Australian pensioners retired in Thailand.

Lacessit · June 24, 2023

The poll is to determine the status of retired Australians living here. It is not intended to be judgmental of anyone, call it curiosity if you will, based on another long running thread.

KhunHeineken · June 26, 2023

Not many votes been cast as yet, but 60% are self funded and paying resident tax, or under the tax free threshold. I am in this group also.

How do people in this group propose to continue to be residents for tax purposes if they haven't been back to Australia for years, given the new laws discussed in the other thread?

Tom A Hawk · June 27, 2023

I ticked part pension taxed as a resident.

Yeah rightio · August 24, 2023

On 6/26/2023 at 12:31 PM, KhunHeineken said:

How do people in this group propose to continue to be residents for tax purposes if they haven't been back to Australia for years, given the new laws discussed in the other thread?

Don't you mean the proposed new laws or have I missed that?

Aged pensioners are allowed to leave permanently and although it's a requirement to be a resident when applying for the aged pension, if going to live overseas permanently then residency no longer applies and as Centrelink do not withhold tax from my pension I'm not obligated to put in a return. This was all confirmed to me by the ATO when I called prior to leaving, and no I don't have an ATO link, so the one below will just have to suffice.

The ATO have also negated my need to put in yearly 'Non Lodgement' forms through special dispensations they may apply to people whose only source of income is the Aged Pension as outlined in this post and the link.

https://www.etax.com.au/aged-pension/#:~:text=You don't need to,to lodge a tax return.

Edited August 24, 2023 by Yeah rightio

Yeah rightio · August 24, 2023

On 6/24/2023 at 1:10 PM, Lacessit said:

The poll is to determine the status of retired Australians living here. It is not intended to be judgmental of anyone, call it curiosity if you will, based on another long running thread.

Would being able to answer more than one question give a slightly different outlook, given that my choice would've been to answer both your first and last question; as outlined in my post above??

Lacessit · August 24, 2023

3 hours ago, Yeah rightio said:

Would being able to answer more than one question give a slightly different outlook, given that my choice would've been to answer both your first and last question; as outlined in my post above??

Perhaps one of the questions is redundant, given it's automatic someone opting out of submitting a tax return pays no tax.

KhunHeineken · September 24, 2023

On 8/24/2023 at 5:43 AM, Yeah rightio said:

Don't you mean the proposed new laws or have I missed that?

Aged pensioners are allowed to leave permanently and although it's a requirement to be a resident when applying for the aged pension, if going to live overseas permanently then residency no longer applies and as Centrelink do not withhold tax from my pension I'm not obligated to put in a return. This was all confirmed to me by the ATO when I called prior to leaving, and no I don't have an ATO link, so the one below will just have to suffice.

The ATO have also negated my need to put in yearly 'Non Lodgement' forms through special dispensations they may apply to people whose only source of income is the Aged Pension as outlined in this post and the link.

https://www.etax.com.au/aged-pension/#:~:text=You don't need to,to lodge a tax return.

Yawn.

Been debated and proven through many links, particularly one link where the question was asked on an online ATO forum, and answered by a staff member from the ATO.

A pension is deemed to be an income, and if you are a non resident for tax purposes, you "should" be paying 32.5% tax on any, and all income, derived from Australia, which includes pensions.

The proposed changes are not new laws. They just allow the ATO, Centrelink, and Immigration data bases to finally all communicate together in order to either collect the 32.5% non resident tax from those earning back in Australia, or withhold 32.5% tax on pensions. It's as simple as that.

4MyEgo · September 26, 2023

On 8/24/2023 at 3:43 PM, Yeah rightio said:

Aged pensioners are allowed to leave permanently and although it's a requirement to be a resident when applying for the aged pension, if going to live overseas permanently then residency no longer applies and as Centrelink do not withhold tax from my pension I'm not obligated to put in a return. This was all confirmed to me by the ATO when I called prior to leaving, and no I don't have an ATO link, so the one below will just have to suffice.

The ATO have also negated my need to put in yearly 'Non Lodgement' forms through special dispensations they may apply to people whose only source of income is the Aged Pension as outlined in this post and the link.

This whole age pension tax thing living overseas is a huge balls up and confusing, but once you have a read of this, your not going to like it.

It's a real eye opener.

https://www.smsfmate.com.au/how-long-can-australian-pensioners-stay-overseas-without-losing-their-pension/#:~:text=The Age Pension and Taxation,-As an age&text=The pension is considered taxable,deduct tax from your payments.

And then there is SAPTO

https://www.ato.gov.au/individuals/income-deductions-offsets-and-records/tax-offsets/seniors-and-pensioners-tax-offset/#Incomelimits

From my reading, they can take $0.32.5c in every $, no threshold as you are deemed a non resident, then they credit you SAPTO, $2,230, so this means you can lose a big chunk of your pension.

