Dating From Your Own Pool

[LinkPopularity]

well, I dated a princess for a while .. what a b!tch !

[siamamerican]

Nice to be young and dumb. OP, print this out and take a look at it ten years. Too bad you can't get a take back on the original post.

[a2396]

If you are living in LOS and are not young, rich and/or handsome, your chanches of attaching to an upper class or even middle class lady are slim. They are not going to lower themselves and tarnish their reputation by bothering with Farangs unless they may have something unusual to offer.

What utter nonsense

It ain't nonsense to me pal. That's the reality I have seen every day here for the past three years. IF, they interested in a Farang it is because: 1. The Farang can provide money 2. May be a ticket to take them to the Farang's country. 3. Possibly a handsome charmer (the Farang). It is certainly not because of high level communication. In my three years here, I know about six Thais (women) who speak a level of English sufficient to form a foundation for a good relationship. Four of them have Thai BF's or are married to Thais. The remaing two are shopping for a Frang, who can provide what they may consider adequate financial security. One is asking for 1 million bht dowery. Would you like her email?

In the last three years you have only come across six girls who speak fluent english? That is comical mate.

What's comical about it? If you are crusing the bars & parlors of BKK, you mich have a higher percentage rate. I live in an Issan city & that's the facts.

[WaiWai]

As long as the partnership works - what does it matter which class the partners have been born into?

Intercultural marriages are probably a different category to Thai-Thai marriages.

"Classism" exists everywhere, I think, but the forms vary. For instance, America strikes me as very elitist with respect to education (and that is a crucial area). You need monstrous amounts of money to attend the "top" colleges, and even the "average" ones are expensive. This is not the case in Australia. (We have our own, special, snobberies & distinctions.)

[ColPyat]

As long as the partnership works - what does it matter which class the partners have been born into?

Intercultural marriages are probably a different category to Thai-Thai marriages.

"Classism" exists everywhere, I think, but the forms vary. For instance, America strikes me as very elitist with respect to education (and that is a crucial area). You need monstrous amounts of money to attend the "top" colleges, and even the "average" ones are expensive. This is not the case in Australia. (We have our own, special, snobberies & distinctions.)

The part of Europe where i am from education is free, and the poor get easy loans. Class obviously exists, but there is lots of mobility both ways. And so it has become now even in relationships. Only the top layer of (former) Royal aristocracy are still forced by house rules to marry within the pool if they want to keep playing in that social scene. And even there more and more people do not play that game anymore.

The best education one gets there in government schools, private boarding schools are there for kids of the moneyed elite who can't function in a government school. I attended one of those boarding schools for a while for exactly that reason, so i know what i am talking about... .

I have also attended several normal government schools, in one i remember one of my class mates was a direct descendant of the Habsburg line who would have been on the very top in the line of the Austrian Hungarian throne if history would have been different, and other class mates in the same class were from a council estate with parents on social security.

[Heng]

One simply SLIGHTLY improves the odds of long term relationship success when you date/marry someone (in a society that doesn't differentiate as much between the individual and the family) who is of comparable socio-economic status to you. For farang-Thai relationships... the latter is often more important than the former. No one ever said it was a magical solution to marry someone from _______ background/social status. But if you look at what people in relationships often fight/argue (often leading to serious rifts between individuals, families, etc.) about, you take a lot out of the equation in terms of things to disagree about if you didn't have to worry about mundane things like bills/money/similar financial goals, etc.

Dress sizes, pidgin English/Thai, where one went to school, are much more minor issues that can be smoothed over.

[qwertz]

Real class transcends social barriers.

I come from the lowest Irish immigrant social background.

Lucky enough to be born in England, I took control of my own life at age 14, worked hard to get on and swore never to be so poor again.

So I'm not rich but life's not bad and the nouveau riche and hi so respect me for what I am - because I can teach them how to pronounce the names of the vintage wines they serve to their dinner guests.

I've turned down several invitations from freemasons and other such cliques, directorships and other junkets - it's just not for me.

It's being yourself that counts, whatever that may be.

