Aftertaste from new 3-stage water filter -- just be patient until it goes away?

[retiree]

Just replaced my 20-year old stainless steel 3-stage water filter with a similar, new Mazuma M3F3-UF guy.   Ordinary carbon and resin tanks, and a newfangled "UF Membrane" for the drinking water (it can be replaced by an ordinary ceramic filter).  

https://mazuma.co.th/en/product/m3f3-uf/ 

 

In any case, I'm getting an aftertaste in the drinking water.  The Interweb says that the taste can be due to temporary leaching from the resin stage (I used the bag of Mazuma resin that came with the filter).   I've always used the cheapest HomePro carbon / resin / ceramic in the past, and never had this before.  Letting the water run and/or backflushing for a few 20-minute runs don't seem to help. 

 

Anybody else get this?  Should I just be patient until it goes away?  Thanks in advance for any advice,

-- Retiree 

[Bill97]

Did you activate the carbon?

[Lacessit]

I would suggest boiling the water and tasting it after it cools. If the aftertaste is still there, it's metallic contamination. If it's not, most probably organic contaminants from the resin or carbon.

[dj230]

people trust the tap water in Thailand ? 

 

even a home water filter can't filter everything

[Dan O]

If there's resin leaching from the filter media that may not be safe for drinking. If it doesn't clear from a good flushing I would remove it and replace it with another media. 

[flexomike]

1 hour ago, dj230 said:

people trust the tap water in Thailand ? 

 

even a home water filter can't filter everything

Been drinking it in Rayong from a small village reservoir for six years with a three stage filter and a pre stage sediment filter and charcoal filter no problems

[dj230]

35 minutes ago, flexomike said:

Been drinking it in Rayong from a small village reservoir for six years with a three stage filter and a pre stage sediment filter and charcoal filter no problems

I mean you wouldn't notice the problems until you're older, I just figured it wasn't regulated/tested regularly so it might not be safe.

 

In my home country it's frequently tested to make sure it's safe, and even then people filter it

[retiree]

Thanks for the comments.   Fwiw, a) early aftertaste is a pretty common phenomenon, apparently, b) the resin and DVB binder are not toxic, at least in the tiny amount that might be dissolved, and c) I think tap water is generally safe -- especially in well-maintained apartment buildings in the middle of the city.  It's just not tasty and it leaves spots on the glasses.   

 

It's certainly possible I just pulverized some of the resin beads while poking them through a funnel into the tank (with a chopstick -- I would'a could'a should'a poured water down the funnel instead).   I guess I'll just swap in store-bought water a little more frequently for a few weeks, and switch out the resin if the taste doesn't clear up.  

 

Btw, Bangkok does test water continuously, just like any other city, and water coming out of the plants is perfectly safe (well, salinity was high for a bit last year, but is usually about half the recommended level).  See: 

https://twqonline.mwa.co.th/map.php?type=cl     live from the Metro Water Authority

https://www.pwa.co.th/download/pwastandard50-1.pdf     waterworks website

 

A recent study at end-points is here -- water stored in poorly maintained (pressure) tanks seems to be a particular problem: 

https://www.e3s-conferences.org/articles/e3sconf/pdf/2018/05/e3sconf_iwa2018_01011.pdf 

The study points out that: 

WHO recommended in distribution system should be free residual chlorine above 0.2 mg/l to prevent post contamination. (WHO 2011)

The live map shows chlorine levels usually several times higher, with 0.2 the minimum as far as I can see, and over 1.0 through almost all of central Bangkok.  No surprise people use carbon filters!  

 

This article (and some of its citations) is a really interesting look at water distribution in general:

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0043135418302392

In particular, it makes the point that the omnipresence of microbes in drinking water systems has been proven and acknowledged .  

 

I am not personally aware of any reporting of outbreaks of water-borne illness from Bangkok tap water -- has anybody seen this?  Actually, I wonder whether or not first-world water-related problems like Legionnaire's disease pose a greater risk ???? 

