Tender Steaks

[AlexLah]

It is only about 2000 Bath for a good piece of meat that you really will enjoy.

If you like steak then just buy once a month or so.

There is another Japanese type of beef that is even more expensive (i believe double the price of Kobe), maybe I will try this weekend.

Let you know how it was when they have it.

Cheers,

Alie

[thaigerd]

It is only about 2000 Bath for a good piece of meat that you really will enjoy.

If you like steak then just buy once a month or so.

There is another Japanese type of beef that is even more expensive (i believe double the price of Kobe), maybe I will try this weekend.

Let you know how it was when they have it.

Cheers,

Alie

Kobe beef is more close to 5-6000.-Baht/kg!

Gerd

[Tywais]

Kobe beef is more close to 5-6000.-Baht/kg!

Gerd

An interesting side note on Kobe beef.

"Most Kobe Beef today is bred and raised in California and Australia. For example, Harris Ranch in California is contracted with beef producers in Kobe to breed and raise their cattle in California, where land and grain is relatively inexpensive. The cattle is raised and fed under the exacting specifications for Kobe Beef. When the cattle is almost ready for slaughter, it is shipped to Kobe, Japan, where its feeding is completed, and the cattle is slaughtered."

Source: The History of Kobe Beef in Japan

[AlexLah]

Yes so what are you trying to say?

I payed 2000 Bath for a 200 Gram steak, something wrong with that?

The fact that some beef is raised in the US using special breeds and (Japanes methods) does not make it US beef.

[Tywais]

The fact that some beef is raised in the US using special breeds and (Japanes methods) does not make it US beef.

Never said that AlexLah, just found it interesting and one reason that adds to the cost.

[sibeymai]

love topics like these...everyone is bound to have an opinion.

For mine it's Aussie beef preferably, but US or NZ beef is just as acceptable.

Nothing less than 1" thick and BBQ on a steel plate with a wood fire (charcoal/gas is for wimps).

I don't marinate before as I want to taste the steak. A light salting while the meat is hot off the BBQ will suffice.

The secret to good BBQ steak is temperature control. The plate has to be hot...ideally just a few minutes after the flames start to die down and the fire is settling into coals. Use small pieces of wood to maintain/control temperature. Keep a larger amount of fuel under the centre of the plate and less at the edges so the edges are cooler for greater temperature variation/control on the cooking surface. Usually cook steak (beef or pork) and sausages in the centre and eggs, fish, chicken, tomatoes, onions, bread, pineapple, potatoes, etc around the edges.

When you think the plate temperature is right to start cooking pour beer over the entire cooking area. This should immediately steam off if the plate is hot enough. Scrape the remaining burnt sugar off the plate and you have a freshly cleaned cooking surface. If cooking thick sausages start with these a good 10 minutes before steaks. Move the sausages aside to finish cooking and the steaks will cook nicely in the fat from the sausages.

Lastly, make sure you sear the steak when you first place it on the plate by pressing it down firmly on the plate for 5-10 seconds (don't press all the juice out of it though). Only turn the steak ONCE - THIS IS CRITICAL (about the right time to turn is a few minutes after a pool of juice has formed on the upper surface) then sear again. Assuming temperature is correct and steak thickness of 1" a medium to well done steak will take somewhere around 10-15 minutes.

Edit: PS. the first side of the steak is cooked for a little longer than the second side...for a 12 minute cooking time cook the first side for about 6-7 minutes and the second side for about 5 minutes.

Edited August 11, 2007 by sibeymai

[sceadugenga]

love topics like these...everyone is bound to have an opinion.

For mine it's Aussie beef preferably, but US or NZ beef is just as acceptable.

Nothing less than 1" thick and BBQ on a steel plate with a wood fire (charcoal/gas is for wimps).

I don't marinate before as I want to taste the steak. A light salting while the meat is hot off the BBQ will suffice.