Too many people don't like themselves and what they haven't achieved is a lifelong thorn in their sides.

[lannarebirth]

As long as the partnership works - what does it matter which class the partners have been born into?

Intercultural marriages are probably a different category to Thai-Thai marriages.

"Classism" exists everywhere, I think, but the forms vary. For instance, America strikes me as very elitist with respect to education (and that is a crucial area). You need monstrous amounts of money to attend the "top" colleges, and even the "average" ones are expensive. This is not the case in Australia. (We have our own, special, snobberies & distinctions.)

A good post secondary education in America is and always has been relatively expensive. That said, an average university there is better than good universities most anywhere else. The London Times and some Chinese organization did a survey of the worlds leading universities. About 75% were in America, when i attended university I got through on a combination of grants, scholorships, loans and working. If you want it, you can do it. The work I was able to get with that education allowed me to repay the loans in 8 months time.

Edited August 12, 2007 by lannarebirth

[WaiWai]

Good for you, lannarebirth.

However, I know Americans with outstanding SAT scores who had to give up on the idea of attending good Universities, because their families simply lacked the means. Loans are not available to everyone.

[0Mix1up]

My recent observations:

involving Thai-Thai relationships

Chinese-Thai guy(wealthy family) dating a Thai girl for 8 years (yes 8 years), he,

as described by her as "playboy and have a coyote gfs".

She's got her own business, appears to be very loyal, beautiful and I'd love to have a chance with her

but was warned off as he still wanted her on a string.

I was made aware that she was treated very poorly when at the family house and he would

be struck off if he married her.

Another Chinese-Thai guy, a great fun person, a bit shy and no gfs at all again massive family

pressure to pick only from a very select group (not easy in issarn I assume).

Most of us (farang) don't have those family pressures , nor make distinctions about skin color, family background.

So for a Farang being with a dark skinned girl no matter her background/history is considered by,

what I call ineducated (my own word) ignorant people as low.

As for me I could care less.

Just adding 2c

[rychrde]

I have managed to move in and out of high and low class societies with ease!

But perhaps it is that very ease that distinguishes the classes. I was at two contrasting secondary schools, one public one private. the difference was not so much that the teaching itself was any better but the whole ethos of the place was that the students could aim to become whatever they wanted. yes, some fell by the wayside as wealthy drunks, but the difference was less about the haves and have-nots but about the can and can-not. The best state schools in the UK are the ones who have emulated this spirit.

Anyway, there are snobs at both ends of the spectrum. Just find someone you like :-)

rych

[kat]

I have to agree with Rychrde. There are snobs at all ends of society. I worked my way up from the lower class group in the States by attending first the worst schools and then the top schools in the Country. And yes, I had to work and sacrafice; the scholarships weren't all there at first.

On the lower end, you are faced with plenty of people who are clawing or struggling to get ahead, and hold themselves above their cohorts as either a survival tactic, or just another way to convince themselves that they are better. I've observed this at different times in my life, and I've seen the same thing in LOS. I've seen the poor daughters of Issan, who are former bargirls, marry farangs who basically fund their entire existence, suddenly look down and berate their Burmese housekeeper, or anyone else whom they think they are now above. There are very poor examples of power and status in LOS, and easy money and sudden influence without any associated work or achievement corrupts the example and idea of power further.

Real class transcends social barriers.

I come from the lowest Irish immigrant social background.

Lucky enough to be born in England, I took control of my own life at age 14, worked hard to get on and swore never to be so poor again.

So I'm not rich but life's not bad and the nouveau riche and hi so respect me for what I am - because I can teach them how to pronounce the names of the vintage wines they serve to their dinner guests.

I've turned down several invitations from freemasons and other such cliques, directorships and other junkets - it's just not for me.

It's being yourself that counts, whatever that may be.

Too many people don't like themselves and what they haven't achieved is a lifelong thorn in their sides.

no wonder you sound like a great guy!

As long as the partnership works - what does it matter which class the partners have been born into?

Intercultural marriages are probably a different category to Thai-Thai marriages.

