4 hours ago, Roadsternut said:

Problem is what the Japanese have done hasn't solved the problem. The Japanese have tried everything. Honda and Toyota are firing the parts cannons at expensive robots, which don't really help. They started tackling the problem in the 1930s, when they introduced radio programming aimed at keeping elders more active (and less of a burden on the state). 90 years on, they are still tackling the problem.

There are only options left that hasn't been tried. Last Day. With a touch of Soylent Green.

The second is a return to agrarian non-mechanised societies, which are associated with large families, because you need everyone hands on deck during the harvest of potatoes and turnips. Pol Pot without the nice weather.

You could create mechanisms to allow people to grow and prosper in a working career, and return to their countries of origin to retire. eg. allow UK pensions to be upgraded for overseas pensioners to facilitate that.

The problem is nobody in Japan is screwing.

This is a terrific solution IF they cap it at 1M. Other countries could do the same, or cap it at, say, 500k.

1 million more on benefits doesn't.

You've based that statement entirely on prejudice, with no consideration what's going on in Spain.

But you are nothing if not predictable. Faced with a policy, which really as FA to do with you (unless your real name is Juanito) that could bring around a million people into the formal economy, your first assumption is "one million benefit claimants." That says more about your assumptions than Spain's economy.

Spain has one of Europe's largest black economies; 24% of GDP, employing about, guess for it, a million people. A huge proportion of undocumented migrants are already working—in agriculture, hospitality, construction, care and other sectors. Regularisation means they're paying income tax and social security instead of working off the books.

It also suggests you know remarkably little about Spain's welfare system, where many benefits depend on contribution records and others are relatively limited. Legal status is not a magic ticket to lifelong benefits. Not everything is like how you remembered it when on the dole and claiming the social.

Your posts follow a familiar pattern: if immigrants are involved, you leap to the most negative interpretation, regardless of the economics, resulting in a combination of racialised assumptions and a poor grasp of how the Spanish labour market actually works.

A million more registered workers and taxpayers is a far more plausible outcome than your fantasy of a million people suddenly living on benefits.

One million new minimum wage regularised workers generates 6 billion Euros in payroll benefits back to the Spanish treasury. Currently Spain spends about 20 million Euros deporting illegals. Spain also spends abut 5 million Euros of a voluntary repatriation and training scheme; those deported migrants will get training and support setting up a business back home. Its a numbers game, many of those businesses may fail, but some won't. The Euro goes a lot further there than home funding essentially defence and security companies create an oppressive informer atmosphere, because the Spanish version of you is at home pissing himself with worry about all these migrants.

7 hours ago, unblocktheplanet said:

The problem is nobody in Japan is screwing.

So you are into Grannies. Ok. Whatever your kink.

7 hours ago, Effective altruism said:

I'm pleased to see Spain attracting highly skilled workers from Africa.

Over half of Spain's illegal immigrants are from South and Central America, Cuba.

14 hours ago, RayC said:

Yes, Jonathan, it will make a difference when citizenship is granted, but if an individual is granted citizenship I doubt that they will be a piece of "unknown, unchecked dross" as you so charmingly label them. To achieve citizenship status, they will have proven themselves to be decent residents of Spain.

And no, Jonathan, as I stated previously you are incorrect. "Many" will not be granted Spanish citizenship after 2 years; the overwhelming majority will have to wait 5 - 10 years to gain citizenship. But, hey, why let facts get in the way of another bigoted rant?

https://www.spanishcitizenship.org/spanish-citizenship-requirements/

However, I'm not surprised that you claim that this is a Brexit benefit given that there are so few of them.

Actually citizens from many countries are eligible after only 2 years Raymond.

You really should do more research.

Then they'll be free to roam across the schengen area into countries that oppose the plan.

But hey who cares what they think. Its not like the EU ever pretended to be democratic anyway.

14 hours ago, Red Forever said:

Aaw Jonny, quick out of the blocks to show your far right ignorance as usual.

