Jaguar Xk8 Transmission Rebuild

[chayatom]

I have just been quoted 400,000 baht by Jaguar Thailand to rebuild my transmission for my 1998 Jag XK8(I am told they send it back to the Uk to be repaired!) . Does anybody know of a specialist in Thailand who might be able to repair it???

[Totster]

The only problem I can see with a specialist in Thailand doing it is the bag of "spares" you'll get when they've finished..

totster

[borracho]

I have just been quoted 400,000 baht by Jaguar Thailand to rebuild my transmission for my 1998 Jag XK8(I am told they send it back to the Uk to be repaired!) . Does anybody know of a specialist in Thailand who might be able to repair it???

Ouch that's a very steep repair.

There are some enthusiast car clubs in Bangkok and associated support networks.

I would seek them out. You will likely find a Jaguar specialist who really knows his stuff.

There are many such people in Thailand. Sometimes you have to be patient and wait for parts. Sometimes those parts can be very expensive.

You can also shop for a rebuilt transmission in the UK and have it shipped here. Compare prices. Don't be in a hurry. Buy a beater Toyota Corolla in the interim.

[chayatom]

You can say ouch again.

I have sourced a replacement gearbox in the UK for 1500 gbp but have to send back to the Uk my current gearbox. This means i have shipping costs both ways , potential tax liability importing the gearbox(???) and no guarantee that its going to work when its fitted.

I believe that its a ZF gearbox as used on some Mercedes cars and if i can find anyone here in Bangkok able to repair it its definitely going to be a cheaper option.

I shall take your wise advice to be patient to find the best way to resolve this but it would help if anyone can put me in touch with the specialist i am trying to find!

Thanks

[goldfish]

Check out e-bay. Just had a quick look and there is a guy advertising a reconditioned gearbox for your car for a 1000gbp. 12 month warranty.

[Japhrodisiac]

I personally would never buy a used auto transmission, unless it was from a verifiable low mileage wreck. The cost quoted seems ridiculous, given that should cover an entirely new transmission or thereabouts. I had a BMW 7 series with a ZF transmission, and it "needed a rebuild" - turned out that the valve body needed cleaning, and some new solenoids installed and it was like new again for about $500. Jaguar did have a recall for your year tranny, due to cracked gear teeth, but this only affected a few hundred cars total - a bad batch of gears I suppose. It would be more helpful if you mentioned what the transmission was doing wrong. Does the car move, shift, reverse, shudder, etc. Might be something simple, might be the torque converter and not the transmission at all. When I diagnose mechanical problems, I tend to like to eliminate all of the simple items first. Often, relatively inexperienced mechanics like to quickly diagnose (without much consideration) and replace large parts. This way, it can't come back on them. I call this the gas cap approach - if you lift up the gas cap, slide a new car underneath, then screw the gas cap back on, that should fix the problem.

[Japhrodisiac]

I forgot to add that Roadfly has some excellent forums which may help you : http://www.roadfly.com/forums/

Best of luck - J

[chayatom]

I personally would never buy a used auto transmission, unless it was from a verifiable low mileage wreck. The cost quoted seems ridiculous, given that should cover an entirely new transmission or thereabouts. I had a BMW 7 series with a ZF transmission, and it "needed a rebuild" - turned out that the valve body needed cleaning, and some new solenoids installed and it was like new again for about $500. Jaguar did have a recall for your year tranny, due to cracked gear teeth, but this only affected a few hundred cars total - a bad batch of gears I suppose. It would be more helpful if you mentioned what the transmission was doing wrong. Does the car move, shift, reverse, shudder, etc. Might be something simple, might be the torque converter and not the transmission at all. When I diagnose mechanical problems, I tend to like to eliminate all of the simple items first. Often, relatively inexperienced mechanics like to quickly diagnose (without much consideration) and replace large parts. This way, it can't come back on them. I call this the gas cap approach - if you lift up the gas cap, slide a new car underneath, then screw the gas cap back on, that should fix the problem.

Thanks Japhrodisiac.

The car is changing gear but making a whining sound when changing which is more noticeable under hard acceleration. I have spoken to a specialist in the Uk who didn't sound convinced the transmission needed replacing and recommended checking the transmission oil level and checking the differential first. I asked Jaguar to recheck and they tell me there are particles of the clutch plate in the transmission fluid??? They have suggested they disassemble the transmission to see if they can supply the new parts and repair here and give me a quote for this. I am no expert and i am not comfortable they are giving me the best advice.

I have had the car for 3 years and totally agree with your diagnosis comments - they seem to start from the opposite end of the spectrum and change the biggest most expensive part first.