The secret to good BBQ steak is temperature control. The plate has to be hot...ideally just a few minutes after the flames start to die down and the fire is settling into coals. Use small pieces of wood to maintain/control temperature. Keep a larger amount of fuel under the centre of the plate and less at the edges so the edges are cooler for greater temperature variation/control on the cooking surface. Usually cook steak (beef or pork) and sausages in the centre and eggs, fish, chicken, tomatoes, onions, bread, pineapple, potatoes, etc around the edges.

When you think the plate temperature is right to start cooking pour beer over the entire cooking area. This should immediately steam off if the plate is hot enough. Scrape the remaining burnt sugar off the plate and you have a freshly cleaned cooking surface. If cooking thick sausages start with these a good 10 minutes before steaks. Move the sausages aside to finish cooking and the steaks will cook nicely in the fat from the sausages.

Lastly, make sure you sear the steak when you first place it on the plate by pressing it down firmly on the plate for 5-10 seconds (don't press all the juice out of it though). Only turn the steak ONCE - THIS IS CRITICAL (about the right time to turn is a few minutes after a pool of juice has formed on the upper surface) then sear again. Assuming temperature is correct and steak thickness of 1" a medium to well done steak will take somewhere around 10-15 minutes.

Edit: PS. the first side of the steak is cooked for a little longer than the second side...for a 12 minute cooking time cook the first side for about 6-7 minutes and the second side for about 5 minutes.

Good post 'sibeymai', I always had a very large BBQ plate so if I had a crowd over I could cook in shifts; the basic meats and veg first, then clean the plate with red wine, (personal choice) fire up the coals, grease with a little olive oil, and cook the steaks to order. For rare, very hot plate and cooked quickly, then let the plate cool a little to finish the medium to well done. What was cooked first, sausages, chops onions etc, went into foil dishes around the edge of the plate.

[AlexLah]

Kobe beef is a fad and nothing special.

Same as other Japper foods such as sushi, fugu, ramen etc, which used to command ridiculous prices due to their rarity and novelty value too.

Haaaaahaaaaaaa!!!!!!!

Go for example here lah:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/10642546/wid/6448213

Quote: Texas cattleman Gary Yamamoto says at least 97 percent of his Kobe-style Wagyu beef is prime. Nationwide, only about 2 percent of beef earns a prime rating.

Or here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kobe_beef

Or here:

http://www.askthemeatman.com/kobe_beef.htm

Obvious to me you have never eaten Kobe beef when I read your comment.

I have been and worked in more then 60 countries and everywhere whenever I can, I find out where the best (non Kobe) steak is served and give it a try.

For example for SE Asia it is for sure at the Park Lane hotel in Jakarta in their restaurant/bar named : Styx.

Anyway have a good time all and enjoy your steaks!

Alex

[AlexLah]

For your info Emperor my brother is a very well known chief cook in Holand.

And he agrees with me that Kobe beef is far out better then any beef you can find elswhere.

Ok you just stick with your beef and I stick with mine.

Take care

Alex

[aussimike]

I have never gotten around to playing with papayas as I cannot grill at my current location... service apartment.

But papain is used in Adolph's Meat tenderizer.

Long ago natives learned that papaya latex is a very effective meat tenderizer. Tough meat was wrapped in fresh leaves for several hours to make it tender. The active tenderizing ingredient is a protein-digesting enzyme called papain, which is very similar to human stomach pepsin. Interestingly, some of the early, crude studies of plant protein structure were made by digesting the proteins into pieces with the use of papain. Papain has been commercially produced by scoring unripened fruits with longitudinal cuts and then collecting the copious latex in containers set on the ground below. The latex is sun- or oven-dried into a powder; the papain powder most commonly is marketed in the United States as Adolph's Meat Tenderizer. Much of the papain is produced in Tanzania. There are a variety of other uses for this interesting enzyme, which is fairly similar to another protolytic enzyme found in pineapple, bromelin.

