3 minutes ago, kwilco said:

Currently we are in the Holocene Epoch, which began roughly 11,700 years ago after the last major glacial period of the Pleistocene ended. The Holocene is characterized by a warmer, more stable climate compared to the Pleistocene.  Unfortunately, man-made climate change (MMCC) is interfering with that, as you can already see with a destabilising climate.

Based on historical climate data and proxy records, the most unstable climate in recent human history was the period surrounding the year 536 AD, often cited as the "worst year to be alive" due to a mysterious, long-lasting volcanic dust veil that caused widespread crop failure, famine, and extreme cold across Eurasia. 

Österreichische Akademie der Wissenschaften +1

Other notable periods of extreme climate instability include:

• The Year Without a Summer (1816): Following the 1815 eruption of Mount Tambora, this period saw severe global cooling, resulting in summer frosts and snow in New England and Europe, leading to the last great subsistence crisis in the Western world.

• The Younger Dryas (approx. 12,500 years ago): A period where temperatures in the North Atlantic fluctuated between full glacial conditions and interglacial warmth on a subdecadal scale.

• The Little Ice Age (14th–19th Century): A prolonged, unstable period characterized by harsh winters, cold summers, and massive agricultural disruption, partially driven by increased volcanic activity.

4 minutes ago, khaosokman said:

Based on historical climate data and proxy records, the most unstable climate in recent human history was the period surrounding the year 536 AD, often cited as the "worst year to be alive" due to a mysterious, long-lasting volcanic dust veil that caused widespread crop failure, famine, and extreme cold across Eurasia. 

Österreichische Akademie der Wissenschaften +1

Other notable periods of extreme climate instability include:

• The Year Without a Summer (1816): Following the 1815 eruption of Mount Tambora, this period saw severe global cooling, resulting in summer frosts and snow in New England and Europe, leading to the last great subsistence crisis in the Western world.

• The Younger Dryas (approx. 12,500 years ago): A period where temperatures in the North Atlantic fluctuated between full glacial conditions and interglacial warmth on a subdecadal scale.

• The Little Ice Age (14th–19th Century): A prolonged, unstable period characterized by harsh winters, cold summers, and massive agricultural disruption, partially driven by increased volcanic activity.

...and you think that you and an uneducated layman have noticed that and the thousands of highly educated scientists haven't? And didn't take that into account? The fact is that those very scientists are the ones who gathered that information and concluded logically that man-made climate change is the reality.

Just now, kwilco said:

...and you think that you and an uneducated layman have noticed that and the thousands of highly educated scientists haven't? And didn't take that into account? The fact is that those very scientists are the ones who gathered that information and concluded logically that man-made climate change is the reality.

You have never met a climate scientist and there are only a small number with many peer reviewed studies.

7 minutes ago, kwilco said:

...and you think that you and an uneducated layman have noticed that and the thousands of highly educated scientists haven't? And didn't take that into account? The fact is that those very scientists are the ones who gathered that information and concluded logically that man-made climate change is the reality.

Only 3 climate scientists with lots of peer reviewed papers. Two are skeptics.

13 minutes ago, kwilco said:

Based on historical climate data and proxy records, the most unstable climate in recent human history was the period surrounding the year 536 AD, often cited as the "worst year to be alive" due to a mysterious, long-lasting volcanic dust veil that caused widespread crop failure, famine, and extreme cold across Eurasia. 

Österreichische Akademie der Wissenschaften +1

Other notable periods of extreme climate instability include:

• The Year Without a Summer (1816): Following the 1815 eruption of Mount Tambora, this period saw severe global cooling, resulting in summer frosts and snow in New England and Europe, leading to the last great subsistence crisis in the Western world.

• The Younger Dryas (approx. 12,500 years ago): A period where temperatures in the North Atlantic fluctuated between full glacial conditions and interglacial warmth on a subdecadal scale.

• The Little Ice Age (14th–19th Century): A prolonged, unstable period characterized by harsh winters, cold summers, and massive agricultural disruption, partially driven by increased volcanic activity.

Far from disproving human-caused climate change, those historical events demonstrate how powerful atmospheric forcing can be — and why adding trillions of tonnes of greenhouse gases has consequences.

People often cite 536 AD, the Year Without a Summer (1816), the Younger Dryas or the Little Ice Age as proof that “climate has always changed.”