You don't have to be a resident to claim SAPTO, but you have to qualify for it to get it, it's not automatic.

Then if your like me, and have just enough assets to show you qualify, you get a double wammy, they apply a Deeming Rate of 2.5% on that, but allow you an income of $204 per fortnight.

At then end of the day in my case it works at at half the pension, so not worth it, others might want to do there calculations as well to see if it's worth it.

Maybe I can get rid of some of these assets in the next 4 years without them knowing ?

At then end of the day, we can all play dumb and when the time comes, ah yeh, $50 per fortnight should be doable.

Edited September 26, 2023 by 4MyEgo

Olmate · September 26, 2023

2 hours ago, 4MyEgo said:

This whole age pension tax thing living overseas is a huge balls up and confusing, but once you have a read of this, your not going to like it.

It's a real eye opener.

?

https://www.smsfmate.com.au/how-long-can-australian-pensioners-stay-overseas-without-losing-their-pension/#:~:text=The Age Pension and Taxation,-As an age&text=The pension is considered taxable,deduct tax from your payments.

And then there is SAPTO

https://www.ato.gov.au/individuals/income-deductions-offsets-and-records/tax-offsets/seniors-and-pensioners-tax-offset/#Incomelimits

From my reading, they can take $0.32.5c in every $, no threshold as you are deemed a non resident, then they credit you SAPTO, $2,230, so this means you can lose a big chunk of your pension.

You don't have to be a resident to claim SAPTO, but you have to qualify for it to get it, it's not automatic.

Then if your like me, and have just enough assets to show you qualify, you get a double wammy, they apply a Deeming Rate of 2.5% on that, but allow you an income of $204 per fortnight.

At then end of the day in my case it works at at half the pension, so not worth it, others might want to do there calculations as well to see if it's worth it.

Maybe I can get rid of some of these assets in the next 4 years without them knowing ?

At then end of the day, we can all play dumb and when the time comes, ah yeh, $50 per fortnight should be doable.

Would you buy a used car from Aswin?

KhunHeineken · October 1, 2023

On 9/26/2023 at 7:29 AM, 4MyEgo said:

From my reading, they can take $0.32.5c in every $, no threshold as you are deemed a non resident, then they credit you SAPTO, $2,230, so this means you can lose a big chunk of your pension.

No, no, no, Sir. This applies only to guys like Paul Hogan. Every other Australia citizen is exempt. :cheesy:

KhunHeineken · October 1, 2023

On 9/26/2023 at 10:02 AM, Olmate said:

Would you buy a used car from Aswin?

Aswin is only repeating what the whole industry, and government, have been saying for some time.

KhunHeineken · February 2

Bumping this thread for some more poll data from newer members.

KhunHeineken · February 2

On 9/26/2023 at 7:29 AM, 4MyEgo said:

This whole age pension tax thing living overseas is a huge balls up and confusing, but once you have a read of this, your not going to like it.

It's a real eye opener.

https://www.smsfmate.com.au/how-long-can-australian-pensioners-stay-overseas-without-losing-their-pension/#:~:text=The Age Pension and Taxation,-As an age&text=The pension is considered taxable,deduct tax from your payments.

And then there is SAPTO

https://www.ato.gov.au/individuals/income-deductions-offsets-and-records/tax-offsets/seniors-and-pensioners-tax-offset/#Incomelimits

From my reading, they can take $0.32.5c in every $, no threshold as you are deemed a non resident, then they credit you SAPTO, $2,230, so this means you can lose a big chunk of your pension.

You don't have to be a resident to claim SAPTO, but you have to qualify for it to get it, it's not automatic.

Then if your like me, and have just enough assets to show you qualify, you get a double wammy, they apply a Deeming Rate of 2.5% on that, but allow you an income of $204 per fortnight.

At then end of the day in my case it works at at half the pension, so not worth it, others might want to do there calculations as well to see if it's worth it.

Maybe I can get rid of some of these assets in the next 4 years without them knowing ?

At then end of the day, we can all play dumb and when the time comes, ah yeh, $50 per fortnight should be doable.

This post contradicts what you have been posting in the other thread.

"From my reading, they can take $0.32.5c in every $, no threshold as you are deemed a non resident" - why are you now saying otherwise in the other thread? What has changed?

4MyEgo · February 6

On 2/2/2024 at 7:27 PM, KhunHeineken said:

This post contradicts what you have been posting in the other thread.

"From my reading, they can take $0.32.5c in every $, no threshold as you are deemed a non resident" - why are you now saying otherwise in the other thread? What has changed?

