All Mixed Up!

[NaiGreg]

Hello all,

I try to learn at least one or two distinctions in Thai synonyms per week.

Today, my Thai wife (who read/writes/speaks English well) tried to explain the difference between pa-som and s'lap (sorry, I don't have my Thai keyboard handy) but she really wasn't confident in her answer.

Consider:

To MIX: (I am mixing ingredients in a bowl) ... use pa-som

To MIX: ("Sometime I mix Thai sentences and English sentences in the same conversation") ... use s'lap (to alternate ?)

Can anyone help out here? I guess you could say I am mixed-up

[meadish_sweetball]

Mary Haas' Student's Dictionary says:

phasom

ผสม (phasom) Verb 1. 'to mix, blend' 2. 'to breed' (animals) 3. biol. 'to cross, crossbreed'

เก็บเล็กผสมน้อย elab. colloq. 'to save up little by little'

ของผสม (khawng phasom) chem. phys. 'mixture'

ผสมพันธุ์ (phasom phan) 'to breed'

salab

สลับ to alternate

"Salab kan" can be used to mean "switch/trade places".

[username2004]

Hello NaiGreg and all:

To MIX: ("Sometime I mix Thai sentences and English sentences in the same conversation") ... use s'lap (to alternate ?)

I'd use "ปน": ผมพูดอังกฤษปนไทย (pom pood ung-glid pon Thai = I mix Thai sentences and English sentences in the same conversation).

Pon (ปน) = to mix

===

สลับ (s'lap) can also be used if you mean "you have to translate from one language to another in a conference, forum, meeting, etc, so that everyone in the conference understands what's being said."

[NaiGreg]

Thanks!

I have a very good Thai-English dictionary (Domnern-Sathienpong) but I really need a good English-Thai dictionary (so I won't post so many easy look-ups here )

Can anyone recommend a good one? Is the Mary Haas dictionary the best?

By "good" I mean easy-to-read, reliable, up-to-date, and weighs less than a turian .

Thanks again.

[Johpa]

Can anyone recommend a good one? Is the Mary Haas dictionary the best?

By "good" I mean easy-to-read, reliable, up-to-date, and weighs less than a turian .

The Haas dictionary is the best, without peer, Thai-to-English dictionary authored. It is not up to date having been written in the 1960s, and it does weigh something close to a Durian. But it is easy to read and it defines reliability. It is pricey at around $60 on Amazon and it is not always in stock. For any serious student of Thai it is essential to have this tome.

[RamdomChances]

Just a quick comment, when we artificaly inseminate our cows, it's refered to as "pa-som tium"

Which I think literally translates into something like "breed man made"

[snowleopard]

Hello all,

I try to learn at least one or two distinctions in Thai synonyms per week.

Today, my Thai wife (who read/writes/speaks English well) tried to explain the difference between pa-som and s'lap (sorry, I don't have my Thai keyboard handy) but she really wasn't confident in her answer.

Consider:

To MIX: (I am mixing ingredients in a bowl) ... use pa-som

To MIX: ("Sometime I mix Thai sentences and English sentences in the same conversation") ... use s'lap (to alternate ?)

Can anyone help out here? I guess you could say I am mixed-up 

Today, my Thai wife (who read/writes/speaks English well) tried to explain the difference between pa-som and s'lap

To MIX: (I am mixing ingredients in a bowl) ... use pa-som

To MIX: ("Sometime I mix Thai sentences and English sentences in the same conversation") ... use s'lap (to alternate ?)

Can anyone help out here? I guess you could say I am mixed-up 

Hi there NaiGreg,

I think the words "mix" and "alternate" describe very different concepts which aren't so closely related!

Let's look at the different definitions and what they might mean in Thai,shall we?

The verb "mix" with some of its various meanings:

1: to combine or blend into one mass=ผสม (pa-som);ปรุง (prohng);ปน (pon)

2: to combine with another=รวมกัน (roo-am gun);นำมารวมกัน (nahm mah roo-am gun)

3: to bring into close association (if compatible)= ประสานกัน (pra-saan gun);ingest;blend=กลืน (gleun);assimilate,blend together=กลมกลืน (glom-gleun)

4: to form by mixing components= ประกอบ (pra-gohp);เชื่อมต่อเข้าด้วยกัน (cheu-am dtoh kaow doo-ay gun)

5: to confuse=สับสน (sahp-son);ผสมปนเปกัน (pa-som pon-pae gun);งง (ngong)

