When To Get Influential People Invovled ?

[Maizefarmer]

A friend and I were talking today about those that use influential people's help. We both have heard it is common practice here in thailand. We are curious what others think about a couple of things.

Let's say that you meet a Police General and he lets you know that if you need any help to give him a call.

1. In which situations would you give him a call ??

Only for matters that deal with the police?

To get a message to low level government workers to leave you alone ?

To get some one that owes money to pay their bill ?

??

??

??

2. If you do give them a call are you going to be paying for the rest of your life ??

3. What happens if the other person has influential friends also ? Does it turn into a war ? Or is it My ace trumps your king ???

Any other thoughts, situations or questions feel free to through them in.

Wolfmanjack

The answer to all the above has to be a firm NO- as another member said, and as I can from my years of experiance living here: don't paddle in murky waters.

Firstly "low level government workers"will just run off to their civil servant superior if they feel under pressure from a Thai Police General (and Thai Police Generals exist by the truckload - no shortage of them), secondly, unpaid debts are civil matters - not criminal matters, thridly, unlees you have a long established close/inter family kind of relationship with your friendly copper he ain't going to stick his neck out (and quite frankly when push comes to shove there ain;t much he can do about an unpaid debt - as said , it's a civil matter), and if he does, yes - you can be pretty certain you have opened yourself to having to return the favour sometime in some way (that may not be convienent for you).

And lastly - no Ace does not trump King - it justs becomes messy.

Leave alone - it's seldom a road worth going down to resolve non-criminal problems.

Edited June 12, 2007 by Maizefarmer

[quiksilva]

I reserve it for good clean honest advice (perhaps over a dinner), or asking if they can act as a sponsor in a Permanent Residency application, or asking them to make a speech at a wedding etc.

But most certainly nothing that might cause them to lose face with their peers, in fact its best not to get into those situations in the first place.

[Old Man River]

I reserve it for good clean honest advice (perhaps over a dinner), or asking if they can act as a sponsor in a Permanent Residency application, or asking them to make a speech at a wedding etc.

But most certainly nothing that might cause them to lose face with their peers, in fact its best not to get into those situations in the first place.

Good advice.

I did get help on the PR application, but the wedding was too long ago for either of us to remember.

[technocracy]

Well here in Laos the knowledge of the right people is pretty ###### crucial in getting things done!

We've pull in favours and the like on numerous occasions - obviously in response you have to grease the old wheels but hey it's all clean enough fun!

One time we'd parked up for an hour in a yellow and whites marked pavement - which means stopping to drop off or short waiting only - anyway we hadn't been in the country for about 6 months and didn't know they were enforcing it. So we came back to the car and two of the boys in green walked over to us rubbing there hands with glee as they had got a falang! However this glee was soon removed when my wife said to them - wait here a minute - and she walked over to the immigration office (just round the corner from where we were parked) and she returned with a the family friend who is a General in Immigration police, he in turn told the two boys in green to go away . . . a bit of muttering and off they popped!

The said General also will be assisting my Permanent residence visa through when I finally get round to applying - but we have numerous 'friends' who assist who when we have the need. Also all these folks are always invited to basi's and any othe parties which we might have. I do remember the Boss of the village being so p*ssed at our wedding he fell off his motorbike into a bush!! Keep them oiled and friends and you'll find they'll gladly help you.

[samran]

indeed, yes it was a boat, and there are a few issues of transporting a boat on a road trailer legally due to some specific legislation that relates to trailers. I mentioned it before in some other thread, and the steel trap mind of Samran filed it for an ocassion just like this :-)

yeah, sorry there mate. Promise I'm not stalking you or anything...not like i'm a 16 year old school girl who remembers every single detail about ones, victim...ur, um sorry, crush..

hehe

actually, my mind is a steel trap for useless bits of information. Great when I'm at a pub quiz night, useless when our clients want to know EV/EBITDA multiples of mongolian sheep hearding enterprises.

Samran,

There are a lot of things that I did at home that I do not dare do here. At home I have plenty of people that can help me out of a nasty situation. Also i almost always carried a gun either on my person or in my car in case of "emergencies".

You do not have situations where you are automatically at fault if you get in an accident. If you have a beef with someone you either duke it out yourself or take it to court. It seems to me sort of strange that in a place where carrying a gun is legal you almost never see a gun pulled. Here in thailand where carrying a gun is mostly illegal it happens all the time. I have seen it several times myself and I don't go to the bars.

I can't think of 1 single instance where an influential person could have helped back home. I can think of several where it could have helped here in thailand.

Jackster, we move in totally different circles I'm afraid. I have no idea where you are from, whether it be Seth Efrica or elsewhere where things are at a point where people feel safer carrying guns around. Different experiences, so sorry I can't really relate (even here in Thailand).

