How Rich Thais View Poor

[zzdocxx]

So can I take it that there is not generally agreement on this topic by the members posting on this thread?

[Prakanong]

What do you mean there are no social norms?

Thais wai eachother when they meet. Farangs are expected to follow certain rules, too. Do not bring a whore to your office functions. If you are a whore, do not pretend to be a hi so.

Problem is a lot of the hi so families started of as whores.

How does a whore pretend to be hi so - because she wants to shop in the Emporium and buy designer clothes?

Does it depend on class of whore.

I am glad I do not live in your world - what were you back in the UK - same as now or are you re-invented?

[BADBRAD]

Somtam - minimum respect for a hooker should be somewhat below a VIP customer treatment, don't you agree?

Tawp - it could have been an error of judgement. We assume that the girl in question was indeed a bar girl with her customer (or former customer, if you wish).

Don't agree with you on the first point (I will decide for myself what the minimum amount of respect due to an individual by me is and it will rarely be determined by how they make their money if they aren't hurting anyone) and why are we assuming the second, because the blogger did? Assuming things is a good way to make mistakes and assuming something is true because someone else assumed it was true, well......

[canadiangirl]

Problem is a lot of the hi so families started of as whores.

An interesting claim.

Examples, please.

Edited September 20, 2007 by canadiangirl

[Prakanong]

Prostitution is big here, but it's never in your face until a farang is involved. By sitting in Nana for weeks they think that the rest of the country is just the same and prostitution is an honorable occupation Thai girls are proud of. It is not.

Who in his right mind would take a stripper to a shopping mall and buy her designer clothes? Why some people think it's ok to do it here?

Exactly.

Does no one see a link between these "who gives a shit what Thais think? I'm going to do whatever I feel like doing -- if people are offended, they are obviously racist/snobs/stuck-up bitches/jealous" attitudes -- and the other endless moans about "why is Thailand becoming so anti-farang? Why are do the visa regulations get worse and worse? Why are they making it so hard to stay here?"

So where is it the accepted norm that a girl the blogger thought was poor or had been a bar girl (or as) can not shop in the Emporium?

Get reall - you are talking bloody daftness here - they accept cold blooded murderers (and their decendants) shopping there but a poor girl no - if your morals are down their with that <deleted> you are in a very bad place.

Not so hard to stay there if you get a proper job with its accompanying WP and Visa.

It only hard for those outside the retirement group, genuine workers and those supporting families - if you do not fall into that then hard cheese mate.

[Prakanong]

Problem is a lot of the hi so families started of as whores.

An interesting claim.

Examples, please.

Read a bit of history

Concubines and courtesans and favourite mistreses - only with the guy for money was one of your definitions I beleive!

[canadiangirl]

Problem is a lot of the hi so families started of as whores.

An interesting claim.

Examples, please.

Read a bit of history

You're the one making this rather derogatory claim. I'd assume you could prove it.

[solo siam]

Problem is a lot of the hi so families started of as whores.

An interesting claim.

Examples, please.

Read a bit of history

Concubines and courtesans and favourite mistreses - only with the guy for money was one of your definitions I beleive!

Which families?

[Acquiesce]

Read her blog and replace in your mind the foreigner for being a black man, and the girl Jewish. You would be lucky not to get locked up if you wrote it.

Last time I looked there wasn't a sign on the door of any shop saying there was a social status requirement for foreigners buying things for Thai girls. For christsake, she could have been his wife.

Spot on somtaam.

[Prakanong]

Problem is a lot of the hi so families started of as whores.

An interesting claim.

Examples, please.

Read a bit of history

Concubines and courtesans and favourite mistreses - only with the guy for money was one of your definitions I beleive!

Which families?

So none of the current hi so's ancestors were not concubines or favourite mistresses?

Get real

[Prakanong]

Read her blog and replace in your mind the foreigner for being a black man, and the girl Jewish. You would be lucky not to get locked up if you wrote it.

Last time I looked there wasn't a sign on the door of any shop saying there was a social status requirement for foreigners buying things for Thai girls. For christsake, she could have been his wife.

Spot on somtaam.

But is not the social norm here ROFLMAO

It amazing how some newbie johnny copme lately's in ThaiVisa set themselves up as Miss Manners in all things Thai - you would think they wrote the book on Thai eitiquete.

