully paid off.

 

As the owner is not Thai, things are a bit trickier and need more copies but can be done.

 

If the property is purchased with a mortgage, then the property is owned by the purchaser, not by the mortgagor.

 

A mortgage is an encumbrance, and the ownership of the building belongs to the purchaser, not the bank.

 

As far as immigration are concerned, it makes no difference at all whether a property has a mortgage registered against it or not.

[Susco]

12 minutes ago, blackcab said:

 

I've not yet seen a company name on the first page of a house book, and I've seen a few hundred house books by now. Many of the properties are owned by limited companies.

 

House books don't even have building names on the first page - just the address as recorded in the District Office database.

I can not read Thai, maybe you can

 

[blackcab]

@Susco That says it is a 1 storey house in Tambon Nong Prue, Amphur Bang Lamung, Jang Wat Chonburi.

 

The first line of the street address has been redacted, which is a good thing for your own privacy.

 

Typically, the first line might say something like 14/3 Soi Christmas, Sukhumvit 22 Road or something similar.

[Metropolitian]

2 hours ago, blackcab said:

 

Juristic Persons and Limited Companies are not listed in Tabien Baans.

Deed.. the Chanote, not the Tabien Baan.

[Metropolitian]

2 hours ago, Susco said:

I can not read Thai, maybe you can

 

2 hours ago, blackcab said:

@Susco That says it is a 1 storey house in Tambon Nong Prue, Amphur Bang Lamung, Jang Wat Chonburi.

 

And it does say 'Park Rung Rueng'. 

Big housing areas , mostly gated, does have the 'condo company name' as the name of the moo-ban.

 

Maybe from there came the mis-understanding that the condo company name was on the tabien baan but just coincidental as it is the name of the block.

 

 

[boriga]

I had a similar experience with regards the Tabien Baan as the OP. Our house is in a mooban developed by Land & House outside Bangkok. Upon purchase we received the empty blue Tabien Baan from the seller and on the first page along with the address it includes the developers name. We queried this at the Amphoe and they said this is normal. Subsequently when I registered myself and received a new yellow Tabien Baan it still has the developer's name on the first, address page.

 

It appears completely standard procedure on newer developments to do this. In terms of visa extension, the reason given seems to be a red herring. It is not that the development company is registered at the property, (which is impossible, as above), but that the owner is not.

[blackcab]

The entry on the first page of the house book that people are discussing says "Chu Moo Baan", or name of the housing project.

 

If you live in a moo baan, the name of the project should be here, not the name of the developer. This is because moo baans are not called, "The Glorious Good Fortune House Building Heng Make Us Happy (2020) Co., Ltd", they are called things like Fortune House, etc.

 

Incidentally, not all "Name of the Housing Project" entries in house books have an entry. Some entries are blank. If you live in a condominium, the name of the condo project might be inserted here, but not always. If you live in a freehold house that is not situated in a moo baan, this entry may or may not be used. Sometimes a descriptive phrase is used (see below).

 

Here are some examples:

 

"The Diplomat Sathorn", which is a condo developed by KPN Land:

 

 

"The Gentry Sukhumvit", a Moo Baan developed by SC Asset:

 

 

"Lumpini Ville Lasalle-Bearing", a condo developed by LPN Development:

 

 

"Baan Pak Tak Agard" (Holiday House), for a large freehold beach side house developed by a private limited company:

 

 

"Baan Nong Katowa" (House and Pond of Khun Katowa), for a freehold house with a borehole and water tower. (Khun Katowa doesn't live there anymore, but their name lives on):

 

 

To keep this on-topic, the Chu Moo Baan section of the house book is irrelevant for the purposes of immigration, as the section itself does not form part of your postal address, and as such is not asked for on your application for an extension of stay (or any other immigration application form) and it is not entered in their computer system.