Trump Set to Issue Executive Order Banning Transgender Athletes from Female Sports

[WDSmart]

14 hours ago, Yellowtail said:

I doubt that. 

So, as long as a man "believes" he is a woman, he should be allowed in girls' and women's showers, yes?

 

But just how do you determine if they believe it? 

 

 

 

No, I didn't say that. I was just correcting your accusation that all transgender people are only "pretending." I don't think a transgender people should always be treated as the gender they believe they are. I have, time after time, only said that I think the rules as to how  people are designated as one gender or the other should be stated, not just left to anyone to decide as they see fit. 

[WDSmart]

14 hours ago, Yellowtail said:

I think if their genitals are deformed at birth such that their sex is not distinguishable, as long as it remains undistinguishable, I think they should be able to Identify as they like. 

 

By mixed-up chromosomes, do you mean their chromosomes do not match their genitals? 

Yes, I agree with you on the deformed genital issue.

And yes. Just as genitals can be deformed at birth, so can their chromosomes. Instead of being either XX or XY, they could be XXY or some variation of that. 

[Yellowtail]

3 minutes ago, WDSmart said:

No, I didn't say that. I was just correcting your accusation that all transgender people are only "pretending." I don't think a transgender people should always be treated as the gender they believe they are. I have, time after time, only said that I think the rules as to how  people are designated as one gender or the other should be stated, not just left to anyone to decide as they see fit. 

How is it they are not pretending they are something they are not? 

[Yellowtail]

2 minutes ago, WDSmart said:

Yes, I agree with you on the deformed genital issue.

And yes. Just as genitals can be deformed at birth, so can their chromosomes. Instead of being either XX or XY, they could be XXY or some variation of that. 

And aside from their chromosomes being not normal, they are otherwise normal, with normal genitals that relate to one sex or another? 

[WDSmart]

1 minute ago, Yellowtail said:

And aside from their chromosomes being not normal, they are otherwise normal, with normal genitals that relate to one sex or another? 

I don't know the answer to that, but I'd assume these genital/chromosome deformations could be separate or together, but probably often together. 

[Yellowtail]

9 minutes ago, WDSmart said:

I don't know the answer to that, but I'd assume these genital/chromosome deformations could be separate or together, but probably often together. 

So, like one person in a million, yes? I assume something like that would be case by case, and be between the doctor and the parents. But I think intact genitals should be determinant. 

[WDSmart]

Just now, Yellowtail said:

So, like one person in a million, yes? I assume something like that would be case by case, and be between the doctor and the parents. But I think intact genitals should be determinant. 

Your "one person in a million" comment is probably very close. On the news yesterday, I heard that the leader of the NCAA was asked how many transgender athletes they have. His answer was 10. There are about 500,000 athletes in the NCAA. That's .002%. That begs the question of just how big a problem this is that we have to discuss it multiple times every day. 

 

[Yellowtail]

3 minutes ago, WDSmart said:

Your "one person in a million" comment is probably very close. On the news yesterday, I heard that the leader of the NCAA was asked how many transgender athletes they have. His answer was 10. There are about 500,000 athletes in the NCAA. That's .002%. That begs the question of just how big a problem this is that we have to discuss it multiple times every day. 

 

But the issue is not how many men that want to get into girls' and women's showers, bathrooms and sports, but the rather the number the number of women and girls affected by the threat of men that want to get into girls' and women's showers, bathrooms and sports. 

 

Do you not care about them? 

 

[WDSmart]

4 minutes ago, Yellowtail said:

But the issue is not how many men that want to get into girls' and women's showers, bathrooms and sports, but the rather the number the number of women and girls affected by the threat of men that want to get into girls' and women's showers, bathrooms and sports. 

 

Do you not care about them? 

 

What is the "threat"? Is it real, or is it just a perceived threat? What was the "threat" of Blacks when they had to be banned from all White resources and activities? Was it real or just perceived? And how many women perceive transgender men* as being a threat? Is it 10%, 50%, 99%? 

And how about the women who want to get into boys' and men's showers, bathrooms, and sports? We never hear anything about them or the men who see that as a threat. 

* I still don't know what to call transgender people. Are "transgender men" people who we designate as men who believe they are women or people who we designate as women who believe they are men? Or maybe we should just call them all "transgender," and that could be either or both? 

[Yellowtail]

12 minutes ago, WDSmart said:

What is the "threat"? Is it real, or is it just a perceived threat? What was the "threat" of Blacks when they had to be banned from all White resources and activities? Was it real or just perceived? And how many women perceive transgender men* as being a threat? Is it 10%, 50%, 99%? 

The threat is men invading their showers and sports. Was that not clear? 