Problem is they were probably no marks back home in the UK or wherever and re-invent themselves in Thailand.

[canadiangirl]

Problem is a lot of the hi so families started of as whores.

An interesting claim.

Examples, please.

Read a bit of history

Concubines and courtesans and favourite mistreses - only with the guy for money was one of your definitions I beleive!

Which families?

So none of the current hi so's ancestors were not concubines or favourite mistresses?

Get real

I'm still waiting for examples. You seem to have more insults than cold hard facts.

Edited September 20, 2007 by canadiangirl

[CarlBkk]

Not all hi-so families came from Royal concubines. There are many big names here that stem from business success, politics, science and art. Can we really hold a grudge against someone who's great great grandfather did something heinous, and through default they were born into money? It doesn't mean that there is an evil/immoral gene passed down.

Sometimes you just have to pity the hi-so set here: it's a mixture of trying to maintain respect within their own culture, which often means throwing money around/being condescending and also copying Western hi-so personalities. They end up looking like mutton dressed as lamb from a Dynasty TV series with a personality just as replusive. Very few have admirable class, but within this Thai society they are still respected. Western countries would have pushed them into a lonely corner a long time ago.

Also don't confuse hi-so with wannabe hi-so. There are plenty of the latter around. Mia Nois, Ratchada girls, social climbers may all love to appear wealthy, white and beautiful in their tight shorts and high heels shopping in Paragon with their heads held high and aloof expression but when they get home they may not always have the perfect life that it may seem on the outside. It's all about show.

Canadagirl said: "Does no one see a link between these "who gives a shit what Thais think? I'm going to do whatever I feel like doing -- if people are offended, they are obviously racist/snobs/stuck-up bitches/jealous" attitudes -- and the other endless moans about "why is Thailand becoming so anti-farang? Why are do the visa regulations get worse and worse? Why are they making it so hard to stay here?" "

Couldn't agree more. The girl blogger said out loud that the couple were basically an eyesore. You don't have to be rich to think that...just as many lower class Thais and farangs would have thought the same.

[solo siam]

Problem is a lot of the hi so families started of as whores.

An interesting claim.

Examples, please.

Read a bit of history

Concubines and courtesans and favourite mistreses - only with the guy for money was one of your definitions I beleive!

Which families?

So none of the current hi so's ancestors were not concubines or favourite mistresses?

Get real

I don't know, you made the claim - I'm waiting to see the facts to back it up. I coul dunderstand a few families coming from this sort of background just as they do around the world, but you claimed a lot of them and quoted 'history', I would also like to read that history if you have a link.

[Acquiesce]

The Patpongpanich family are one of the richest families in Thailand and you don't here them complaining about it.

[Prakanong]

Not all hi-so families came from Royal concubines. There are many big names here that stem from business success, politics, science and art. Can we really hold a grudge against someone who's great great grandfather did something heinous, and through default they were born into money? It doesn't mean that there is an evil/immoral gene passed down.

Sometimes you just have to pity the hi-so set here: it's a mixture of trying to maintain respect within their own culture, which often means throwing money around/being condescending and also copying Western hi-so personalities. They end up looking like mutton dressed as lamb from a Dynasty TV series with a personality just as replusive. Very few have admirable class, but within this Thai society they are still respected. Western countries would have pushed them into a lonely corner a long time ago.

Also don't confuse hi-so with wannabe hi-so. There are plenty of the latter around. Mia Nois, Ratchada girls, social climbers may all love to appear wealthy, white and beautiful in their tight shorts and high heels shopping in Paragon with their heads held high and aloof expression but when they get home they may not always have the perfect life that it may seem on the outside. It's all about show.

Canadagirl said: "Does no one see a link between these "who gives a shit what Thais think? I'm going to do whatever I feel like doing -- if people are offended, they are obviously racist/snobs/stuck-up bitches/jealous" attitudes -- and the other endless moans about "why is Thailand becoming so anti-farang? Why are do the visa regulations get worse and worse? Why are they making it so hard to stay here?" "

Couldn't agree more. The girl blogger said out loud that the couple were basically an eyesore. You don't have to be rich to think that...just as many lower class Thais and farangs would have thought the same.

