Webmasters In Thailand

[Flow]

Hi

I really do believe that there are some decent foreign experienced webmasters residing in Thailand. However, I do also believe that they charge farang prices. Hence a lot of them either have very few customers, and some who own a small computer biz are even forced to close shop because they simply aren't competetive. Anyone agree?

I have been trying to locate a decent webmaster for months and so has a friend. But the prices they quote are simply outrageous.

I got a website. Designed it myself with Frontpage. the site is alright but not great. Want to improve it and get a pro to give it a more professional look but god... it is difficult to find THAT pro. I mean you design one page then most pages will look the same except for the index/homepage of course. Just use the page as a template copy and paste onto a blank page et voila, so it can't be that much work involved.

Any advice?

[ThaidleHands]

Have a look at WordPress. It's trivial to extend it from being blog software to a full CMS. There are plenty of professional templates out there, then just tweak them to suit you, add modules and paste in your content.

[Prakanong]

As a poster said Wordpress or if you want to go for a full opensource CMS look at Joomla

I was charged 100 USD for an example page by a guy from the Philippines on Joomla.

I already had the web space and Joomla installed - of course if you want a full site it will be more but I bet waaaaay cheaper than a lot of these farang webmasters who I have met who are about as much IT professionals as I am an optometrist.

If you want details of the PI guy pm me - there is also a Thai Joomla group too - they might be OK

Once your site it set up adding new content and managing it is a breeze.

[Crushdepth]

What do you mean by webmaster? If you want someone to update pages using a pre-existing template and perform general maintenance it shouldn't cost you much. But if you want professional(s) to plan your site, write copy, create quality graphic design work from scratch and build it, it can cost you quite a bit, depending whether you are after 'toyota' or a 'ferrari' or a 'bomb'. Anyone can make a website, but few people can make a good website. That's the difference.

If you are on a budget and want to do it yourself, have a look at some of the open-source content management systems that are available like XOOPS, Joomla, Wordpress etc. These provide an advanced degree of functionality and automate most of the publishing process, so you don't need to know HTML in order to maintain your own website. There are also a lot of attractive templates available that you can literally switch on or off with a click. And you get free software updates.

Edited October 28, 2007 by Crushdepth

[Flow]

What do you mean by webmaster? If you want someone to update pages using a pre-existing template and perform general maintenance it shouldn't cost you much. But if you want professional(s) to plan your site, write copy, create quality graphic design work from scratch and build it, it can cost you quite a bit, depending whether you are after 'toyota' or a 'ferrari' or a 'bomb'. Anyone can make a website, but few people can make a good website. That's the difference.

If you are on a budget and want to do it yourself, have a look at some of the open-source content management systems that are available like XOOPS, Joomla, Wordpress etc. These provide an advanced degree of functionality and automate most of the publishing process, so you don't need to know HTML in order to maintain your own website. There are also a lot of attractive templates available that you can literally switch on or off with a click. And you get free software updates.

thanks for your input.

I need to give my site a better more professional look. It's a Frontpage website. I need someone who can look at it and make the necessary changes to the "existing" website.

[TopDogger]

I got some guy from India to nock me up a simple 8 page site yesterday, a few new graphics & a couple forms etc. Its fairly simple, but well laid out and gets the point across which is all that was required.

$20 and he was happy as larry, probably just some 15yr old kid but he didn't want a penny till it was finished.

[Prakanong]

I got some guy from India to nock me up a simple 8 page site yesterday, a few new graphics & a couple forms etc. Its fairly simple, but well laid out and gets the point across which is all that was required.

$20 and he was happy as larry, probably just some 15yr old kid but he didn't want a penny till it was finished.

And a lot of the time that is all that is required.

The job I mention above I posted on joomlancers and got various quotes - I did not choose the cheapest but the guy wha talked sensibly and knew what he was on about.

A couple of months later I was in Manila so met up with him - he was the good guy I picked up on from dealings over the web.

Just manage each others expectations - as you say payment is upon completion or use a credible escrow account. I paid direct so he would not lose commission but after completion.

[Guest Reimar]

Hi

I really do believe that there are some decent foreign experienced webmasters residing in Thailand. However, I do also believe that they charge farang prices. Hence a lot of them either have very few customers, and some who own a small computer biz are even forced to close shop because they simply aren't competetive. Anyone agree?

