EU Ministers to Boycott Hungary’s Foreign Affairs Summit Amid Growing Tensions

[RayC]

3 hours ago, NativeBob said:

By watching Euronews and France24 I wouldn't say they are prospering either.

The best example on how they doing was Brexit: brits pulled many facts on why they should go by their own and NOT by demands from Brussel.

 

The EU faces challenges; when hasn't it? However, despite the doomsayers predicting that the EU would disintegrate following Brexit, nothing of the kind has occurred. In fact, public support for the EU remains high; above 50% - well above in many cases - in all EU member states with the exception of Greece where it is +/-48%.

 

The economic performance of the individual member states at any one point time will almost inevitably be variable. This is hardly surprising given the different industrial make-up of the individual countries.

 

I find the idea that Brexit has been a success laughable given the wealth of evidence which suggests otherwise.

[Tubulat]

2 hours ago, john donson said:

one country that wants to keep it values and not want to be invaded by muslims

100% true!!

Thanks for mention this.

[Tubulat]

2 hours ago, candide said:

You should get informed about EU institutions and scope, instead of posting nonsense.

A short one for a start.

https://european-union.europa.eu/institutions-law-budget/law/how-eu-policy-decided_en

Is it you Mr Borrell?

[NativeBob]

10 minutes ago, Peterphuket said:

Just put down like that by the same fillies who consider themselves superior to the population.
Not even elected yet, something like "if you are nice to me, I will make you head of the eu".
A disgusting club.

COVID-19 pandemia showed to the whole world level of corruption in EU, and just one of screaming samples.

One of the biggest damage was done to agricultural sectors: in France centuries old farms are closing down, Germany, Italy and others

[RayC]

2 hours ago, candide said:

You should get informed about EU institutions and scope, instead of posting nonsense.

A short one for a start.

https://european-union.europa.eu/institutions-law-budget/law/how-eu-policy-decided_en

 

Give it up, mate. You are wasting your time and energy.

 

The simple fact is that there are clearly people who do not have the foggiest idea about the different EU institutions and how they function, nor do they have any desire to acquire this knowledge.

[CG1 Blue]

3 minutes ago, RayC said:

The simple fact is that there are clearly people who do not have the foggiest idea about the different EU institutions and how they function, nor do they have any desire to acquire this knowledge.

And there are people who turn a blind eye to all the EU corruption and squandering of money, because they desperately want to believe the EU is good. 

[RayC]

14 minutes ago, NativeBob said:

COVID-19 pandemia showed to the whole world level of corruption in EU, and just one of screaming samples.

 

The alleged corruption involving von der Leyen and Pfizer is currently being investigated 

 

https://www.politico.eu/article/pfizergate-covid-vaccine-scandal-european-prosecutors-eu-commission/

 

14 minutes ago, NativeBob said:

One of the biggest damage was done to agricultural sectors: in France centuries old farms are closing down, Germany, Italy and others

 

How is the damage done by lockdown measures to the agricultural sector the fault of the EU? Decisions regarding lockdowns were made by the individual member states not at an EU level. The European Commission did intervene in an attempt to mitigate against the negative effects of lockdown. Would you have preferred that they remained idle?

 

https://commission.europa.eu/strategy-and-policy/coronavirus-response/supporting-jobs-and-economy-during-coronavirus-pandemic/state-aid-cases/france_en#:~:text=on 28 July 2021%2C the,the spread of the virus.

 

Btw many centuries-old French farms have benefited from EU CAP related subsidies over the years.

[RayC]

19 minutes ago, CG1 Blue said:

And there are people who turn a blind eye to all the EU corruption and squandering of money, because they desperately want to believe the EU is good. 

 

Not at all.

 

The alleged corruption is quite rightly being investigated (see link in my post above). If found guilty, I would hope that the individuals are punished and any necessary changes made to EU processes and procedures to minimise the chances that such events cannot happen again.

 

Imo there is much that can be improved  with the mechanics of the EU. However, I support its' fundamental principles and I do not subscribe to the overly simplistic view apparently held by many on this forum - perhaps not by you? - that the UK's problems will somehow be solved as a result of Brexit. In fact, as I pointed out on numerous occasions, the overwhelming evidence to date suggests the exact opposite.

[Peterphuket]

11 hours ago, NativeBob said:

COVID-19 pandemia showed to the whole world level of corruption in EU, and just one of screaming samples.

One of the biggest damage was done to agricultural sectors: in France centuries old farms are closing down, Germany, Italy and others

Again I agree with you, can you still imagine there are people who think differently, even with this item you see them emerging as trolls again.

