9 hours ago, Yagoda said:

Im sure the military has a term for what happens after you soften the enemy up so they are completely defenseless.

Maybe this:

U.S. Intelligence Shows Iran Retains Substantial Missile Capabilities

Secret new assessments say Iran has operational access to 30 of its 33 missile sites along the Strait of Hormuz, suggesting that its military remains far stronger than President Trump has asserted.

4 minutes ago, JerryM said:

Maybe this:

U.S. Intelligence Shows Iran Retains Substantial Missile Capabilities

Secret new assessments say Iran has operational access to 30 of its 33 missile sites along the Strait of Hormuz, suggesting that its military remains far stronger than President Trump has asserted.

says who?

Btw if we know they are there they are eassier to destroy LOL

Edited May 13May 13 by Yagoda

1 minute ago, Yagoda said:

says who

I see -- you don't have to say who says Iran is completely defenseless

1 minute ago, JerryM said:

I see -- you don't have to say who says Iran is completely defenseless

He has better information than anyone else and isnt anonymous.

11 minutes ago, Yagoda said:

He has better information than anyone else and isnt anonymous.

Trump calls Iran 'defenseless,' demands unconditional surrender

Jun 18, 2025

President Donald Trump on Wednesday described Iran as “totally defenseless” and said he is still considering military action.

“Well, I don't know how much longer it's going to go on. They're totally defenseless. They have no air defense whatsoever. Totally captured. You know we've totally captured the air, right?” Trump told reporters.

https://www.iranintl.com/en/202506182522

12 hours ago, ericthai said:

Why exactly would Americans “not be able to afford anything”?

Worldwide economic depression as bad if not worse than 1920's

non paywall link to an interesting article in the Atlantic magazine

https://archive.ph/wEX3C

Checkmate in Iran

Washington can’t reverse or control the consequences of losing this war.

By Robert Kagan

'Defeat in the present confrontation with Iran will be of an entirely different character. It can neither be repaired nor ignored. There will be no return to the status quo ante, no ultimate American triumph that will undo or overcome the harm done. The Strait of Hormuz will not be “open,” as it once was. With control of the strait, Iran emerges as the key player in the region and one of the key players in the world. The roles of China and Russia, as Iran’s allies, are strengthened; the role of the United States, substantially diminished'

13 hours ago, ericthai said:

This reads more like a Tom Clancy fiction thread than a serious military analysis.

Nobody sane wants a war with Iran. Yes, Iran can still cause disruption with missiles, drones, proxies, and attacks on oil infrastructure. That’s real.

But “causing disruption” is not the same thing as winning a war against the United States and its allies.

Iran’s strategy has always been asymmetric warfare because they cannot match the U.S. conventionally. Their air force is outdated, their economy is heavily sanctioned, and much of their regional proxy network has already been degraded over the last few years.

And the “America is helpless without Saudi overflight permission” ignores reality.

The U.S. military has global strike capabilities far beyond one route or one aircraft platform.

Also, nobody credible is talking about nuking Iran except internet doom and groom posters trying to turn every conflict into the apocalypse.

The real goal is deterrence, make Iran understand that attacking U.S. forces, Gulf states or shipping lanes carries consequences.

Iran can absolutely create problems. But the idea that Iran, China, and Russia are about to dethrone America while Trump secretly hands Xi the keys to the planet belongs in Netflix, not geopolitics.

Yep, nobody defeats the best military in the world. Wait. Except the National Liberation Front in Vietnam.

There are no winners in war. If nukes are fired it's curtains for all of us. Might be better for the planet, too.

15 hours ago, Yagoda said:

Dont even need nukes for them LOL.

Maybe we will just let the IDF do it.

Dont see many MAGA guys bringing it up here.

Oh lets act all tough on the net.

The trolls are annoying I agree, I think Ill give them free reign for a few days. Same bs over and over.

How would you know LOL. Guess you hate gays too? Or have a fixation? Do you think men can become women by raising their hand and saying Im a women in falsetto?

"Maybe we will just let the IDF do it."

No, you won't. Your Daddy, Bibi, just stated categorically in that 60 minutes interview love fest that there will be no Israeli boot on the ground in Iran, period.

And when Daddy speaks, Trump listens.

Iran’s defence doctrine now seems to be:

* faceless, well-armed forces able to melt into guerrilla warfare

* mobile drone and missile launchers hidden in hardened sites

* swarms of cheap attack boats and the occasional tanker strike to signal intent and capability

* satellite and intelligence support from Russia and China

* propaganda warfare down to the level of Lego animations and meme battles (yes really information war matters now)

* fighting on home territory across huge difficult terrain

* eventually perhaps a nuclear deterrent whose message is simply: “leave us alone”

* proxies like the Houthis, Hamas and Hezbollah damaged but far from destroyed, with their own agency and operational capability

They don’t necessarily need endless fleets of tanks, airbases and conventional air superiority. Those were the assumptions of older wars.