[undercover]

Your modern version of Coventry's finest should have the ZF(6HP26)Transmission. As was said there are other makes of cars with that model box and for sure a few here in Thailand. I would try first looking for a compleat replacement from one of the write off cars garages, if your lucky you will get someone who will phone around and find something, it's truly amazing whats around in these garages, the word on the street is the xk8 box is a snatchy squawky beast once theres a few miles on it so don't pay everything up front, good luck.

[Japhrodisiac]

Your modern version of Coventry's finest should have the ZF(6HP26)Transmission. As was said there are other makes of cars with that model box and for sure a few here in Thailand. I would try first looking for a compleat replacement from one of the write off cars garages, if your lucky you will get someone who will phone around and find something, it's truly amazing whats around in these garages, the word on the street is the xk8 box is a snatchy squawky beast once theres a few miles on it so don't pay everything up front, good luck.

I think that the later versions use the ZF 6HP26, but the 1998 model seems to list the ZF 5HP24 trans. The ZF 5HP24 is a bit of an odd tranny. It was installed in some of the BMW 7 series as well, I believe it was the E38 740il. The key with this transmission is that is uses a special fluid, and was "sealed for life" from the factory (never intended to be serviced, just replaced). However, you can buy the fluid (expensive and maybe hard to find here) and top up the tranny yourself if you find the correct fill location etc. Your transmission sounds like it is simply low on fluid, perhaps the lining of the torque converter is going (this is a more common failure than a real trans. problem) If it is one of the serviceable ones, change out the filter, replace all the fluid and start form there. have a look here:

http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.a...mp;f=66&h=0

http://forums.roadfly.com/forums/jaguar/ja.../7818385-1.html

[Japhrodisiac]

Also...

http://www.zf-group.com/pdf/5HP24.pdf

for service procedures, diagrams etc

[dino67]

There is a guy near Rama 9/RCA area that specialises in Auto Gearboxes. I took my Audi A4 there to get it checked out. He had about 20 cars in there for gearbox work, porsches, audi, bmw, etc

Can't remember the name but I found his ad in a thai secondhand car book - the ones that come out monthly.

Sorry I can't be of more assistance to track him down. Try looking through the books at a 7-11 see if you can find his ad - it was a full page color ad.

[Arkady]

Your modern version of Coventry's finest should have the ZF(6HP26)Transmission. As was said there are other makes of cars with that model box and for sure a few here in Thailand. I would try first looking for a compleat replacement from one of the write off cars garages, if your lucky you will get someone who will phone around and find something, it's truly amazing whats around in these garages, the word on the street is the xk8 box is a snatchy squawky beast once theres a few miles on it so don't pay everything up front, good luck.

I think that the later versions use the ZF 6HP26, but the 1998 model seems to list the ZF 5HP24 trans. The ZF 5HP24 is a bit of an odd tranny. It was installed in some of the BMW 7 series as well, I believe it was the E38 740il. The key with this transmission is that is uses a special fluid, and was "sealed for life" from the factory (never intended to be serviced, just replaced). However, you can buy the fluid (expensive and maybe hard to find here) and top up the tranny yourself if you find the correct fill location etc. Your transmission sounds like it is simply low on fluid, perhaps the lining of the torque converter is going (this is a more common failure than a real trans. problem) If it is one of the serviceable ones, change out the filter, replace all the fluid and start form there. have a look here:

http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.a...mp;f=66&h=0

http://forums.roadfly.com/forums/jaguar/ja.../7818385-1.html

There are a lot mechanics that can rebuild this type of auto transmission for you in Bangkok. I had one rebuilt for a Benz E class a 3 years ago for B80k and it is still running fine. You can also get the transmission fluid replaced in an E38 740il for about B7k, even tho the dealers are not allowed to do it due the "sealed for life" BS. What they mean is that it's sealed for the what they regard as its maximum life of 120k km when you are supposed to buy a new car. You must use the right transmission fluid but the exactly the same fluid is used by VW which sells it for much less than BMW under their own part number. The mechanics you need usually service only German brands, mostly only Benz and BMW. Some have worked at dealers and are very good. You can find them around Navamin Road and advertising in Thai auto magazines. I also had a steering rack rebuilt for about B20k. Whatever you do dont pay Jaguar B400k to "send it back to the Uk ha ha". They will probably just sent to Nawamin road themselves and make a big profit from you while pissing themselves laughing. The price is outrageous. A new one would be the same or less.

[Luckydog]

I have just been quoted 400,000 baht by Jaguar Thailand to rebuild my transmission for my 1998 Jag XK8(I am told they send it back to the Uk to be repaired!) . Does anybody know of a specialist in Thailand who might be able to repair it???