"Papaya is the greatest natural tenderizer. Sandwiching the flank steak between papaya slices will make this the most tender flank steak you have ever eaten:

INGREDIENTS:

1 1 to 2 pound flank steak

2 tablespoons sugar

2 tablespoons soy sauce

2 tablespoons black pepper

1 tablespoon salt (kosher)

1 papaya, peeled and seeded

PREPARATION:

Slice papaya into thin slices. Combine sugar, soy sauce, black pepper and salt into a paste and rub over the surface of the flank steak. Place half the papaya slices on a plate. Place steak on papaya and cover top with remaining slices. Place another plate on top and press together. Refrigerate overnight. Remove steak and grill to desired doneness."

totally agree with jazzbo - this is about the only method of getting anything that resembles a decent steak here - i have tried this method and it does work = the chemical meat tenderizers do work but there is alway some chemical taste left behind - as a trained chef this method is the most natural and the best way of getting results with thai beef - which is still mooing when it arrives at the market - not like good beef from oz or the like which has been aged or hung for about 3 weeks at the wholesalers - and then aged again at the restaurant if they have a caring chef - so good luck with you steak dinner - use what ever cut - they still dont know how to break up beef here -- but try for some tenderloin or sirloin -- i have never seen fillet in the market -- let alone t-bone or the other option is to stew it - slow tender cooking - or even roast --

[tutsiwarrior]

I've used the papaya tenderizing technique in my humble, south Suphanburi, shophouse kitchen and it works pretty good...although I usually use the meat for other purposes like stews, goulash and etc...can cut the meat with a fork...

[khunandy]

Kosher Salt? Rest for 3.38 minutes? etc etc.

Guys I have just returned from a BBQ in Aussie an hour ago and the steak was perfect. Not soft and "decayed"..not hard and chewy..just bloody good steak. Now considering I had been away from Oz for a while I was a bit curious as to why it was so nice and started to reconstruct our cooking method.

Very hot BBQ plate, seared both sides for 3 minutes a piece and poured beer and wine over the whole sizzling lot. Just enough to amuse the BBQ attendents and justify having the wine and beer reserves close to hand.

This "basting" was continued until the lady folk informed us we were being stupid and then the meat was reluctantly removed from the BBQ.

It was rested for the amount of time it took to get more beer and wine and set the table (maybe 5 minutes). The results were spot on...tender without being "mushy" and just the right amount of sugars, yeasts and wine flavours to be judged as "bloody good steak" by all.

As a marinade and baste may I recommend the Chataue La Cardboard Merlot.

Andy

[Gary A]

Beef can be tender and still not very good. The key to a good steak is that it was grain fed. Grain fed beef even smells different to beef that has been grazed. At one time I ground hamburger for a restaurant in Bangkok. I used Thai French chuck steak and could immediately tell the difference is the butcher slipped in some Thai beef. Grain fed beef has a good smell and Thai beef doesn't. The nearest comparison would be that raw grain fed beef has a kind of nutty smell.

[AlexLah]

Again I tell you for a good steak buy Kobe or Matsusaka beef.

Google for it and you wil find out why this is the best meat for steaks.

Try it and you will now.

Alex

[chinthee]

Stop this right now, you a hole. Can't you see I'm really suffering here?

[chinthee]

I'll have to invite you over for a BBQ!

My Pleasure! I'll buy for the whole group if you can cook like that my friend!

[jasreeve17]

Lol!

Done.

There's a bit of traffic getting up to Minburi, but can I come too please. Sounds tasty.

A little steak story from last week:-

The local butcher (in Phrakanong) fancies my missus and gave her a bit of beef (not sure what) for twenty baht. [stop those silly jokes!]

She marinated it overnight in pineapple juice then cooked / seared it in a wok with some of the pizza delivery herbs that were left over from the night before. I had an Italian cheese pasta (35 baht) that I made in the microwave, and then put it on top of the steak which the missus had undercooked perfectly. It sounds nasty, but tasted really good. The total cost was 55 baht.