"Classism" exists everywhere, I think, but the forms vary. For instance, America strikes me as very elitist with respect to education (and that is a crucial area). You need monstrous amounts of money to attend the "top" colleges, and even the "average" ones are expensive. This is not the case in Australia. (We have our own, special, snobberies & distinctions.)

A good post secondary education in America is and always has been relatively expensive. That said, an average university there is better than good universities most anywhere else. The London Times and some Chinese organization did a survey of the worlds leading universities. About 75% were in America, when i attended university I got through on a combination of grants, scholorships, loans and working. If you want it, you can do it. The work I was able to get with that education allowed me to repay the loans in 8 months time.

That's right, lannarebirth, and that is distinctly American. We have to work hard for it, but once you exhibit that grit or ability, doors will open. I have always envied the Western European approach to free education, but there are still costs, and one side effect has been that their university educational system has fallen behind. I cited the studies to which you allude on this forum many times.

Good for you, lannarebirth.

However, I know Americans with outstanding SAT scores who had to give up on the idea of attending good Universities, because their families simply lacked the means. Loans are not available to everyone.

WaiWai, I seriously find this hard to believe. There are different tiers of universities, but everyone knows that if you can't get into a Harvard or Yale without loans or scholarships, there is the University of Berkley, the University of Wisconsin at Madison, and so on. There are excellent public universities in the States and they also top the same international survey cited above.

Edited August 12, 2007 by kat

[ratchabuild]

I never met so many stuck up snobbish pricks as the farangs in Thailand screaming "My girlfriend has a degree and a car!"

Yes.

And those snobs never fail to amuse me.

I never played the class game back in the west - why should i start here? Just because some quarters of Thai society are still stuck in archaic feudalism doesn't mean that i have to be as well.

As long as the partnership works - what does it matter which class the partners have been born into?

"Pool" is a good word to use since many of the Falang men in Thailand qualify as pond life. Many supposed "liberated" guys who date poor uneducated women and tell us how freethinking they are do it because they are themselves sad, poorly educated losers or on the rebound from some european woman and think they can intimidate a poorly educated Thai woman from a humble background. Or else they are control freaks or insecure and afraid of a real partnership. Of course its never described as intimidation....just keeping them on pocket money, hiding their assets, making no attempt to learn Thai or encouraging their partner to shoot higher than a cleaning job. How you can have a real relationship without communicating properly is beyond me. How you can have a real relationship when you have completely diferent perspectives, educations and outlooks is beyond me. I guess so many relationship work because

a Girl has no other choice

b Man keeps her on a tight financial reign.

d man has such low expectations as regular sex and food

d Friendship is for friends not partner

e Thai women have such low expectaions of falang men (justifiably)

If I had a baht for everytime a Falang guy has told me how to manage a thai woman, keep her poor and badly informed, still have lots of sex on the side "Thai women are used to men going to brothels its part of their culture" and how happy their wife is.....hahahahaha. I would be as rich as Thaksin.

[SiamSquare123]

if you ask a farang if his wife is an ex bar girl, and she wasnt, then he gets mad. So that means that he thinks that his girl is higher then an ex bar girl, but if I mention that my girl goes to the best university in thailand a bunch of insecure guys think i am bragging and get mad. if there girl is higher then a prostitute, then why cant my girl be higher then their girl? for what its worth, my girl is thai-chinese, born in bkk, and from a very wealthy family. her parents arent crazy about me though. she was talking to her sister and they over heard that i borrow money from her from time to time and she also told her sister about my 'measurements' so i think they are kind of afraid that i am some kind of genetic freak.