I have been trying to locate a decent webmaster for months and so has a friend. But the prices they quote are simply outrageous.

I got a website. Designed it myself with Frontpage. the site is alright but not great. Want to improve it and get a pro to give it a more professional look but god... it is difficult to find THAT pro. I mean you design one page then most pages will look the same except for the index/homepage of course. Just use the page as a template copy and paste onto a blank page et voila, so it can't be that much work involved.

Any advice?

What you expect?

A Thai is working for THB 8,000 a month and living from this!

A Farang must earn (Pension) above THB 50,000 a month just to be able to apply for an Non-O Visa and in case this Farang is working legally he need to own an Working Permit which although cost some money and not just a little! He although need to pay Income Tax!

Now the question again: What do you expect? You expect that the Farang is working for you like a Thai? For a wages like a Thai?

If you running a Website that means that you proberly (want to) make some money with this Website?! Do you own a Working Permit? Do you Pay Tax for you Income? And, and, and! Think about the Law and the legal procedures involved.

If you running a legal Business in Thailand, you wouldn't even think about what you wrote because you know the real situation from your own experiences very well! I do believe that you didn't run a legal busines in Thailand because of what you wrote! Better you think about your own legal status in Thailand before to write some comments like you have done! And you should although think about yourself and what you want for the same things for yourself before you post such comments.

Cheers

[Prakanong]

Hi

I really do believe that there are some decent foreign experienced webmasters residing in Thailand. However, I do also believe that they charge farang prices. Hence a lot of them either have very few customers, and some who own a small computer biz are even forced to close shop because they simply aren't competetive. Anyone agree?

I have been trying to locate a decent webmaster for months and so has a friend. But the prices they quote are simply outrageous.

I got a website. Designed it myself with Frontpage. the site is alright but not great. Want to improve it and get a pro to give it a more professional look but god... it is difficult to find THAT pro. I mean you design one page then most pages will look the same except for the index/homepage of course. Just use the page as a template copy and paste onto a blank page et voila, so it can't be that much work involved.

Any advice?

What you expect?

A Thai is working for THB 8,000 a month and living from this!

A Farang must earn (Pension) above THB 50,000 a month just to be able to apply for an Non-O Visa and in case this Farang is working legally he need to own an Working Permit which although cost some money and not just a little! He although need to pay Income Tax!

Now the question again: What do you expect? You expect that the Farang is working for you like a Thai? For a wages like a Thai?

If you running a Website that means that you proberly (want to) make some money with this Website?! Do you own a Working Permit? Do you Pay Tax for you Income? And, and, and! Think about the Law and the legal procedures involved.

If you running a legal Business in Thailand, you wouldn't even think about what you wrote because you know the real situation from your own experiences very well! I do believe that you didn't run a legal busines in Thailand because of what you wrote! Better you think about your own legal status in Thailand before to write some comments like you have done! And you should although think about yourself and what you want for the same things for yourself before you post such comments.

Cheers

Sorry mate- I will not even go into the fact that most so called web guy's I have met in Thailand being self taught chancers whose idea of development methodolgy was thought out on a nana beer bar beermat

However - if you think someone is going to pay a premium just because a farang has higher cost of doing business in Thailand than a Thai then you are extremely mistaken,. It os not up to the OP to subsise a farang business just because they have higher costs - the OP has one issue - his own competative advantahge and not the other farangs ie he wants his costs as low as possible.

If the competative advantage of the farang web business do not exists then you know what to do - get out of the business - it will happen anyway so best to do it voluntarily while still retaining some monies and returning investment to whoever invested even if its only oneself.

Realities of business - why a farang web business should expect more for the same job just because they are farang is laughable - maybe why so many chancers do nmot last or whinge about ever decreasing margins and revenues - smell the coffee.

[girlx]

so hire a thai webmaster and see how far you get.

[nullx8]

there are quite good thai coders out there ....

well i for myself .. runn alot of websites .. where i outsource the artwork to thais .. and implement the output then in templates (like cms systems or something else)

work is mostly very reliable .. and a good price ..

most farangs i leaned to know are not really good .. just more expensive ...

where most thais are not that well in technical issues .. so i combined myself withthe outsourced atwork part ... and this worked fine so far.