Correct — it has. And in every case we know why.

536 AD and 1816 were caused by massive volcanic eruptions that blasted sulphate into the stratosphere, blocking sunlight and causing short-term global cooling.
The Little Ice Age was linked to increased volcanic activity and reduced solar output.
The Younger Dryas involved major ocean circulation shifts.

These were natural forcings — and mostly cooling events.

What’s happening now is different:

• CO₂ levels are higher than at any time in at least 800,000 years.
• The carbon’s isotopic fingerprint matches fossil fuels.
• The lower atmosphere is warming while the upper atmosphere cools — exactly what greenhouse physics predicts.
• Natural drivers (solar cycles, volcanoes, orbital changes) cannot explain the current warming trend.

Past climate shocks actually prove how sensitive the system is to atmospheric changes. Block sunlight → cooling. Trap heat → warming.

“Climate changed before” doesn’t mean humans can’t change it now. Fires happened before humans too — that doesn’t mean arson isn’t real.

 

1 minute ago, kwilco said:

Far from disproving human-caused climate change, those historical events demonstrate how powerful atmospheric forcing can be — and why adding trillions of tonnes of greenhouse gases has consequences.

People often cite 536 AD, the Year Without a Summer (1816), the Younger Dryas or the Little Ice Age as proof that “climate has always changed.”

Correct — it has. And in every case we know why.

536 AD and 1816 were caused by massive volcanic eruptions that blasted sulphate into the stratosphere, blocking sunlight and causing short-term global cooling.
The Little Ice Age was linked to increased volcanic activity and reduced solar output.
The Younger Dryas involved major ocean circulation shifts.

These were natural forcings — and mostly cooling events.

What’s happening now is different:

• CO₂ levels are higher than at any time in at least 800,000 years.
• The carbon’s isotopic fingerprint matches fossil fuels.
• The lower atmosphere is warming while the upper atmosphere cools — exactly what greenhouse physics predicts.
• Natural drivers (solar cycles, volcanoes, orbital changes) cannot explain the current warming trend.

Past climate shocks actually prove how sensitive the system is to atmospheric changes. Block sunlight → cooling. Trap heat → warming.

“Climate changed before” doesn’t mean humans can’t change it now. Fires happened before humans too — that doesn’t mean arson isn’t real.

 

430ppm is low for plants. They go better at 600 to 1000.

• Cannabis: This is one of the most responsive crops to elevated

  . Levels of 800-1,200 ppm are typically used to maximize yields and reduce production time, especially during the vegetative and early-to-mid flowering stages.

• Tomatoes & Peppers: These crops thrive in elevated environments, with 800-1200 ppm often recommended for faster, higher-yield production.

• Cucumbers: Similar to tomatoes, cucumbers benefit from higher

  levels to accelerate growth, especially during rapid establishment.

• Lettuce & Leafy Greens: 800-1000 ppm supports faster development and larger, healthier leaves.

Co2 of 430ppm is low for grass as well.

The optimal CO₂ levels for the aboveground biomass were 945, 915, and 1151 ppm, and for the total biomass were 915, 1178, and 1386 ppm for tall fescue, perennial ryegrass, and Kentucky bluegrass, respectively

For rice, a typical C3 crop, the ideal concentration for maximizing growth and yield is between 500 and 800 ppm.

Inflammatory baiting posts and replies with personal insults have been removed:

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Is this video on greenhouse gases OK?

1 hour ago, ericthai said:

when I was a kid we had a hole in the ozone and we were all going to die. The Earth is a living thing and is always changing.

We are currently in the Pleistocene Ice Age period.

The hole in the ozone layer was repaired by the Montreal Protocol, which banned the use of halons, chlorofluorocarbons, and carbon tetrachloride. All these compounds were ozone -depleting substances.

A much more difficult task to reduce our dependence on fossil fuels, due to the money interests involved.

We are in the Holocene period, 10,000 years of reasonably stable weather.

Yes, the Earth is changing. We are changing it.

4 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

The hole in the ozone layer was repaired by the Montreal Protocol, which banned the use of halons, chlorofluorocarbons, and carbon tetrachloride. All these compounds were ozone -depleting substances.

A much more difficult task to reduce our dependence on fossil fuels, due to the money interests involved.