[jackmuu]

"Pool" is a good word to use since many of the Falang men in Thailand qualify as pond life. Many supposed "liberated" guys who date poor uneducated women and tell us how freethinking they are do it because they are themselves sad, poorly educated losers or on the rebound from some european woman and think they can intimidate a poorly educated Thai woman from a humble background. Or else they are control freaks or insecure and afraid of a real partnership. Of course its never described as intimidation....just keeping them on pocket money, hiding their assets, making no attempt to learn Thai or encouraging their partner to shoot higher than a cleaning job. How you can have a real relationship without communicating properly is beyond me. How you can have a real relationship when you have completely diferent perspectives, educations and outlooks is beyond me. I guess so many relationship work because

a Girl has no other choice

b Man keeps her on a tight financial reign.

d man has such low expectations as regular sex and food

d Friendship is for friends not partner

e Thai women have such low expectaions of falang men (justifiably)

If I had a baht for everytime a Falang guy has told me how to manage a thai woman, keep her poor and badly informed, still have lots of sex on the side "Thai women are used to men going to brothels its part of their culture" and how happy their wife is.....hahahahaha. I would be as rich as Thaksin.

Too true, it makes me cringe when I listen to Thai / Western couples who communicate on the lowest level of understanding because she can't speak more than basic English and he can't be bothered or is not capable of learning more than a few basic Thai words. Dating by class is not so much an issue but dating someone you can't communicate with, what's the point?

[ratchabuild]

The old concept of class has nothing to do with it - it's about money.

People are divided in to groups depending on how much money they have.

A poor farmer might win the lottery and be instantly elevated in to a different social group.

A <deleted> can come from any social group.

[A_Traveller]

if you ask a farang if his wife is an ex bar girl, and she wasnt, then he gets mad. So that means that he thinks that his girl is higher then an ex bar girl, but if I mention that my girl goes to the best university in thailand a bunch of insecure guys think i am bragging and get mad. if there girl is higher then a prostitute, then why cant my girl be higher then their girl? for what its worth, my girl is thai-chinese, born in bkk, and from a very wealthy family. her parents arent crazy about me though. she was talking to her sister and they over heard that i borrow money from her from time to time and she also told her sister about my 'measurements' so i think they are kind of afraid that i am some kind of genetic freak.

small ...... loans was it as well

Regards

[SiamSquare123]

ratchabuild,

it sounds like you spend to much time around lousy cheating farang. i will never ever cheat on my wife. I am guessing you work at one of the lower language schools in thailand. i work at one of the more professinal language schools and those guys dont go around to the bars and act the way you describe. keep better company mate. i am telling you because i am with a thai-chinese white skinned girl.

[ratchabuild]

The old concept of class has nothing to do with it - it's about money.

People are divided in to groups depending on how much money they have.

A poor farmer might win the lottery and be instantly elevated in to a different social group.

A <deleted> can come from any social group.

Not true at all, of course class matters only people who believe that are deluded. Whole dynasties of families control each country. the myth of the self made man is precisely that. Of course they exist but not in sufficient numbers to do anything other than deflect criticism of the ruling elite............look at the Bushes...were they born to govern? Apparently so.

[ratchabuild]

If you are living in LOS and are not young, rich and/or handsome, your chanches of attaching to an upper class or even middle class lady are slim. They are not going to lower themselves and tarnish their reputation by bothering with Farangs unless they may have something unusual to offer.

What utter nonsense

In fact its absolutely true. Most educated middle class Thai women wouldnt dream of marrying a falang. That feeling is changing but very slowly. Just because bar girls love falangs doesnt mean the rest do.

[kat]

I never met so many stuck up snobbish pricks as the farangs in Thailand screaming "My girlfriend has a degree and a car!"

Yes.

And those snobs never fail to amuse me.

I never played the class game back in the west - why should i start here? Just because some quarters of Thai society are still stuck in archaic feudalism doesn't mean that i have to be as well.

As long as the partnership works - what does it matter which class the partners have been born into?