6: to associate=รู้จักเป็นเพื่อนกัน (roo-jahk phen peu-an gun); รวมกลุ่ม (roo-ahm gluhm);ซึ่งเกี่ยวเนื่อง (sing gee-o neu-ang)

7.to crossbreed=ผสมข้ามพันธุ์ (pa-som kaam pun)

8.to participate=ร่วมมือ (roo-am meau);มีส่วนร่วม (mee so-an roo-am);เข้าร่วม (kaow roo-am);เกี่ยวข้อง (gee-o koong)

The noun "mix" with some of its various meanings:

1: the process of mixing=วิธีการผสม (we-tee-gahn pa-som);กระบวนการผสม (kra-boo-an gahn pa-som)

2: a mixture,a mix=ของผสม (korng pa-som);ส่วนผสม (soo-an pa-som);สิ่งที่ได้จากการผสม (sing tee dai jahk gahn pa-som)

3:a combination of different things=การรวมกัน (gahn roo-am gun);การผสมกัน (gahn pa-som gun); การปนกัน (gahn pon gun)

Some menings of "alternate:

1:to follow in turns;rotate=ทำให้สลับกัน (tum hai sa-lahp gun);ผลัดกัน (plaht gun)

2:an alternate,a reserve=สำรอง (sahm-rong)

3:every alternate one=หนึ่งเว้นหนึ่ง (neung waen neung)

4:an alternative;an alternate= ที่เป็นตัวเลือก (tee phen dtoo-ah leu-ahk)

Hope we are wiser now!

Cheers.

Snowleopard.

[bina]

thanx random, because that's what we are going to be doing in two weeks to our goats and i was trying to explain the whole deal to my worker... couldnt find the words.... (AIn.) also i could say was : Ya hormone , nam pu tschai (hormone med. and male's water) because he kept asking when i'm bringing a male to breed with or 'mai mi baby' next spring because the male i have is the son of a brother and sister...so no good for breeding this time round.

I think what random and i need are a whole lexicon of animal related jargon in thai (i need issan thai)

[RamdomChances]

Hi Bina, nearly missed your reply

While I can speak nearly fluent "Farm" Thai, I cant speak any "Issan" they don't speak it around here, its central thai here's as few they should be able to understand Central even if they prefer to speak Issan.

Pegnant = mi tong

Female = dtua mia so female goat "pae dtua mia"

Male/bull = dtua poo

Young Female= saow

Goat = pae (the e is a really short sount a bit like pair without the "r")

Sheep = gae

Cow = wua

Breeding

AI = ba-som tiam

Semen = nam chua

On heat = Ben sat

Semen = nam chua

To let the bull inseminate = hi dtua tam ba-som ing (sort of) or ba-som tam-a-chard (breed naturaly)

Parts of the body

Leg = kar

Hoof = leab (can always use "new" nail if that fails)

Nerve = sen

Vein/artery = sen luat or luad

Blood = luat or luad

Horn = chow (same basic sound as rice, white, mountian,enter but all with different tones)

Head =hua

Eye = dtaa

Liver = die

Kidney = dap

Heart = hua jai

Intestines = sai

Skin = nang

Medical

Mastitis = Dtow nom ak-sep ( do goats get this?)

Wound = Pear (dont roll the "r")

Fever = Khai

Milk fever = Khai nom (dont know if goats get this or just cows)

Have a cold = Ben wat

Infection = ak-sep (inflamation)

Hurt = jep (when talking about hoofs they always use jep toaw(foot))

Inject medicen= Cheet yaa

Tablet = yaa met

Medicen = yaa

Swolen = buam

Parisite = Pie-at

Vet = moor ( Docter I know it's not the correct term, cant remember what is but no one uses it enless in formal situations anyway)

Anyway tried my best to approximate the sound, but writing in english is very limited, prehaps one of the good guys will write the thai in then you can print it off and get some help with the pronouncation.

A lot of the above are not the correct words but are what people generally use

(anyone who has a farm and works with thai people everyday feel free to disagree )

[bina]

fantastic!!!

but yes, could use the list in thai script for pronounciation. i also get corrected by different thai according to their area of origin.:

fang: hay

fiang: hay (issan)

so i must really sound like a chao na from nongkhai which is a laugh for many of the thai i meet in other kibbutzim and moshavim.

and yes they get both eclampsia (milk fever) and also toxemia/ketosis (twins disease) which they get in last part of pregnancy if they have more than one baby. mastitis less because i hand milk so no germ back up from the suction tubes and i have gentle hands! goats 'let down' better if they know you.

if you have any more animals oriented farm words, great!!!