[ratchabuild]

Lol!

Done.

There's a bit of traffic getting up to Minburi, but can I come too please. Sounds tasty.

A little steak story from last week:-

The local butcher (in Phrakanong) fancies my missus and gave her a bit of beef (not sure what) for twenty baht. [stop those silly jokes!]

She marinated it overnight in pineapple juice then cooked / seared it in a wok with some of the pizza delivery herbs that were left over from the night before. I had an Italian cheese pasta (35 baht) that I made in the microwave, and then put it on top of the steak which the missus had undercooked perfectly. It sounds nasty, but tasted really good. The total cost was 55 baht.

trying the Heston Blumenthal way today, the man who has fat duck at Bray, best retsaurant in the world 2006. Char outside of 1 month old three rib rib of beef using heavy duty gas blow torch. Cook in oven for 24 hrs at 50 degrees C then put cast iron pan on full heat for twenty mins. Slice beef off rib and cut into 4 steaks Add a little oil to pan and immediately sear each side of steaks for 2 mins. Serve and enjoy. Mine has been cooking 18 hrs and smell is driving me crazy. Forgot to say grain fed beef is the best and in Uk longhorn the best breed

Edited August 18, 2007 by ratchabuild

[Gary A]

The only beef I can get out here in the boonies is still quivering when I take it home. Without my secret tenderizer it is exactly like trying to chew a sandal. Here's the secret. The guys praising the papaya are on the right track but not quite there. Go out and pick a nice firm green papaya. Peel it then cut it into about one inch squares. Put them in the blender and add enough beer, I'm not joking, and blend it thick and smooth. Pour a layer in a pan and lay your beef on top of it, them pour another layer and so on. Put it in the refrigerator over night. I then wash the steaks in plain water to get the papaya off the meat. Cook as you like and the meat WILL be tender with absolutely no off flavor from the papaya. The store bought tenderizer will NOT work any way near as well as this method. If you choose to barbecue on a charcoal or gas grill you will need to find some kind of fat to make flavor and smoke. I use pork fat and it works okay. I like to make beef stew or shredded beef for sandwiches.

[thedi]

... papain is used in Adolph's Meat tenderizer.

Long ago natives learned that papaya latex is a very effective meat tenderizer. Tough meat was wrapped in fresh leaves for several hours to make it tender. The active tenderizing ingredient is a protein-digesting enzyme called papain, which is very similar to human stomach pepsin. Interestingly, some of the early, crude studies of plant protein structure were made by digesting the proteins into pieces with the use of papain. Papain has been commercially produced by scoring unripened fruits with longitudinal cuts and then collecting the copious latex in containers set on the ground below. The latex is sun- or oven-dried into a powder; the papain powder most commonly is marketed in the United States as Adolph's Meat Tenderizer. Much of the papain is produced in Tanzania. There are a variety of other uses for this interesting enzyme, which is fairly similar to another protolytic enzyme found in pineapple, bromelin.

"Papaya is the greatest natural tenderizer. Sandwiching the flank steak between papaya slices will make this the most tender flank steak you have ever eaten:

INGREDIENTS:

1 1 to 2 pound flank steak

2 tablespoons sugar

2 tablespoons soy sauce

2 tablespoons black pepper

1 tablespoon salt (kosher)

1 papaya, peeled and seeded

PREPARATION:

Slice papaya into thin slices. Combine sugar, soy sauce, black pepper and salt into a paste and rub over the surface of the flank steak. Place half the papaya slices on a plate. Place steak on papaya and cover top with remaining slices. Place another plate on top and press together. Refrigerate overnight. Remove steak and grill to desired doneness."

I tried it last weekend and it works:

• Bought a filet of an ordinary Isarn cow at the local butcher for 130 Baht/kilo.
  
• Sliced it to reasonable pieces and put it into a plastic container, flanked with slices of a not yet ripe papaya fruit.
  