The “unknown unchecked “ will have to prove their presence for 5 months in the country up until December 31st 2025 and have their criminal history checked. So, not unknown or unchecked. More far right lies from you!

You were probably too busy to read the OP in your zeal to spew your xenophobic drivel.

I bet that on your phone you have activated alerts to inform when words such as immigrants, small boats, asylum, EU, woke are mentioned in order that you can lead your like minded “patriots” in the verbal battle against the wokerati.

No. They have to have been there before January 1. A few months ago.

So now they will be legalised and many will also be given citizenship in 2 years.

Then they are free to spread around Europe like a wet turd dropped from a great height. Even though the other countries do not want them.

Sovereignty lost. Thank goodness we left.

5 hours ago, Roadsternut said:

You've based that statement entirely on prejudice, with no consideration what's going on in Spain.

But you are nothing if not predictable. Faced with a policy, which really as FA to do with you (unless your real name is Juanito) that could bring around a million people into the formal economy, your first assumption is "one million benefit claimants." That says more about your assumptions than Spain's economy.

Spain has one of Europe's largest black economies; 24% of GDP, employing about, guess for it, a million people. A huge proportion of undocumented migrants are already working—in agriculture, hospitality, construction, care and other sectors. Regularisation means they're paying income tax and social security instead of working off the books.

It also suggests you know remarkably little about Spain's welfare system, where many benefits depend on contribution records and others are relatively limited. Legal status is not a magic ticket to lifelong benefits. Not everything is like how you remembered it when on the dole and claiming the social.

Your posts follow a familiar pattern: if immigrants are involved, you leap to the most negative interpretation, regardless of the economics, resulting in a combination of racialised assumptions and a poor grasp of how the Spanish labour market actually works.

A million more registered workers and taxpayers is a far more plausible outcome than your fantasy of a million people suddenly living on benefits.

One million new minimum wage regularised workers generates 6 billion Euros in payroll benefits back to the Spanish treasury. Currently Spain spends about 20 million Euros deporting illegals. Spain also spends abut 5 million Euros of a voluntary repatriation and training scheme; those deported migrants will get training and support setting up a business back home. Its a numbers game, many of those businesses may fail, but some won't. The Euro goes a lot further there than home funding essentially defence and security companies create an oppressive informer atmosphere, because the Spanish version of you is at home pissing himself with worry about all these migrants.

Always the same with your ilk.

Let them in illegally (accidentally on purpose) then say "oh we better legalise them now or we dont get tax". Justify it on the grounds of gdp or pensions. Pretend they're engineers and doctors.

How about not letting them in in the first place and preserving the safety of the citizens and culture of the Spanish?

Anyway strap in. Youre about to see the consequences of your deranged mindset over the coming couple of decades. It wont be pretty but at least you can live in a largely safe, homogenous, patriotic, nationalistic country with strong immigration policy like Thailand while you watch liberalism destroy Europe from a distance.

Do they live off the state or do they have jobs?

That is a key data point.

I'd add one more point... Do they qualify for jobs in underserved markets, or are they just low wage alternatives to hiring Spanish kids and paying them a living wage?

The time to figure that out is when they're still in their country applying for residency. Not after they're already in country.

No. They have to have been there before January 1. A few months ago.

Not even:

According to explosive reports from Spanish National Police sources published by El Español and Breitbart, over 400,000 of the staggering 1.3 million amnesty applications come from migrants who weren’t even living in Spain before the January 1, 2026 cutoff date.

Documents required to “prove” five months of continuous presence — utility bills, bus tickets, rental contracts, empadronamiento registrations — are being openly sold on Telegram and Instagram black markets. Criminal networks have turned the entire process into a lucrative business, shuttling migrants across Europe to exploit this one-time socialist giveaway.

Really. Nobody saw that coming? Sadly, it's a Spanish language link... And probably not an approved source. El Espanol. But I'd bet you could do a web search for the text and find it. They figure 400,000 of the applications are fraudulent.