[Richard W]

Cow = wua

This one is งัว in Lao as opposed to the วัว of Standard Thai. They're different simplifications of งวัว, which may survive in some parts.

[Richard W]

Hi Bina, nearly missed your reply

While I can speak nearly fluent "Farm" Thai, I cant speak any "Issan" they don't speak it around here, its central thai here's as few they should be able to understand Central even if they prefer to speak Issan.

Pegnant = mi tong

Female = dtua mia so female goat "pae dtua mia"

Male/bull = dtua poo

Young Female= saow

Goat = pae (the e is a really short sount a bit like pair without the "r")

Sheep = gae

Cow = wua

Breeding

AI = ba-som tiam

Semen = nam chua

On heat = Ben sat

Semen = nam chua

To let the bull inseminate = hi dtua tam ba-som ing (sort of) or ba-som tam-a-chard (breed naturaly)

Parts of the body

Leg = kar

Hoof = leab (can always use "new" nail if that fails)

Nerve = sen

Vein/artery = sen luat or luad

Blood = luat or luad

Horn = chow (same basic sound as rice, white, mountian,enter but all with different tones)

Head =hua

Eye = dtaa

Liver = die

Kidney = dap

Heart = hua jai

Intestines = sai

Skin = nang

Medical

Mastitis = Dtow nom ak-sep ( do goats get this?)

Wound = Pear (dont roll the "r")

Fever = Khai

Milk fever = Khai nom (dont know if goats get this or just cows)

Have a cold = Ben wat

Infection = ak-sep (inflamation)

Hurt = jep (when talking about hoofs they always use jep toaw(foot))

Inject medicen= Cheet yaa

Tablet = yaa met

Medicen = yaa

Swolen = buam

Parisite = Pie-at

Vet = moor ( Docter I know it's not the correct term, cant remember what is but no one uses it enless in formal situations anyway)

Anyway tried my best to approximate the sound, but writing in english is very limited, prehaps one of the good guys will write the thai in then you can print it off and get some help with the pronouncation.

A lot of the above are not the correct words but are what people generally use

(anyone who has a farm and works with thai people everyday feel free to disagree )

I'll have a go at spelling them out:

Pegnant = mi tong มี ท้อง (polite form, for people, is มี ครรภ์)

Female = dtua mia so female goat "pae dtua mia" แพะ ตัว เมีย

Male/bull = dtua poo ตัว ผู้

Young Female= saow สาว

Goat = pae (the e is a really short sount a bit like pair without the "r") แพะ

Sheep = gae แกะ

Cow = wua วัว (also งัว, even in Standard Thai)

Breeding

AI = ba-som tiam

- I think this is ผสม เทียม - but I would then expect to see 'pa-som', not 'ba-som'.

Semen = nam chua

- I think this one is น้ำ ชั่ว literally 'wicked water'.

On heat = Ben sat

- One for the experts! I'd guess เป็น สัตว์ 'be an animal', but I may very easily be wrong on this one. - Richard.

Semen = nam chua

To let the bull inseminate = hi dtua tam ba-som ing (sort of) or ba-som tam-a-chard (breed naturaly)

ให้ ตัว ทำ ผสม เอง / ธรรมชาติ

Parts of the body

Leg = kar ขา

Hoof = leab (can always use "new" nail if that fails)

I'm confused here. The words I know are:

นิ้ว /niu/ = finger, toe

เล็บ /lep/ = nail

Nerve = sen เส็น

Vein/artery = sen luat or luad

artery = เส็น เลือด แดง

vein = เส็น เลือด ดำ

Blood = luat or luad เลือด (also unrelated โลหิต)

Horn = chow (same basic sound as rice, white, mountian,enter but all with different tones) เขา

Head =hua หัว

Eye = dtaa ตา

Liver = die

Kidney = dap

Transposition here!

liver = dtap ตับ

kidney = dtie ไต

Heart = hua jai หัว ใจ

Intestines = sai ใส้

Skin = nang หนัง

Medical

Mastitis = Dtow nom ak-sep ( do goats get this?) เต้า นม อักเสบ

Wound = Pear (dont roll the "r") แผล /phlae/

Fever = Khai ไข้

Milk fever = Khai nom (dont know if goats get this or just cows) ไข้ นม

Have a cold = Ben wat เป็น หวัด

Infection = ak-sep (inflamation) อักเสบ

Hurt = jep (when talking about hoofs they always use jep toaw(foot)) เจ็บ เท้า

Inject medicen= Cheet yaa ฉีด ยา

Tablet = yaa met ยา เม็ด

Medicen = yaa ยา

Swolen = buam บวม

Parisite = Pie-at พยาธิ

Vet = moor หมอ

Posh word for 'vet' is สัตวแพทย์ /sat wa phaet/, literally 'one versed in the knowledge about animals', if one pushes it back to Sanskrit.