 

Why not poll women on whether they think men should be allowed in their showers and sports? 

 

 

12 minutes ago, WDSmart said:

And how about the women who want to get into boys' and men's showers, bathrooms, and sports? We never hear anything about them or the men who see that as a threat. 

That's because women are not trying to get into boys' and men's showers, bathrooms, and sports. 

 

12 minutes ago, WDSmart said:

* I still don't know what to call transgender people. Are "transgender men" people who we designate as men who believe they are women or people who we designate as women who believe they are men? Or maybe we should just call them all "transgender," and that could be either or both? 

They can pretend to be whatever they like. 

[WDSmart]

6 minutes ago, Yellowtail said:

The threat is men invading their showers and sports. Was that not clear? 

 

Why not poll women on whether they think men should be allowed in their showers and sports? 

 

 

That's because women are not trying to get into boys' and men's showers, bathrooms, and sports. 

 

They can pretend to be whatever they like. 

You've misinterpreted all of my questions. I'll asked again in more detail:
1. What is the threat? The threat of being raped? The threat of having a man see them undressed? The threat of seeing a man undressed?
2. I think a poll of women would be a good thing and those that see transgenders as a threat should ask why.
3. Are you denying there are transfenders who we otherwise would define as being a woman who believe they are a man?
4. I was asking about how to distinguish between someone who we otherwise would define as being a man who believe they are a woman. Is that a "transgender man" or a "transgender woman"? Or do we just use "transgender" to mean both? It seems like people only use that to refer to a man who believes he is a woman.  

This whole issue is because most people believe that EVERYONE must belong to only one of two genders: male or female. There is no belief of accommodation for those who do not fit neatly into one of those two categories. I also believe that these people, transgenders, are a very, very small percentage of the population, probably around 1%, but only 80% of the population clearly identify as being purely heterosexual.
"In this survey, on average about 80% of people worldwide identified as heterosexual, 3% as gay, lesbian or homosexual, 4% as bisexual, 1% as pansexual or omnisexual, 1% as asexual, 1% as "other", and 11% don't know or won't say."
Demographics of sexual orientation - Wikipedia

 

[Yellowtail]

4 minutes ago, WDSmart said:

You've misinterpreted all of my questions. I'll asked again in more detail:
1. What is the threat? The threat of being raped? The threat of having a man see them undressed? The threat of seeing a man undressed?

Privacy. Do you think women and girls should have private spaces or not? 

 

If not, why not only have unisex showers and bathrooms? 

 

Fairness. Do you think women and girls should have their own sports competitions or not? 

 

If not, why not only have only one league where anyone can compete that wants to?  

 

4 minutes ago, WDSmart said:

2. I think a poll of women would be a good thing and those that see transgenders as a threat should ask why.

If women and girls don't want to shower, toilet and compete against men, why should the onus be on them to say why? 

 

Men should be allowed to shower with girls as long as there is no threat of rape? 

 

 

4 minutes ago, WDSmart said:

 

3. Are you denying there are transfenders who we otherwise would define as being a woman who believe they are a man?

Sure. There are people that believe any number of things. That a woman believes she is a man, does not make her a man. I do not care that a woman thinks she is a man, but I do care that she (apparently) wants me to believe she's a man. 

4 minutes ago, WDSmart said:

4. I was asking about how to distinguish between someone who we otherwise would define as being a man who believe they are a woman. Is that a "transgender man" or a "transgender woman"? Or do we just use "transgender" to mean both? It seems like people only use that to refer to a man who believes he is a woman.  

What they think really has nothing to do with it. A man that wants to pretend they are a woman, regardless of what they think, is a trans "women". A woman that wants to pretend they are a man, regardless of what they think, is a trans "man". 

 

 

4 minutes ago, WDSmart said:

This whole issue is because most people believe that EVERYONE must belong to only one of two genders: male or female. There is no belief of accommodation for those who do not fit neatly into one of those two categories. I also believe that these people, transgenders, are a very, very small percentage of the population, probably around 1%, but only 80% of the population clearly identify as being purely heterosexual.

 

No. This is an issue because the left/LGBT wants to compel schools to allow men into girls' and women's bathrooms and showers, and to compete against girls' and women's sports. 

 

 

[metisdead]

A post using a derogatory nickname to belittle or mock individuals with differing political views has been removed.

[WDSmart]

17 minutes ago, Yellowtail said:

Privacy. Do you think women and girls should have private spaces or not? 

Yes, that's okay. Isn't sitting on a toliet which is surrouned by walls and a door, private enough?

 

If not, why not only have unisex showers and bathrooms? 
For the same reason we used to have White and non-White bathrooms. Some (most?) women do not feel comfortable or safe around men.