Just had a complete rebuild for my Holden Calais Auto Gearbox by a good engineer. No Jag specialist in Thailand?. A good Engineer can do the job for you too. I had to get my parts from Australia. You might have to get them from UK. But 400.000bht?

Nonesense. The whole thing cost me 32000bht and I feel that was too much!

Edited May 27, 2007 by Luckydog

[Beardog]

Yea for 400,000 you can probably get the engine rebuilt new tires & a paint job in Thailand. Sounds like commercial fisherman with an extremely sharp gaffing hook "ouch"

[Lickey]

I personally would never buy a used auto transmission, unless it was from a verifiable low mileage wreck. The cost quoted seems ridiculous, given that should cover an entirely new transmission or thereabouts. I had a BMW 7 series with a ZF transmission, and it "needed a rebuild" - turned out that the valve body needed cleaning, and some new solenoids installed and it was like new again for about $500. Jaguar did have a recall for your year tranny, due to cracked gear teeth, but this only affected a few hundred cars total - a bad batch of gears I suppose. It would be more helpful if you mentioned what the transmission was doing wrong. Does the car move, shift, reverse, shudder, etc. Might be something simple, might be the torque converter and not the transmission at all. When I diagnose mechanical problems, I tend to like to eliminate all of the simple items first. Often, relatively inexperienced mechanics like to quickly diagnose (without much consideration) and replace large parts. This way, it can't come back on them. I call this the gas cap approach - if you lift up the gas cap, slide a new car underneath, then screw the gas cap back on, that should fix the problem.

Thanks Japhrodisiac.

The car is changing gear but making a whining sound when changing which is more noticeable under hard acceleration. I have spoken to a specialist in the Uk who didn't sound convinced the transmission needed replacing and recommended checking the transmission oil level and checking the differential first. I asked Jaguar to recheck and they tell me there are particles of the clutch plate in the transmission fluid??? They have suggested they disassemble the transmission to see if they can supply the new parts and repair here and give me a quote for this. I am no expert and i am not comfortable they are giving me the best advice.

I have had the car for 3 years and totally agree with your diagnosis comments - they seem to start from the opposite end of the spectrum and change the biggest most expensive part first.

If the trans is whining at every gearchange, it is almost certainly the torque converter at fault, worn friction plate or cracked diaprgham plate lowering oil pressure inside the converter, if it is a worn friction plate the trans oil will be dark and smell sort of burnt, if the oil is ok then you could be lucky, because black oil has a habit of slowing down shift valves in the valve body, this will mean a complete overhaul because low oil pressure in the converter will affect all parts of the trans, a cracked diaphram plate will lower overall pressure and cause premature wearing of all the clutches in the trans, There should be two points on the box to attach independant pressure gauges, 1 for the converter, and 1 for the valve body, a good trans shop should know the pressure and changing figures,

Ive rebuilt 100s of comercial ZF auto boxes, and after the first 100, it was easy, the auto principle is the same though, and it could even be the regulator near the output shaft of box that is sticking, this is a gyroscopic thing that spins and also tells box when to change gear, if the oil aint black and doesnt smell, this would be an easy option to check,

Anyway, goodluck with trans! Lickey.

[peterd1961]

I have just been quoted 400,000 baht by Jaguar Thailand to rebuild my transmission for my 1998 Jag XK8(I am told they send it back to the Uk to be repaired!) . Does anybody know of a specialist in Thailand who might be able to repair it???

Hi, My father alway's drive jaguar, and I know he buy a couple of years ago a very good used gearbox in the netherlands!! A friend off us have very much knowledge about this! I just send him a email to check the price for you.

Regards Peter

[chayatom]

Thanks very much everyone for the helpful replies, the Jag forums in particular are excellent with anyone wanting to do some research into a problem.

I should get a new quote from Jaguar this week for the repair - I will see what this looks like before deciding to get it repaired elsewhere.

[chayatom]

I personally would never buy a used auto transmission, unless it was from a verifiable low mileage wreck. The cost quoted seems ridiculous, given that should cover an entirely new transmission or thereabouts. I had a BMW 7 series with a ZF transmission, and it "needed a rebuild" - turned out that the valve body needed cleaning, and some new solenoids installed and it was like new again for about $500. Jaguar did have a recall for your year tranny, due to cracked gear teeth, but this only affected a few hundred cars total - a bad batch of gears I suppose. It would be more helpful if you mentioned what the transmission was doing wrong. Does the car move, shift, reverse, shudder, etc. Might be something simple, might be the torque converter and not the transmission at all. When I diagnose mechanical problems, I tend to like to eliminate all of the simple items first. Often, relatively inexperienced mechanics like to quickly diagnose (without much consideration) and replace large parts. This way, it can't come back on them. I call this the gas cap approach - if you lift up the gas cap, slide a new car underneath, then screw the gas cap back on, that should fix the problem.