[Prakanong]

there are quite good thai coders out there ....

well i for myself .. runn alot of websites .. where i outsource the artwork to thais .. and implement the output then in templates (like cms systems or something else)

work is mostly very reliable .. and a good price ..

most farangs i leaned to know are not really good .. just more expensive ...

where most thais are not that well in technical issues .. so i combined myself withthe outsourced atwork part ... and this worked fine so far.

I would agree - give the pretty pic's to the Thai's

Go to India, PI or elsewhere for the tech stuff but it should not be long before you could run a CMS site yourself and hire for the bits you can not do or its cheaper for someone else to do.

Its a no brainer really - why pay expensive farang people when you can outsource and offshore - and I am a farang manager in IT for a very large MNC

[Guest Reimar]

Hi

I really do believe that there are some decent foreign experienced webmasters residing in Thailand. However, I do also believe that they charge farang prices. Hence a lot of them either have very few customers, and some who own a small computer biz are even forced to close shop because they simply aren't competetive. Anyone agree?

I have been trying to locate a decent webmaster for months and so has a friend. But the prices they quote are simply outrageous.

I got a website. Designed it myself with Frontpage. the site is alright but not great. Want to improve it and get a pro to give it a more professional look but god... it is difficult to find THAT pro. I mean you design one page then most pages will look the same except for the index/homepage of course. Just use the page as a template copy and paste onto a blank page et voila, so it can't be that much work involved.

Any advice?

What you expect?

A Thai is working for THB 8,000 a month and living from this!

A Farang must earn (Pension) above THB 50,000 a month just to be able to apply for an Non-O Visa and in case this Farang is working legally he need to own an Working Permit which although cost some money and not just a little! He although need to pay Income Tax!

Now the question again: What do you expect? You expect that the Farang is working for you like a Thai? For a wages like a Thai?

If you running a Website that means that you proberly (want to) make some money with this Website?! Do you own a Working Permit? Do you Pay Tax for you Income? And, and, and! Think about the Law and the legal procedures involved.

If you running a legal Business in Thailand, you wouldn't even think about what you wrote because you know the real situation from your own experiences very well! I do believe that you didn't run a legal busines in Thailand because of what you wrote! Better you think about your own legal status in Thailand before to write some comments like you have done! And you should although think about yourself and what you want for the same things for yourself before you post such comments.

Cheers

Sorry mate- I will not even go into the fact that most so called web guy's I have met in Thailand being self taught chancers whose idea of development methodolgy was thought out on a nana beer bar beermat

However - if you think someone is going to pay a premium just because a farang has higher cost of doing business in Thailand than a Thai then you are extremely mistaken,. It os not up to the OP to subsise a farang business just because they have higher costs - the OP has one issue - his own competative advantahge and not the other farangs ie he wants his costs as low as possible.

If the competative advantage of the farang web business do not exists then you know what to do - get out of the business - it will happen anyway so best to do it voluntarily while still retaining some monies and returning investment to whoever invested even if its only oneself.

Realities of business - why a farang web business should expect more for the same job just because they are farang is laughable - maybe why so many chancers do nmot last or whinge about ever decreasing margins and revenues - smell the coffee.

Prakanong:

Just a excuse but I'm NOT a native english speaker! So may I wrote something a bit wrong! Excuse me for that.

What I was meaning is very easy: A "professional" Webmaster is running on "legal" base because it's easy to track him down! A Farang need to have a much higher Income than a Thai: the Thai Officials counting 8 to 10 times the Income of an Thai! Even the living cost for an Farang are higher than for an Thai!

If you take a close look, you may find out that even legal Thai Companies with an good reputation having thems price, which is mainly on the same level as for an Farang owned company! Cheap Thai Companies means: cheap service!

As I understand, the OP was speaking about Thailand, work in Thailand and Farangs who doing this work in Thailand! And there is a big difference between "private" work and Business! While "private" work, everything is negotiable but whil Business work everything has to follow some rules (let say Law and so on)!

I although had understand that the OP is speaking about some kind of Business via a website! If I'm wrong I'm sorry! But Business means some income! And dosen't matter where you are, in which country ever and even in your home country, if you do some legal business you have to follow some legal rules! It's as easy as that!

