Thai Tomatoes, Why Mai Aroi?

[uptou]

i'm not really a big fan of the thai tomato.they seem almost dead to the taste.a thai lady told me that they use alot of chemicals on them.

is it possible to grow the western varieties over here?

[Maizefarmer]

Yes - Western varities grow very well - and unless you grow them under cover, you too will land up using chemicals - because the bugs will sure have a go at them.

Plant a few in a couple of buckets - they'll be fine (and will grow rather quick as well in this climate - so long as you keep them well watered and use decent soil - and no need to go overboard with the chemicals - just do as it says on the tin and it'll do the job just fine and they'll be safe to eat).

MF

[uptou]

thanks mf,as far as undercover,no chemicals go,is there an easy soloution?

this is from a hobby,beginner point of veiw.

[Maizefarmer]

Thats why |I suggested a few buckets - commercilising the exercise is of course very different - and it's in those case (as with many veggies you find at markets) that far more chemicals are used than are needed, or indeed safe.

A couple of buckets up against the wall - buy some mozzie netting and fix it to a 1" x 1" wooden framework - that'll keep 99% of the bugs off.

You'll get great tomatoes from that setup in about 4 to 6 weeks.

I'm no tomatoe specialist but just about every variety I have found in seed packets in ag stores and grown for use at home done great with no more than basic care and protection from bugs. You can by 25 litre packets of premixed horticulture type soil - or mix your own up from using about 15% dry cow/buffulo dubg if out in the country.

My motto: keep it simple, keep it practical

Send me the bill if it don;t work.

Good luck

MF

Edited May 5, 2007 by Maizefarmer

[Maizefarmer]

As you can see - I can't type/spell to save my life!!

[uptou]

but you know your tomatoes.mozzie net,why didnt i think of that.

i'm thinking that western seed varieties cant be had in thailand???or is the thai variety actually more edible grown naturally without the bug spray?

[chownah]

I eat sliced tomatoes almost every day. Sometimes they are as tastey as any tomatoes grown anywhere...and sometimes they are tasteless. I don't think its a matter of importing foreign varieties..its more a matter of just trying a few Thai varieties and finding the ones with the good flavor and then growing them on the vine long enough so that they are either ripe or will ripen properly off the vine.

I have successfully raised Thai variety tomatoes organically here in the north out in an open garden. My experience has been that you need to have really good soil and the plants need to get a fast start and maintain fast growth because they will only live for about 3 months or so before either bugs or disease will get them...but...the varieties I grew gave me ripe tomatoes in about 3 months and alot of almost ripe tomatoes which ripened off the vines having good flavor.

I have also had some failures. My experience has been that disease is more of a problem than bugs. I have only tried growing tomatoes in the cool dry season which is the easiest time...someday I'll try some in the off season...but haven't had time for it yet...I'm ready for lots of dissapointments but I think that using an enclosure and perhaps heat sterilizing some soil should allow them to be grown year round but don't know for sure.

Chownah

[Maizefarmer]

Hey Mr Chownah - no mention of soap suds????? - - whats up, using chemicals are we.

[chownah]

Hey Mr Chownah - no mention of soap suds????? - - whats up, using chemicals are we.

I don't understand your meaning....does is it relate to this topic?

Chownah

[Maizefarmer]

I was suprized you hadn't presented the anti-chemical pro organic pest control option.

[torrenova]

C'mon, spill the beans as I want to grow some as well. Small tasty ones. How do i keep the bugs away and disease free without loads of chemicals ?

Edited May 6, 2007 by torrenova

[SnakeBite]

Picked too early and no taste is the main culprit.

[chownah]

I was suprized you hadn't presented the anti-chemical pro organic pest control option.

I'm not sure if I have posted anything that is truly "anti-chemical". It would interest me to see what I have posted that you think is "anti-chemical"....really, it would be interesting...maybe I have and don't realize it. I am mostly happy to let everyone farm in whatever manner they think is best. For me and for what I want to accomplish with my farming I think that organic farming methods using natural processes to control pests and diseases is best.