[RamdomChances]

Thanks Richard I take back everything I've said about you

I really am going to have to learn to write Thai, trying to answer anything in english without knowing the Thai spelling is very hit and miss!!

Ok pa-som not ba-som, say them quick and they sound the same, how about bpa-som??

I'd translate 'ben sat" to "be animal" as well, I've asked before ansd this is correct.

You are right Lep= nail= hoof (had a bit of a typo there)

artery = เส็น เลือด แดง= sen luad deng (red)

vein = เส็น เลือด ดำ= sen luad dam (black)

Thas right but generally no one uses them

Vet thas right another one i've heard is "sat da-wa phaet" nearly the same.

Anyway cheers

Just curious, can you speak thai, or are you more interested in the writen language, its origines ect, do you deal with languages professionaly ect

Think I put a thread in about that.

Cheers RC

[bina]

thanx!

i'm starting to write basic instructions for the thai workers as visas finish etc.they change place within a few days, i want to write a basic checklist cause most of the daily work they remember, also seasonal stuff, but medical changes, feeding changes etc, i have to write (i have in three languages hebrew arabic and english) for all staff as they change around also. someone on some moshav did that once for hot house flower growers but it was hand written and difficult (they also wrote the hebrew in transliterated thai which was hilarious as it was a thai who did it and half the words were incorrect.

i copy and paste the words etc and then add pics for any one who cant read (work with all sorts from many places!)

more animal / vet jargon would be appreciated.

actually Sompong does use the words: artery = เส็น เลือด แดง= sen luad deng (red)

vein = เส็น เลือด ดำ= sen luad dam (black)

BTW PUT PICS IN THE PICTURE PLACE IN FORUM; WILL ATTEMPT TO PUT PICS OF US WITH ANIMALS BUT NOT SURE IF ON DIGITAL OR NOT.

[Richard W]

Ok pa-som not ba-som, say them quick and they sound the same, how about bpa-som??

It's a Khmer word in origin, and they also spell it with ผ. However, I suspect the Khmer pronunciation was /phsam/, which they may not have distinguished from /psam/. There's a similar word of Khmer origin, ผสาน (proper Thai pronunciation /pha saan/), which seems to have been replaced, in spelling at least, by ประสาน /bpra saan/ 'settle, compromise, co-ordinate; clasp (hands); link, join, solder'. (This relates to the vagaries of the prefixes ka/kra-, pa-/pra-.) Thus /bpa som/ could easily be the local pronunciation, even though the spelling implies /pha som/.

(I was using bp- rather than p- to dispel ambiguity, though I much prefer to follow sceintific usage.)

artery = เส็น เลือด แดง= sen luad deng (red)

vein = เส็น เลือด ดำ= sen luad dam (black)

Thas right but generally no one uses them

Well, so long as everyone knows which one to apply a sharp instrument to when. I don't know what calibre of workers Bina gets. I can well imagine Palestinians hating them fiercely.

Vet thas right another one i've heard is "sat da-wa phaet" nearly the same.

I apologise for writing /sat wa phaet/ for สัตวแพทย์. I should have checked (at the Royal Institute Dictionary, which gives สัด-ตะ-วะ-แพด, i.e. sat-dta-wa-phaet, as the only correct pronunciation. I just checked with my wife, and she gave sat-dta-phaet! It's a bit of advanced grammar which deserves a thread of its own.

[bina]

Well, so long as everyone knows which one to apply a sharp instrument to when. I don't know what calibre of workers Bina gets. I can well imagine Palestinians hating them fiercely.

work with thai (mostly from issan: some kmer speakers, some nongkhai, some udon some korat, etc) ; arab youths from local 'friendly' villages; no one from over the green line comes near my goats except obviously when they steal them ( three times already, they steal, slaughter on the spot, then load up and drive off into the 'wadi' (valley) and 15 mins away they are over the line and we cant follow...

and usually only needles go into veins, no cutting except for testicles!!and then we cauterize--- sizzle sizzle,and the dog gets to eat the 'yummies'