[Peterphuket]

11 hours ago, RayC said:

 

Not at all.

 

The alleged corruption is quite rightly being investigated (see link in my post above). If found guilty, I would hope that the individuals are punished and any necessary changes made to EU processes and procedures to minimise the chances that such events cannot happen again.

 

Imo there is much that can be improved  with the mechanics of the EU. However, I support its' fundamental principles and I do not subscribe to the overly simplistic view apparently held by many on this forum - perhaps not by you? - that the UK's problems will somehow be solved as a result of Brexit. In fact, as I pointed out on numerous occasions, the overwhelming evidence to date suggests the exact opposite.

The EEC, which was a good development for trade in Europe, but the EU is an unwieldy ungovernable and far too costly machine which will only bring more misery to the eu, just look at the euro als voorbeeld, completely failed.

[JonnyF]

11 hours ago, RayC said:

 

The EU faces challenges; when hasn't it? However, despite the doomsayers predicting that the EU would disintegrate following Brexit, nothing of the kind has occurred. In fact, public support for the EU remains high; above 50% - well above in many cases - in all EU member states with the exception of Greece where it is +/-48%.

 

The economic performance of the individual member states at any one point time will almost inevitably be variable. This is hardly surprising given the different industrial make-up of the individual countries.

 

I find the idea that Brexit has been a success laughable given the wealth of evidence which suggests otherwise.

 

The UK is doing just fine. We don't need to be in the EU, we've shown that. Look at the data, not always sticking to and repeating your out of touch, old fashioned ideas.

 

https://www.ft.com/content/0fc79013-5a66-4b34-a07a-b9b22a7342e1

 

[RayC]

6 hours ago, JonnyF said:

 

The UK is doing just fine. We don't need to be in the EU, we've shown that. Look at the data, not always sticking to and repeating your out of touch, old fashioned ideas.

 

https://www.ft.com/content/0fc79013-5a66-4b34-a07a-b9b22a7342e1

 

 

I agree that we should "look at the data". Doing so reveals that the only logical conclusion is that Brexit has had a negative economic effect on the UK. I have posted numerous links on numerous occasions supporting this view and I can only assume that you didn't bother reading them.

 

Rather than waste my time, reposting these links, I'll try a different approach: Do a search using the string  'Economic impact of Brexit on the UK' and then investigate the results and links yourself. Also given that you appear to have access to the FT, trawl through their library of Brexit articles, podcasts and videos. Spoiler alert: Taken as a whole, they paint Brexit in a negative light.

 

Try to put your irrational hatred of the EU to one side; take your own advice and "Look at the data".

[RayC]

7 hours ago, Peterphuket said:

The EEC, which was a good development for trade in Europe, but the EU is an unwieldy ungovernable and far too costly machine which will only bring more misery to the eu, just look at the euro als voorbeeld, completely failed.

 

You raise some valid points.

 

While I don't think that the EU is ungovernable, it is certainly unwieldy. The expansion of the membership in the 2000s did create problems of governance. To that end, the increased use of majority voting for legislation was probably a necessity. However, the loss of sovereignty for the individual member states and an increase in the power of the Commission are imo negative by-products. Personally, I would like to see more powers transferred to the European Parliament.

 

On a micro level, imo the Euro has been a success. A personal ancedote: I worked on a Europe-wide aviation project which straggled the introduction of the Euro. Pre-1999, one of the most tedious parts of the job concerns the logistics of international travel e.g. ensuring that I had sufficient francs, marks, lira, pesos, etc to tide me over for trips (recall that in those days overseas cards weren't so readily accepted by businesses and banks (ATMs)). In 1999 those problems evaporated overnight. I imagine that it was even more of a godsend for those businesses operating pan-Europe on a daily basis. 

 

At a macro level, the centralisation of monetary policy decisions has caused problems. For example, a cut in interest rates might be justified for Germany but not for Italy. However, is this really any different to the problem faced by the Fed in the US where the monetary policy needs of, say, California might differ from those of New York at any one time? No one is suggesting that the US starts afresh.

 

To state the blindingly obvious, the world today is a lot different to the one in which faced the EEC operated in the 70s/80s. In order for the Single Market to function in the 21st century, there has to be alignment on standards, etc. hence the need for greater (EU wide) regulation.

 

The scope of the EU has obviously increased to encompass education, R&D, foreign policy, etc. I see this increased co-operation as a good thing.