Arguably it’s closer to the Vietnam model updated for the drone and information age: make intervention so costly, messy and politically corrosive that even a superpower starts wondering whether it’s worth it.

Smart people as Trump would say , nasty people but smart and Trump lost. Sorry about that , Trumpton fans but you got outplayed and as for Isarel the myth of invunerability shattered for ever -FAFO.

1 hour ago, johng said:

Worldwide economic depression as bad if not worse than 1920's

non paywall link to an interesting article in the Atlantic magazine

https://archive.ph/wEX3C

Checkmate in Iran

Washington can’t reverse or control the consequences of losing this war.

By Robert Kagan

'Defeat in the present confrontation with Iran will be of an entirely different character. It can neither be repaired nor ignored. There will be no return to the status quo ante, no ultimate American triumph that will undo or overcome the harm done. The Strait of Hormuz will not be “open,” as it once was. With control of the strait, Iran emerges as the key player in the region and one of the key players in the world. The roles of China and Russia, as Iran’s allies, are strengthened; the role of the United States, substantially diminished'

Thanks for that great article and a salutary lesson in why previous US presidents largely avoided directly attacking Iran.

Trump and his fanbois may well have engineered one of the greatest setbacks to the projection of US authority in my lifetime. The difference this time is that they know full escalation is no longer realistically sustainable politically, financially or strategically.

Unlike earlier wars where America could still go “all in,” there is now little appetite at home for another vast Middle Eastern entanglement, and adversaries know it.

That’s the real shift: not simply military capability, but the erosion of credibility, deterrence and the assumption that the US can endlessly impose outcomes abroad.

An empire rarely collapses in one dramatic moment. More often it begins when everyone quietly realises its reach now exceeds its will. In China Trump can only marvel at the new world hegemon hatched almost perfectly from the world' largest population oh and Trump everybody is laughing at you - they always were - because you are a joke.

The power to close or control the flow of ships through the strait is greater and more immediate than the theoretical power of Iran’s nuclear program. This leverage will allow the leaders in Tehran to force nations to lift sanctions and normalize relations or face penalties. Israel will find itself more isolated than ever, as Iran grows richer, rearms, and preserves its options to go nuclear in the future. It may even find itself unable to go after Iran’s proxies: In a world where Iran wields influence over the energy supply of so many nations, Israel could face enormous international pressure not to provoke Tehran in Lebanon, Gaza, or anywhere else.

22 hours ago, davb said:

I predict an attack by Sunday. Note:

1) Fox News announces Project Sledgehammer as Trump and his men travel to China to bring Xi into line.

2) Warmonger Lindsey Graham is making sure Pakistan knows that its behavior is under scrutiny and has been unacceptable recently.

3) Next US president Marco Rubio is wearing the same clothing worn by Maduro when Trump decided to take him out.

4) Economic assassin Scott Bessent, the man who broke both the UK and Thailand when he managed currency trades for Soros, continues to destroy the Iranian economy.

Things are aligning for a massive Iranian strike. Trump is handling this brilliantly and soon we will see the results.






https://x.com/JesseBWatters/status/2054359007440122201

Project Sand Wedge - they're stuck in a bunker thanks to Project Epic F.U.

As for bringing Xi into line, what reality do they live in? The US, with the help of Israel, have hugely depleted the USA's inventory of smart munitions, stuff that is expensive, complicated to manufacture, and requiring a shed load of rare earth magnets. Has no one explained that the US gets the latter from China; the USA doesn't have the capability to either process or manufacture themselves. Trump is in no position to dictate to Xi, the boot is on the other foot.

13 hours ago, ericthai said:

Why exactly would Americans “not be able to afford anything”?

The U.S. doesn’t rely on Iran for imports. In 2025, U.S. goods imports from Iran were only about $1.4 million so, basically nothing in national trade terms.

The U.S. is also producing record levels of oil. So this isn’t a situation where America suddenly has no oil, food or basic supplies because of Iran.

Could Iran cause disruption in the Strait of Hormuz and push global oil prices up? Sure. That’s a real risk.

But prices may rise is not the same as 'Americans won’t be able to afford anything.’

That’s just doom posting from people rooting against America!

It seems that you sometimes alter claims for the sake of argumentation.