Of course not all Hi So families came from concubines etc - whoever said they did but they are there.

The blogger comes from a really nice family though does she not?

As for eyesore - in whose eyes?

[Prakanong]

Problem is a lot of the hi so families started of as whores.

An interesting claim.

Examples, please.

Read a bit of history

Concubines and courtesans and favourite mistreses - only with the guy for money was one of your definitions I beleive!

Which families?

So none of the current hi so's ancestors were not concubines or favourite mistresses?

Get real

I'm still waiting for examples. You seem to have more insults than cold hard facts.

As I said, "Read a book" about Thai history

Edited September 20, 2007 by Prakanong

[canadiangirl]

Problem is a lot of the hi so families started of as whores.

An interesting claim.

Examples, please.

Read a bit of history

Concubines and courtesans and favourite mistreses - only with the guy for money was one of your definitions I beleive!

Which families?

So none of the current hi so's ancestors were not concubines or favourite mistresses?

Get real

I'm still waiting for examples. You seem to have more insults than cold hard facts.

As I said, "Read a book" about Thai history

Well, if you had "Read a book" about Thai history, maybe you could name me some examples. In the meantime, maybe stick to arguments you might be able to back up?

[t.s]

Because people in Singapore actually have some manners and are not obsessed with one upmanship. And everyone wonders why this country is slowly splitting itself, Bangkok versus the rest.

We go shopping everywhere we like. It is strange how our lifestyle evolved, it definitely wasn't intentional just sort of ended up that way. Thailand is so superficial there is nothing to be done to stop the looks.

good god, surely you jest.

[Prakanong]

Problem is a lot of the hi so families started of as whores.

An interesting claim.

Examples, please.

Read a bit of history

Concubines and courtesans and favourite mistreses - only with the guy for money was one of your definitions I beleive!

Which families?

So none of the current hi so's ancestors were not concubines or favourite mistresses?

Get real

I'm still waiting for examples. You seem to have more insults than cold hard facts.

As I said, "Read a book" about Thai history

Well, if you had "Read a book" about Thai history, maybe you could name me some examples. In the meantime, maybe stick to arguments you might be able to back up?

so you are saying no current Hi So families did not get their surname or whatever by being concubines or mistresses?

You want to work in this region? - better understand it first

Look at some of the Chinese famlies - left wives in China and had their Thai mistresses before bringing all the other familiy over.

Not just Thailand - all over the region

Then there are the family we can notspeak about here - read a book

[IMA_FARANG]

Check out this post in the rich Thai girl blog "Oh! See what the Cat drags in!" This so-called "journalist" (she seems to write for BK Magazine, but can't even get the name of her own blog right) has a terrible encounter with the country's lower classes and survies to tell about it.

What's really interesting is that this girl is the direct descendant of Thailand's cruelest and most infamous military dictator (and that's saying something) -- Thanom Kittikachorn.

<link removed>

Out in Emporium buying expensive shoes for her mommy, she has a self-described "bitch moment" when confronted with a farang and a prostitute... who have the audacity to be shopping in the same store as her! She goes on to describe prostitutes as "toilets" and can't understand why anybody would want to be seen with such awful creatures.

When she gets a scolding in the comments the best she can come up with is a cruel "me no speaky English" bar-girl style mockery. Totally unable to address the issue.

Great from an anthropological perspective: we get to see how the country's elite, a child of the most vile, murdering rapist of the land, really thinks of the lower castes.

Some years ago an American friend of mine was getting his Thai wife through the U.S. visa process in the American embessy in BKK. His wife was an ex-bargirl, they had been married several years and he had lived and worked in Thailand for that time. He told me that the most predjudiced people in the embessy were the educated Thais that worked there. He thought a lot of it had to do with jealousy, these women knew that they were unlikely to get a chance to marry a forieigner and go abroad, but they had to handle the paperwork for the girls they knew were bargirls that had found a foriegn man, and they were jealous of that fact.

Yes there is a strain of "eliteism" in Thai society. People from "upcountry" are often looked down upon by city people. If you are "dark" you are not the equal of a whiter skinned Thai. If your family had the money to send you to an private international school, you are clearly the superior of a person who went through Thai public schools. And so on.