"Pool" is a good word to use since many of the Falang men in Thailand qualify as pond life. Many supposed "liberated" guys who date poor uneducated women and tell us how freethinking they are do it because they are themselves sad, poorly educated losers or on the rebound from some european woman and think they can intimidate a poorly educated Thai woman from a humble background. Or else they are control freaks or insecure and afraid of a real partnership. Of course its never described as intimidation....just keeping them on pocket money, hiding their assets, making no attempt to learn Thai or encouraging their partner to shoot higher than a cleaning job. How you can have a real relationship without communicating properly is beyond me. How you can have a real relationship when you have completely diferent perspectives, educations and outlooks is beyond me. I guess so many relationship work because

a Girl has no other choice

b Man keeps her on a tight financial reign.

d man has such low expectations as regular sex and food

d Friendship is for friends not partner

e Thai women have such low expectaions of falang men (justifiably)

If I had a baht for everytime a Falang guy has told me how to manage a thai woman, keep her poor and badly informed, still have lots of sex on the side "Thai women are used to men going to brothels its part of their culture" and how happy their wife is.....hahahahaha. I would be as rich as Thaksin.

Ratcha, you hit the nail right on the head. I don't want to stigmatize many of the good men that are in Thailand, but from my experience and observation you describe the norm. As a woman there, I also experienced much of what you described in terms of the attempted controlling, objectifying and simply unacceptable attitudes that basically caused me to remove myself from any possible "pool" there at anytime past or ever.

if you ask a farang if his wife is an ex bar girl, and she wasnt, then he gets mad. So that means that he thinks that his girl is higher then an ex bar girl, but if I mention that my girl goes to the best university in thailand a bunch of insecure guys think i am bragging and get mad. if there girl is higher then a prostitute, then why cant my girl be higher then their girl? for what its worth, my girl is thai-chinese, born in bkk, and from a very wealthy family. her parents arent crazy about me though. she was talking to her sister and they over heard that i borrow money from her from time to time and she also told her sister about my 'measurements' so i think they are kind of afraid that i am some kind of genetic freak.

Yes, but you are part of it because you have to go out of your way to flag your girlfriend as this or that, white-skinned Chinese and so-own, precisely because of the overwhelming frequency of relationships that would never happen any where else or under any other conditions.

[jackmuu]

If you are living in LOS and are not young, rich and/or handsome, your chanches of attaching to an upper class or even middle class lady are slim. They are not going to lower themselves and tarnish their reputation by bothering with Farangs unless they may have something unusual to offer.

What utter nonsense

In fact its absolutely true. Most educated middle class Thai women wouldnt dream of marrying a falang. That feeling is changing but very slowly. Just because bar girls love falangs doesnt mean the rest do.

Don't talk crap. I think you move in the wrong circles mate, I know plenty of educated Thai women both here and in Europe and the US that are happily married to westerners.

Tarnish their reputation indeed, what planet are you on?

[SiamSquare123]

well i dont go around telling people she is this and that, but i do mention where she goes to school. this is natural. if it were back home, i would say the samething, "she goes to...." but here, guys give me a look like "Oh great, youve got a thai chinese white skinned angel going to the best university and ive got swamp thing". im not sure why farang in thailand are so insecure. i guess its the same reason why everyone's girl used to be the cashier. however, since most of you are marrying girls a 1/3 of your age, obviously as long as she is younger and has a pulse it doesnt matter what she is or does.

[ColPyat]

I never met so many stuck up snobbish pricks as the farangs in Thailand screaming "My girlfriend has a degree and a car!"

Yes.

And those snobs never fail to amuse me.

I never played the class game back in the west - why should i start here? Just because some quarters of Thai society are still stuck in archaic feudalism doesn't mean that i have to be as well.

As long as the partnership works - what does it matter which class the partners have been born into?

"Pool" is a good word to use since many of the Falang men in Thailand qualify as pond life. Many supposed "liberated" guys who date poor uneducated women and tell us how freethinking they are do it because they are themselves sad, poorly educated losers or on the rebound from some european woman and think they can intimidate a poorly educated Thai woman from a humble background. Or else they are control freaks or insecure and afraid of a real partnership. Of course its never described as intimidation....just keeping them on pocket money, hiding their assets, making no attempt to learn Thai or encouraging their partner to shoot higher than a cleaning job. How you can have a real relationship without communicating properly is beyond me. How you can have a real relationship when you have completely diferent perspectives, educations and outlooks is beyond me. I guess so many relationship work because

a Girl has no other choice

b Man keeps her on a tight financial reign.

d man has such low expectations as regular sex and food

d Friendship is for friends not partner

e Thai women have such low expectaions of falang men (justifiably)

If I had a baht for everytime a Falang guy has told me how to manage a thai woman, keep her poor and badly informed, still have lots of sex on the side "Thai women are used to men going to brothels its part of their culture" and how happy their wife is.....hahahahaha. I would be as rich as Thaksin.