 

-- Retiree 

Edited September 1, 2022 by retiree

[tomazbodner]

Using a 5 stage filter (from Pure, if that makes a difference) with UltraFiltration has no strange smell, taste or after taste, and I've been drinking it for a good year now. Can't tell if it's harming me but having done the <deleted> test on filtered water, it's disappointingly showing same or higher than the tap water that goes into filter. <deleted> is always around 200-300 range. Tap water before that is in 150-250 range. It definitely filters out the sand and other solids, just not dissolved ones. At least UV lamp is in it, but still... considering changing to RO filter now, but difficult finding table-top model that hooks up to the faucet since Xiaomi stopped selling them. Most are under-counter type or have own tank at the back. So far only found Coway but no idea whether they are any good?

[marin]

17 hours ago, dj230 said:

people trust the tap water in Thailand ? 

 

even a home water filter can't filter everything

Don't post if you dont know. 30+ years here and for all that time we have used filtered water and nary a problem one. I dont know one Thai house in our village that buys bottled water. 

 

Don' forget to brush your teeth with your bottled water. ????

[retiree]

20 minutes ago, tomazbodner said:

the <deleted> test

uhh, what is that?

[tomazbodner]

38 minutes ago, retiree said:

uhh, what is that?

T-D-S - Total Dissolved Solids

[unheard]

1 hour ago, marin said:

Don't post if you dont know. 30+ years here and for all that time we have used filtered water and nary a problem one.

Does it mean that water quality is good and consistent throughout Thailand???

[unheard]

16 hours ago, dj230 said:

I just figured it wasn't regulated/tested regularly so it might not be safe.

You're absolutely correct.

The only way to know for sure if your drinking water is safe to drink is to pay for a comprehensive lab water test.

Besides, only Reverse Osmosis removes every kind of impurity out of water.

Also, without the test you will not  know if your water is loaded with some nasty mineral like Fluoride (not uncommon, especially in the Northern Thailand), since it has no smell or taste and might take years to show up as a problem.

Edited September 1, 2022 by unheard

[dj230]

1 hour ago, marin said:

Don't post if you dont know. 30+ years here and for all that time we have used filtered water and nary a problem one. I dont know one Thai house in our village that buys bottled water. 

 

Don' forget to brush your teeth with your bottled water. ????

I mean, just because people do it doesn't really make it optimal or safe. Brushing your teeth would be quite different from ingestion, I don't drink the water after I brush my teeth with it. I can't say most mid aged and older people in Thailand are "healthy", both physically and mentally. I would assume living conditions and diet would be for the most part the cause. Interestingly, a lot of Thai friends have a family member or friend who has had cancer, not correlating with water, but it has to be something in Thailand, I am assuming it has to do with diet. 

But to each their own, I was just shocked people trust the water in Thailand enough to filter and drink it vs paying for bottled water which doesn't cost much. 

 

21 minutes ago, unheard said:

You're absolutely correct.

The only way to know for sure if your drinking water is safe to drink is to pay for a comprehensive lab water test.

Besides, only Reverse Osmosis removes every kind of impurity out of water.

Also, without the test you will not  know if your water is loaded with some nasty mineral like Fluoride (not uncommon, especially in the Northern Thailand), since it has no smell or taste and might take years to show up as a problem.

I read even reverse osmosis only removes ~99% of impurities/metals. 
That would be a good solution though, regularly testing your water supply. I wonder if Thailand has any regulations which do so. It's usually monitored in other countries. 

Edited September 1, 2022 by dj230

[unheard]

22 minutes ago, dj230 said:

I wonder if Thailand has any regulations which do so. It's usually monitored in other countries. 

I'd think they regularly test bigger cities municipal water supplies.

But even there water can and does get contaminated via dirty, broken supply pipes.

Edited September 1, 2022 by unheard

[dj230]

1 hour ago, unheard said:

I'd think they regularly test bigger cities municipal water supplies.

But even there water can and does get contaminated via dirty, broken supply pipes.

The water in my tap usually isn't even clear. 