And now think about that you as a Farang (Guest) in Thailand expect Service/work from other Farangs on the same base as the native people of this country! If you can show me that you're living on the same level and for the same income as the native people of this country than we can start to talking about the same cost of service/work! If you can't show me that, I wouldn't talk about! Take to first a look to yourself, your living standard, your Income and even your charge for services/work and show that you're on the same level as the Thais before you start talking and bargain!

This isn't a personal statement against anybody but a statement what and how I'm thinking. By the way this is an result of an running (Farang-)business for 23 years in Thailand!

Cheers!

[Prakanong]

so hire a thai webmaster and see how far you get.

Like I an others are saying - no need to

Outsource and offshore to somewhere cheaper just like your clients do to you.

Give all the chancers and snake oil salemen a miss.

I reckon web developer / webmaster / seo expert (and I do not mean you by this as I know you did it back in the USA) is right up there with Real Estate Agents and teachers where farangs re-invent themselves in Thailand.

It used to be in general IT as well before the web became so big and there were some real charlatans about there too

[Prakanong]

Hi

I really do believe that there are some decent foreign experienced webmasters residing in Thailand. However, I do also believe that they charge farang prices. Hence a lot of them either have very few customers, and some who own a small computer biz are even forced to close shop because they simply aren't competetive. Anyone agree?

I have been trying to locate a decent webmaster for months and so has a friend. But the prices they quote are simply outrageous.

I got a website. Designed it myself with Frontpage. the site is alright but not great. Want to improve it and get a pro to give it a more professional look but god... it is difficult to find THAT pro. I mean you design one page then most pages will look the same except for the index/homepage of course. Just use the page as a template copy and paste onto a blank page et voila, so it can't be that much work involved.

Any advice?

What you expect?

A Thai is working for THB 8,000 a month and living from this!

A Farang must earn (Pension) above THB 50,000 a month just to be able to apply for an Non-O Visa and in case this Farang is working legally he need to own an Working Permit which although cost some money and not just a little! He although need to pay Income Tax!

Now the question again: What do you expect? You expect that the Farang is working for you like a Thai? For a wages like a Thai?

If you running a Website that means that you proberly (want to) make some money with this Website?! Do you own a Working Permit? Do you Pay Tax for you Income? And, and, and! Think about the Law and the legal procedures involved.

If you running a legal Business in Thailand, you wouldn't even think about what you wrote because you know the real situation from your own experiences very well! I do believe that you didn't run a legal busines in Thailand because of what you wrote! Better you think about your own legal status in Thailand before to write some comments like you have done! And you should although think about yourself and what you want for the same things for yourself before you post such comments.

Cheers

Sorry mate- I will not even go into the fact that most so called web guy's I have met in Thailand being self taught chancers whose idea of development methodolgy was thought out on a nana beer bar beermat

However - if you think someone is going to pay a premium just because a farang has higher cost of doing business in Thailand than a Thai then you are extremely mistaken,. It os not up to the OP to subsise a farang business just because they have higher costs - the OP has one issue - his own competative advantahge and not the other farangs ie he wants his costs as low as possible.

If the competative advantage of the farang web business do not exists then you know what to do - get out of the business - it will happen anyway so best to do it voluntarily while still retaining some monies and returning investment to whoever invested even if its only oneself.

Realities of business - why a farang web business should expect more for the same job just because they are farang is laughable - maybe why so many chancers do nmot last or whinge about ever decreasing margins and revenues - smell the coffee.

Prakanong:

Just a excuse but I'm NOT a native english speaker! So may I wrote something a bit wrong! Excuse me for that.

What I was meaning is very easy: A "professional" Webmaster is running on "legal" base because it's easy to track him down! A Farang need to have a much higher Income than a Thai: the Thai Officials counting 8 to 10 times the Income of an Thai! Even the living cost for an Farang are higher than for an Thai!

If you take a close look, you may find out that even legal Thai Companies with an good reputation having thems price, which is mainly on the same level as for an Farang owned company! Cheap Thai Companies means: cheap service!

As I understand, the OP was speaking about Thailand, work in Thailand and Farangs who doing this work in Thailand! And there is a big difference between "private" work and Business! While "private" work, everything is negotiable but whil Business work everything has to follow some rules (let say Law and so on)!