Well, yes, those types are of course existing.

But, as you said, what appears to be liberated there is nothing but abuse of several forms of classism - the hold of a slightly more educated person over his partner, and the advantage of having the right passport over a passport that gives no advantage.

But not all relationships with partners of opposite parts of society work the way you outlined here. And in most of the ones i have seen that do work that way, the women in the end do get their way, behind the supposedly superior man who believes he manages them.

So, in my place of birth i am aware of a certain meeting point were many of those women play the game while their husbands are at work, and more often than not, when a husband refuses to communicate with his wife, well... then she finds somebody who does.

There is always two people to a relationship, both must have a will to make it work. Not just people from opposite parts of society separate - also people of a similar background get divorced.

[SiamSquare123]

Colypat speaks the truth. many farang think they have control because their girl nods and does what he says, then she slips out the backdoor in sexy langerie to go shopping and instead is just going back to the bar to turn a trick. a good friend works in a bangkok hospital and he said that something like 1/5 of the babies born in thailand to farang husbands are someone else's child. its a sick thing, but maybe these guys deserve it.

[kat]

If you are living in LOS and are not young, rich and/or handsome, your chanches of attaching to an upper class or even middle class lady are slim. They are not going to lower themselves and tarnish their reputation by bothering with Farangs unless they may have something unusual to offer.

What utter nonsense

In fact its absolutely true. Most educated middle class Thai women wouldnt dream of marrying a falang. That feeling is changing but very slowly. Just because bar girls love falangs doesnt mean the rest do.

Don't talk crap. I think you move in the wrong circles mate, I know plenty of educated Thai women both here and in Europe and the US that are happily married to westerners.

Tarnish their reputation indeed, what planet are you on?

Jack, I don't think that's completely crap, but I think it may be a bit exaggerated, because things are changing, and there is more diversity among farangs now. However, I think they are very selective and careful about the farang men that they date, although their criteria still differs from the West.

However, I think your earlier statement about class and money is just simply wrong. A farmer who suddenly wins the lotto will simply have more money, but he is not going to be catapulted into a higher class or status as viewed by Thai society. We are talking about a culture that uses different speech to talk about royalty, and to distinguish themselves. Do you really think middle-class and hi-so Thais are suddenly going to view an Issan farm girl differently because she can shop at Guess or Siam Paragon on a farang man's wallet?

[SiamSquare123]

there are many false things being said about rich chinese thais. many of them are willing to support a farang boyfriend(me) if he is capable of doing things for her that thai men cant physically imagine. obviously, most farang will not have such luck, but i do. that doesnt mean that other marriages to other girls will be the same or cant work.

[lannarebirth]

there are many false things being said about rich chinese thais. many of them are willing to support a farang boyfriend(me) if he is capable of doing things for her that thai men cant physically imagine. obviously, most farang will not have such luck, but i do. that doesnt mean that other marriages to other girls will be the same or cant work.

In another topic you mentioned your wife, then in this one in an earlier post you mentioned you would never cheat on your wife, then in another post you were about to root your neighbors wife and now you've got yourself a thai gf who wants to support you. What is your purpose for posting all this bullshit?

[Maigo6]

These threads always make me cringe...............

I probably have the whitest girlfriend around, she's albino. Oh and she is the daughter of the Chief of all the Police in Thailand, and her brother is the head of all the Immigration offices in Thailand, and she has 3 Degrees one from Harvard, one From Yale and one From Oxford University..what else, oh yeah, she supports me as I have no money but she don't care cos she loves me.

Beat that!

[Maigo6]

What is your purpose for posting all this bullshit?

Iannarebirth, I often wonder why people post such stupidity myself, then I read some of my own posts and wonder why I also post such rubbish.