As for presenting organic options for disease and pest control, I have presented some of this in other threads and figure that people will get tired of seeing it over and over and over again. Specifically, for this topic, I don't remember for sure but I think that I had no bug problem with the sucessful batch of tomato plants. Why no bugs? I don't know for sure but it might be that since no pesticides or artificial fertilizers have been applied in my garden plot for 5 years now that the natural balance has re-established to a certain degree so that the bugs keep themselves controled somewhat. Raising things organically means that some bugs will appear and chew on some leaves...and spoil a percentage of the produce. The goal is not to kill everything but to maintain a natural balance.

For tomatoes what I have observed from my own experience is that bugs were not the main problem....it was disease...and that with the right variety (disease resistent) a tomato plant can be grown in good organically rich soil to the age of approximately 3 months before disease destroys the plant...and that in that time you can get a crop of tomatoes. I should add that you need to be careful to not replant tomatoes (or eggplants) in the same place for at least one year and probably more to allow the natural processes which occur in rich organic soils to reduce the harmful pathogens which have thrived on the tomato roots to a level that will once again allow a healthy plant to survive for 3 months to produce your crop....so....one of the things that organic farmers do is try to think of ways to speed up or otherwise enhance the natural processes which give the desired results....I'm going to try planting mustard or marigolds and plow them into the soil since they are known to reduce harmful soil pathogens...mabe I'll try solarizing some soil...maybe do both. But, you know, I am no expert in this...I have got a lot to learn.....I have alot of failures and I try to learn from them all.

There is no single thing that can be said that will assure success in raising tomatoes organically in northern Thailand. It takes an integrated approach involving not only your crops but also all the living things in the garden and how they interact together in the web of life.

Chownah

Edited May 7, 2007 by chownah

[Maizefarmer]

Fair comment

[Maizefarmer]

C'mon, spill the beans as I want to grow some as well. Small tasty ones. How do i keep the bugs away and disease free without loads of chemicals ?

Go back to my 2nd posting on this thread - if its just a few plants, construct a 1" x 1" timber framework and throw some fine mesh over it (e.g. mozzie type netting) - that will keep 99% of the bugs off and you won't have to use chemicals of any sort.

You can buy fine mesh by the roll or by what ever length you want from most village/market/town stores (white goods and hardware) - it's cheap around Bhat 25 - Baht35 per meter. Get the steel or synthetic type - not the alloy type.

MF

Edited May 7, 2007 by Maizefarmer

[brahmburgers]

cherry tomatoes are the best way to go. I've grown tomatoes in northern California and I've grown them here in northern Thailand. Cherries are best for various reasons:

1. they don't need chemicals. None at all in a healthy garden space.

2. they're tastier than larger types

3. larger types don't grow well in Thailand because they're bug-prone and take longer to yield, therefore longer time for pests to invade.

Thais generally don't care for nor understand tomatoes. They don't have ample amounts of sliced tomatoes in salads (indeed, they rarely have real fresh salads at all). Thai cuisine is heavily cooked, spiced, and meat-laden - so tomatoes are relegated to the sidelines.

Also: don't plant tomatoes twice in the same spot without an interval of a year or two - unless you thoroughly re-vamp the soil. ...because there are nematodes that will screw up the roots and shrivel subsequent crops planted in the same spot.

[torrenova]

Also: don't plant tomatoes twice in the same spot without an interval of a year or two - unless you thoroughly re-vamp the soil. ...because there are nematodes that will screw up the roots and shrivel subsequent crops planted in the same spot.

Sorry to appear a dimwit but without googling "nematodes" what are they and why cannot I grow toms in the same place ? I want to knock some veggies up in Non Suwan between Korat and Buriram.

Re-vamp the soil ?