Thanks Japhrodisiac.

The car is changing gear but making a whining sound when changing which is more noticeable under hard acceleration. I have spoken to a specialist in the Uk who didn't sound convinced the transmission needed replacing and recommended checking the transmission oil level and checking the differential first. I asked Jaguar to recheck and they tell me there are particles of the clutch plate in the transmission fluid??? They have suggested they disassemble the transmission to see if they can supply the new parts and repair here and give me a quote for this. I am no expert and i am not comfortable they are giving me the best advice.

I have had the car for 3 years and totally agree with your diagnosis comments - they seem to start from the opposite end of the spectrum and change the biggest most expensive part first.

If the trans is whining at every gearchange, it is almost certainly the torque converter at fault, worn friction plate or cracked diaprgham plate lowering oil pressure inside the converter, if it is a worn friction plate the trans oil will be dark and smell sort of burnt, if the oil is ok then you could be lucky, because black oil has a habit of slowing down shift valves in the valve body, this will mean a complete overhaul because low oil pressure in the converter will affect all parts of the trans, a cracked diaphram plate will lower overall pressure and cause premature wearing of all the clutches in the trans, There should be two points on the box to attach independant pressure gauges, 1 for the converter, and 1 for the valve body, a good trans shop should know the pressure and changing figures,

Ive rebuilt 100s of comercial ZF auto boxes, and after the first 100, it was easy, the auto principle is the same though, and it could even be the regulator near the output shaft of box that is sticking, this is a gyroscopic thing that spins and also tells box when to change gear, if the oil aint black and doesnt smell, this would be an easy option to check,

Anyway, goodluck with trans! Lickey.

Guess what ...you were dead right! Having opened the gearbox they cannot find anything wrong but say there is a problem with the torque converter - a new one is 40,000 baht. I can probably get a new one from Jaguar in the UK for 60% of this cost. I could so easily have spent a lot of time and money trying to get a replacement gearbox which would have been a complete waste of time and money.

Thanks everyone for your comments and suggestions .......

[Lickey]

Glad to have been a little help Chayatom, Im not atall familar with the Jaguar setup, but when you get car back, ensure oil level is correct in trans, if it is a sealed unit, and the garage puts the specified amout in, should be ok, but if oil is checked with an underbonnet dipstick, get trans warm, select park, check oil, {engine running} should be between the marks if correct,,

2 more things to order from UK, set of fixing bolts between converter and flex plate, usually about 6, and an input shaft seal for trans, as this nearly always gets damaged after TC removal..

[chayatom]

I was looking forward to picking up my car yesterday with its new tourque converter after Jaguar rang to tell me everything was ok. However they test drove it again in the morning and have told me that the timing chain has broken which is likely to have damaged the engine. Can this possibly be a coincidence or have they screwed up something in replacing the torque converter??? They will tell me by Monday what the state of the enging is like.

[goldfish]

Sorry to hear of the trouble. Get down there asap. Don't believe anything you are told on the phone. See for yourself what, if anything, has happened and take it from there. Don't let them near the engine

[monty]

Bloody ell,

Broken timing belt means major damage to your engine. Most likely some of the valves impacted with the pistons, with all kinds of bent and broken metal as a result...

There's only very few "non interference" engines around, meaning engines where if the timing belt breaks they just stop running but incur no further damage. In these engines the valves can't touch the pistons, even with valves down and pistons at TDC.

I'm lucky to have one of those (red block Volvo, used in 200, 700 and 900 series)...

[LivinLOS]

If you drove the car to them.. Then 'they' broke the timing chain surely..

Major job and a royal pain.. I tend to change the timing chain / belt on any car I buy as I dont trust people to maintain at correct intervals.

[chayatom]

Update fromJaguar having removed the Cylinder Head......

timing chain fine - no engine damage

Oil cooler needs to be replaced

Water hose leak

these guys are unbelievable and i just hope i can get my car back in one piece

[John 1]

I will buy the Jag sight unseen for 200,000bt, you should take this offer quickly as you will only have a pile of spares to sell by the sound of your story.

[Luckydog]

May be worth draining the box and filling up with one of those additives for dodgy gears?

Why dont you give it a try?

[chayatom]

I will buy the Jag sight unseen for 200,000bt, you should take this offer quickly as you will only have a pile of spares to sell by the sound of your story.

Thanks john 1 for the kind offer - i am optimisitc by nature and expect to have my beautiful car up and running by the weekend (even if i have to push it myself!)