 

The EU has its' problems but all things considered, I believe that European nations benefit individually from being a member and that, on an aggregated level, Europe benefits from its' existence.

[Peterphuket]

2 hours ago, RayC said:

 

You raise some valid points.

 

While I don't think that the EU is ungovernable, it is certainly unwieldy. The expansion of the membership in the 2000s did create problems of governance. To that end, the increased use of majority voting for legislation was probably a necessity. However, the loss of sovereignty for the individual member states and an increase in the power of the Commission are imo negative by-products. Personally, I would like to see more powers transferred to the European Parliament.

 

On a micro level, imo the Euro has been a success. A personal ancedote: I worked on a Europe-wide aviation project which straggled the introduction of the Euro. Pre-1999, one of the most tedious parts of the job concerns the logistics of international travel e.g. ensuring that I had sufficient francs, marks, lira, pesos, etc to tide me over for trips (recall that in those days overseas cards weren't so readily accepted by businesses and banks (ATMs)). In 1999 those problems evaporated overnight. I imagine that it was even more of a godsend for those businesses operating pan-Europe on a daily basis. 

 

At a macro level, the centralisation of monetary policy decisions has caused problems. For example, a cut in interest rates might be justified for Germany but not for Italy. However, is this really any different to the problem faced by the Fed in the US where the monetary policy needs of, say, California might differ from those of New York at any one time? No one is suggesting that the US starts afresh.

 

To state the blindingly obvious, the world today is a lot different to the one in which faced the EEC operated in the 70s/80s. In order for the Single Market to function in the 21st century, there has to be alignment on standards, etc. hence the need for greater (EU wide) regulation.

 

The scope of the EU has obviously increased to encompass education, R&D, foreign policy, etc. I see this increased co-operation as a good thing.

 

The EU has its' problems but all things considered, I believe that European nations benefit individually from being a member and that, on an aggregated level, Europe benefits from its' existence.

Nice presentation and in part I agree with you, it is too much for me to set out my objections in a foreign language, but there are plenty.
I dare say that the majority of the EU population does not support the EU, for example education has become a disaster in the country I am originally from, and it used to be very good. The population is wrung out in collecting taxes. Healthcare is below par, many medicines are simply not available, despite having compulsory insurance.
It is a disaster, partly because of this same EU.
The micro level on the euro was an argument by the EU to push that filthy euro through, etc., etc., etc.

 

[UWEB]

On 7/16/2024 at 1:37 PM, blazes said:

Time for Magyarexit....

I hope so.

[RayC]

2 hours ago, Peterphuket said:

Nice presentation and in part I agree with you, it is too much for me to set out my objections in a foreign language, but there are plenty.
I dare say that the majority of the EU population does not support the EU, for example education has become a disaster in the country I am originally from, and it used to be very good. The population is wrung out in collecting taxes. Healthcare is below par, many medicines are simply not available, despite having compulsory insurance.
It is a disaster, partly because of this same EU.
The micro level on the euro was an argument by the EU to push that filthy euro through, etc., etc., etc.

 

 

The majority of the population in 26 of the member state are in favour of the EU (Greece is the exception). 

 

The provision of Education and Health services is the responsibility of the individual member states, so the EU cannot be blamed for any failings there.

[candide]

4 hours ago, Peterphuket said:

Nice presentation and in part I agree with you, it is too much for me to set out my objections in a foreign language, but there are plenty.
I dare say that the majority of the EU population does not support the EU, for example education has become a disaster in the country I am originally from, and it used to be very good. The population is wrung out in collecting taxes. Healthcare is below par, many medicines are simply not available, despite having compulsory insurance.
It is a disaster, partly because of this same EU.
The micro level on the euro was an argument by the EU to push that filthy euro through, etc., etc., etc.

 

It's quite interesting that you are citing examples which are not part of EU's prerogatives: tax policy, education policy, health policy are member States prerogatives.

It seems you are blaming the EU instead of the successive governments of your  country.

[stevenl]

11 hours ago, Peterphuket said:

Nice presentation and in part I agree with you, it is too much for me to set out my objections in a foreign language, but there are plenty.
I dare say that the majority of the EU population does not support the EU, for example education has become a disaster in the country I am originally from, and it used to be very good. The population is wrung out in collecting taxes. Healthcare is below par, many medicines are simply not available, despite having compulsory insurance.
It is a disaster, partly because of this same EU.
The micro level on the euro was an argument by the EU to push that filthy euro through, etc., etc., etc.

 

Your examples are not related to the EU but lack of governance from the Netherlands.