The only time I come into the vicinity of inflential people these days is via work..and some family friends. The rest, like steve, I make my own way and hope for the best - smiling, speaking Thai and being deferential. As I said, people are usually helpful. The only time I turn into a snob, is when we get sh!tty service at a restuarant, and then I imitate my grouchy Thai chinese uncle. No chance of a fight happening there!!

ps...my comment wasn't meant to turn this thread into a gun debate

[sukanyacondo]

To the OP, personally, these ar chits i would not call in unless there was an emergency.

Couldn't agree more.

Also, it works just as well to subtely advertise that you are in "favour" with well connected people. And by this I don't mean running around shooting your mouth off. That would be the worst possible thing you could do.

Thai people, given other shortcomings allready addressed on this forum, are very observant people. They also talk & gossip more than any other race on earth (IMO). Just having the nayok thesabahn around for dinner will set all sorts of speculation going amongst the people in your moo bahn. After one or too situations like this it will not be necessary to even make a threat against other nearby people. You will also notice that the local police will "leave you alone" when it comes to everyday infractions of the law, & also generally side with you in minor disputes.

This is good advice (for once). Listen up!!

Soundman.

Wow Ive got two Happy new years cards from one of the Thai Princesses, I will frame them and hang them on the wall in our hall so all an sundry can see them when they come in. No Im not joking!!

[wolfmanjack]

indeed, yes it was a boat, and there are a few issues of transporting a boat on a road trailer legally due to some specific legislation that relates to trailers. I mentioned it before in some other thread, and the steel trap mind of Samran filed it for an ocassion just like this :-)

It was never about the money, but more to ensure that i didn't get stopped at every road block and have to unpack the whole boat to show I didn't have drugs etc; the drive is already 14 hours, and with stops would have bumped it up to 20+ with potential for on the spot fines. Plus there would have been consequences, as i filled the boat with an illegal quantity of crack cocaine. Actually, I'm not that serious about the crack.

All about doing everything in advance, not when the kee hits the patlom.

As far as thanks, I gave each of the policemen concerned a small token of appreciation (there were 3) that escorted me for part of the way - they were only doing their job, but it must not be fun riding a motorcycle for a hour and clearing traffic out of the way. Envelope, a few hundred baht inside, they weren't expecting it, but I can guarantee that their boss would have asked them was everything ok, and no doubt they could then tell him, ah yes, that was fine.

For the bigger guy, I have offered to take him out for dinner, and ring and chat to him socially from time to time; he actually has not been free yet to take me up on my offer; some nice seafood, a bottle of black or similar served, that sort of thing. That would be quite acceptable. For a higher up person, money would not be appropriate, a gift would be far more suited; his underlings, well a small bit of cash is fine.

Come this year or next, when i have the same issue, it will be very easy to get the same support.

Southern Thailand is fine, but around Bangkok police have never seen a boat like mine, and this immediately invites concern that 'this thing shouldn't be on a trailer/you can't transport somethign like that at this time of the day/you need some additional license for that/you aren't allowed to tow it with a car/it should be on a truck/ etc etc. With unclear legality, better to have all the paperwork and some support.

BTW just to be clear, I don't think that the people help me (at least) for the money. They help me mostly because they like me (amazing at that may seem) and as Samran said, many Thai people like to help people they like. In return I show gratitude, and the cycle continues.

But just yanking out cards to get out of parking tickets etc I think is an abuse of a friendship, and only a few people I know of would be scummy enough to do that.

Speaking Thai i properly I think is a major benefit in 'getting respect' here, probably far more than having a gun, strutting or anything else.

Thanks for the explanations. Speaking thai properly is not so easy for me since I am tone deaf. Even when I have my wife pronounce words and I repeat them many times I can not get them right. I do try though and can usually get my meaning across with much effort and the english added in.

As for the guns it did not figure in on the respect part back home. It was always for protection and every one assumes the other person has one also. Here in thailand it was always some one being stupid. I have seen a couple of thais flash the gun in their belt. One guy stuck a gun out the window and fired off a shot in the air when he passed the truck in front of him. I guess the guy was going too slow. All of these I can figure out why they did it. The one case I can not figure out was when a low level gov official walked into a friends office and placed a pistol on his desk. To this day I can not figure out what the point of that was.

As Samran said no need to start a gun debate. It has already been done unless you have any ideas on why a low level official would place a gun on the guys desk.

[wolfmanjack]

Thanks for all the advice from every one on both sides of the coin. I will keep it in mind if I ever gain any influential friends. I will also pass it on to my friend since he does not read thaivisa.

As you can understand those of us trying to run businesses here come into contact with gov officials more than those that are retired here. I know a few thai people that have businesses here that tell me they send gifts to higher ups every year at songklan and they tell me that I should also. I have never done so because I do not know any of the higher ups and always thought that it would be stupid to draw attention to myself. Any way what benefit would it bring to me ?? i can't see how they even remember all of the people that send gifts to them.

It is a pain in the ass to have to pay bribes all of the time to get people to do their jobs though and as technocracy pointed out having friends could help sort things like that out.