I although had understand that the OP is speaking about some kind of Business via a website! If I'm wrong I'm sorry! But Business means some income! And dosen't matter where you are, in which country ever and even in your home country, if you do some legal business you have to follow some legal rules! It's as easy as that!

And now think about that you as a Farang (Guest) in Thailand expect Service/work from other Farangs on the same base as the native people of this country! If you can show me that you're living on the same level and for the same income as the native people of this country than we can start to talking about the same cost of service/work! If you can't show me that, I wouldn't talk about! Take to first a look to yourself, your living standard, your Income and even your charge for services/work and show that you're on the same level as the Thais before you start talking and bargain!

This isn't a personal statement against anybody but a statement what and how I'm thinking. By the way this is an result of an running (Farang-)business for 23 years in Thailand!

Cheers!

My point is it does not matter about the standard of living etc.

I reckon I am a professional in IT - some may dispute that but with over 18 years experience mainly in MNC's and a post grad IT too then if I am not then I am not.

When I am purchasing services the last thing I look at is the standard of living of the guy proposing those services - I am looking at what is going to be delivered and at what price. I have done cost plus contracts and I have done the whole beauty contest open bidding. It never goes on price alone but I am not going to pay more for the same service just because some guys have a higher standard of living or costs.

On a personal level if I was going to purchase what the OP wants - I would go straight to joomlancers and get quotes. I would then pick two or three that seemed reasonable and I would enter into communication with them. I would evaluate their previous work and would also talk to people they had worked with before. OK I probably know how to spec a job but the OP could spec his job as much as he can - the guy on the other end should help him and offer advice too.

I know for a non-tech/web savvy guy it might seem daunting but its not really - thats the dirty little secret about IT - its a service like any other and its not that hard

[Guest Reimar]

My point is it does not matter about the standard of living etc.

I reckon I am a professional in IT - some may dispute that but with over 18 years experience mainly in MNC's and a post grad IT too then if I am not then I am not.

When I am purchasing services the last thing I look at is the standard of living of the guy proposing those services - I am looking at what is going to be delivered and at what price. I have done cost plus contracts and I have done the whole beauty contest open bidding. It never goes on price alone but I am not going to pay more for the same service just because some guys have a higher standard of living or costs.

On a personal level if I was going to purchase what the OP wants - I would go straight to joomlancers and get quotes. I would then pick two or three that seemed reasonable and I would enter into communication with them. I would evaluate their previous work and would also talk to people they had worked with before. OK I probably know how to spec a job but the OP could spec his job as much as he can - the guy on the other end should help him and offer advice too.

I know for a non-tech/web savvy guy it might seem daunting but its not really - thats the dirty little secret about IT - its a service like any other and its not that hard

What you wrote is right I do not disagree with it.

But what I found a bit to harsh: ""I really do believe that there are some decent foreign experienced webmasters residing in Thailand. However, I do also believe that they charge farang prices. Hence a lot of them either have very few customers, and some who own a small computer biz are even forced to close shop because they simply aren't competetive.""

It's a fact that Foreigner in Thailand need to charge more than Thai's, that's what I wrote before! But here need to consider the situation of the Foreigner in Thailand according to the existing Thai law. You can't expect that Foreigners charging just the same as Thais! Or you do? I mean this for Foreigner which working on base as Freelancers, not for a company!

And as I wrote before as well, competetive and good Thai companies although chareging and on Company levels with good services, the charge of the Thai companies are nearly if not same as Foreigner owned companies!

The OP is looking for an Professional and around the World Professionals costing more than the "normal" or low level people!

I have some in my company which working for a low income but those are workers with a low level of knowledge. The real Pro's which working for me cost me a lot more and if I compare Thais Pro's with Foreigner Pro's the Foreigners cost me more than doubble as an Thai! That's fact!

So, Services done by the Foreigner Pro of my company are more expensive than from the Thai Pro.

Funny enough but maybe even normal: Thai costumers liking the service from Foreigner Pro's while Foreign companies the service from Thai Pro's! and latest one is mainly because of the costings!

[Flow]

Thanks for your input. My site is non-commercial. It is not registered as a business because it isn't a business. It targets Singaporeans only.

I am glad that's been cleared up.