We are in the Holocene period, 10,000 years of reasonably stable weather.

Yes, the Earth is changing. We are changing it.

The ozone has not repaired fully yet. Fossil fuels made you move to Thailand. You might not have been born without them.

Around 2206 Co2 will reach 700ppm. Ideal for plants. Just imagine the planes and cars in 2206! Probably be like the Jetsons cartoons finally!

23 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

Yes, the Earth is changing. We are changing it.

and all living things has humans to thank for it, co2 recycling is mankinds greatest legacy for life on earth, in particular plants https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d0Z5FdwWw_c&t=1s

The Little Ice Age (LIA) was a period of regional cooling, particularly in the North Atlantic and Europe, lasting from approximately the early 14th century to the mid-19th century. It was characterized by harsh, long winters and short, cool, and often wet summers, which caused significant agricultural disruption and widespread famine.

Britannica +2

The Little Ice Age (AD 1350–1850) was a period of particularly harsh climatic conditions across most parts of the world.

4 minutes ago, mordothailand said:

and all living things has humans to thank for it, co2 recycling is mankinds greatest legacy for life on earth, in particular plants https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d0Z5FdwWw_c&t=1s

The Little Ice Age (LIA) was a period of regional cooling, particularly in the North Atlantic and Europe, lasting from approximately the early 14th century to the mid-19th century. It was characterized by harsh, long winters and short, cool, and often wet summers, which caused significant agricultural disruption and widespread famine.

Britannica +2

The Little Ice Age (AD 1350–1850) was a period of particularly harsh climatic conditions across most parts of the world.

Yes fossil fuels saved humans from millions of deaths and disease. These alarmists only exist due to them. Their parents as well.

Yes, Dr. William Happer, a physicist and Professor Emeritus at Princeton University, has argued that increasing atmospheric

to roughly 800 to 1,000 ppm (parts per million) would be "optimal" for the Earth and its inhabitants. 

Happer’s position is based on the following claims regarding climate science and agriculture:

• "CO2 Famine": Happer argues that Earth is currently in a "

  famine" at roughly 400-420 ppm, and that historically, CO2 levels have been much higher, which benefited plant life.

• Agricultural Benefits: He contends that higher

  concentrations (specifically citing 800-1000 ppm) increase photosynthesis, improve water efficiency in plants, and boost crop yields, making it beneficial for feeding a growing population.

• Minimal Warming: Happer argues that

  is a "weak" greenhouse gas and that doubling

  from current levels would cause only a "small and benign" increase in global temperature, around 1°C or less.

• Saturation Principle: He argues that the heat-trapping effect of

  is largely "saturated" at current levels, meaning adding more

  will have a negligible effect on global temperature. 

Ideal CO2 for Potato Growth (Greenhouse/Field)

• Optimal Growth Range: 700 to 900 ppm is recommended for maximizing growth and yield.

• Maximum Levels: Levels above 1000 ppm can cause leaf injuries and reduce growth.

• Benefits: Elevated CO2 can boost tuber yield by 9-21% and help potatoes withstand higher temperatures.

For carrots grown in greenhouses or controlled environments, elevating

levels can dramatically increase root weight and development.

• Ideal Range: 800 – 1,200 ppm.

• Saturation Point: Maximum growth rates are typically achieved around 1,000 – 1,300 ppm.

• Yield Impact: Increasing

  to roughly 550 ppm has been shown to increase carrot root weight by 31%

The ideal level for maximizing corn (Zea mays) growth and yield, particularly in controlled environments, is generally considered to be in the range of 550 to 650 ppm. While some studies suggest higher, up to 800 ppm, in specific cases, 600–650 ppm is often cited as optimal for balancing increased carbon fixation with nutrient, temperature, and moisture limitations. 

• Ideal for Growth & Photosynthesis: Research indicates the "sweet spot" for wheat biomass and photosynthesis is approximately 890 ppm to 970 ppm.

5 hours ago, mordothailand said:

and all living things has humans to thank for it, co2 recycling is mankinds greatest legacy for life on earth, in particular plants https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d0Z5FdwWw_c&t=1s

The Little Ice Age (LIA) was a period of regional cooling, particularly in the North Atlantic and Europe, lasting from approximately the early 14th century to the mid-19th century. It was characterized by harsh, long winters and short, cool, and often wet summers, which caused significant agricultural disruption and widespread famine.