[retiree]

23 hours ago, dj230 said:

Interestingly, a lot of Thai friends have a family member or friend who has had cancer, not correlating with water, but it has to be something in Thailand, I am assuming it has to do with diet. 

Yes, it's puzzling.

WHO International Agency for Research on Cancer
https://gco.iarc.fr/today/online-analysis-map    (the table tab, sorted by value)
Estimated age-standardized incidence rates (World) in 2020, all cancers, both sexes, all ages
Population      Value
Australia       452.4      (50% of all Aus are diagnosed with cancer by 85, www.cancer.org.au)
New Zealand     422.9
Ireland 372.8
United States of America        362.2      (40% lifetime risk, www.cancer.gov)
Denmark 351.1
The Netherlands 349.6
Belgium 349.2
Canada  348.0
France  341.9
Hungary 338.2
Norway  327.5
United Kingdom  319.9
Switzerland     317.6
Germany 313.2
....
Thailand        164.0   #88
 

[retiree]

Getting back to the question, the answer is yes, be patient.  The aftertaste cleared up in about 5 days.  My takeaways:

 -- use water, rather than a stick, to help carbon and resin pour down the funnel in to the filter cylinder (to avoid pulverizing the powder).
 - -with a UF membrane and the Mazuma filter, allow more time for initial flushing through all three stages -- not just the carbon + resin stages.

 

I didn't want to clog the UF membrane, so I don't think I let the drinking spigot run long enough -- my bad. 

I suspect the taste was due to teeny bits of resin & DVB getting caught in the UF membrane, and in the bottom of the resin tank.  On the Mazuma, the drinking water flow pipe is a little lower than the dishwashing spigot; my old tank had them at the same level.   The membrane probably fouled a bit in the first few uses, and took longer than expected to dissolve out.

 

With a traditional ceramic filter, I usually stiff brush the ceramic after a day or two to clear off the fine carbon and resin that made it through.  The UF membrane does not appear dirty (and can't be brushed anyway).  Still, next time I'll take it out and try to spray-clean it after a day or two, and maybe try using a rubber hose to backwash it -- https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/am/pii/S0376738816319937 has an interesting backwash discussion.   And there are various chemical solutions that can be used for periodic cleaning down the road, if needed. 
 

Thanks all for comments,

-- Retiree

Edited September 2, 2022 by retiree

[dj230]

3 hours ago, retiree said:

Yes, it's puzzling.

WHO International Agency for Research on Cancer
https://gco.iarc.fr/today/onli

3 hours ago, retiree said:

Yes, it's puzzling.

WHO International Agency for Research on Cancer
https://gco.iarc.fr/today/online-analysis-map    (the table tab, sorted by value)
Estimated age-standardized incidence rates (World) in 2020, all cancers, both sexes, all ages
Population      Value
Australia       452.4      (50% of all Aus are diagnosed with cancer by 85, www.cancer.org.au)
New Zealand     422.9
Ireland 372.8
United States of America        362.2      (40% lifetime risk, www.cancer.gov)
Denmark 351.1
The Netherlands 349.6
Belgium 349.2
Canada  348.0
France  341.9
Hungary 338.2
Norway  327.5
United Kingdom  319.9
Switzerland     317.6
Germany 313.2
....
Thailand        164.0   #88
 

ne-analysis-map    (the table tab, sorted by value)
Estimated age-standardized incidence rates (World) in 2020, all cancers, both sexes, all ages
Population      Value
Australia       452.4      (50% of all Aus are diagnosed with cancer by 85, www.cancer.org.au)
New Zealand     422.9
Ireland 372.8
United States of America        362.2      (40% lifetime risk, www.cancer.gov)
Denmark 351.1
The Netherlands 349.6
Belgium 349.2
Canada  348.0
France  341.9
Hungary 338.2
Norway  327.5
United Kingdom  319.9
Switzerland     317.6
Germany 313.2
....
Thailand        164.0   #88
 

The wealthiest countries with the best healthcare have higher numbers in this data, perhaps it's actually being recorded correctly in those countries. 

 

 

Edited September 2, 2022 by dj230