What you expect?

A Thai is working for THB 8,000 a month and living from this!

A Farang must earn (Pension) above THB 50,000 a month just to be able to apply for an Non-O Visa and in case this Farang is working legally he need to own an Working Permit which although cost some money and not just a little! He although need to pay Income Tax!

Now the question again: What do you expect? You expect that the Farang is working for you like a Thai? For a wages like a Thai?

If you running a Website that means that you proberly (want to) make some money with this Website?! Do you own a Working Permit? Do you Pay Tax for you Income? And, and, and! Think about the Law and the legal procedures involved.

If you running a legal Business in Thailand, you wouldn't even think about what you wrote because you know the real situation from your own experiences very well! I do believe that you didn't run a legal busines in Thailand because of what you wrote! Better you think about your own legal status in Thailand before to write some comments like you have done! And you should although think about yourself and what you want for the same things for yourself before you post such comments.

Cheers

[Prakanong]

My point is it does not matter about the standard of living etc.

I reckon I am a professional in IT - some may dispute that but with over 18 years experience mainly in MNC's and a post grad IT too then if I am not then I am not.

When I am purchasing services the last thing I look at is the standard of living of the guy proposing those services - I am looking at what is going to be delivered and at what price. I have done cost plus contracts and I have done the whole beauty contest open bidding. It never goes on price alone but I am not going to pay more for the same service just because some guys have a higher standard of living or costs.

On a personal level if I was going to purchase what the OP wants - I would go straight to joomlancers and get quotes. I would then pick two or three that seemed reasonable and I would enter into communication with them. I would evaluate their previous work and would also talk to people they had worked with before. OK I probably know how to spec a job but the OP could spec his job as much as he can - the guy on the other end should help him and offer advice too.

I know for a non-tech/web savvy guy it might seem daunting but its not really - thats the dirty little secret about IT - its a service like any other and its not that hard

What you wrote is right I do not disagree with it.

But what I found a bit to harsh: ""I really do believe that there are some decent foreign experienced webmasters residing in Thailand. However, I do also believe that they charge farang prices. Hence a lot of them either have very few customers, and some who own a small computer biz are even forced to close shop because they simply aren't competetive.""

It's a fact that Foreigner in Thailand need to charge more than Thai's, that's what I wrote before! But here need to consider the situation of the Foreigner in Thailand according to the existing Thai law. You can't expect that Foreigners charging just the same as Thais! Or you do? I mean this for Foreigner which working on base as Freelancers, not for a company!

And as I wrote before as well, competetive and good Thai companies although chareging and on Company levels with good services, the charge of the Thai companies are nearly if not same as Foreigner owned companies!

The OP is looking for an Professional and around the World Professionals costing more than the "normal" or low level people!

I have some in my company which working for a low income but those are workers with a low level of knowledge. The real Pro's which working for me cost me a lot more and if I compare Thais Pro's with Foreigner Pro's the Foreigners cost me more than doubble as an Thai! That's fact!

So, Services done by the Foreigner Pro of my company are more expensive than from the Thai Pro.

Funny enough but maybe even normal: Thai costumers liking the service from Foreigner Pro's while Foreign companies the service from Thai Pro's! and latest one is mainly because of the costings!

As a purchases of IT services I would be concerned only with one thing - delivery on time, to spec with agreed quality to the budget agreed - I do not care if you employ martians or afghani's!

I wonder why I seem to deal with a lot of Indian and to a lessor extent Philippine companies lately?

Its not my concern what your costs are - I do not give a flying fig as a purchaser (I am talking rhetorically here)

Its business - if you can not deliver on a price that is competitive then you know the answer - if you have no competitive advantage then compete on operational excellence but with no barriers to entry really in the this business the profits are going to level down - you accept that or get out as a business - this happens in every business

Porters 5 forces - some argue for 1 main one - the barriers to entry - in the globalised web development business there are none and you are competing on a fast leveliing field

Sorry to be harsh but that's the way it is - will I be outsourced - maybe - got the t-shirt on that one too!

I might be a manager in IT now at a MNC employing over 100,000 people worldwide but I have also ran a IT Consultancy in Thailand so have an inkling of what I speak

Edited October 28, 2007 by Prakanong

[opalhort]

This is probably somewhat off-topic, but here it goes:

In 1999 I created our web-site with Frontpage. Being a novice at that time I was happy with my creation.