Wouldn't you rather live in Spain than Ol 'Blighty if you were a migrant? I sure would.

It still mystifies me why so many of them want to go to the UK...

The social protection programmes, like health care and welafre, are pretty similar across most Western European countries. I don't think Britain's is any better than the others. Why England??

7 hours ago, JonnyF said:

No. They have to have been there before January 1. A few months ago.

So now they will be legalised and many will also be given citizenship in 2 years.

Then they are free to spread around Europe like a wet turd dropped from a great height. Even though the other countries do not want them.

Sovereignty lost. Thank goodness we left.

According to AI the migrants from African countries cannot gain citizenship for at least 10 years.

Unlike Spanish speaking South American countries and the Phillipines.

• The Legal Status Granted: Successful applicants receive a one-year residency and work permit. This allows undocumented immigrants to join the formal economy, pay taxes, and access public services. [1, 2, 3]

• Voting Rights: It does not grant the right to vote in general elections or yield a Spanish passport. [1]

• General Path Forward: To transition from residency to citizenship, migrants typically must hold legal residency continuously for up to 10 years (though this is reduced to 2 years for citizens of Latin American countries, the Philippines, and Andorra). [1, 2, 3, 4]

how many of the spanish migrants will be granted citizenship? - Google Search

10 minutes ago, bannork said:

According to AI the migrants from African countries cannot gain citizenship for at least 10 years.

Unlike Spanish speaking South American countries and the Phillipines.

• The Legal Status Granted: Successful applicants receive a one-year residency and work permit. This allows undocumented immigrants to join the formal economy, pay taxes, and access public services. [1,

  ,

  ]

• Voting Rights: It does not grant the right to vote in general elections or yield a Spanish passport. [

  ]

• General Path Forward: To transition from residency to citizenship, migrants typically must hold legal residency continuously for up to 10 years (though this is reduced to 2 years for citizens of Latin American countries, the Philippines, and Andorra). [1, 2, 3, 4]

how many of the spanish migrants will be granted citizenship? - Google Search

I never mentioned Africans.

Why are you singling them out? For many other groups it's 2 years just as I said.

50 minutes ago, JonnyF said:

I never mentioned Africans.

Why are you singling them out? For many other groups it's 2 years just as I said.

So which groups ' spread like a wet turd' to quote you?

1 hour ago, ronnie50 said:

Wouldn't you rather live in Spain than Ol 'Blighty if you were a migrant? I sure would.

It still mystifies me why so many of them want to go to the UK...

The social protection programmes, like health care and welafre, are pretty similar across most Western European countries. I don't think Britain's is any better than the others. Why England??

Some have relatives in the UK. Some speak English already.

8 hours ago, JonnyF said:

Actually citizens from many countries are eligible after only 2 years Raymond.

You really should do more research.

You really should read and try to comprehend the link I provided, Jonathan:

Individuals become eligible for Spanish citizenship after:

"2 years: For citizens of Ibero-American countries, Portugal, Andorra, the Philippines, or Equatorial Guinea

1 year: For individuals who:

• Were born in Spain

• Have been married to a Spanish citizen for at least one year

• Are widows or widowers of Spanish nationals

• Were legally adopted by a Spanish citizen (if over 18)

• Are descendants of Spanish nationals, including grandchildren"

If only there weren't so many adopted, widowed, Andorran refugees of Spanish descent who (re)married to a Spanish citizen knocking around then there wouldn't be an illegal immigration problem in Europe.

What are the Spanish government thinking of opening the floodgates to those sort of people?!

8 hours ago, JonnyF said:

Then they'll be free to roam across the schengen area into countries that oppose the plan.

As I have explained before. In terms of rights and the ability to 'roam', there are differences between being a resident of an EU member state and being a citizen. As a resident an individual is limited to living and working in ONE EU country, whereas a citizen can live and work in any EU country

I really don't understand why you find this so difficult to comprehend.