No one claims that the lack of imports from Iran would affect the US. The claim is that the blocus of the Hormuz strait (preventing exports from all other countries located there) will affect the US, directly or indirectly.

You did the same in your previous post ("But pretending Trump personally created global dependence on China, Iran’s aggression or fragile fertilizer supply chains is absurd."). It is not claimed that Trump caused this dependence.

Operation slightly bent spoon! 😄

1 hour ago, Stocky said:

Project Sand Wedge - they're stuck in a bunker thanks to Project Epic F.U.

As for bringing Xi into line, what reality do they live in? The US, with the help of Israel, have hugely depleted the USA's inventory of smart munitions, stuff that is expensive, complicated to manufacture, and requiring a shed load of rare earth magnets. Has no one explained that the US gets the latter from China; the USA doesn't have the capability to either process or manufacture themselves. Trump is in no position to dictate to Xi, the boot is on the other foot.

Trump - foot - himself - shot - inthe - rearrange into a well known phrase and add 'bigly' at the end. Oh what a circus ! Is America Great Again - yet ?

The Arab countries will have to grow some balls and bomb Iran back to the Stone Age before they go back there themselves ,they all face an existential crisis

1 hour ago, beautifulthailand99 said:

Iran’s defence doctrine now seems to be:

They don’t necessarily need endless fleets of tanks, airbases and conventional air superiority. Those were the assumptions of older wars.

Arguably it’s closer to the Vietnam model updated for the drone and information age: make intervention so costly, messy and politically corrosive that even a superpower starts wondering whether it’s worth it.

Iran and the IRGC needs money to make that work. It's not Vietnam where an entire population lives on a handful of rice each day. They are (formerly) almost middle class, now that Bessent has destroyed their currency, as he likes to do.

No money to pay outside terrorists. Companies sending them drones or missile parts - even Chinese companies - get sanctioned. No money for drones.

Being (formerly) middle class made them soft, unlike the Vietnamese. Very different.

2 hours ago, unblocktheplanet said:

Yep, nobody defeats the best military in the world. Wait. Except the National Liberation Front in Vietnam.

America lost in Vietnam due to LBJ. Important to note - LBJ bankrupted the US and Nixon had to sharply devalue the currency.

Trump has learned from this. It's Iran that now has not just a devalued currency, but one that has less value than Monopoly money. So there is a parallel, but it's not good for Iran.

23 hours ago, worgeordie said:

What will the next project be called Project Kill all Iranians ,

is this what Hegseth does all day thinking up war games

names with a bottle of gin, we have had Operation Midnight

Hammer ,Epic Fury ,project Freedom ,Operation Sledgehammer,

Christian warrior Pete Hegseth is in China.

I could write words answering this post, but instead a picture shows everything. Hegseth shakes Xi's hand, and then, man-to-man, they face off. Grim determination. Someone who doesn't back down.

This is who the Iranians must defeat.

19 hours ago, johng said:

Yeah I don't live in America but that doesn't change the facts due to stupid closures of the straits the world economy will suffer.

Short-term pain. The world will be better off with maniac mullahs with nuclear weapons, which is what we were months away from.

OPEC is in shambles. Trump runs Venezuela, the UAE left OPEC, and if there is anything left of Iran's oil-making capability after Sunday's attack, then that too will be OPEC-free. The world will be better off in the medium term.

18 hours ago, Enoon said:

Yeah, sure........you soften them up and then have over a months ceasefire so they can rebuild their defences.

Christian warrior Hegseth has addressed this. Eyes from the sky see everything. He knows what is being rebuilt, what is being cleared.

At the same time, US weaponry is either being restocked or, in the case of hypersonic missiles, being moved into place for the first time.

Trump also needed to give diplomacy a chance to work, but the Iranians refused to settle this peacefully.

20 minutes ago, davb said:

Iran and the IRGC needs money to make that work. It's not Vietnam where an entire population lives on a handful of rice each day. They are (formerly) almost middle class, now that Bessent has destroyed their currency, as he likes to do.

No money to pay outside terrorists. Companies sending them drones or missile parts - even Chinese companies - get sanctioned. No money for drones.

Being (formerly) middle class made them soft, unlike the Vietnamese. Very different.

I think the arguemnt has legs tbh but not enough to run. Not in the sense Iran is "winning" but in the sense that sanctions and conventional military dominance don't automatically translate into strategic victory anymore.

The old unipolar world after 2003 isn't really there now. BRICS, the global south and even US allies are increasingly hedging their bets rather than blindly lining up behind Washington every time. Iran only really needs enough econoic oxygen and enough partners to avoid total isolation.