You may not realise it but 40 years ago someone from "upcountry" was regarded as a country bumpkin to most upper-class city Thais. The King and Queen were among the first to establish services and a place where these "upcountry" types could work and sell their products. Once the King and Queen were seen as taking an interest in the welfare of these people, it became socially fashionable for the wealthy Thai upper-class to also take an interest in Issan or "upcountry" farmers.

[canadiangirl]

so you are saying no current Hi So families did not get their surname or whatever by being concubines or mistresses?

No -- I'm saying if you want to make a claim like that -- it's up to you to back it up with actual information -- you know -- that little detail that distinguishes real arguments from random bulls-?

[Prakanong]

so you are saying no current Hi So families did not get their surname or whatever by being concubines or mistresses?

No -- I'm saying if you want to make a claim like that -- it's up to you to back it up with actual information -- you know -- that little detail that distinguishes real arguments from random bulls-?

So if you are not saying that then you accept it - thank you I always had faith in reality creeping in

PS: Read the book yet that can not be named - might be a fe clues n there

Ever been shopping to certain department stores - interviews with the founder familiy's in Hi So magazines (or wannabee ie Thailand Tatler)decendants talk of the Chinese wives and Thai mistresses - all together in the same group now are they not?

[Prakanong]

so you are saying no current Hi So families did not get their surname or whatever by being concubines or mistresses?

No -- I'm saying if you want to make a claim like that -- it's up to you to back it up with actual information -- you know -- that little detail that distinguishes real arguments from random bulls-?

I believe that he is hinting at that it cannot be discussed here due to forum rules!

The light, the light

[canadiangirl]

so you are saying no current Hi So families did not get their surname or whatever by being concubines or mistresses?

No -- I'm saying if you want to make a claim like that -- it's up to you to back it up with actual information -- you know -- that little detail that distinguishes real arguments from random bulls-?

So if you are not saying that then you accept it.

Ha! As if. Nice try.

[CarlBkk]

We don't have to mention the book if it risks getting this thread closed, but we can mention family names and quotes I'm sure (so long as it's not the Royal family directly). Am I right?

[Prakanong]

We don't have to mention the book if it risks getting this thread closed, but we can mention family names and quotes I'm sure (so long as it's not the Royal family directly). Am I right?

How many concubines and unofficial wives did certain people have say about 100-120 years ago?

Its no different from Europe actually!

[t.s]

But is not the social norm here ROFLMAO

It amazing how some newbie johnny copme lately's in ThaiVisa set themselves up as Miss Manners in all things Thai - you would think they wrote the book on Thai eitiquete.

Problem is they were probably no marks back home in the UK or wherever and re-invent themselves in Thailand.

while i think you are all full of it, this takes the cake. "newbie johnnie come lately's". how superior do you need to feel to post crap like that? does your 2000+ posts really make you an authority on anything but wasting time?

i lived in thailand for 8 years before iposted on thai visa? am i a johnny come lately too?

you are the epitomie if the ignorant expat, you and your assumed superiority.

Edited September 20, 2007 by t.s

[Prakanong]

But is not the social norm here ROFLMAO

It amazing how some newbie johnny copme lately's in ThaiVisa set themselves up as Miss Manners in all things Thai - you would think they wrote the book on Thai eitiquete.

Problem is they were probably no marks back home in the UK or wherever and re-invent themselves in Thailand.

while i think you are all full of it, this takes the cake. "newbie johnnie come lately's". how superior do you need to feel to post crap like that? does your 2000+ posts really make you an authority on anything but wasting time?

i lived in thailand for 8 years before iposted on thai visa? am i a johnny come lately too?

you are the epitomie if the ignorant expat, you and your assumed superiority.

Got a bite there

[Plus]

Lots of "hi so" families had mistresses and concubines somewhere up their tree. What does it prove? A mistress is not a prostitute. She is in a relationship with one man and fully depends on his support, she usually has children from that man, too. How can you compare that to a whore who entices every one to stick his dick into any orifice of his choice in exchange for a few coins?

If you can find a family that descended from prostitutes and prove that it was a norm and they didn't hide that fact, go ahead.

I hope the language wasn't too offending, but it's not about flowers and romance.