8 hours ago, JonnyF said:

But hey who cares what they think. Its not like the EU ever pretended to be democratic anyway.

But hey, it's not like that statement has any relevance or veracity.

22 minutes ago, bannork said:

So which groups ' spread like a wet turd' to quote you?

Really????

I mentioned a turd and you thought.of Africans? 😀

Might want to check that unconscious bias.

I wouldn't volunteer for any word association games if I were you.

14 minutes ago, RayC said:

You really should read and try to comprehend the link I provided, Jonathan:

Individuals become eligible for Spanish citizenship after:

"2 years: For citizens of Ibero-American countries, Portugal, Andorra, the Philippines, or Equatorial Guinea

1 year: For individuals who:

• Were born in Spain

• Have been married to a Spanish citizen for at least one year

• Are widows or widowers of Spanish nationals

• Were legally adopted by a Spanish citizen (if over 18)

• Are descendants of Spanish nationals, including grandchildren"

If only there weren't so many adopted, widowed, Andorran refugees of Spanish descent who (re)married to a Spanish citizen knocking around then there wouldn't be an illegal immigration problem in Europe.

What are the Spanish government thinking of opening the floodgates to those sort of people?!

As I have explained before. In terms of rights and the ability to 'roam', there are differences between being a resident of an EU member state and being a citizen. As a resident an individual is limited to living and working in ONE EU country, whereas a citizen can live and work in any EU country

I really don't understand why you find this so difficult to comprehend.

But hey, it's not like that statement has any relevance or veracity.

Like I said.

2 years for citizenship for many countries.

After that full ability to roam under schengen.

Everything I said was correct. No need to repeat me again Raymond.

3 minutes ago, JonnyF said:

Like I said.

2 years for citizenship for many countries.

And as I inferred, greater than 2 years for the overwhelming majority of countries

3 minutes ago, JonnyF said:

After that full ability to roam under schengen.

Indeed. So you would limit the rights of Spanish citizens to travel around the EU?

3 minutes ago, JonnyF said:

Everything I said was correct. No need to repeat me again Raymond.

Everything I said was also correct, Jonathan.

Of course, everyone knows that your regular tirades about immigration are directed at citizens of Ibero-American countries, Portugal, Andorra, the Philippines and Equatorial Guinea attempting to illegally enter Spain.

If only there weren't so many of these groups, Europe would be a better place.

21 minutes ago, JonnyF said:

Really????

I mentioned a turd and you thought.of Africans? 😀

Might want to check that unconscious bias.

I wouldn't volunteer for any word association games if I were you.

No, I didn't say Africans.

You described the influx of migrants into Europe as 'spreading like a wet turd' so I'll ask you again, ' Which migrant ethnic groups do you consider are 'spreading like a wet turd' over Europe?

Why do people quibble over the timeline for citizenship? Two years? Five years? Twenty years? Irrelevant. One million plus is a forgone conclusion--it will likely be many, many more--and once inside the facts on the ground will mean a permanent open breach for the rest of the world to enter Spain and then Europe. Any political will to say no will crumble. Say what you will, Raspail outlined the future, our present, to a Tee.

4 hours ago, ronnie50 said:

Wouldn't you rather live in Spain than Ol 'Blighty if you were a migrant? I sure would.

It still mystifies me why so many of them want to go to the UK...

The social protection programmes, like health care and welafre, are pretty similar across most Western European countries. I don't think Britain's is any better than the others. Why England??

Ai, Reynaldo jauna. Oso ondo pasatuko duzu Espainian: beroan lo egiten, garagardo ahula edaten eta izterretik moztutako urdaiazpikoa jaten.

Because of the language, obviously. 1 in 4 of the global population was ruled by the gracious hand of the British. Tribal memory lingers.

12 hours ago, Roadsternut said:

Ai, Reynaldo jauna. Oso ondo pasatuko duzu Espainian: beroan lo egiten, garagardo ahula edaten eta izterretik moztutako urdaiazpikoa jaten.