 

Fairness. Do you think women and girls should have their own sports competitions or not?

Yes, I have no problem with that. The problem is how to determine who is a woman and who is not. 

 

If not, why not only have only one league where anyone can compete that wants to?
We already have that. Women are allowed to participate in most men's leagues I know of . I've heard of instances in that in almost any sport, even a professional one - golf. It's just that men are no allowed to participate in a womens-only league.  And, again, the problem is how to determine who is a woman and who is not. 

 

If women and girls don't want to shower, toilet and compete against men, why should the onus be on them to say why?
Why not? If people want some exception made, they should at least be able to explain themselves. And, again, the problem is how to determine who is a woman and who is not.  

 

Men should be allowed to shower with girls as long as there is no threat of rape?

No one should be prohibited from using the same facilities as anyone else if there is no threat. (Except in a capitalisitc arena where access to the facilities require a purchase or fee.) And, again, the problem is how to determine who is a woman and who is not. 

 

Sure. There are people that believe any number of things. That a woman believes she is a man, does not make her a man. I do not care that a woman thinks she is a man, but I do care that she (apparently) wants me to believe she's a man. 

What they think really has nothing to do with it. A man that wants to pretend they are a woman, regardless of what they think, is a trans "women". A woman that wants to pretend they are a man, regardless of what they think, is a trans "man". 
I could easity turn what you said above around to say, "That a you believe someone is a man, does not make her a man... What you think really has nothing to do with it." And thanks for your clarification of  "trans man" and presubably "trans woman."

 

No. This is an issue because the left/LGBT wants to compel schools to allow men into girls' and women's bathrooms and showers, and to compete against girls' and women's sports.

Although that may be the case for some, as far as I'm concerned it is much simpler. I just want the right/narrcissists to establish a definite rule or method to determine a person's gender if they are doing to use that to descriminate. 

 

 

 

[Yellowtail]

Privacy. Do you think women and girls should have private spaces or not? 

Yes, that's okay. Isn't sitting on a toliet which is surrouned by walls and a door, private enough?

No. And what about the showers? 

 

 

If not, why not only have unisex showers and bathrooms? 
For the same reason we used to have White and non-White bathrooms. Some (most?) women do not feel comfortable or safe around men.

So you think sex is similar to race. Can a white person identify as a black person? 

 

Fairness. Do you think women and girls should have their own sports competitions or not?

Yes, I have no problem with that. The problem is how to determine who is a woman and who is not. 

So, being born with a vagina is not enough?

 

If not, why not only have only one league where anyone can compete that wants to?
We already have that. Women are allowed to participate in most men's leagues I know of . I've heard of instances in that in almost any sport, even a professional one - golf. It's just that men are no allowed to participate in a womens-only league.  And, again, the problem is how to determine who is a woman and who is not. 

So, again, being born with a vagina is not enough?

 

If women and girls don't want to shower, toilet and compete against men, why should the onus be on them to say why?
Why not? If people want some exception made, they should at least be able to explain themselves. And, again, the problem is how to determine who is a woman and who is not.  

So, again, why is being born with a vagina not enough?

 

Men should be allowed to shower with girls as long as there is no threat of rape?

No one should be prohibited from using the same facilities as anyone else if there is no threat. (Except in a capitalisitc arena where access to the facilities require a purchase or fee.) And, again, the problem is how to determine who is a woman and who is not. 

So, there it is. Anyone should be able to use whatever facility they like, finally a bit of honesty. 

 

Sure. There are people that believe any number of things. That a woman believes she is a man, does not make her a man. I do not care that a woman thinks she is a man, but I do care that she (apparently) wants me to believe she's a man. 

What they think really has nothing to do with it. A man that wants to pretend they are a woman, regardless of what they think, is a trans "women". A woman that wants to pretend they are a man, regardless of what they think, is a trans "man". 
I could easity turn what you said above around to say, "That a you believe someone is a man, does not make her a man... What you think really has nothing to do with it." And thanks for your clarification of  "trans man" and presubably "trans woman."

So, being born with a vagina is not enough?

 

No. This is an issue because the left/LGBT wants to compel schools to allow men into girls' and women's bathrooms and showers, and to compete against girls' and women's sports.

Although that may be the case for some, as far as I'm concerned it is much simpler. I just want the right/narrcissists to establish a definite rule or method to determine a person's gender if they are doing to use that to descriminate. 

 

Why is being born with a vagina is not enough?

[riclag]

4 hours ago, Yellowtail said:

How is it they are not pretending they are something they are not? 

And to prove it they cut off their normal parts!