Cheers

[chownah]

Growing tomatoes gives certain disease agents (which includes some types of nematodes I guess) a perfect place to live because they love to eat tomato roots. After one crop the soil contains enough of these to cause a newly planted tomato plant to very quickly get diseased and die. However, if you wait a year or two or three and other things grow in that spot then the disease agents might diminish, depending on what grows there. If something grows there that has roots that these disease agents like to eat (like eggplant, which is related to tomato) then the disease agents will persist, but if something that grows there has roots that either the disease agents don't like to eat...or better yet that kills them (like some varieties of mustard or marigolds) then thier numbers will diminish and with good plant husbandry you may be able to grow a crop of tomatoes and get ripe fruit before the disease organisms increase to the degree that they kill the plants.

Note that this discussion is from an organic farming perspective....perhaps someone who knows about using chemicals in farming will post their perspective.

Chownah

Edited May 13, 2007 by chownah

[fruity]

Let's be honest here! Has anyone ever eaten a tomato that was truly delicious anywhere in the world?.........Granted, the very small mediterranean varieties are much more 'tasty' than most , but, harldy delicios by any stretch of the imagination! A small red sack of vegetable matter-water could hardly be called delicios, aroy or whatever anywhere, surely?

[Matthew31140]

i'm not really a big fan of the thai tomato.they seem almost dead to the taste.a thai lady told me that they use alot of chemicals on them.

is it possible to grow the western varieties over here?

Maybe it's just me but the Tomatos my mother in law gets are bloody gorgeous!! They are of the cherry variety (I think!).

[fruity]

Sorry can't spell DELICIOUS or AROI.............:-(............Sad...:-)

Never mind; Tomatoes are horrible.......lol.......

[Mid]

Let's be honest here! Has anyone ever eaten a tomato that was truly delicious anywhere in the world?.........Granted, the very small mediterranean varieties are much more 'tasty' than most , but, harldy delicios by any stretch of the imagination! A small red sack of vegetable matter-water could hardly be called delicios, aroy or whatever anywhere, surely?

sure have .................

just a little salt is all it takes .

[Gary A]

I have been trying to raise tomatoes for several years. A friend of mine brought me five varieties that all get VERY large. (in Florida) They were developed for growing in southern Florida. The rubber balls that they call tomatoes here are indeed tasteless and juice less. After many different ways of trying to grow then I have failed dismally. They come up, flower, fruit then shrivel and die without the tomatoes ever maturing. Potting soil, native soil, pots and buckets have all failed. I didn't want to use any chemicals but even that failed. I am of the opinion that the only tasty tomatoes I am able to grow are cherry tomatoes. They do well and are tasty. If I do make another effort it will be hydroponic.

[aaaaaa]

i'm not really a big fan of the thai tomato.they seem almost dead to the taste.a thai lady told me that they use alot of chemicals on them.

is it possible to grow the western varieties over here?

for Thais tomatoes are one of those foreign fruits. yes, fruits. and as it happens with most people who do not understand (and BTW don't even try to) something foreign, they don't bother to find out what the real good taste of tomatoes is. same can be said about many other things - like bread or salad, for Thai people is more like "kanom", or decert - than a food, as for westerners. therefore, more or less good bread can be found only in westerners-catering supermarkets, and it is several times more expensive than most of breads sold in normal supermarkets. same goes about tomatoes.

first time I've purfhased those real good western tomatoes, wich naturally cost 2-4 times more than thos normally sold Thai tomatoes, first my wife has scolded me - "why you spend more than necessary? there are cheap Thai tomatoes". but once she's tasted them - all questions were over, she said - wow, I never realized tomatoes can be so delicious, can just simply eat them on their own!

oh, and by the way, I was told, that not only chemicals are used - even human sh1t ! perhaps not by all farms, but surely by some. some "agencies" even do good business - buying sh1t and re-selling it as fertiliser to farms. especially some farms where all those prisoners work.

[uptou]

oh, and by the way, I was told, that not only chemicals are used - even human sh1t ! perhaps not by all farms, but surely by some. some "agencies" even do good business - buying sh1t and re-selling it as fertiliser to farms. especially some farms where all those prisoners work.

yuk ,now theres an incentive to grow your own.

[meadish_sweetball]

I took the liberty of changing the topic from 'mae aroi' to 'mai aroi' since I think the OP was asking why tomatoes weren't tasty, and did not want to discuss why his mother was delicious.