Because of the language, obviously. 1 in 4 of the global population was ruled by the gracious hand of the British. Tribal memory lingers.

Yes, but I don't think the majority of those migrants turning up in Britain are proficient (at all) in English. But they somehow think that's the place to go - it's obviously being 'marketed' to them. The people smuggling is a profitable organized criminal enterprise.

On 7/2/2026 at 4:54 PM, RayC said:

And as I inferred, greater than 2 years for the overwhelming majority of countries

Indeed. So you would limit the rights of Spanish citizens to travel around the EU?

Everything I said was also correct, Jonathan.

Of course, everyone knows that your regular tirades about immigration are directed at citizens of Ibero-American countries, Portugal, Andorra, the Philippines and Equatorial Guinea attempting to illegally enter Spain.

If only there weren't so many of these groups, Europe would be a better place.

Europe would be better with minimal/zero immigration.

There are very few benefits. A plethora of drawbacks.

It is destroying what used to be the best place in the world.

But you don't care because you lived the good times and wont see the mess your liberal idiocy left for others.

Classic selfish #bekind boomer liberal pulling up the ladder behind them.

On 7/2/2026 at 5:04 PM, bannork said:

No, I didn't say Africans.

You described the influx of migrants into Europe as 'spreading like a wet turd' so I'll ask you again, ' Which migrant ethnic groups do you consider are 'spreading like a wet turd' over Europe?

I don't care about their ethnicity.

Identity politics is a liberal game I refuse to play.

The fact you thought I was referring to Africans when i used the word turd shows your racism/unconscious bias not mine.

#exposed

14 minutes ago, JonnyF said:

I don't care about their ethnicity.

Identity politics is a liberal game I refuse to play.

The fact you thought I was referring to Africans when i used the word turd shows your racism/unconscious bias not mine.

#exposed

So who are you referring to when you describe all migrants to Spain as a wet turd?

Everyone who is not Spanish?

7 minutes ago, bannork said:

So who are you referring to when you describe all migrants to Spain as a wet turd?

Everyone who is not Spanish?

Criminals who break into a country illegally.

But more importantly why did you associate turds with Africans? Seems you have some deep seated issues there Bro. Might want to get that checked out or at least not make your prejudice so obvious.

3 hours ago, JonnyF said:

Criminals who break into a country illegally.

But more importantly why did you associate turds with Africans? Seems you have some deep seated issues there Bro. Might want to get that checked out or at least not make your prejudice so obvious.

Your words-

Once the unknown unchecked dross has been legalised they'll be free to travel wherever they like in schengen. They'll spread around Europe like a turd dropped from the 50th floor.

They're not free to work in other EU countries even when registered legally in Spain, though it's true other EU countries are furious with Spain.

Your vile description of migrant workers in Spain is no better than Nazis comparing Jews to rats.

5 hours ago, JonnyF said:

Europe would be better with minimal/zero immigration.

There are very few benefits. A plethora of drawbacks.

But presumably Thailand reaps multiple benefits from the presence of immigrants with similar views to yourself?

(Oh that's right. You're not an immigrant🤦)

5 hours ago, JonnyF said:

It is destroying what used to be the best place in the world.

Wrt Thailand I'm sure that some Thais agree with that sentiment.

5 hours ago, JonnyF said:

But you don't care because you lived the good times and wont see the mess your liberal idiocy left for others.

Yes I was lucky to be born at the right time. I don't envy youngsters today.

Better my 'liberal idiocy' which hopefully in some small way made immigrants feel welcome, rather than your narrow-minded, aggressive, bigoted hostility which brings nothing but division and aliernates people.

5 hours ago, JonnyF said:

Classic selfish #bekind boomer liberal pulling up the ladder behind them.

Listen to the altruist who does nothing but criticise and moan about the state of the UK (and the rest of Europe) from his position as an immigrant based 6,000 miles away.

Poor white trash comments from losers who can't compete with superior immigrants. Don't come to Thailand.