• Stored it in the coolest corner in my refrigerator for two days.
  
• Added my prefered kind of spices and grilled it.
  
• Eat it with 'Lay' potato chips and a beer: excellent
  

While grilling it, the meat was not getting hard, rateher stayed soft, as if it would still be raw - even when it was close to well done.

Naturally it was still a steak from a Isarn cow, but it was]/i] tender, this steak. Thanks to jazzbo for this tip.

Regards

Thedi

[IMA_FARANG]

For all the years I have lived in Asia, I have never ever been able to cook a steak myself that I would consider to be tender and lovely to the taste.

All my efforts tend to end up with a piece of cow whose texture is about the same as a flip flop.

I had a friend in Manila who used to serve the most elicious steaks and he used to say its in the "hanging" that makes it so good.

I never really fathomed that one out, but can anyone here explain how a steak is prepared. Should it be left in the fridge for 3-4 days to ripen or whatever. And when ready for the cooking, whats the best way to cook it ? Quickly seared or slowly fried etc

Marinading the meat is the answer. I like an acidic marinade, lemon juice or such and water. If you like vinegar it also works, but some people object to the vinegar taste. For meat that is a little "gamey" tasting (such as mutton) use a mix of milk and water. The milk helps remove the gamey taste and counteracts the natural acids in the meat. But that's a different topic.

I'm asuming you are using a lower quality tougher steak at the start. I've even used water buffalo and had people praise me on how "tender" it was.

Edited August 31, 2007 by IMA_FARANG

[JohnBKKK]

The easiest way to a tender, joicy steak is to use a at least 4 weeks dry aged ribeye or other steak - the more marbeling the more flavor - place it into a pan with smoking hot oil - 10 seconds on each side - than add course salt and freshly crushed black pepper - reduce the heat and give it not more than a further 1 minute (1inch thick) on each side during which you may add some butter onto the steak for additonal juice- remove from the pan and place it onto a plate - leave it to rest for 5 minutes - this steak will be equal to any of the top steak houses i New York or even better

If your wallet does not allow to dish out 1,600.00 baht a kilo of importet aged steak - buy Thai French and place the steak into a plastic bag with some red wine for 2 days - dry it with some kitchen towel before placing it into the really hot pan or your maid or whoever has to clean up the mess will hate you for ever - the result is so close to the above that most people will not be ale to tell the difference - the acids in the wine brake down the fibres in the meat and softens it - by the way there is no need for expensive wine, any dry Chateau Plonk will do but it has to be dry

By the way, the only way to have a juicy steak is to prepare it medium rare - anything beyond that one should consider a burger!

Edited August 31, 2007 by JohnBKKK

[Jai Dee]

"Papaya is the greatest natural tenderizer. Sandwiching the flank steak between papaya slices will make this the most tender flank steak you have ever eaten:

INGREDIENTS:

1 1 to 2 pound flank steak

2 tablespoons sugar

2 tablespoons soy sauce

2 tablespoons black pepper

1 tablespoon salt (kosher)

1 papaya, peeled and seeded

PREPARATION:

Slice papaya into thin slices. Combine sugar, soy sauce, black pepper and salt into a paste and rub over the surface of the flank steak. Place half the papaya slices on a plate. Place steak on papaya and cover top with remaining slices. Place another plate on top and press together. Refrigerate overnight. Remove steak and grill to desired doneness."

I tried this method last night... prepared the steak (Thai tenderloin) the night before... a quick 5 second sear and seal on both sides in a smear of hot oil in a frypan... then cooked on an aluminium tray for 10 minutes in a preheated (200 degrees) oven.

Fantastically tender... equal if not better than the imported US grain fed steaks I've eaten in Manhattans restaurant.

Next time, I'll try it without the soy and half the sugar... maybe some olive oil instead and some bush spices.

Thanks for the tip jazzbo.