And asymmetric warfare changes the calcualtion. You don't need fleets to make intervention costly and politically toxic over time. Drones, proxies, cyber attacks, disruption and attrition can be enough to create deterrence.

Also the sanctions architecture itself isn't quite as airtight as it once was. Even crypto and alternative financial rails - which ironically Trump himself has politically leaned into - gradually chip away at the West's monopoly over global finance.

People said "middle class societies go soft" but history doesn't always support that. Ukraine is a pretty obvious conter example.

That said, Iran is still under huge pressure econoically and BRICS is more fragmented than some people admit. So I think the stronger argument is not "Iran is winning", it's that the old Western playbook no longer guarantees clean victories the way it once did.

Oh and what are these middle classes gonna do - write to the Guardian ? They tried demonstrating and got slaughtered in their thousaNDS if anything the IRCG is more hardened and the US/Isarel have cleared out a lot of the dead wood at the top - the Colonel class historically have great power when they get to use it and they are.

Edited May 14May 14 by beautifulthailand99

10 minutes ago, davb said:

Christian warrior Pete Hegseth is in China.

I could write words answering this post, but instead a picture shows everything. Hegseth shakes Xi's hand, and then, man-to-man, they face off. Grim determination. Someone who doesn't back down.

This is who the Iranians must defeat.

Nah yopu are seeing what you want to see I see an alcoholic Fox News presenter looking unconfortable when in eye contact with the world's most powerful man - and it's not clown world Trump it's the real thing.

Some folk really live in Lala-Land.

Christian warrior Hegseth - please, the man's a knuckle dragging alcoholic.

16 hours ago, BarraMarra said:

Well it won't be the 1st the Yanks have vapourised civilians is it Wingate. Didn't bother them then and it wouldn't bother them now because the Good old US of A is the best in the World.

Correct on all counts. The Yanks have vaporized civilians before, it didn't bother them, it won't bother them now, and the USA is the best in the world.

The Japanese and Germans both learned that civilian casualties are something the US finds acceptable, but the lesson came too late.

6 minutes ago, Stocky said:

Some folk really live in Lala-Land.

Christian warrior Hegseth - please, the man's a knuckle dragging alcoholic.

When you use a phrase like that then you have lost any argument you may have had. Plus which Jesus is this bloodthirsty warrior - I must have mssied that at Sunday school !

When I was a kid, we had several mean aunties in the family. Nothing changed their behavior except applying pain.

Long pleading conversations, appeals to their Christian nature, talking about feelings - it all failed to alter behavior. Interestingly, only some of the men were willing to apply pain and get to live in relative harmony. Others weren't up to it, and inevitably paid the price.

The Iranians are like these women, and I believe Trump knows it. Pain is the only thing that will change their behavior, and Trump is the type of man willing to apply pain.

Prediction: devastation of Iran's infrastructure with multiple waves of conventional aircraft.

Save time, Project Taco.

6 minutes ago, davb said:

When I was a kid, we had several mean aunties in the family. Nothing changed their behavior except applying pain.

Long pleading conversations, appeals to their Christian nature, talking about feelings - it all failed to alter behavior. Interestingly, only some of the men were willing to apply pain and get to live in relative harmony. Others weren't up to it, and inevitably paid the price.

The Iranians are like these women, and I believe Trump knows it. Pain is the only thing that will change their behavior, and Trump is the type of man willing to apply pain.

Prediction: devastation of Iran's infrastructure with multiple waves of conventional aircraft.

beating on a gal thats maga right there

7 minutes ago, davb said:

When I was a kid, we had several mean aunties in the family. Nothing changed their behavior except applying pain.

Long pleading conversations, appeals to their Christian nature, talking about feelings - it all failed to alter behavior. Interestingly, only some of the men were willing to apply pain and get to live in relative harmony. Others weren't up to it, and inevitably paid the price.

The Iranians are like these women, and I believe Trump knows it. Pain is the only thing that will change their behavior, and Trump is the type of man willing to apply pain.

Prediction: devastation of Iran's infrastructure with multiple waves of conventional aircraft.

Come on man you're just badly trolling now - up your game !

In the recent UAP "disclosures", which contained nothing of value, CENTCOM included this video from October 1, 2023. It starts with the US monitoring an Iranian port from the UAE side, and then suddenly something flies in front of the camera.

This was yet another message to the Iranians that not only are they being watched, but the US has drone technology that surpasses even known physics and capabilities.




Source: https://www.dvidshub.net/video/1006067/dow-uap-pr27-unresolved-uap-report-united-arab-emirates-october-2023