We all know why, except you, i.e. we stumbled upon new information, e.g. Article 18 of the Double Taxation Agreement between Australia and Thailand, of which you have since been made aware of in the other thread, but are still reluctant to say you were WRONG "from your reading, above.....LoL

Lacessit · February 6

:violin:

11 hours ago, 4MyEgo said:

We all know why, except you, i.e. we stumbled upon new information, e.g. Article 18 of the Double Taxation Agreement between Australia and Thailand, of which you have since been made aware of in the other thread, but are still reluctant to say you were WRONG "from your reading, above.....LoL

"When the facts change, I change my mind. What do you do, sir?" ( John

Maynard Keynes )

When one is in a hole, it's best to stop digging.

Perhaps we will be seeing KH in China next.

Edited February 6 by Lacessit

Olmate · February 6

15 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

"When the facts change, I change my mind. What do you do, sir?" ( John

Maynard Keynes )

When one is in a hole, it's best to stop digging.

Perhaps we will be seeing KH in China next.

Can they treat OCD in China?

Lacessit · February 6

34 minutes ago, Olmate said:

Can they treat OCD in China?

AFAIK they are sent to re-education camps. I am wondering how far he has tunneled by now.

I couldn't find a guy beating a drum, so a violin will have to do. 🤣

KhunHeineken · February 7

21 hours ago, 4MyEgo said:

We all know why, except you, i.e. we stumbled upon new information, e.g. Article 18 of the Double Taxation Agreement between Australia and Thailand, of which you have since been made aware of in the other thread, but are still reluctant to say you were WRONG "from your reading, above.....LoL

Why don't you run YOUR interpretation past some companies like this one?

https://www.ngssuper.com.au/articles/news/age-pension-travelling-overseas#:~:text=Yes — the age pension is,you lodge your tax return.

Can I live overseas and get the age pension?

If eligible, yes. Your payments will be made every 4 weeks instead of fortnightly, and you may be paid less than what you would have in Australia.

Is the age pension taxable?

Yes — the age pension is counted as taxable income. You can ask Services Australia to deduct tax from your payment so you don't need to pay it when you lodge your tax return.

KhunHeineken · February 7

9 hours ago, Lacessit said:

"When the facts change, I change my mind. What do you do, sir?" ( John

Maynard Keynes )

When one is in a hole, it's best to stop digging.

Perhaps we will be seeing KH in China next.

You really are in denial.

I'll explain it in the other thread.

KhunHeineken · February 7

9 hours ago, Olmate said:

Can they treat OCD in China?

Not sure, but it's difficult to treat ignorance on this forum. :cheesy:

ripstanley · February 7

On 2/2/2024 at 3:25 PM, KhunHeineken said:

Bumping this thread for some more poll data from newer members.

You should read the initial post again. The poll closed in August 2023.

Olmate · February 7

6 minutes ago, KhunHeineken said:

Not sure, but it's difficult to treat ignorance on this forum.

12 minutes ago, KhunHeineken said:

Why don't you run YOUR interpretation past some companies like this one?

https://www.ngssuper.com.au/articles/news/age-pension-travelling-overseas#:~:text=Yes — the age pension is,you lodge your tax return.

Can I live overseas and get the age pension?

If eligible, yes. Your payments will be made every 4 weeks instead of fortnightly, and you may be paid less than what you would have in Australia.

Is the age pension taxable?

Yes — the age pension is counted as taxable income. You can ask Services Australia to deduct tax from your payment so you don't need to pay it when you lodge your tax return.

Wrong about both! Give up today!! SOS.

KhunHeineken · February 7

9 hours ago, Lacessit said:

AFAIK they are sent to re-education camps. I am wondering how far he has tunneled by now.

I couldn't find a guy beating a drum, so a violin will have to do. 🤣

You disregard every piece of information except one piece of information that meets your narrative, which is question due to its mention of another "Article" and then beat your own drum that you are right and I am wrong.

I keep an open mind, and I am still researching, but there's more to Article 18 and Article 19 than you think.

Olmate · February 7

13 minutes ago, KhunHeineken said:

Not sure, but it's difficult to treat ignorance on this forum.

Consult one of your linked experts, they seem to excell! 😂

KhunHeineken · February 7

4 minutes ago, ripstanley said:

You should read the initial post again. The poll closed in August 2023.

Can the OP bump the poll date, if he has enough time in between trolling me? :smile:

KhunHeineken · February 7

3 minutes ago, Olmate said:

Wrong about both! Give up today!! SOS.

Do you disagree with the information in the link?

KhunHeineken · February 7

2 minutes ago, Olmate said:

Consult one of your linked experts, they seem to excell! 😂

Well, at least they are not of the professional opinion such laws "are only for guys like Paul Hogan." :cheesy:

Mike Lister · February 7

This thread has been closed, per the request of the op.

Sign In

Australian pensioners retired in Thailand.