[thai_narak]

ok, here is my humble version... i'm not a chef so don't laugh

ingredients:

1/4 cup red wine or beer

300 grams rib-eye steak

1/2 cup steak sauce (heinz 57, A1, or similar)

2 tbl spoon olive oil

salt and pepper

preparation:

sprinkle salt and pepper on both side of the steak according to your liking, i usually put generous amount of black pepper to spice up the flavour (like pepper steak). add 1/2 cup of steak sauce (marinade) onto both side of the meat and set aside for 2-4 hours or overnight. i normally freeze the meat overnight to sterilise it . defrost the meat if frozen. once ready, place it into a pan with a smoking olive oil. adjust the stove to medium heat right away and fry it for 4 minutes on both sides. put it the steak on the plate and set aside. you may have noticed that your frying pan has turned the marinade to somewhat burned caramel but this is OK, you need this caramelised marinade to make the sauce.

now for the sauce, add 1/4 cup red wine to the caramelised marinade on the frying pan to boil stirring it occasionaly in low heat until it gets sticky. this will take around 5-6 minutes. now, add the sauce on the top of the steak and that's it!

[attachmentid= 44983]

[attachmentid= 44984]

Edited October 23, 2007 by thai_narak

[thai_narak]

ok, here is my humble version... i'm not a chef so don't laugh

ingredients:

1/4 cup red wine or beer

300 grams rib-eye steak

1/2 cup steak sauce (heinz 57, A1, or similar)

2 tbl spoon olive oil

salt and pepper

preparation:

sprinkle salt and pepper on both side of the steak according to your liking, i usually put generous amount of black pepper to spice up the flavour (like pepper steak). add 1/2 cup of steak sauce (marinade) onto both side of the meat and set aside for 2-4 hours or overnight. i normally freeze the meat overnight to sterilise it . defrost the meat if frozen. once ready, place it into a pan with a smoking olive oil. adjust the stove to medium heat right away and fry it for 4 minutes on both sides. put it the steak on the plate and set aside. you may have noticed that your frying pan has turned the marinade to somewhat burned caramel but this is OK, you need this caramelised marinade to make the sauce.

now for the sauce, add 1/4 cup red wine to the caramelised marinade on the frying pan to boil stirring it occasionaly in low heat until it gets sticky. this will take around 5-6 minutes. now, add the sauce on the top of the steak and that's it!

[attachmentid= 44983]

[attachmentid= 44984]

forgot to mention that also add the remaining marinade in the procedure above or add some more steak sauce if needed.

Edited October 24, 2007 by thai_narak

[Macx]

Great thread!

Thanks for all the recipes.

And while you're at it, how about some favorite sauces to go with those fantastic steaks?

It's 9AM, and I'm so hungry just reading this thread that I'm already planning for dinner!

[pampal]

At foodland Suk 5 they have excellent Thai steaks that are very marbled at 300-500 per kilo.

[pattyboy]

I've used the papaya tenderizing technique in my humble, south Suphanburi, shophouse kitchen and it works pretty good...although I usually use the meat for other purposes like stews, goulash and etc...can cut the meat with a fork...

Thanks for the insight. This is something I've been curious about. Apparently, the popular meat tenderizer, Aldolph's, is basically dried papaya latex (which contains an enzyme called papain -- the key tenderizing ingredient) . I've hear that if you take a papaya leaf, score it with a sharp knife, wrap your steak in it and leave it for a night in the fridge, it will have the same tenderizing effect as sprinkling Adolph's on it. Is this the "papaya tenderizing technique" that you are referring to?

________________________________________________________________________________

__________

EDITED----Just noticed that somebody has already provided a recipe for using the papaya fruit as a tenderizer, and it looks good.

Edited October 24, 2007 by pattyboy

[bigchang]

marinate the steak in coca cola over night it should make it tender

[nonthaburial]

I tried a T Bone steak last night ( albeit a very thin slice) left it compressed with Papaya for two days in a bag but found that although very tender, the papaya appears to have runied the meat fibres and it ended up a little "mushy"