What Does A Lease Really Mean?

[pokr122]

After living and teaching here in Thailand for several months, my landlord told me yesterday that I would have to sign a 6 month lease in order to continue to stay in my very nice 25,000b apt. I had been staying month to month and would like to stay but dont want to get tied down in case I decide to leave the country or just have some bad experience and want to change apartments.

When I told this to my friend who has lived here for 20 years he told me to just sign the lease if I wanna stay. He said that the worst thing that can happen is I lose my security deposit (20000). I dont like breaking agreements and in the USA would not sign a lease I intended to break but, if this is the way thay do it here, and that is the only downside I would sign to stay here.

Gotta decide in 2 days so any opinions from you guys would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks,

larry

0856630080

ps. if anyone knows of a nice rental near the MRT or the BTS for 25000b or less, please give me a call.

any info good for at least 2 beers even if i dont use it.

[Scott]

From what you said, it doesn't sound like you PLAN to break your lease. You like your apartment, so I would suggest signing the lease. Should events require you to move, then you probably have a valid reason for breaking it and you will lose your security deposit.

I know quite a few people in the same situation. Some have signed for 6 months, some for a year, some for 2 years.

Best of luck to you.

[GuestHouse]

I've known a number of people in Thailand move from places they liked, to places they thought they might like better only to realize they've made a mistake (bad neighbours, poor quality services, nasty landlord).

If you are happy with the place you have, sign the lease (it will have a get out clause).

If breaking agreements offends your sensibility, consider then that you are living in your landlord's property without giving him his rights to a lease. He is as entitled to peace of mind just as much as you are - if you can manage to see it from his perspective you'll come to the right decision.

[Payboy]

all of the above....and i'm not sure that the new lease agreement would have just 20,000 baht as the indemnity for breach... have you seen the proposed lease agreement yet?

[Gary A]

I rent my condo to a friend of mine. He told me that he really likes the condo but would feel better with a two year lease. I gave him the two year lease but if he would choose to leave, the lease would be useless to me. It may afford him some protection but I seriously doubt that it helps me. If he leaves, he leaves.

[Sanpatong]

I think everyone here needs to keep a few things separate.

I propose to use the term LEASE only when it is official, i.e. the land has been registered at the land department as being leased to a person. This is typically indicated on the back of the Chanote registration document and leased typically run several years.

The original poster seems to be talking more of a 6 months rent agreement.

Now what's so far unclear to me is if this means the property owner also wants this 6 months paid in advance? That I would assume could be a bit of an issue. But if it's a 6 month agreement that you rent the place, then I wouldn't call it a lease at all. Sign a rental agreement document then, there's a standard form for that as well.

Edited August 28, 2007 by Sanpatong

[Sanpatong]

I rent my condo to a friend of mine. He told me that he really likes the condo but would feel better with a two year lease. I gave him the two year lease but if he would choose to leave, the lease would be useless to me. It may afford him some protection but I seriously doubt that it helps me. If he leaves, he leaves.

If he can't leave it wouldn't be a condo anymore but a jail. Sure he can leave, the terms of the lease (or rental agreement) state what happens in that case. And does it offer him any protection.... Well, 'up to you', as they say.

[quiksilva]

What you choose to call it is up to you but the correct use of the term "lease" is as a verb, as in: to lease / let out. There is no strict definition of either a Rental agreements / Lease agreement the terms are interchangeable. They do not strictly imply the duration of a term. Rent = money, nothing more.

Describing one or the other as official or unofficial is dangerous territory. They are both binding legal contracts which may or may not be registered at the land department depending upon the duration of the Lease term. Should someone breach their commitment to pay rental throughout the duration of the term they could, in theory be sued, for all of their outstanding arrears. In practice this does not happen, as it is typically not worth the time, hassle and legal fees, but it could happen.

After saying all that, I think the OP will find that the lessor is being very reasonable. Most residential leases are for a minimum of 12 months. Shorter leases like the 6 month term they have offered you are uncommon and periodic tenancies like you have been enjoying up to now are even harder to find and it really is of no surprise that they have asked for more commitment on your part.

If you are staying in the area for any reasonable length of time 6 months is not all that long, why would you want to endure moving house that often anyway?

Besides if any significant change happened during the term of your tenancy that effected your right to enjoy the premises, wouldn't that amount to a breach of contract, empowering you to vacate without penalty?

Edited August 28, 2007 by quiksilva

[ProThaiExpat]

Here again am I, endorsing quicksilvas post but with the following additional information.

I am currently tutoring a Judge of the higher or the two courts of first impression in Thailand and have questioned him extensively regarding the origin of Thai laws. He always said they are taken from English and U.S. models. Since U.S. law has originated from Englands, you are fairly safe in applying the general common laws of those jurisdictions to Thailand.

A interest in real property, usually a possessory right, is termed an "estate" and is measured by its length and degree of right of possession. A lease is a right of possession to real property and the improvements thereon and if over a year, must be in writing to be enforceable in the U.S. Clearly a right of possession of a condo or apartment documented in a written contract is a lease for a term, said term delineated in the lease document or contract.

Any letting of real property for a term is properly referred to as a lease, as quicksilva said, regardless of whether it is recorded or not. Recording a lease just makes good sense as it puts the world on notice of your possessory right to the property.

[Johpa]

After living and teaching here in Thailand for several months, my landlord told me yesterday that I would have to sign a 6 month lease in order to continue to stay in my very nice 25,000b apt. I had been staying month to month and would like to stay but dont want to get tied down in case I decide to leave the country or just have some bad experience and want to change apartments.

When I told this to my friend who has lived here for 20 years he told me to just sign the lease if I wanna stay. He said that the worst thing that can happen is I lose my security deposit (20000). I dont like breaking agreements and in the USA would not sign a lease I intended to break but, if this is the way thay do it here, and that is the only downside I would sign to stay here.

Getting back to the original question and away from the flatulence of the legal crowd here, the only thing this lease means is that the landlord is committed to the 25,000 baht per month rental amount for six months before he can raise the rent. Of course, as others have noted, if you want to break the lease you can kiss your deposit good bye, but then most often you can kiss your deposit good bye regardless if you break the lease or not. Landlords around the globe are notorious for finding reasons for not fully refunding security deposits.

In the world of commercial leases where I have far too much experience, my maxim is to never fear the rent, but only to fear the landlord. I have paid high rent for a good location with a good landlord and have forsaken a great location with decent rents because the landlord was a jerk.

[true blue]

maybe if you worried about to much depoist try to negotiate a smaller sum in thailand if you rent they excpect 1 to2 months depoist