I still use Frontpage to update the site from time to time but looking at it now I'm very well aware that it is absolutely lousy for the purpose of promoting our business.

The major problem I found when asking for help was that the people willing to help (Thai and Farang) had absolutely no understanding of our business (exporting plants - not retail!).

I've found it very difficult (impossible to date) to hire a programmer/web master (Thai or Farang) who has a full understanding of our business and has full command of the English language.

opalhort

[Guest Reimar]

As a purchases of IT services I would be concerned only with one thing - delivery on time, to spec with agreed quality to the budget agreed - I do not care if you employ martians or afghani's!

I wonder why I seem to deal with a lot of Indian and to a lessor extent Philippine companies lately?

Its not my concern what your costs are - I do not give a flying fig as a purchaser (I am talking rhetorically here)

Its business - if you can not deliver on a price that is competitive then you know the answer - if you have no competitive advantage then compete on operational excellence but with no barriers to entry really in the this business the profits are going to level down - you accept that or get out as a business - this happens in every business

Porters 5 forces - some argue for 1 main one - the barriers to entry - in the globalised web development business there are none and you are competing on a fast leveliing field

Sorry to be harsh but that's the way it is - will I be outsourced - maybe - got the t-shirt on that one too!

I might be a manager in IT now at a MNC employing over 100,000 people worldwide but I have also ran a IT Consultancy in Thailand so have an inkling of what I speak

Prakanong:

Again it isn't personell what I wrote and I wrote it for Thailand based only! International it's a bit different! I run a Thailand company in Thailand with business in Thailand and mixed employees. By the way the best programmers I have and had are Israelies following by Indian. But I need to employ Thais as well for several reasons. If you had run a Thailand legal Company you know what I mean!

The Question from the OP was for Thailand with Service in Thailand and cost in THB!

[Prakanong]

As a purchases of IT services I would be concerned only with one thing - delivery on time, to spec with agreed quality to the budget agreed - I do not care if you employ martians or afghani's!

I wonder why I seem to deal with a lot of Indian and to a lessor extent Philippine companies lately?

Its not my concern what your costs are - I do not give a flying fig as a purchaser (I am talking rhetorically here)

Its business - if you can not deliver on a price that is competitive then you know the answer - if you have no competitive advantage then compete on operational excellence but with no barriers to entry really in the this business the profits are going to level down - you accept that or get out as a business - this happens in every business

Porters 5 forces - some argue for 1 main one - the barriers to entry - in the globalised web development business there are none and you are competing on a fast leveliing field

Sorry to be harsh but that's the way it is - will I be outsourced - maybe - got the t-shirt on that one too!

I might be a manager in IT now at a MNC employing over 100,000 people worldwide but I have also ran a IT Consultancy in Thailand so have an inkling of what I speak

Prakanong:

Again it isn't personell what I wrote and I wrote it for Thailand based only! International it's a bit different! I run a Thailand company in Thailand with business in Thailand and mixed employees. By the way the best programmers I have and had are Israelies following by Indian. But I need to employ Thais as well for several reasons. If you had run a Thailand legal Company you know what I mean!

The Question from the OP was for Thailand with Service in Thailand and cost in THB!

I know what you are talking about - yes I am talking more international and as long as the companies meet certain criteria (pretty high though) I can use them.

As for running a business in Thailand aimed at the market in Thailand be it farang, Thai or whatever there are different considerations - you have to add value locally and differentiate enough so people will purchase. Many will always feel comfortable if they can go and speak to someone face to face - companies might also have a buy local policy (When I was at MOT we did as far as possible - another place I worked at for example a purchase of 3000 PC's was from Compaq with worldwide prices but we had a local VAR configure them and deliver on a cost plus 8% deal)

Strategically though a small development house in Thailand is going to have to be assessing the situation at all times, looking at how to reduce costs, operate with excellence and add value - there is obviously a niche in the market and its the ability to stay there is key.