Britannica +2

The Little Ice Age (AD 1350–1850) was a period of particularly harsh climatic conditions across most parts of the world.

I guess microplastics, forever chemicals, deforestation and oestrogen- mimicking surfactants aren't on your radar.

9 hours ago, khaosokman said:

Southern Thailand is hot and loaded with plants. The issue isn't heat but lack of water. Regions with crop issues are due to lack of water and poor farming methods. They need to build water pipes to move the water around to dry areas. This costs money. Co2 taxes raise money. That's why they lie about climate. Same as big pharma funded food studies last century and told people to eat the wrong foods. They made people sick then saved them with drugs.

They aren't lying about climate. It has nothing to do with the tropical areas, The human equation has been ruining the planet, increasing the heat, much faster than happened centuries ago.

Loss of topsoil has been occurring everywhere there are crops. Overuse of topsoil, exposing it to the elements, is breaking it down, erosion happens, and the soil takes years to replenish, and especially here, where they plant the same crops yearly, and needing to use chemicals to replace natural nutrients hurts it more. it further destroys the top layer. Lack of water has happened in certain areas all along,

Big Pharma nor anyone involved in the health industry has told anyone to eat crappy foods. That's the advertisement from the food companies. There was nothing wrong with the food pyramid as it was a guideline to follow. People misunderstood what it said and substituted junk food for what's listed. Servings of bread didn't mean Little Debbie cakes, pepperoni pizza and Twinkies.

8 hours ago, khaosokman said:

By 2150 then hey? Who knows. The earth can fit 50bn I think with better farming and land management. Just think 2500.

It isn't just about farming but ocean depletion and cutting down trees for meat production. People will not stop eating meat and fish, the rich will not stop promoting these foods and tearing down the forests until they are stopped. Boats trash certain species in lieu of others, wasting resources and needed species. The population will still increase and it's already too much to sustain it into the future. Land management is those with money cutting down those trees and building millions of new homes. Developers aren't going to stop until the population is curtailed.

5 hours ago, khaosokman said:

Yes fossil fuels saved humans from millions of deaths and disease. These alarmists only exist due to them. Their parents as well.

Fossil fuels have saved lives but also taken many. They will be the bane of society if their use isn't curtailed. I'm posting this just so you might understand why, as it's been well known for decades Inflammation of the body is a major cause of many ailments, and a lot of this comes from air pollution. .................https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC10686099/

6 hours ago, khaosokman said:

The ozone has not repaired fully yet. Fossil fuels made you move to Thailand. You might not have been born without them.

I would think for most here, the women had them move to Thailand. Humans would still be here, and reproducing, if fossil fuels were never used.

54 minutes ago, fredwiggy said:

They aren't lying about climate. It has nothing to do with the tropical areas, The human equation has been ruining the planet, increasing the heat, much faster than happened centuries ago.

Depending on whether there are documented extinctions or estimates , mankind is responsible for anywhere between 1000 and 100,000 species disappearing from the planet.

37 minutes ago, fredwiggy said:

I would think for most here, the women had them move to Thailand. Humans would still be here, and reproducing, if fossil fuels were never used.

Foreigners move here because of economic arbitrage. The women are a bonus.

48 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

Depending on whether there are documented extinctions or estimates , mankind is responsible for anywhere between 1000 and 100,000 species disappearing from the planet.

It's said 99% are already gone. Man is responsible for possibly thousands.

48 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

Foreigners move here because of economic arbitrage. The women are a bonus.

I'm sure many are, who can have more here than back home, but still think if there weren't younger women to be had much easier, half wouldn't be here. Most might be too much.

1 hour ago, fredwiggy said:

I would think for most here, the women had them move to Thailand. Humans would still be here, and reproducing, if fossil fuels were never used.

You can't fly without fossil fuels.

1 hour ago, fredwiggy said:

Fossil fuels have saved lives but also taken many. They will be the bane of society if their use isn't curtailed. I'm posting this just so you might understand why, as it's been well known for decades Inflammation of the body is a major cause of many ailments, and a lot of this comes from air pollution. .................https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC10686099/

Humans lived to 35yo pre 1880 before cars. Fossil fuels led to cars,planes, vitamins and penicillin.