Phasing In Palm Oil And Diesel Fuel; What About Sugar Based Ethanol?

[seykota]

I'm a tad confused about Ethanol.

I read recently that the government is going to enforce the switch to ethanol/diesel mix, however the report stressed that this will be palm oil based. There has be quite a "hoopla" in our area for the past 5-6 months about switching to growing sugar cane, rather than solely rice, for the expanding ethanol industry. In fact, a hub for the collection of the sugar cane has been set up not far from our farm.

Several of us were preparing to grow palms but had been advised that sugar was a better choice.

Can anyone provide information about this?

Thanks

[Gary A]

I'm a tad confused about Ethanol.

I read recently that the government is going to enforce the switch to ethanol/diesel mix, however the report stressed that this will be palm oil based. There has be quite a "hoopla" in our area for the past 5-6 months about switching to growing sugar cane, rather than solely rice, for the expanding ethanol industry. In fact, a hub for the collection of the sugar cane has been set up not far from our farm.

Several of us were preparing to grow palms but had been advised that sugar was a better choice.

Can anyone provide information about this?

Thanks

Ethanol is mostly made from sugar cane here in Thailand and so much cane has been diverted to making ethanol that it has caused the price if sugar to go up. Ethanol is what makes gasohol and is a different fuel than bio diesel.

I think either crop is viable and it would be difficult to say which is better, Sugar cane will certainly give a quicker return.

[seykota]

Ethanol is mostly made from sugar cane here in Thailand and so much cane has been diverted to making ethanol that it has caused the price if sugar to go up. Ethanol is what makes gasohol and is a different fuel than bio diesel.

I think either crop is viable and it would be difficult to say which is better, Sugar cane will certainly give a quicker return.

Thanks Gary A,

So they are enforcing the supply of Bio diesel but what about ethanol? Is it currently being used as vehicle fuel?

I agree that sugar cane will provide a quicker return and I believe it is hardier (less maintanence) than palm, but I am still confused about gasahol vs bio diesel.

[Crossy]

So they are enforcing the supply of Bio diesel but what about ethanol? Is it currently being used as vehicle fuel?

Due to the fact that ethanol based additives to gasoline (known as gasohol and widely sold in Thailand) can cause SERIOUS DAMAGE to the fuel systems of certain vehicles the forced usage of this DAMAGING fuel has been, at least for now, abandoned. Unfortunately for the owners of vehicles which must use a 95 octane fuel (and cannot use gasohol) REAL gasoline is becoming more and more difficult to find

Luckily, the bio-additive to diesel does not cause such problems, indeed it has been noted as being beneficial to the engine, the more the better.

Two different fuels, two different crops.

[chownah]

Seykota,

If yo want to learn more about ethanol production, it has been discussed here a bit and you can find these threads by searching the farming forum for "ethanol".

Chownah

[pete_r]

The two crops are for two distinct uses: Sugar cane (as well as cassava) is to produce ethanol to blend with gasoline, for use in gasoline motors, while palm oil is to produce biodiesel to blend with diesel, for use in diesel motors.

Blends of ethanol and gasoline are now widely sold as gasohol (10% ethanol + 90% gasoline). On the other hand blends of biodiesel and diesel are being introduced as Biodiesel, but it's not as widespread as gasohol yet. I'm not sure about the proportions, but it could be 10% biodiesel + 90% diesel.

Sugar cane seems a safe investment, as far as investments can be safe, considering that there are currently 15 factories being built to process sugar cane or molasses into ethanol, mostly in the North & North-East (Korat, Khon Kaen, Chayapum, Petchaboon), plus 4 already in operation. Some of these factories will also be able to use cassava to produce ethanol, and 7 more factories using only cassava are also under construction. When these factories become operational in the next 2 to 3 years, the demand and prices for sugar cane and cassava should increase, but that will also depend on the supply and how many farmers switch to these crops, which is difficult to estimate.

[seykota]

Many thanks Pete r,

now I understand the situation.

Again thanks

seykota

[pete_r]

You're very welcome. My work is with cassava, but sugar cane is not far off when it comes to bioethanol.

One hurdle in developing the sector has been to find a good price balance so every player (farmers, ethanol factories, petrol companies) had enough incentive to join the party. Among others, it took some time for investors to be convinced that building ethanol factories would be worthwhile, considering the price of raw materials, the production cost of ethanol, and the price of ethanol set by the government.

[sly]

Hello,

my wife is from Nong Bua Lamphu and we have some land over there.We have planted sugar cane and after new year I will now if it is realy the right thing to do.From what I hear and read all over the world Ethanol is(in some country's annyway)something that is to stay.Bud for the moment I thing there are still many problems,not al the cars can use it,the distribution and production in thailand is for sure not yet as it should be.Bud,if I can believe the specialists ,some country's will for sure continue to do what they can since the oil price is getting set for more upside.

Now,as far as sugar cane is concerned;the family's in Nong Bua are all planting sugar cane.Now there seems to be a new factory in NBL,so the transport is not a big problem anymore.

Ik think for the moment the big question is the policital problems in Thailand.I hope that in december we will know something more about the future because there's nothing so bad for business as political situations as right now.

Any way,after new year I will let you know if the planting of sugar was a good idea or not.If you still have other views on this topic,I always would like to here from someone.Since I live in Belgium,I don't always know if the family of my wife are sure about what they are telling us.

Sawasdee Khrap

[seykota]

Hello Sly,

Further to my earlier posts; the refinery in Nong Bua is close to our farm but it will not be completed and operational for atleast 2 years. We have moved to Bangkok from Nong Bua as we wanted our young son to have greater educational opportunities, certainly in his formative years, than the local schools can provide. We gave alot of thought to the sugar option but finally decided that it is too labour intensive, especially at harvest time and we always have difficulty getting reliable labourers when we need them. We do not require a reqular monthly or yearly income from our land so our options are greater than many of the local farmers.

We are going down the long term plantation route of eucalyptus trees, I know about the possible negatives of this (soil degradation etc) but have also read and heard the counter arguments. Specific purpose plantations for paper production do assist in the long term re less demand for old growth trees etc. The paper production (Double A) company give assistance in the provision of seedlings and the harvesting when it is time eg 8+ years, so less reliance on local labour (including family). After 6 1/2 years living in Nong Bua my wife and I are comfortable with this decision. We asked our share farmer (he grows rice on some of our land) and his advice was to grow eucalyptus, to avoid reliance on local labour!!

seykota