As for the OP's spec - As I said I would not pay a premium for a farang to work in Thailand if I could get the same elsewhere given proviso's of course. Some might say this is hypocritical of me given I am paid a substantial "Ang Moh" premium here in Singapore

Edit : I do not get paid more just for being a ang moh but a local in the same position and job would be unlikely to get the same salary but there was no local with the specific skills (and they really are company (division actually) specific

Edited October 28, 2007 by Prakanong

[Prakanong]

This is probably somewhat off-topic, but here it goes:

In 1999 I created our web-site with Frontpage. Being a novice at that time I was happy with my creation.

I still use Frontpage to update the site from time to time but looking at it now I'm very well aware that it is absolutely lousy for the purpose of promoting our business.

The major problem I found when asking for help was that the people willing to help (Thai and Farang) had absolutely no understanding of our business (exporting plants - not retail!).

I've found it very difficult (impossible to date) to hire a programmer/web master (Thai or Farang) who has a full understanding of our business and has full command of the English language.

opalhort

I would not expect a programmer to have specific knowledge of your business unless it was a bit of luck.

I would however expect a good analyst to be able to understand your business quite quickly and come up wioth a specification a developer could take and produce a systemn to your requirements.

This analyst and programmer might be the same guy but often it will not and the small scale developer often lacks in this - they may be brilliant technical programmers but have no knowledge of business and the processes.

Hiring your own guy - he might learn the business in time but do you want to wait?

As said above - if you are only looking to promote your business and not do extensive web commerce etc go for a CMS like Joomla

Once you have the design done you can update and add to it as you like - as easy as using a word processing package - not like writing html or anything

Have a look into it www.joomla.org

[mart29]

Hi

I really do believe that there are some decent foreign experienced webmasters residing in Thailand. However, I do also believe that they charge farang prices. Hence a lot of them either have very few customers, and some who own a small computer biz are even forced to close shop because they simply aren't competetive. Anyone agree?

I have been trying to locate a decent webmaster for months and so has a friend. But the prices they quote are simply outrageous.

I got a website. Designed it myself with Frontpage. the site is alright but not great. Want to improve it and get a pro to give it a more professional look but god... it is difficult to find THAT pro. I mean you design one page then most pages will look the same except for the index/homepage of course. Just use the page as a template copy and paste onto a blank page et voila, so it can't be that much work involved.

Any advice?

hi mate, im a web developer is your site live?, any chance of looking at what you have at the moment?

[absolutelyBangkok]

Was at the same juncture as you. Was looking for a webmaster / webdesigner.

Then, without any knowledge, did it myself using Wordpress, as has been mentioned above.

There are hosting providers providing a service called Fantastico. Included in Fantastico is an automatic setup of Wordpress and many other templates you can easily change yourself.

It doesn't take much to get into the matter.

Especially Wordpress offers a wide range of plugins and widgets that you can easily customize your webpage.

PM me if you need details of a hosting provider that you'll be quite happy with.

I mean, a month or so ago I had no idea of how to setup a webpage.

Safe that money you wanted to spend for a webmaster for other things!

If - and that's an important if - if your webpage won't have all the bells and whistles.

[Crushdepth]

You can get excellent design work done in Thailand by the way (not necessarily cheap). The real headache is the standard of coding - in particular the (lack) of attention to security.

[klikster]

Hi

I really do believe that there are some decent foreign experienced webmasters residing in Thailand. However, I do also believe that they charge farang prices. Hence a lot of them either have very few customers, and some who own a small computer biz are even forced to close shop because they simply aren't competetive. Anyone agree?

I have been trying to locate a decent webmaster for months and so has a friend. But the prices they quote are simply outrageous.

I got a website. Designed it myself with Frontpage. the site is alright but not great. Want to improve it and get a pro to give it a more professional look but god... it is difficult to find THAT pro. I mean you design one page then most pages will look the same except for the index/homepage of course. Just use the page as a template copy and paste onto a blank page et voila, so it can't be that much work involved.

Any advice?

I'm assuming that since you can make a site in FP, you can do your own content. Try some of the coder sites and just ask for a (or 2) template design .. ask the bidders lots of questions .. require them to show you a watermarked PSD or something like that before you buy it.

Coder sites like scriptlance, rentacoder, etc .. lots of 3rd worlders. For some odd reason, very few Thais, it seems.

Or find a template you like and buy a CSS coded version, then drop in the content.

BTW, what do you call 'outrageous' prices?

[Entrep]

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